#1
Hey everybuddy !!

I'm a metal fan ( i consider the metal is the best music genre of all time ) i love it all ( death , nu , groove , thrash , power , prog , symphonic ... ) and i'm proud of being a Metalcore fan !! but i heard that most of metal fans hate metalcore !! so could anyone give me reasons to hate this music ???
#4
Cos we've never heard metalcore because of the 13 year old teenage girls/ gayboys screaming over the music like wet turds sliding down the side of your house in the rain.
#5
I don't know exactly what seperates metalcore from every other -core, so I just assume everything I haven't heard is crap.
#6
Not all of use hates it. It's just not tr00.

Kvltists and tr00 metal heads hate it with a passion though and I can see why. A good 80% of metalcore is really really bland and awful.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#7
I love when people say "-core" as if there's thousands of "-core" genres. I really don't see how Hardcore, Grindcore, Metalcore and Deathcore is an excessive amount of "-cores", given that Metalcore and Deathcore are both sub-genres of Hardcore (and Metal, before anyone gets their knickers in a twist) anyways.
Quote by ChemicalFire
The point of underground bands is their not popular or famous most of the time. Thus there is a good chance they suck.
#8
It's like you take vodka, and then dilute it down until it's pretty much water, but still call it vodka, and proceed to pretend to get heavily wasted off it.
#9
because lots of metalcore bands such, and get most of their fan base from "scene" kids wanting to be cool/12 year old girls wanting to **** the singer *cough*BMTH*cough* there are some good metalcore bands out there though (ABR, architects etc)
#10
Quote by ChemicalFire
Not all of use hates it. It's just not tr00.

Kvltists and tr00 metal heads hate it with a passion though and I can see why. A good 80% of metalcore is really really bland and awful.

A good 80% of all music is really really bland and awful.
#12
Quote by theknuckster
It's like you take vodka, and then dilute it down until it's pretty much water, but still call it vodka, and proceed to pretend to get heavily wasted off it.


this
#13
Quote by Retrac17
because lots of metalcore bands such, and get most of their fan base from "scene" kids wanting to be cool/12 year old girls wanting to **** the singer *cough*BMTH*cough* there are some good metalcore bands out there though (ABR, architects etc)


Though saying that There is a hell was 50% a really good album.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#16
Quote by technicolour
because converge is probably better than all the metal bands you like, and that probably pisses you off


Eh, Converge to me just play on that, look it's really really noisy and chaotic and stuff. But it leads to a lot of Converge just playing on the fact that you can't really hear whats going on.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#17
The Metalcore you speak of is frowned upon by Metal purists because it combines simply formulated Pedal riffing and Slayer esque galloping along with open note breakdowns. This combination added with a simple Verse Chorus Verse Chorus Bridge song structure, makes it rather generic and to alot, uninspiring.

Does this mean it is bad? No not at all, it like many other genres of music, has a multitude of bands whom go for the simplest form of this style and add nothing to give themselves their own sound.

Trivium
Shadows Fall
Killswitch Engage
Darkest Hour
Unearth
All That Remains
Becoming The Archetype

These bands I think have developed their own sound and I can tell which is which, this is just an example and personal opinion though.
#18
Just think, in about 10 years metalcore will probably be considered "kvlt"/"tr00" or whatever the future equivalent of that is. The genre's popularity is already rapidly fading away
#19
Quote by ChemicalFire
Eh, Converge to me just play on that, look it's really really noisy and chaotic and stuff. But it leads to a lot of Converge just playing on the fact that you can't really hear whats going on.
Converge isn't that chaotic.
#20
Quote by fumb duck
Just think, in about 10 years metalcore will probably be considered "kvlt"/"tr00" or whatever the future equivalent of that is. The genre's popularity is already rapidly fading away


Naw, it's populist,trendy, music at it's core.It's not like Blasphemy was getting played on MTV and became cult when their non existent music videos stopped getting airtime.And the whole"true" thing basically means conservative to Metal's roots, which metalcore isn't at all ideologically or aesthetically.
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.

#21
Quote by ChemicalFire
Eh, Converge to me just play on that, look it's really really noisy and chaotic and stuff. But it leads to a lot of Converge just playing on the fact that you can't really hear whats going on.

Blasphemy! (Even though that's what I thought when I first heard Jane Doe many years ago.)

Seriously though, Kurt Ballou writes some absolutely bitchin' riffs.
Last edited by Annihilator666 at Jul 21, 2011,
#22
Quote by Riffmast
Naw, it's populist,trendy, music at it's core.It's not like Blasphemy was getting played on MTV and became cult when their non existent music videos stopped getting airtime.And the whole"true" thing basically means conservative to Metal's roots, which metalcore isn't at all ideologically or aesthetically.

This.
Quote by theknuckster
It's like you take vodka, and then dilute it down until it's pretty much water, but still call it vodka, and proceed to pretend to get heavily wasted off it.

This.

Basically, everything that makes metal metal, Metalcore lacks. And it gets paraded about as this newfangled great metal revival when a] metal never needed reviving and b] it's not metal. Even aesthetically it's very different from most metal. There are similarities here and there, sure but mostly it's not.
Quote by MoogleRancha
It's like Fenriz and J. Read

"I'm so happy to love metal and stuff"

"I AM metal"
#23
Quote by Burning_Angel
This.

This.

Basically, everything that makes metal metal, Metalcore lacks. And it gets paraded about as this newfangled great metal revival when a] metal never needed reviving and b] it's not metal. Even aesthetically it's very different from most metal. There are similarities here and there, sure but mostly it's not.


I want to hear the major differences that make these bands not Metal.
#24
Basically as Riffy said, it completely lacks the ideology and the aesthetics. Populist, trendy music. And populist, trendy music is something metal never was, is, or should be.

But to go more in depth? The songwriting is dumbed down, simple Verse Chorus structure, distinctly a non-metal feature. Metal has long been defined by it's more linear structures.

The melodic, harmonic, and rhythmic content is also dumbed down.

It has some aesthetics of metal, like some double bass drumming and some so-called "heavy" low tuned guitars, and some "harsh" vocals, but none of these are exclusive to metal, and all of these are presented in a dumbed down, easy way to the masses. That is to say, the guitars really arent heavy at all, the harsh vocals are not harsh, and the drumming is triggered and perfect and compressed to a glossy sheen that's so processed it often sounds fake.

And if people persist in calling it metal? Fine. It still ****ing sucks though. And I think most people have realized this as metalcore seems to slowly lurch it's way towards it's grave, in the same manner as nu-metal.
Quote by MoogleRancha
It's like Fenriz and J. Read

"I'm so happy to love metal and stuff"

"I AM metal"
Last edited by Burning_Angel at Jul 21, 2011,
#25
That sounds like every band who formed when they heard The Fall Of Ideals and Ascendancy come out, which I will agree with as they take the basics of those albums and use it tediously. When it comes to the first half of most of the more well known band of this style, or even over half, discographies seem to have alot of Metal influence to count being Metal.

I will admit it is generic and been done before, and I wouldn't call it Trendy, populist music unless you speak of bands like The Sorrow to Attack Attack!, but aside from their ilk, it sounds like pretty straight up Metal, generic it may be, but I would say atleast solid for what it is.

Also I'd like to point out something about the polished sound you mentioned, even though you meant just for the drums in that sentence, alot of these bands have a polished sound that tends to allow me to hear everything, while "true" metal bands have a muffled, monotonous sound that for me ruins any form of intensity and uniqueness in the music, aswell as it doesn't highlight what the music is capable of and sounds emotionless to me. That's just my opinion on the production though.
#27
Quote by Morphogenesis26
I want to hear the major differences that make these bands not Metal.



It's lacking that warlike,reactionary,nihilistic(or very impassioned, usually about heritage,strength,will etc) attitude, replacing it with something allot more shallow and easily digestible. Metalcore bases itself on egoism(self involvement, or a very shallow attitude towards world events and more focus on just making things seem "cool"), easily accessible and convenient sound that attracts people who don't want to take time to learn to appreciate more difficult music. It also has a much lighter and obvious style of phrasing, leaning more towards the novelty and shock value of individual riffs, while recycling older trends in Metal and stitching them together in a way that appeals to as many potential youtube watching scenesters as possible.

Traditional Metal is about building architectural song structures,with riffs that support one another to make a more powerful whole.It uses allot ugly sounds(harsh ,organic production, and in some genres the envelope was pushed so far that it began to resemble Wagnerian chromaticism, along with other dark sounds that fell out of style in the modern era,as popular music became more about jingles than real emotion) to repulse initial listeners,and using it in a way denies status quo and populist tendencies,throwing arbitrary standards of sound and aesthetic out the window, only using what works to get the message across,functionality at it's most pure. Going into controversial topics and challenging preconceived notions on the value of life,death,morals,standards,and other messy topics. The music it'self is a reactionary stance against false utopian sentiment that does'nt stack up to reality.All theese things directly translate through the music.

Metalcore is "Metal" made by and for who don't really listen to metal,but enjoy some baseline elements that seem "cool", that's about it. Though when i say Metalcore i don't mean stuff like Converge or Botch or any first wave metalcore, just the modern pop metal bands who have been given that label.

EDIT: Cleaned up a bit.
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.

Last edited by Riffmast at Jul 22, 2011,
#28
Modern metalcore is almost entirely dependent on melodic vocal hooks, occasional screams and emotional lyrics which are basically the same in each song just rephrased. The songs are typically 2 - 4 minutes long and are structured in a similar format to what you would expect in a pop or radio rock song. Instrumentation is usually simple and generic but besides breakdowns, the fanbase (or at least any fans I know, which is alot) don't really care about anything except for the vocals and the band's image.
The newest wave of metalcore bands (past year or so) is basically just pop-punk with a 10 second screaming + breakdown section, I wonder how popular they'd be if they didn't have those screams though .

EDIT: What I said was involving the new wave of "scene" bands, not Trivium, A7X, LOG etc. don't crack it at me fanboys
Last edited by fumb duck at Jul 22, 2011,
#29
Thank you for that informational reply Riffmast, great food for thought, would be even better without the headache I have. XD

I've never had a problem with the fanbase aside from some being rather flighty and one-dimensional, others are usually nice people or good musicians.
#30
And just to clarify that I'm not saying " people who listen to Metalcore are shitty people" or anything. One of my best friends is a big fan of Attack Attack and Iwrestledabearonce and all that shit. That's just what the music translates into for me when i listen to it. And sorry, reading back some of those sentences are worded terribly, i had to leave quick so i just spam typed and left, sorry if it was confusing.
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.