#1
Hello all

I want to build my very first tube amp, I will probably go with a fender champ 5E1 circut just to practice. I was wonderering what the difference is between using a PCB board, and using PTP wiring. Is it possible to make the champ 5E1 Circut PTP? Does it offer any tonal advantages? I've read it's easier to build/mod later on if it is point to point. I appreciate any help
#2
The big difference is with point to point you can easily eliminate crosstalk if you plan it right, pcb doesn't have the ability to just move it's traces but it shouldn't have crosstalk problems as long as its planned very well. There's no real advantage as long as both are planned well, they can both be very decent or they can both suck if they're poorly thought out. And yes PTP can be very easy to mod but a pcb can too if its planned with modding in mind. Any amp (within reason) can be wired point to point

This is an example of good point to point wiring, the power supplies are on the opposite side of the input section and wires cross at near right angles and they don't run parallel for a significant length.


I'd suggest that for you're first build you do an eyelet/turretboard and find a layout for the amp you want to build so you won't have to worry about the whole crosstalk issues and everything.
Guitars:
LTD F-50
Yamaha EG-112
'77 Harmony
Roadworn Starcaster
Gretsch G5120

Amps:
Vypyr 15
Epiphone Valve Junior combo
#3
thanks for the response! So I will stick with the Champ with turretboard as a first build. If you don't mind me asking, what exactly is 'crosstalk'?
#5


wait wait.

this is ****ing terrible.
Jumping on dat gear sig train.
PRS Hollowbody II / BKP Warpigs
Strandberg OS6T / BKP Aftermath
Strandberg OS7 / Lace Poopsticks
Skervesen Raptor 7FF / BKP Warpigs
Skervesen Raptor 6 NTB / BKP Juggernauts
Hapas Sludge 7 FF / Hapas Leviathan
Anderson Baritom / Motorcity Nuke BKP Sinner Anderson H2+
Warmoth Baritone / BKP Piledriver
Ibanez Rg2120x / BKP Nailbomb

Blackstar ID:Core Beam
#7
there's cheap pcb and there's good pcb. A cheap pcb will have traces only on one side, it'll be thin and bend easily.

A good pcb is thick, double sided, through hole plated etc.

That being said for something like a champ a turret board will work easily. There aren't very many parts at all.

jmi and hiwatt are pretty great at turrets





matamp uses a hybrid style sometimes.



and this is a newer style ptp technique

Jumping on dat gear sig train.
PRS Hollowbody II / BKP Warpigs
Strandberg OS6T / BKP Aftermath
Strandberg OS7 / Lace Poopsticks
Skervesen Raptor 7FF / BKP Warpigs
Skervesen Raptor 6 NTB / BKP Juggernauts
Hapas Sludge 7 FF / Hapas Leviathan
Anderson Baritom / Motorcity Nuke BKP Sinner Anderson H2+
Warmoth Baritone / BKP Piledriver
Ibanez Rg2120x / BKP Nailbomb

Blackstar ID:Core Beam
#8
I'm still confused as to what crosstalk is, as mentioned above. I will be going with PCB then, it looks like it will be more neat and orderly, easier to learn on. thanks for the posts acousticmirror
#9
if your going for a 5f1 i suggest a turret board. there's plenty of kits.
Jumping on dat gear sig train.
PRS Hollowbody II / BKP Warpigs
Strandberg OS6T / BKP Aftermath
Strandberg OS7 / Lace Poopsticks
Skervesen Raptor 7FF / BKP Warpigs
Skervesen Raptor 6 NTB / BKP Juggernauts
Hapas Sludge 7 FF / Hapas Leviathan
Anderson Baritom / Motorcity Nuke BKP Sinner Anderson H2+
Warmoth Baritone / BKP Piledriver
Ibanez Rg2120x / BKP Nailbomb

Blackstar ID:Core Beam
#11
Quote by kurtlives91
Hiwatt's are super neat.
Some times lead dress and lead length were compromised to keep things looking neat though.


true. all of their amps could have been compact.



bc does a pretty good job. i'd teflon tube those bare leads now though.
Jumping on dat gear sig train.
PRS Hollowbody II / BKP Warpigs
Strandberg OS6T / BKP Aftermath
Strandberg OS7 / Lace Poopsticks
Skervesen Raptor 7FF / BKP Warpigs
Skervesen Raptor 6 NTB / BKP Juggernauts
Hapas Sludge 7 FF / Hapas Leviathan
Anderson Baritom / Motorcity Nuke BKP Sinner Anderson H2+
Warmoth Baritone / BKP Piledriver
Ibanez Rg2120x / BKP Nailbomb

Blackstar ID:Core Beam
#12
To answer TS's question..

cross-talk is where a signal in one part of a circuit finds it's way into other parts of the circuit where it shouldn't be.

like if wires in an amp run paralell for a significant length, their magnetic fields, being inductively coupled, will induce their respective signals into each other.

i probably didnt explain that very well..
#13
Quote by Invader Jim
To answer TS's question..

cross-talk is where a signal in one part of a circuit finds it's way into other parts of the circuit where it shouldn't be.

like if wires in an amp run paralell for a significant length, their magnetic fields, being inductively coupled, will induce their respective signals into each other.

i probably didnt explain that very well..


So if the wires are running paralell for enough length then the signals will all be mixed together so to speak. Making for a poor tone?
#14
Quote by AcousticMirror
true. all of their amps could have been compact.



bc does a pretty good job. i'd teflon tube those bare leads now though.



Sorry for the double post but that is beautiful
#15
Quote by hoppusfan182
So if the wires are running paralell for enough length then the signals will all be mixed together so to speak. Making for a poor tone?

in a nutshell, yes. poor tone and more noise and/or random oscillations and motorboating.

and that amp looks nice, but i'd have laced the cable runs instead of using ugly zip-ties.

http://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&hl=en&source=hp&biw=1280&bih=644&q=cable+lacing&gbv=2&oq=cable+lacing&aq=f&aqi=g1&aql=&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=1159l3541l0l3575l12l8l0l2l2l0l259l860l3.2.1l6l0
Last edited by Invader Jim at Aug 2, 2011,
#16
I see, the pictures make it clear to see. Thanks for that!

I've always loved the way the inside of tube amps look, some people really make it like an art.