#1
I bought a rp1000 this weekend but when I connect it (properly) to my 5150 combo's effects loop, the amp gets wacky. The power amp volume stops working but the preamp volume works.

i am unsure why. i believe that when it attempts to isolate the preamp (using the rp1000's preamp models), the amp sees the effects loop is broken and kills the poweramp (so only the "bleed over" from the tube buffer is making it into the speaker.)


I am just guessing. dont know enough to say for sure.

Anyone have any ideas? I can run it into the 5150, but i really want to be able to use my real 5150s preamp for high gain, and use the rp1000's low gain orange and blackface preamp models through the 5150's power amp.
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
#2
How's it hooked up? Are you saying that you get a large volume drop? The part about the master vol not working but the amp's preamp volume working is strange. doe's the amp's preamp vol works both when the RP amp loop is on and off?
#3
Try a cable between effects send and effects return - no FX units, just a cable. If that fails then it's the effects loop jacks themselves. You probably just need to clean them.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#4
No, the effects loop works fine with pedals or just a loop cable.

when I set the rp1000 to disable the preamp and use it's internal models, the amp volume completely falls off. unhearable unless I crank the 5150's preamp gain all the way up.

If I hit the bypass on the rp1000, the 5150 works normally. I just do not want to run the delay and such through the clean input because time effects will get muddy too quickly.

When i try to use a preset on the rp1000, the 5150 acts as if I had pluged in 1 device to the fx send and another device to the return (so the preamp isnt looped into the return)
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
#5
There's gain and volume controls on the amp models in the RP1000. Sounds like you need to adjust those levels.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#6
Quote by Cathbard
There's gain and volume controls on the amp models in the RP1000. Sounds like you need to adjust those levels.

Nope, and that does not explain why the power amp volume stops working.

it is something to do with the 5150 combo's circuit.
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
#7
Quote by Cathbard
There's gain and volume controls on the amp models in the RP1000. Sounds like you need to adjust those levels.


That, and when you engage the RP's models, the RP's master volume controls the amps poweramp. It makes your amp's volume knob useless.
In addition, the RP has a preset volume and an amp volume.

Quote by PimpSmurf
Nope, and that does not explain why the power amp volume stops working.

it is something to do with the 5150 combo's circuit.


It is probably not. Every amp in which I have plugged my RP in the FX loop and switched on it's amp models disabled the poweramp's volume knob. The same thing happens with Ignite's HD500 and his Mark IV.


He needs to fiddle with the RP's volume controls.

Oi, Cath, correct me if I am wrong, but the poweramp is driven by the output of the preamp, right? Which is why stickign an MFX pedal in the loop of a poweramp disables the volume knob, since the volume knob is actually a part of the pre amp and not the poweramp? And which is why all dedicated poweramps usually have a pair of 12AX7's, like the Carvin TS100?

Or am I barking up the wrong tree?

EDIT
http://www.mesaboogie.com/Product_Info/Stereo_Power/Simul_2_Ninety/simul_2_ninety.html

YES. 3 12AX7's.

@TS: When you run the RP's amp models, you effectively turn your RP into a pre amp and the 5150's pre amp into a sort of volume booster. Thhe RP's master volume will control the 5150's volume.

Put the 5150 in 4CM with the RP. THat should solve all your problems, letting you use the RP's cleans/effects with the 5150's distortion and switch with one switch.
Alternatively if you want to use the RP purely for effects and not amp modelling, hit the "amp/cabinet bypass" button. The RP's internal preamp is switched off, and only the effects work.
Last edited by GS LEAD 5 at Jun 18, 2011,
#8
Quote by PimpSmurf
No, the effects loop works fine with pedals or just a loop cable.

when I set the rp1000 to disable the preamp and use it's internal models, the amp volume completely falls off. unhearable unless I crank the 5150's preamp gain all the way up.
Once again... post your hookup. When you say "disable the preamp", what preamp? The amp or the RP? Please use the terminology.. enable or disable the amp loop on the RP instead.

When the amp loop light on the RP is lit, is that when the volumen drops? Or when it's off?

When i try to use a preset on the rp1000, the 5150 acts as if I had pluged in 1 device to the fx send and another device to the return (so the preamp isnt looped into the return)
Sounds like you hooked it up wrong.
#9
The loop is after the amp's volume control. If the device in the loop is attenuating, the volume will be low. Turning up the amp's volume changes what is being fed into the FX loop and then the power amp. If it's attenuated enough in the loop it won't matter how loud you crank the amp's volume because it is being attenuated elsewhere. Even if the loop was before the volume control it wouldn't help because your RP1000 is attenuating the signal so naff all is being fed into the power amp.
It still sounds like you have the volume on the RP1000 turned right down. It's knobs 5 and 6 and 4 is the gain. A quick look at the manual leads me to believe that this is simply operator error.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
Last edited by Cathbard at Jun 18, 2011,
#10
I appreciate that all of you are taking time to try to help.

Quote by GS LEAD 5
That, and when you engage the RP's models, the RP's master volume controls the amps poweramp. It makes your amp's volume knob useless.
In addition, the RP has a preset volume and an amp volume.


This is my first experience with an RP1000, so I appreciate the input. Even with the master volume all the way up, and the rp1000's amp volume/gain all the way up, I get no volume through my speakers. I am connecting the effects loop properly I have the "to the amp's effects loop send" pluged into my amp's effects loop send as it should be.

Quote by GS LEAD 5

It is probably not. Every amp in which I have plugged my RP in the FX loop and switched on it's amp models disabled the poweramp's volume knob. The same thing happens with Ignite's HD500 and his Mark IV.


Awesome! I didn't understand that this is normal behavior.

Quote by GS LEAD 5

He needs to fiddle with the RP's volume controls.

Put the 5150 in 4CM with the RP. THat should solve all your problems, letting you use the RP's cleans/effects with the 5150's distortion and switch with one switch.
Alternatively if you want to use the RP purely for effects and not amp modelling, hit the "amp/cabinet bypass" button. The RP's internal preamp is switched off, and only the effects work.


4CM? Don't know what this means

Quote by Cathbard

It still sounds like you have the volume on the RP1000 turned right down. It's knobs 5 and 6 and 4 is the gain. A quick look at the manual leads me to believe that this is simply operator error.


Nope, unless there is a volume knob I don't know about somewhere. I have the gain on the rp1000's preamp model (using the og-120 for testing) set to max, I have the amp volume (rp-1000) set to max as well. I have the master volume set to max as well.

I've read the manual 3 times now and can't figure it out. I'm usually one of those people who doesn't need to read manuals. Everything just works.
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
#11
Quote by PimpSmurf
4CM? Don't know what this means
Bingo!

I have an RP1000 and could help you, but since you don't want to respond to my posts I'm done here.
#12
Quote by fly135
Bingo!

I have an RP1000 and could help you, but since you don't want to respond to my posts I'm done here.


LOL. I didn't see your post. I was on my cell phone. Don't get so mad

I believe I'm using the hookup method from the top of page 12 in the manual.

I replaced my effects buffer tube and now I have volume btw.

Yes I am already using 4 cables.
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
Last edited by PimpSmurf at Jun 18, 2011,
#13
Now my only problem is I have absolutely no control over my 5150.

The "4CM" hookup (what digitech calls "Amp loop using Guitar Amp's Pre Amp") completely disables all of my amp's controls. 100% gone. If I bypass a preset (ie, press the preset's button again) it disables all the rp1000 effects, but I still have no control over my real amp whatsoever.

I wanted to be able to use the rp1000 with the effects loop (so delays or whatever would be put in the right place) but be able to bypass the rp1000 so I could play with my real 5150 tone (as it sounds better to me than the model.)

It seems like this just isn't possible with the 4cm method, and I would have to use the clean 5150 amp channel as an input for the rp1000. Then when I wanted the high gain channel, I would have to bypass the rp1000 preset and hit my pedal control to change the 5150's amp channel to my other channel. Is this correct? Weaksauce.
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
#14
The hookup at the top of page 12 is correct. When the AMP LOOP light is ON, then your amp's preamp will be in the chain and the amp controls should work. When the AMP LOOP light is OFF, then your amp's preamp is completely out of the chain and the controls will not work.

Verify that the AMP LOOP light is ON and your amp comtrols work. This setup will do everything you want regarding placing the delay in the 5150's loop. Modulation FX can be either pre or post amp and that's selectable elsewhere.

Again I ask the question, when does the volume drop? When the AMP LOOP light is ON or OFF?

Also, I should ask, are you even using the AMP LOOP button?
Last edited by fly135 at Jun 18, 2011,
#15
Quote by fly135
The hookup at the top of page 12 is correct. When the AMP LOOP light is ON, then your amp's preamp will be in the chain and the amp controls should work. When the AMP LOOP light is OFF, then your amp's preamp is completely out of the chain and the controls will not work.

Verify that the AMP LOOP light is ON and your amp comtrols work. This setup will do everything you want regarding placing the delay in the 5150's loop. Modulation FX can be either pre or post amp and that's selectable elsewhere.

Again I ask the question, when does the volume drop? When the AMP LOOP light is ON or OFF?

Also, I should ask, are you even using the AMP LOOP button?


oh my... So before I changed the tube everything was acting crazy. My normal pedals worked and then I installed the rp1000 and everything broke and started acting crazy.


NOW:

Thanks. I hit the amp loop and then my amp's controls all came back and what not.

What was confusing is the bypass (tapping the preset a second time) was seeming to disable the rp1000, but it wasn't turning my amp controls back on. It also was very loud and clean, and not really usable.


I don't get why bypass doesn't do what the amp loop button does.
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5
#16
It's because the amp loop button is unique to multifx that have an amp loop. Bypass just means move everything from the input to the output without interference. Your amp's preamp is inside the multifx, therefore bypassed as well

Basically you were feeding your guitar straight into the power amp. Hence no controls and no volume.
#17
Quote by fly135
It's because the amp loop button is unique to multifx that have an amp loop. Bypass just means move everything from the input to the output without interference. Your amp's preamp is inside the multifx, therefore bypassed as well

Basically you were feeding your guitar straight into the power amp. Hence no controls and no volume.

Awesome.

Now the 3rec and od120 sound better (although the orange is no where close to the sound I was hoping for.)

thanks for your help in understanding this mess!
Agile 2800 Baritone (Crunchy Rail bridge/Fat Pat Neck) or Douglas WRL 590 -> MXR Super Comp -> -> MXR M108 EQ -> Peavey 5150 212 (Eminence Redcoat Gov) or Bugera V5