#1
How can I sound like that? I mean like jazzy/fusion guitarists sometimes create some cool dissonant phrasing and then they play again consonant. Any particular scale? Tips/advices?

Thanks
#3
Just make sure to resolve your accidentals. As a rule of thumb, a half-step in the same direction usually works (be sure to keep your harmony in mind, though!)

Extended chromatic runs generally have a "goal note" in mind--oftentimes, this is a chord tone in the next chord. So, there are two easy ways to get there chromatically: in a straight run or surrounding the goal note. We'll use a harmony of A - E7. We're playing over the Amaj7 with an upcoming chord change. We're playing a C#, trying to get to the G# at the same time the chord changes to E7. Instead of moving diatonically, e.g. C# - D - E - F# - G#, we'll chromaticize this mother. C# - D - D# - E - F - F# - G - G#. More tension was built than the straight diatonic path, and you probably didn't sound half-bad, either. You can do the straight chromatic run at blazing speeds, too! Same situation, but this time we'll 'surround' the goal note. We'll go from C# - D - E to get in striking range. Now, instead of moving straight up to the G#, we'll go past it, come back, go past, etc. So, something like: E - B - F - F# - A# - A - Fx (double-sharp) - G#. This builds a good bit of tension, especially if you prolong it: it almost feels like you keep "missing", but it eventually gets resolved properly so you don't completely obliterate your tonality in the process.

Just a few ideas to get you going. Keep experimenting with chromaticism to see how far you can take it without losing your sense of key. Once you better understand the threshold, you'll be able to manipulate that dissonance like none other.
Nothing that is worthwhile in life will ever come easy.
#4
Quote by Twistedrock
This should help you loads, this guy is a master at jazzy fusion playing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXg3-D-c_dI


wow, i don't like what this guy is saying.... very misleading...

"wrong" "if your playing outside notes you sound tense and then you go back to your inside notes to sound melodic"? outside notes can't be melodic? "THE NOTES THAT YOUR PLAYING DON@T EVEN MATTER< AS LONG AS THEY@RE OUTSIDE" !?!?!?


....i'm ok, i'm ok....

edit: haha oh yeah, outside playing.... learn theory. if you can use theory like neapolitans, secondary dominants, chromatic tones resolving, etc your playing will sound more outside. if you learn theory you can learn to use every note of the fretboard in the one key, this is a really big advantage.
Last edited by gavk at Jun 13, 2011,
#6
TS, do you know how to play "inside"? Do you know what "outside" really means in the context of a somg?
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#7
Quote by gavk
wow, i don't like what this guy is saying.... very misleading...

"wrong" "if your playing outside notes you sound tense and then you go back to your inside notes to sound melodic"? outside notes can't be melodic? "THE NOTES THAT YOUR PLAYING DON@T EVEN MATTER< AS LONG AS THEY@RE OUTSIDE" !?!?!?



The way I teach it is that a blend of the two make it interesting. If the scales and notes fit together, there's almost no tension at all, its very safe and not a lot is happening. The use of outside notes can make it interesting and changes the ear a bit...I think melodic is built with steps and skips, personally, and use of outside notes makes it less predictable, and sound more interesting, as long as there's a sense of where inside and outside is, and they are playing with some sense that its being done deliberately.

Sean
#8
Quote by Sean0913
The way I teach it is that a blend of the two make it interesting. If the scales and notes fit together, there's almost no tension at all, its very safe and not a lot is happening. The use of outside notes can make it interesting and changes the ear a bit...I think melodic is built with steps and skips, personally, and use of outside notes makes it less predictable, and sound more interesting, as long as there's a sense of where inside and outside is, and they are playing with some sense that its being done deliberately.

Sean


yeah i just dunno if i agree with the way he's presenting it. it seems like a lot of misinformation and sweeping statements just to keep the attention of a kid, and not someone who's actually trying to learn music. i don't think of someone was learning the piano, their teacher would tell them to play any notes, doesn't matter what they are! i think teaching like this has a lot to do with why so many guitarists don't have a clue what they're talking about.

i don't mean this about you (i don't know how you teach but i've heard you get very good results) but i just don't think this type of sweeping statement based teaching, like a lot of the stuff people quote here, like that guy who had a website saying the blues (12 bar) was in three different tonalities, helps guitarists to be anything other than misguided at best.

maybe people should learn music theory from people who teach music theory, not those who teach guitar. again, i don't mean this as an attack on anyone, but i think if people learned in a non guitar based environment (college) that they'd get it so much more.

/rant. sorry about that guys
#9
Quote by gavk
i don't think of someone was learning the piano, their teacher would tell them to play any notes, doesn't matter what they are!


Schoenberg...
Nothing that is worthwhile in life will ever come easy.
#12
Quote by jazz_rock_feel
I know I've used this once already this week but...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFcqGGMPc3k


I'm at work and can't see the video: if it was a witty retort, rest assured that I didn't mean my comment as a diss to Schoenberg or atonal music; just a joke about people's conceptions.
Nothing that is worthwhile in life will ever come easy.
#14
I think we agree more than disagree. The way he presents it seems at best an oversimplification or a careless use of terms.

In terms of theory, and guitar, I think it's best (at least for guitarists) to be able to use theory on the guitar, therefore a program which not only teaches it but prescribes a system of applying it to their instrument, covers the bases. The problem is when guitar teachers are good at one thing and bad at the theory side, mostly because their knowledge is secondhand, passed along from others who have secondhand knowledge at best and the process has repeated itself so many times as to miss detection and appear "normal".

I mean, while I don't teach the mechanics of the piano in terms of techniques (because I am not a pianist) what I teach a guy can be moved to the piano and applied there, because the guitarist doesn't need the guitar to have access to the working knowledge of their theory. In other words, if I teach what a triad is, they don't use the guitar to find the triad, they know the triad (say its an E Augmented) they don't grab a shape and then announce the notes. They instantly say to themselves "E Augmented E G# B#" and then go to their guitar, and see the notes E G# B# and can play it in a myriad of ways.

If they want, they can play Open 6th 1st fret 3rd and tap the C (B#) at the High E 8th fret. Doesn't matter. Or maybe an Open E harmonic at the 12, pluck the G# at the 3rd/1st fret, tap the (C) B#) at the Hi E 8th fret, run that to a slide to the 12 fret and strike the 16th with their Elbow. Whatever, they are not relegated to the guitar to use instant access to theory. And to me that's the way it should be.

If all that I taught was only referenced from when they have the guitar in their hands, then I'd be giving them a very narrow skill set, in my opinion. Are there things that I teach that directly apply to the guitar? Of course, because for all of my students, online and otherwise, that's their instrument of choice. But, I've taught theory to the blind and to piano players, in the sense that their access to accurate information can be done in real-time and applied to their instrument of choice be it a Keyboard or a Xylophone played using a mummified hand as a mallet.

Best,

Sean

Quote by gavk
yeah i just dunno if i agree with the way he's presenting it. it seems like a lot of misinformation and sweeping statements just to keep the attention of a kid, and not someone who's actually trying to learn music. i don't think of someone was learning the piano, their teacher would tell them to play any notes, doesn't matter what they are! i think teaching like this has a lot to do with why so many guitarists don't have a clue what they're talking about.

i don't mean this about you (i don't know how you teach but i've heard you get very good results) but i just don't think this type of sweeping statement based teaching, like a lot of the stuff people quote here, like that guy who had a website saying the blues (12 bar) was in three different tonalities, helps guitarists to be anything other than misguided at best.

maybe people should learn music theory from people who teach music theory, not those who teach guitar. again, i don't mean this as an attack on anyone, but i think if people learned in a non guitar based environment (college) that they'd get it so much more.

/rant. sorry about that guys
Last edited by Sean0913 at Jun 13, 2011,
#15
Quote by soviet_ska
I'm at work and can't see the video: if it was a witty retort, rest assured that I didn't mean my comment as a diss to Schoenberg or atonal music; just a joke about people's conceptions.


Whether it's a joke or serious, once you see the video, it will apply.