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#1
I have listened to metal and its vast amount of sub-genres a real lot.
So please don’t get me wrong. I don't want to bash the genre at all. I consider Metal to be the most skilled, intelligent, vast and deep music since classical music.

However, it something bores me and sometimes even annoys me.
I'll try not to tell any history on hardcore music or completely covering all characteristics or something but...let's start here

It feels like metal is for a big part used as a medium to bash pop-music (which is good of course)
Where pop music most often relies on predictable song stuctures and consonant melodies, death metal (for example) has a lot of different riffs/ideas, mostly being chromatic and dissonant plus the well known grunts.

And yes, it is an art to write good riffs and putting them together in a way as coherent as possible. But do you see the analogy with classical composers?
Metal also feels like a ‘composition puzzle’ made by an architect who is, sometimes, over-critical.

The problem for me as a listener occurs in the fact that I sometimes don’t hear an expression of emotions but I hear the aforementioned journey of a composer.

Take guitar solos; hardcore music often shuns them. And I think I know why.

It feels like there’s a solo for the sake of having a solo (a piece in the puzzle, you see?) The solo might compromise some beautiful ideas but it can get boring (for me).

The main ingredient for hardcore, whatever ‘sub-genre’ you take (skramz, emo(core), post-hardcore, metalcore, whatever.. is passion.

And lyrics, of course, are a great part in this. Where metal tends to use lyrics about war/gore and related, historic events, etc. Hardcore tends to write about things involving your emotions and the aforementioned passion to change, change anything.

Music is a great medium to express these emotions and I like to use it as inspiration and solace.

Become one with yourself.
The faster we do this, the clearer our outlook will become.
The world that you take in every waking hour, might be the only one that
You have.
Because the task in life is to push yourself to be the only person
That you could die happy as and finding the feeling that takes you
Somewhere new.
To experience, is our goal.
To be closed minded is like taking a gift and throwing it away.
Our decisions they will stay. Actions will become answers. And people they
Will change. Yeah.
Because I had the most beautiful feeling inside, and I pushed everything
Else in my life aside.
I had it, I felt it, embraced the warmth of it.
And now that it's gone I won't stop until I find it. Even if it takes a
Lifetime.


If I want to hear about fecal stuffed **** stumps…I don’t want to hear about that. If I want to hear about war, I’ll turn on the news.
Using (metal) music for this, again, is boring.

And besides, I learned that hardcore doesn’t equal simple harmonies (try to listen to It Prevails’ latest record) or generic musical ideas (try Thursday) but that passion is still a priority. Good (modern) hardcore bands can make worn-out progressions (think i VI VII) still acceptable when added some slight differences in timing and/or adding countermelodies/picking stuff with lead guitar. This turn something from generic into solid. And solid into brilliant.

I just don't feel a rush of emotion when listening to cookie monster gutturals, or some long-haired guy singing opera. And of course they are technically skilled. But still boring

However I feel a rush of emotion listening to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFpL5Nw2GQY
And countless other bands.

And i'd like to end with saying that the best music lies in the underground scene (same for metal imo) and you better search there

goodnight
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
Last edited by 08L1V10N at Sep 1, 2011,
#2
Quote by 08L1V10N

However I feel a rush of emotion listening to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFpL5Nw2GQY
And countless other bands.


Well that explains everything
A heathen, conceivably
but not,

I hope,
I’m not ashamed to be white
Vi doede ikke... vi har aldri levd
Barbarism is the natural state of mankind
Civilization is unnatural

It is a whim of circumstance
an unenlightened one
#3
??

And it wasn't the best example
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
#5
nah.
Watching from a distance by Warning is an exception on my whole post of course
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
#6
Did you really think that making a huge post about why you don't like metal in the metal forum was a good idea?

This thread is dumb and I think it would be best if it were closed.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#9
So please don’t get me wrong. I don't want to bash the genre at all.


Oh really!????


I just don't feel a rush of emotion when listening to cookie monster gutturals, or some long-haired guy singing opera
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#10
I do like metal. look at my fav bands list, it's 50/50
And yes in this mainly elitist forum it might seem like a bad idea. But maybe people can throw good arguments in.

Being close-minded is like taking a gift and throwing it away

again, a hardcore lyric


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There is so much wrong with this I don't even know where to start.


do your best please!
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
Last edited by 08L1V10N at Sep 1, 2011,
#11
It doesn't matter "what you mean" to be honest I don't give a flying monkeys if you are a huge metal fan or not. There is no discussion to be had here. All you've done is give an opinion; it's basically a blog post.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
Last edited by ChemicalFire at Sep 1, 2011,
#13
agreed. I was only hoping for Wildchild to pop in here and say something funny
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
#15
I'd like to hear why people find metal mostly not boring
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
#16
yah one day ull learn u can get emotion from any type of music. the fact that u stereotyped metal as having grunts or long haired opera singers or being about war and that crap just makes ur whole arguement invalid.
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Teddy-Metal
for those who like to mosh, but just wanna cuddle afterwards

smashing pumkins fans=)^
#18
I find the structural intricacy of Metal allows it to go through many different emotions in one song and makes it more stimulating mentally and emotionally to listen to. Hardcore is limited because the writers can't look past their own perspective and rely on their emotions for content, which falls short because it it limited to their own sentiment, the removed nature of metal allows for more abstraction and room to create a more vast landscape of emotional and ideological content.It is not so much of an "i'm happy" or " i'm sad" kind of feeling you should get from listening to say Angelcorpse, rather, you get a vast vision of conquering armies and the power at display resonates with the listener and creates a large amount of complex emotions and ideas linked together. Hardcore is great music for expressing simple emotional ideas, but it's lack of being able to move on past it, is it's greatest strength and weakness compared to Metal.
My issue with hardcore is that while i like some of it, allot of the time it seems way to self centered and the individuals are too based around their own existence within the modern world, i also dislike moral hardcore that spends it time pointing out that people aren't "acting the way they should" by their standards and proceed to make a song were they can whine about that.
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.

#21
Quote by 08L1V10N
I'd like to hear why people find metal mostly not boring

Because they like it?
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and Jon777 .


#24
Christ dude, I agree with the sentiment of what you're saying and even I think this is retarded. Also you didn't argue your point very well, and mentioning It Prevails 100000 times is no way to give an example of how hardcore is ebtter than metal... they are not and never have been a hardcore band.

Unrelated: what thread did you get that quote in your sig from? It seems like it would be fun to read.
My name is Danny. Call me that.
#25
Quote by Riffmast
I find the structural intricacy of Metal allows it to go through many different emotions in one song and makes it more stimulating mentally and emotionally to listen to. Hardcore is limited because the writers can't look past their own perspective and rely on their emotions for content, which falls short because it it limited to their own sentiment, the removed nature of metal allows for more abstraction and room to create a more vast landscape of emotional and ideological content.It is not so much of an "i'm happy" or " i'm sad" kind of feeling you should get from listening to say Angelcorpse, rather, you get a vast vision of conquering armies and the power at display resonates with the listener and creates a large amount of complex emotions and ideas linked together. Hardcore is great music for expressing simple emotional ideas, but it's lack of being able to move on past it, is it's greatest strength and weakness compared to Metal.
My issue with hardcore is that while i like some of it, allot of the time it seems way to self centered and the individuals are too based around their own existence within the modern world, i also dislike moral hardcore that spends it time pointing out that people aren't "acting the way they should" by their standards and proceed to make a song were they can whine about that.


thank you
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
#26
I guess that makes sense... But a lot of hardcore/deathcore/crapcore music is just 'you broke my heart, now I'm gonna kill you' with as many f-cks thrown in as possible. I can't say it sounds brilliant because it just sounds over done. And hardcore breakdowns pretty much ruin a song for me. I feel the same with metal on certain aspects, but I feel so much passion coming from a metal singer talking about war and how much they hate it. I don't listen to grunty growly metal much, but I think there are good and bad parts to every genre (except classical and jazz)

In my most basic opinion if I had to describe metal and hardcore what first comes to mind:

Metal: Music > Lyrics
Hardcore: Lyrics > Music

Some hardcore bands and their sub genres have both great music and a great message, and so does metal. But I would rather listen to this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYeSKZjNH_s

Than to this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nn4QsRmm6Y0


I'd prefer to listen to something where I know that the musicians can show their skills in a great fashion (metal) than listen to something that's more hit and miss, and just has something to say about being yourself, with boring music behind it (Hardcore)

I enjoy both genres. But hardcore is like punk to me, it's totally acceptable if one doesn't know jack about music as long as they claim to be 'hardcore' and doing it for 'the message'.

Example: I wrote a semi-hardcore song with my band, and our singer is a 'it's about the art, I don't need to learn everything' kind of people, and I wrote a guitar solo for the song that sounded pretty good, and came up with a simple unrepetitive rhythm under it. He wanted me to change it to a 3 chords rhythm because it was 'too technical to be hardcore'. And I agree with Riffmast. Hardcore is personal, but really annoying sometimes.
Quote by willT08
Quote by HowSoonisNow
How was Confucius death metal?
You've clearly never read any Confuscius.

As I wait on the edge of the earth,
I can see the walls being torn down again
Only to be rebuilt in another name,
On a different day
Last edited by thePTOD at Sep 1, 2011,
#27
I understand what you are saying, but most of your points are invalid. There wouldn't be any hardcore style music without there being metal first. As for not having emotion, have you ever listened to Megadeth's "In My Darkest Hour" or "Addicted to Chaos"? You can't get much more emotional than that.

In my opinion, Hardcore music is nothing but an imitation of metal, but with whiny singers or aggressive punks, just a few steps away from emo, or a few steps away from actual punk. Not saying that it is bad, but saying that it is better than the genres that spawned it is incorrect.

Everyone has their own opinions,I have mine and you have yours, but most of your points on this subject are invalid, have no structure beyond "this is better because I think it is"
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This is terrible advice. Even worse than the useless dry, sarcastic comment I made.

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#28
Oh ok you meant "that kind" of hardcore, take back anything remotely good i said about hardcore in comparison. I was talking about real hardcore, not the populist, bitter sweat, scene girl stuff.
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.

#30
Hardcore works really well for workout music. If I want to actually sit down and listen to something, it'll be metal though.

Related: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBXcNr_CLlE
Quote by severed-metal
Come to think of it, my penis should've listened to more death metal.


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#31
Well OP.

I don't enjoy some shitty random breakdowns and attempts at guitar leaks with a guy with a gay looking haircut singing like he is being buttfucked.

So yeah I don't know how people enjoy that aberration which you posted. Oh well I guess we are even.
#32
Stray From The Path, now there is an awesome Hardcore band
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#33
Quote by stonyman65
I understand what you are saying, but most of your points are invalid. There wouldn't be any hardcore style music without there being metal first. As for not having emotion, have you ever listened to Megadeth's "In My Darkest Hour" or "Addicted to Chaos"? You can't get much more emotional than that.

In my opinion, Hardcore music is nothing but an imitation of metal, but with whiny singers or aggressive punks, just a few steps away from emo, or a few steps away from actual punk. Not saying that it is bad, but saying that it is better than the genres that spawned it is incorrect.

Everyone has their own opinions,I have mine and you have yours, but most of your points on this subject are invalid, have no structure beyond "this is better because I think it is"

Holy shit...
My name is Danny. Call me that.
#34
Quote by stonyman65
I understand what you are saying, but most of your points are invalid. There wouldn't be any hardcore style music without there being metal first. As for not having emotion, have you ever listened to Megadeth's "In My Darkest Hour" or "Addicted to Chaos"? You can't get much more emotional than that.

In my opinion, Hardcore music is nothing but an imitation of metal, but with whiny singers or aggressive punks, just a few steps away from emo, or a few steps away from actual punk. Not saying that it is bad, but saying that it is better than the genres that spawned it is incorrect.

Everyone has their own opinions,I have mine and you have yours, but most of your points on this subject are invalid, have no structure beyond "this is better because I think it is"


No actually, most of early extreme metal was inspired by Discharge(Thrash came from mixing hardcore and metal together, hardcore has been a genre since the late 70's/early 80's and has nothing to do with this shit). The shit he was talking about is'nt even hardcore, and this thread is full of idiots.

Edit: This is real Hardcore.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICBvzYjTu9o&feature=related
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.

Last edited by Riffmast at Sep 1, 2011,
#35
eh, thrash metal came after hardcore ( taking influence) of it and then slayer influenced death metal etcetra.
Quote by razorback91
Im sorry, I just don't see how you could argue that hardcore isn't metal. That just seems arrogant to me.

Yes, its its own kind of metal, but its still metal.
#36
Quote by 08L1V10N
I have listened to metal and its vast amount of sub-genres a real lot.
So please don’t get me wrong. I don't want to bash the genre at all. I consider Metal to be the most skilled, intelligent, vast and deep music since classical music.

However, it something bores me and sometimes even annoys me.
I'll try not to tell any history on hardcore music or completely covering all characteristics or something but...let's start here

It feels like metal is for a big part used as a medium to bash pop-music (which is good of course)


Not really, and most of, no all of todays pop music is garbage. It used to be filled artists who could actually sing without autotune or some some synth garbage.

Quote by 08L1V10N
Where pop music most often relies on predictable song stuctures and consonant melodies, death metal (for example) has a lot of different riffs/ideas, mostly being chromatic and dissonant plus the well known grunts.


That's a stereotype of death metal.


Quote by 08L1V10N
The problem for me as a listener occurs in the fact that I sometimes don’t hear an expression of emotions but I hear the aforementioned journey of a composer. .



So in other words, their emotions.

Quote by 08L1V10N
Take guitar solos; hardcore music often shuns them. And I think I know why..


Because they don't have the creativity or skill to play them?

Quote by 08L1V10N
It feels like there’s a solo for the sake of having a solo (a piece in the puzzle, you see?) The solo might compromise some beautiful ideas but it can get boring (for me)..


So beautiful music bores you.

Quote by 08L1V10N
The main ingredient for hardcore, whatever ‘sub-genre’ you take (skramz, emo(core), post-hardcore, metalcore, whatever.. is passion.


That's the most generic thing I've ever heard. I could say that for any song/genre. Doesn't mean its true, seeing as how I didn't write said songs.

Quote by 08L1V10N
And lyrics, of course, are a great part in this. Where metal tends to use lyrics about war/gore and related, historic events, etc. Hardcore tends to write about things involving your emotions and the aforementioned passion to change, change anything.


Oh wow, another complete stereotype about metal. Insomnium for example, sings about mourning, loss, pain, and nature.


Quote by 08L1V10N
Music is a great medium to express these emotions and I like to use it as inspiration and solace.


Insert overused generic lyrics here.

Quote by 08L1V10N
If I want to hear about fecal stuffed **** stumps…I don’t want to hear about that. If I want to hear about war, I’ll turn on the news.
Using (metal) music for this, again, is boring.


Awful stereotype and you should feel ashamed.

Quote by 08L1V10N
And besides, I learned that hardcore doesn’t equal simple harmonies (try to listen to It Prevails’ latest record) or generic musical ideas (try Thursday) but that passion is still a priority. Good (modern) hardcore bands can make worn-out progressions (think i VI VII) still acceptable when added some slight differences in timing and/or adding countermelodies/picking stuff with lead guitar. This turn something from generic into solid. And solid into brilliant.



And yet at the beginning you said metal was much more complex. The thing is, HXC is either really simple or so technical its still shit.

Quote by 08L1V10N
I just don't feel a rush of emotion when listening to cookie monster gutturals, or some long-haired guy singing opera. And of course they are technically skilled. But still boring.



Even though you said they make beautiful music. But then again I guess its your fault you find beautiful music boring. And on top of that its EVEN MORE stereotypes.
#37
**** you guys, I have a response but am not near my computer. Keep this going until I return next Tuesday. It will make you feel good.
#38
no
Quote by Steve08
Acid probably makes you feel less like a hedonistic raver piece of trash, too.

#39
listen to metalcore?

personally, i hate throwing myself into one particular genre...i can find metal bands i love and metal bands i hate, so saying "i love/hate metal" just doesn't describe my taste in music.

this is my solution and i've found it works for me: pick and choose bands from every genre you like and disregard to ones you don't. don't label yourself or the music you listen to, just listen to what sounds good to you.

and listen to btbam, they solve everything.
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A Brain Malfunction

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