Poll: "Hello Krusty Krab?" "No this is PATRIOTISM"
Poll Options
View poll results: "Hello Krusty Krab?" "No this is PATRIOTISM"
1 - I've already started the revolution
32 14%
2
18 8%
3 - I write demeaning stuff about it on the Internet
37 16%
4
19 8%
5 - It's k, bro
38 16%
6 - It's better than k, bro
29 12%
7
33 14%
8 - I'd die to protect it and the people that live in it
20 9%
9
2 1%
10 - My country is perfect and I don't want it to ever change
5 2%
Voters: 233.
Page 2 of 4
#41
Quote by daytripper75
I'm not a big fan of a lot of US politics, and I don't like some of our foreign policy decisions. That said, I quite enjoy living here.

This. I do like Britain, or at least the parts I've seen of it. However, it required no work or effort on my part to be born from here, so I can't really be proud of being from it. Proud of working hard at uni/guitar etc? Yes. An accident of birth? Nah.
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#42
Quote by devourke
So you propose that we all share resources or something? Then would every landmass on the world report to one global leader and be under one set of global laws? I don't think that's what you're planning because that sounds like it wouldn't work very well.

Please elaborate on your plan


Human laws for human residents of planet Earth. How about that for a change.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#43
Quote by darkstar2466
Human laws for human residents of planet Earth. How about that for a change.


Who decides on these laws though? You'd have to take into account all the different religions, cultures and all that whatnot and then tell them that these are the new laws that they'd have to follow. It seems nice but it doesn't seem viable on a global scale.
#44
i voted 5 though because it really it like k, bro. there doesn't seem to be much hope in having individuals actually having anything to do to change it other than going through massive amounts of politics, which i strongly dislike. that could just be me being highly cynical, though.
#45
Quote by devourke
Who decides on these laws though? You'd have to take into account all the different religions, cultures and all that whatnot and then tell them that these are the new laws that they'd have to follow. It seems nice but it doesn't seem viable on a global scale.


I didn't say anything about us being ready for that yet. We've got a lot of ideological restructuring cut out for us, and if we don't get there in time... well... there is a cutoff point. I don't want to get into that.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#46
Quote by darkstar2466
I didn't say anything about us being ready for that yet. We've got a lot of ideological restructuring cut out for us, and if we don't get there in time... well... there is a cutoff point. I don't want to get into that.


You're acting like the world's gonna end bro, are there some Spanish rebels with access to a stockpile of Nuclear Arms or something?

But when you say "We've got a lot of ideological restructuring" do you mean the whole world or just a few countries at a time? Because I seriously doubt that every country in the world is going to hand over power to one global government and relinquish whatever power they're currently holding.

Out of curiosity what sort of government did you see ruling the world?
#47
Quote by devourke
Who decides on these laws though? You'd have to take into account all the different religions, cultures and all that whatnot and then tell them that these are the new laws that they'd have to follow. It seems nice but it doesn't seem viable on a global scale.
no you dont, religion should never be taken into account when redacting laws, although i agree that religion freedom is a must
#48
I think it's ludicrous to have pride in your country while ignoring all that is bad about your country, that kind of patriotism is insane.

To me, true patriotism is feeling the need to improve your country because it's your country.
#49
Quote by devourke
You're acting like the world's gonna end bro, are there some Spanish rebels with access to a stockpile of Nuclear Arms or something?

But when you say "We've got a lot of ideological restructuring" do you mean the whole world or just a few countries at a time? Because I seriously doubt that every country in the world is going to hand over power to one global government and relinquish whatever power they're currently holding.

Out of curiosity what sort of government did you see ruling the world?


Nah, I'm looking at it from a purely evolutionary perspective. Species collapse, prevalent in humans inducing it on fish, isn't something humans aren't immune to by inducing it unto themselves.

These are just silly ideals of mine. We're going nowhere anytime soon boys. Let's grab a couple of beers and watch who wins the 2012 elections.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#50
Quote by StewieSwan
Wow I can't believe how many of you don't know what patriotism is. It is not taking pride in the accomplishments of your country. It is devotion to your country. If you campaign for something you believe in because you think it will better your country, then you are a patriot, you angsty fucking teenagers.


Speak of the devil.
V


"The standard dictionary definition reads “love of one's country.” This captures the core meaning of the term in ordinary use; but it might well be thought too thin and in need of fleshing out. In what is still the sole book-length philosophical study of the subject, Stephen Nathanson (1993, 34–35) defines patriotism as involving:

* Special affection for one's own country
* A sense of personal identification with the country
* Special concern for the well-being of the country
* Willingness to sacrifice to promote the country's good"


In other words, patriotism is the embodiment of the idea that your country deserves more than others - with no other objective reason than you being a citizen of it.

That's not even the point though. The point is what people think, do, and say in the name of patriotism. Sure, good things can come out of it, but learning from history the opposite is true most of the time. I really couldn't care less about what it means to you personally, and calling people angsty doesn't exactly help your case.
#51
* Special affection for one's own country
* A sense of personal identification with the country
* Special concern for the well-being of the country
* Willingness to sacrifice to promote the country's good"

In other words, patriotism is the embodiment of the idea that your country deserves more than others - with no other objective reason than you being a citizen of it.
None of those things imply that. At all.
#52
Quote by Ahteh
"The standard dictionary definition reads “love of one's country.” This captures the core meaning of the term in ordinary use; but it might well be thought too thin and in need of fleshing out. In what is still the sole book-length philosophical study of the subject, Stephen Nathanson (1993, 34–35) defines patriotism as involving:

* Special affection for one's own country
* A sense of personal identification with the country
* Special concern for the well-being of the country
* Willingness to sacrifice to promote the country's good"


In other words, patriotism is the embodiment of the idea that your country deserves more than others - with no other objective reason than you being a citizen of it.

That's not even the point though. The point is what people think, do, and say in the name of patriotism. Sure, good things can come out of it, but learning from history the opposite is true most of the time. I really couldn't care less about what it means to you personally, and calling people angsty doesn't exactly help your case.


I meet all these criteria but I don't believe New Zealand deserves more than others. I'd die to defend it, but I wouldn't invade another country for the benefit of more power towards New Zealand. The country I love would never ask me to do such a thing though, so it looks like I'm all good in that department.

EDIT:


Quote by crohno
no you dont, religion should never be taken into account when redacting laws, although i agree that religion freedom is a must


That's exactly the point of taking religion into account. If religious freedom is a must then you can't create a law which stops a person from fully practising every part of their religion.
Last edited by devourke at Sep 13, 2011,
#53
Quote by Ahteh
"The standard dictionary definition reads “love of one's country.” This captures the core meaning of the term in ordinary use; but it might well be thought too thin and in need of fleshing out. In what is still the sole book-length philosophical study of the subject, Stephen Nathanson (1993, 34–35) defines patriotism as involving:

* Special affection for one's own country
* A sense of personal identification with the country
* Special concern for the well-being of the country
* Willingness to sacrifice to promote the country's good"


In other words, patriotism is the embodiment of the idea that your country deserves more than others - with no other objective reason than you being a citizen of it.

That's not even the point though. The point is what people think, do, and say in the name of patriotism.
Sure, good things can come out of it, but learning from history the opposite is true most of the time. I really couldn't care less about what it means to you personally, and calling people angsty doesn't exactly help your case.



Change patriotism into religion and see if you still think it's fair to say that. In the way that it's unfair to brand Islam as a violent religion because there are some muslims who do violence in its name, it is also unfair to scorn patriotism because of the extreme nationalism that it can sometimes result in.


As I stated previously, nationalism and patriotism aren't the same thing.
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Last edited by StewieSwan at Sep 13, 2011,
#54
Quote by StewieSwan
Change patriotism into religion and see if you still think it's fair to say that. In the way that it's unfair to brand Islam as a violent religion because there are some muslims who do violence in its name, it is also unfair to scorn patriotism because of the extreme nationalism that it can sometimes result in.


As I stated previously, nationalism and patriotism aren't the same thing.


I'm not branding anyone, I'm not trying to attack you or other patriots personally. I'm just opposing patriotism as a concept, and the role it has in the modern world. I'm opposed to religion as well, if you'd like to draw that parallel, but that doesn't mean I hate every religious person. I just don't agree with them.

The point I was making above is that patriotism is - in the end - irrational. Which is why it doesn't appeal to me.

Devourke stated that he was proud of New Zealand in the post I responded to, which is why I posted that quote.
#55
Quote by Ahteh
I'm not branding anyone, I'm not trying to attack you or other patriots personally. I'm just opposing patriotism as a concept, and the role it has in the modern world. I'm opposed to religion as well, if you'd like to draw that parallel, but that doesn't mean I hate every religious person. I just don't agree with them.

The point I was making above is that patriotism is - in the end - irrational. Which is why it doesn't appeal to me.

Devourke stated that he was proud of New Zealand in the post I responded to, which is why I posted that quote.


It's possible to be proud of your country without thinking that it's the best country on the face of the planet though. I can say that I'm proud to live here and that I love my country. That's not to say that I think that the whole world should bow down to New Zealand's mighty rule because we're superior. Dying to protect my neighbours, the people that I see on the streets everyday, my friends, my family and everyone else in this wonderful country just doesn't seem irrational to me.

I love my country and my countrypeople


#56
Quote by devourke
I love my country and my countrypeople


That's just fine... do you love all other countries and all other countrypeople just the same?
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#57
Quote by Ahteh
I'm not branding anyone, I'm not trying to attack you or other patriots personally. I'm just opposing patriotism as a concept, and the role it has in the modern world. I'm opposed to religion as well, if you'd like to draw that parallel, but that doesn't mean I hate every religious person. I just don't agree with them.

The point I was making above is that patriotism is - in the end - irrational. Which is why it doesn't appeal to me.

Devourke stated that he was proud of New Zealand in the post I responded to, which is why I posted that quote.



Pride doesn't necessitate superiority. It is not dangerous if you don't believe it to be superior.
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#59
Quote by darkstar2466
That's just fine... do you love all other countries and all other countrypeople just the same?


I got some love for Australians, but keep that on the down low because Australians and New Zealanders are never supposed to admit that we secretly like each other.

As for the other countries and countrypeople; I can say that I don't, because not having lived anywhere except Australia and New Zealand, I don't really know what the people are like outside of the Pacific. I am curious though, so I usually ask what it's like in other countries whenever I talk to someone in a different country. So I love New Zealand more than any other country in the world, I'm never gonna say that New Zealand is better than any other country.
#60
I'm from England.

My country has flaws, my country folk have flaws, we have a rich culture and history and we have a lot to be proud of, but we also have a lot to be ashamed of.

I would say despite this I am fiercely patriotic, although I accept being born here was completely accidental so to be patriotic in a sense is quite silly, at the same time for the last 30+ years a cultural marxist agenda has been trying to diminish what is great about our country and make us feel ashamed to be proud, aswell as selling off our culture and replacing it with a foreign culture. It's now become frowned upon to fly our national flag. I'm neither racist nor xenophobic and I appreciate and celebrate many cultures, however I feel my own nation and culture is under attack and so this has bred a patriot in me.

Yeah.
#61
Yeah, I´s so far the only one to vote 10. Norway is awesome.
Quote by apple_apple
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#63
I find it interesting how Americans are giving answers more in relation to the historical understanding of patriotism. Might possibly be due to historical reasons. (This is not to undermine anything. I always have a soft spot for radical political philosophies in history, not excluding anglo-American radicals in the 18th century.)
Last edited by Craigo at Sep 13, 2011,
#64
I am not captain America but i do like my country. I think that most countries have good and bad, mine included. I am living in Korea currently and i have been to japan and loved it. the only thing that makes me feel a semi-swell of patriotism is when America is being trashed online. I hate that it has become cool to trash America by people who have never been there. Just as i would never say harsh words toward other countries (that i have not been too) i do not appreciate hearing it of my country. Do we have problems? Of course, but so does every other country.
Quote by BlackVoid
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#65
Quote by devourke
I got some love for Australians, but keep that on the down low because Australians and New Zealanders are never supposed to admit that we secretly like each other.



Hmmm... are you sure you're from New Zealand, being all nice about Aussies???


lol jokes, I would also like to have some mutual love between Aus & NZ. Although I can't see that happening with TV like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9kkVo7Rv8g

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#67
Quote by GuitarViking
Yeah, I´s so far the only one to vote 10. Norway is awesome.


So is your paint (Jotun). After dealing with this chore yearly to keep our wood outside in good condition, I finally won't have to worry about it now for the next couple of years. More time for something else. Woot!

My wife always wants to go south for the holidays. I want to go north! But I heard Norway is pretty expensive though. Fact or false?
Just because I have some strong opinions doesn't mean I agree with everything I say.
Last edited by xgunterx at Sep 13, 2011,
#68
Quote by Don Pedro
I'm from England.

My country has flaws, my country folk have flaws, we have a rich culture and history and we have a lot to be proud of, but we also have a lot to be ashamed of.

I would say despite this I am fiercely patriotic, although I accept being born here was completely accidental so to be patriotic in a sense is quite silly, at the same time for the last 30+ years a cultural marxist agenda has been trying to diminish what is great about our country and make us feel ashamed to be proud, aswell as selling off our culture and replacing it with a foreign culture. It's now become frowned upon to fly our national flag. I'm neither racist nor xenophobic and I appreciate and celebrate many cultures, however I feel my own nation and culture is under attack and so this has bred a patriot in me.

Yeah.


Yeah, bloody Thatcher and her Marxism.
Looking to buy a Fender Jagstang, u sellin?
#69
Quote by Cal UK
Yeah, bloody Thatcher and her Marxism.

"If God exists, there's no way he is French" - Andrea Pirlo

S A D B O Y S
#70
I'm only patriotic in the presence of the english.
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#71
Quote by zenbone
I am not captain America but i do like my country. I think that most countries have good and bad, mine included. I am living in Korea currently and i have been to japan and loved it. the only thing that makes me feel a semi-swell of patriotism is when America is being trashed online. I hate that it has become cool to trash America by people who have never been there. Just as i would never say harsh words toward other countries (that i have not been too) i do not appreciate hearing it of my country. Do we have problems? Of course, but so does every other country.


All them other countrys are just jealous of our freedom.
#72
No I'm not patriotic. I have no love government, current or past, and I have no love for the sheep like metality that has infected a large chunk of the population. There's nothing to be proud of, and UK heritage is basicaly built off suffering and smashing the underlings, there's nothing to be proud of.
#73
Quote by DaveM666
No I'm not patriotic. I have no love government, current or past, and I have no love for the sheep like metality that has infected a large chunk of the population. There's nothing to be proud of, and UK heritage is basicaly built off suffering and smashing the underlings, there's nothing to be proud of.


lmao
#74
I think the UK is a good place to live, in certain places. I'm grateful I live here, but I'm in no way proud to be British.. because I had no say in living here, I didn't earn my citizenship, neither did I make this country what it is today.

Patriotism is a concept I don't really understand... it's just taking other people's achievements and feeling glory from them because you live on the same plot of land as them.
#75
Quote by Weaponized
This


Seeing how you're an illegal alien, why would you be in America if you didn't like it?

Why would you stay here if you don't even support it?
#76
You have got to remember that this is the Pit. Everyone is allowed to like their country except Americans

That being said, I love it here. The only other place I would consider moving is probably Canada, since they are pretty similar imo. I'm probably a 7 or 8
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she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#78
Quote by WCPhils
You have got to remember that this is the Pit. Everyone is allowed to like their country except Americans

This is hardly confined to the Pit. It exists in the real world too, go to another country and start expressing pride in the USA and see how quickly many people will become hostile.
The reason for this is fairly obvious, the US's foreign policy for the last 50 or so years has been absolutely deplorable in the eyes of most of the world. People understandably have a reaction against anything that they could see as condoning it. This is the same problem that the British face when expressing patriotism around people who have not forgotten the actions of the British in the past, the US gets it worse because they're seen as still at it right now and completely unrepentant (unlike the Brits who have at least apologised for lots of their stuff)


I understand that some people see patriotism more as being happy to live in a certain place or liking their country, but for many (especially people on the outside looking in) patriotism is linked to support for the actions of the state, both past and present. I don't think that it's unfair, given this understanding of patriotism, that people would attack American Patriotism.
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#79
Quote by Ur all $h1t
*long post*


Yea, I understand that. It makes sense too.

It just starts to get annoying when people from the UK and Canada, and Australia are talking about how they like it there and nobody cares, but once someone mentions they like living in America, you get the typical responses. "hurr durr, 'merica. Fuck Yea!"

I know that the U.S. is by no means perfect, but I do enjoy living here.
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#80
4 - U.S.A.

If I could live in another country that just doesn't mess around with others and lets people actually be free, then I would move there.
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