Page 1 of 2
#1
so as i was walking to school today, i was thinking about sunday coming up. football. new squidbillies. but obviously there was the nagging reminder that our country was forever changed ten years ago on that day. you hear a lot about post-9/11 america. and on morning joe today they played news reels from september 10th, 2001 calling it the last day of pre-9/11 america. which is obvious, but i guess i'd never heard it phrased that way and it was kind of haunting to think about. there's no doubt that 9/11 defined the decade of american history, and perhaps even the next several.

as i walked along i started thinking about the oklahoma city bombing on a slightly related note. i thought about how domestic terrorists (though IMO conspiratorial opintion i believe they nabbed the wrong one) exploded a bomb killing men, women and children at a federal building.

and then an interesting scenario:

what would the last decade have been like if it were domestic terrorists, not unlike timothy mcveigh and jared lee loughner, who had flown those planes into the buildings? what would america be like? what would have happened if they were right-wing terrorists? left-wing terrorists? where would we be today? civil war? would we be better off? worse off?

TL;DR -- what would the last decade have been like if american terrorists had been the ones to perpetrate 9/11?

what this thread is NOT: this thread is not about some "inside job" conspiracy theory. we're merely speculating what would have happened if this tragedy had been at the hands of the american equivalent to the al qaeda
#DTWD
Last edited by primusfan at Sep 9, 2011,
#3
I was just thinking today how different America would be if those events hadn't occurred at all. It's mind boggling to think of the radical changes the disaster threw our way.

For domestic terrorists, I'm sure there would have been some backlash, but no where really for a war to blossom out. I'd like to imagine that even at domestic terrorists, we'd be better off.
#4
Quote by blake1221
I was just thinking today how different America would be if those events hadn't occurred at all. It's mind boggling to think of the radical changes the disaster threw our way.

For domestic terrorists, I'm sure there would have been some backlash, but no where really for a war to blossom out. I'd like to imagine that even at domestic terrorists, we'd be better off.


I agree with this; there'd be no one to fight.

#5
The Patriot Act would have been scarier.
The UG Awards exist only to instill me with existential doubt.


For me, the 60's ended that day in 1978...

Willies. Fuck the lick and fuck you too.
#6
It's an interesting thought. I remember America being a lot different before the attack happened, having visited a few times before and after.
#7
9/11/01 was the day America progressed into the state it is today. Terrible court system, terrible politicians, everything's fake, the music sucks. 9/11 was going to happen no matter what, as it was planned and done by the up and up government, so I guess there's no real point in thinking of what America, or the world for that matter, would be if it didn't happen. But if the Illuminati would have waited 10 years to turn the world to shit, then it would probably be the amazing place it was until September 11th, 2001.
#8
My mind goes to the shootings in Olso and on the island of Utoya in Norway not long ago.

That was pretty much the same scale of "destruction" if you take into account the populations, maybe the shootings were even bigger

Anyways, I see no change in Norway (though without living there, I'm sure this is slightly untrue). They're trialling him and that's it

Internal terrorists doing 9/11? What could they (America) do, after that? Be devestated that it happened and get on with life.. There is no one to trace, track, start war against
#9
We (the world) wouldn't be in a financial crisis because American's wouldn't be occupied with war for once in 70 years.

Airport security would have been alot faster and alot smoother.

Privacy would still be pretty much the same as before.

The European Onion would not be hammering so much on unification and integration of 'poorer' countries.

We wouldn't care as much about everything ?

The American government would have been scolded at by the UN since they would go on a war in the middle-east anyway, just using a different and non-global reason.

Electric cars would not exist in it's current form.

Dinosaurs would be revived and tamed for Russian soldiers to ride.

Kawaii would be cool.

Chicks would go dig some more **** ?

We would all write in a Cuneiform language.
#11
My history teacher earlier today, said that the 90's could be viewed as the 1920's since the economy was doing really doing, and people were living life freely/comfortably, yaddi yaddah. And that 9/11 could be viewed the same as the crash of '29. Following that the great depression, and following 9/11 a huge recession as well as the war on terrorism and in afganistan. I know thtas a little off topic, and kinda pointless. But just something else to think about.
Please call me Rainer, was 16 and empty minded when I made my profile.

Sometimes I talk to myself too...but never on the internet.
#13
Quote by blake1221
I was just thinking today how different America would be if those events hadn't occurred at all. It's mind boggling to think of the radical changes the disaster threw our way.




I think this is the big one.

How radically different would the entire face of the Earth be without those occurrences. I mean, just think how many things that happened were directly attributed to the attacks having taken place. Then all the things that were caused because of those things...and so on, ad infinitum.

Not just that, if anyone is, as I am, a believer in something like the butterfly effect. How different would everything be.
#14
The world would be more peaceful (inb4 "dur middle east would be ****ed up anyway")

The USA would probably be some kind of police state... the paranoia it's suffered the past decade would be much, much worse, seeing as the potential terrorists would no longer stick out like sore thumbs.
#15
Quote by TheBurningFish
The Patriot Act would have been scarier.


This. I think the kind of detention without trial that happened to many alleged "Islamists" would have been extended to anyone perceived to be anti-government.

Quote by Lord_Doku
We (the world) wouldn't be in a financial crisis because American's wouldn't be occupied with war for once in 70 years.
[...]
The American government would have been scolded at by the UN since they would go on a war in the middle-east anyway, just using a different and non-global reason.



Last edited by National_Anthem at Sep 9, 2011,
#16
I probably wouldn't of been selected for "random extra screening" (or whatever it's called) at the airport a couple years back.
#17
Quote by sam b
My mind goes to the shootings in Olso and on the island of Utoya in Norway not long ago.

That was pretty much the same scale of "destruction" if you take into account the populations, maybe the shootings were even bigger

Anyways, I see no change in Norway (though without living there, I'm sure this is slightly untrue). They're trialling him and that's it

Internal terrorists doing 9/11? What could they (America) do, after that? Be devestated that it happened and get on with life.. There is no one to trace, track, start war against


This.

I think the Coalition would have still got involved in Middle Eastern affairs, but for different reasons, and probably at a different time.
WHOMP

Think of that next time you are not allowed to laugh.
#18
i still wouldn't
give a ****
Whenever the Will to Power, in no matter what form, begins to decline, a physiological retrogression, decadence always supervenes.
-Friedrich Nietzsche
#19
America would have had to declare war on America in order to make the world safe for democracy and to prevent the terrorists from winning, or at least that's what happens if you follow the logic behind the mass murder in Afghanistan to its logical conclusion.

In reality nothing would have really happened, if the people who did 9/11 had been from Canada do you think they'd have bombed the shit out of Canada? Of course they ****ing wouldn't.
Same for anywhere else, the mass murder going on in the middle east is nothing to do with terrorism and it never has been, 'islamic terrorism' has been the scare tatic that's used to try to get the public to agree with these imperalist invasions. It is all about money, just like everything else in this world.

The whole 'war on terror' is insane, it's the equivilent of bombing Sicily if they thought the mafia were operating there, no one would support that though but it highlights the stupidity of this.

edit: on a related note
Last edited by Zoot Allures at Sep 9, 2011,
#20
probably not that different, i'm sure the far right hated islam just as much before 9/11. maybe they'de be less security, but security measures been increasing before 9/11 aanyway
Quote by ErikLensherr
It's threads like this that separate grammar Nazis from only mildly anti-Semitic grammar conservatives.
#22
Quote by Zoot Allures


I've been worried about this for years

If the terrorists actually did have WMD's and decided to use them, guess who's going down with America. Canada and Mexico
Gotta keep my eyes from the circling skies...
tounge tied and twisted just an earth bound misfit...

>CRYPTIC METAPHOR<


Quote by ilikepirates
ilikeyou.

not hated
#23
Quote by ChadLikesGuitar
9/11/01 was the day America progressed into the state it is today. Terrible court system, terrible politicians, everything's fake, the music sucks. 9/11 was going to happen no matter what, as it was planned and done by the up and up government, so I guess there's no real point in thinking of what America, or the world for that matter, would be if it didn't happen. But if the Illuminati would have waited 10 years to turn the world to shit, then it would probably be the amazing place it was until September 11th, 2001.


Just checked and you were born in 1994, which means you had about 7 years experience of pre 9/11 America. So I dunno if I'm gonna trust your verdict about the court system and how it's changed over the years.
So true. If 9/11 hadn't happened there would be such great music everywhere all the time. Because it's 9/11's fault that the world is full of shit music. Not just you having a closed mind.
Yeah nah. Sorry bro but no, 9/11 was not a conspiracy by the American Government to go to war with Iraq for cheap oil. Show some respect to the deceased victims of 9/11 and mourn them instead of casting their deaths as some cheap government ploy.

Also:

what this thread is NOT: this thread is not about some "inside job" conspiracy theory. we're merely speculating what would have happened if this tragedy had been at the hands of the american equivalent to the al qaeda
#24
9/11. It's been ten years already and I think americans should stop blowing shit out of proportion. How much longer are they going to mourn every 11/9(it's date before month in the real world)? Shit happens. Get over it.

It's actually easier then most people think to assemble a 'dirty' bomb within a country's border. The hardest part is smuggling weapons grade plutonium/uranium, but it's not unheard of. Imagine a nuclear bomb detonating out of the blue in several cities. Somebody can do that shit. But I don't give a ****.
THE SOLE PURPOSE OF THIS SIG IS TO GRAB YOUR ATTENTION TO THIS POST OF UTTER GENIUS
Last edited by Grimriffer at Sep 9, 2011,
#25
Quote by devourke
Just checked and you were born in 1994, which means you had about 7 years experience of pre 9/11 America. So I dunno if I'm gonna trust your verdict about the court system and how it's changed over the years.
So true. If 9/11 hadn't happened there would be such great music everywhere all the time. Because it's 9/11's fault that the world is full of shit music. Not just you having a closed mind.
Yeah nah. Sorry bro but no, 9/11 was not a conspiracy by the American Government to go to war with Iraq for cheap oil. Show some respect to the deceased victims of 9/11 and mourn them instead of casting their deaths as some cheap government ploy.

Also:

What a pathetic and absurd strawman. Questioning the official story on any is not disrespectful to anyone who died, it's trying to find out the truth about what happened instead of accepting being lied to, i don't know how your mind has managed to turn that into something 'offensive', i suppose being brainwashed by the media for years will make you believe stupid things though.
#26
Quote by Zoot Allures
America would have had to declare war on America in order to make the world safe for democracy and to prevent the terrorists from winning, or at least that's what happens if you follow the logic behind the mass murder in Afghanistan to its logical conclusion.

In reality nothing would have really happened, if the people who did 9/11 had been from Canada do you think they'd have bombed the shit out of Canada? Of course they ****ing wouldn't.
Same for anywhere else, the mass murder going on in the middle east is nothing to do with terrorism and it never has been, 'islamic terrorism' has been the scare tatic that's used to try to get the public to agree with these imperalist invasions. It is all about money, just like everything else in this world.
The whole 'war on terror' is insane, it's the equivilent of bombing Sicily if they thought the mafia were operating there, no one would support that though but it highlights the stupidity of this.

edit: on a related note
stupidimagezootshaspostedeverychancehegets



You're just getting so lazy now, it's like you're trying to attack America but you've just run outta bullshit to pull out of your ass. Just give it up already
Quote by ErikLensherr
Don't belittle it like that, your mom produces top quality stuff.



C4C
[thread="1339859"]Hammerhead[/thread]
[thread="1341152"]Anglerfish[/thread]

VOTE
Thrustor: 2012
#27
Quote by vicarious46
You're just getting so lazy now, it's like you're trying to attack America but you've just run outta bullshit to pull out of your ass. Just give it up already

I'm not trying to attack 'america', i'm against the actions of the government, and the other governments that have participated in all this too actually.

How about you argue against the things i've said instead of making some nonesense point crying about how i'm 'attacking america'? What do you want me to call the deaths of 100s of thousands of civillians? Collateral damage is what it gets called in the media i think, sounds much less emotive doesn't it, makes it sound as if it's okay when you say it with a phrase like that.
Last edited by Zoot Allures at Sep 9, 2011,
#29
Quote by MakinLattes
Remember the reaction to school shootings in the 90s? That times the entire country.
This but times two.

It's definitely weird/interesting to think about.
*-)
Quote by Bob_Sacamano
i kinda wish we all had a penis and vagina instead of buttholes

i mean no offense to buttholes and poop or anything

Rest in Peace, Troy Davis and Trayvon Martin and Jordan Davis and Eric Garner and Mike Brown
#30
Quote by Zoot Allures
I'm not trying to attack 'america', i'm against the actions of the government, and the other governments that have participated in all this too actually.

How about you argue against the things i've said instead of making some nonesense point crying about how i'm 'attacking america'.


No, sorry not tonight, I find your arguements kind of boring seeing as they rarely lack hard-evidence as their base and are completely ignorant of what is ACTUALLY going on.

EDIT: I apologize if I 'derailed' this thread or aided in anyway I hate when threads like this turn into irrelevant arguements
Quote by ErikLensherr
Don't belittle it like that, your mom produces top quality stuff.



C4C
[thread="1339859"]Hammerhead[/thread]
[thread="1341152"]Anglerfish[/thread]

VOTE
Thrustor: 2012
Last edited by vicarious46 at Sep 9, 2011,
#31
Quote by Zoot Allures
I'm not trying to attack 'america', i'm against the actions of the government, and the other governments that have participated in all this too actually.

How about you argue against the things i've said instead of making some nonesense point crying about how i'm 'attacking america'? What do you want me to call the deaths of 100s of thousands of civillians? Collateral damage is what it gets called in the media i think, sounds much less emotive doesn't it, makes it sound as if it's okay when you say it with a phrase like that.

This is why it will never be worthwhile trying to have a conversation with you. All you ever want is an argument. Not intelligent discussion, or a reasonable debate. An argument.
#32
Quote by Zoot Allures
What a pathetic and absurd strawman. Questioning the official story on any is not disrespectful to anyone who died, it's trying to find out the truth about what happened instead of accepting being lied to, i don't know how your mind has managed to turn that into something 'offensive', i suppose being brainwashed by the media for years will make you believe stupid things though.


You obviously don't know anyone that died in 9/11

Have you considered trying to find out the truth without purposely trying to stir people up. If every 9/11 conspiracist spent as much time trying to back their story up as they did just spouting shit on the Internet, I'd be a little more inclined to listen to you. All I ever hear from you guys is, "lololol sheeple open your eyes stop following the flock baa baa", just give it a rest and let people think what they want to think.

Yup, blatantly disregarding human life for the sake of trying to look better than everyone else. Forgive me if I'd rather be a sheep who is considerate of other people and their losses, than a chronic shit stirrer who lives on reviving other peoples pain.
#33
Quote by nincompoop
One can only hope that 9/11/11 won't overshadow 9/11/01 with something worse.


this is how they really won. the towers collapsing, tragic as it was, was the least of the consequences.

1) they have bled our country dry into debt
2) they've further polarized our political parties to exacerbate said economic issues
3) they've made us look over our shoulder in fear.

anyone who has had their house robbed knows that what the robber/mugger really takes is your peace of mind. your shit doesn't matter. it's the idea that your security was compromised and you were helpless.

same with 9/11. is there a plot to kill innocent on sunday? maybe. but the fact is they have made us so afraid that if they cry wolf, we'll jump every time.
#DTWD
#34
Quote by Dirge Humani
This is why it will never be worthwhile trying to have a conversation with you. All you ever want is an argument. Not intelligent discussion, or a reasonable debate. An argument.

You can have a reasonable argument, i've heard the word used almost interchangeably with 'debate' before too, i don't really ever get all riled up at the computer anyway, so i'm not looking for some really 'heated' argument where everyones hammering away at the keys and getting really angry.

I'm not trying to start an argument about what an argument is either ._.
#35
Quote by devourke
You obviously don't know anyone that died in 9/11

Have you considered trying to find out the truth without purposely trying to stir people up. If every 9/11 conspiracist spent as much time trying to back their story up as they did just spouting shit on the Internet, I'd be a little more inclined to listen to you. All I ever hear from you guys is, "lololol sheeple open your eyes stop following the flock baa baa", just give it a rest and let people think what they want to think.

Yup, blatantly disregarding human life for the sake of trying to look better than everyone else. Forgive me if I'd rather be a sheep who is considerate of other people and their losses, than a chronic shit stirrer who lives on reviving other peoples pain.

I'm not trying to revive peoples pain, if they don't want to talk about 9/11 then they shouldn't be posting in a thread about 9/11. If you post views on a forum you should at least expect people to reply to them , or realise they could.
#36
If I stop posting on Sunday you'll know the sons of bitches took out Queens.
Quote by jakesmellspoo
ooh look at me i'm ERIKLENSHERR and i work at fancy pants desk jobs and wear ties and ply barely legal girls with weed and booze i'm such a classy motherfucker.
#37
Quote by sam b
My mind goes to the shootings in Olso and on the island of Utoya in Norway not long ago.

That was pretty much the same scale of "destruction" if you take into account the populations, maybe the shootings were even bigger

Anyways, I see no change in Norway (though without living there, I'm sure this is slightly untrue). They're trialling him and that's it


Slightly off-topic, but since it was mentioned:
Norway has definitely changed a bit after the shootings on Utøya. We feel like a more united people, I mean, people that have never met smiles and says "hello" at the grocery store, we give up seats for each other on the bus etc. I think it is amazing that instead of showing hate for Breivik after the shootings, we show love for each other instead.
Quote by apple_apple
oh my god! guitarViking is a genius... respect !!!

I'm GuitarViking! Don't you forget it!
#38
Quote by Zoot Allures
I'm not trying to revive peoples pain, if they don't want to talk about 9/11 then they shouldn't be posting in a thread about 9/11. If you post views on a forum you should at least expect people to reply to them , or realise they could.



If you're not trying to revive peoples pain why do you have to be such a dick about it? TBH I'm pretty sure you care more about how WT7 came down than the people that died in it.

And you call me pathetic.
#39
Quote by devourke
If you're not trying to revive peoples pain why do you have to be such a dick about it? TBH I'm pretty sure you care more about how WT7 came down than the people that died in it.

And you call me pathetic.

How am i being a dick about 9/11? I could quite easily make the claim that you're being a dick for saying i'm being a dick about it, because my original post is referencing the mass murder carried out at the orders of the US government in Iraq and Afghanistan, hundreds of thousands of civillians have died for an imperalist war. You should be angry at your government and everyone elses for killing people for a pointless imperialist campaign that benefits the elite and using 9/11 and the emotional turmoil of the time as the excuse.

Being a dick about 9/11 would be if i was saying '9/11 was a good thing', saying 'the official reponse to 9/11 was disgusting' is not in any way an insult to those who died. I think you'd find a lot of people affected by 9/11 who would probably disagree with the wars too, i don't think they're being offensive to themselves.

edit: and i've been arguing about wtc7 in the other thread because that's what the discussion came to, i'm not going to have people to make a strawman argument at me and try to use it as a way to get me to stop debating an issue. That's idiotic, it's reasonable to question whatever you want and to try to claim that this questioning is offensive is a really pathetic way to try to get the person to shut up.
Last edited by Zoot Allures at Sep 10, 2011,
#40
What I wonder about people who will remember 9/11 for it's victims:

Will you also remember the people outside of America who died in that event and the events leading from it? Not just foreign people who were in one of the towers at that day, but also say civil victims in Afghanistan and Iraq?

And about some the "terrorists" who have been wrongly imprisoned and tortured in Guatanamo Bay? Just today I read an article about an Al Jazeera cameraman, who had been imprisoned, sexually intimidated and was forced-fed when he refused to eat. All because the US was wondering why Al Jazeera had these "scoops" about Bin Laden's videotapes.

I think it's those people who deserve more consideration, simply because of the irrational "retribution" style of ill-based and poorly argumented response to the event.
Page 1 of 2