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#1
Okay guys i'm planning to get a Schecter Hellraiser C-1 FR Special. but i just wanna know what's the difference between the one without the "Special" name?

Okay besides the pickups, inlays, the paint job and the price what's the difference?

Hellraiser C-1 FR

http://www.schecterguitars.com/Products/Guitar/Hellraiser-C-1-FR.aspx



Hellraiser Special C-1 FR

http://www.schecterguitars.com/Products/Guitar/Hellraiser-Special-C-1-FR.aspx

#3
No coil tapping on the special either.
NOW PART OF THE

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#4
Quote by bragglefraggle
the floyd and tuners on the special are worse

well whats wrong with the floyd rose on the guitar? forgive me because i'm such a newb on knowing floyd rose bridges.
#5
Quote by GibsonMan321
No coil tapping on the special either.
What's coil tapping? is it something to do with the pups?
#6
The biggest difference is that the Floyd on the Special is way worse than the one on the regular Hellraiser.

Basically with floyds, the cheaper ones are made out of metal that is soft, and so eventually, it will wear down, and the guitar won't stay in tune. It can sometimes be dealt with, but in some cases, the guitar can become unusable if the bridge has worn enough.

Coil tapping is a feature on some pickups that lets you essentially only use half the power of the pickup, so you get more of a single coil esque tone. It really doesn't make your humbuckers sound like single coils, but it does give you more tonal options.

EDIT: With the cheaper floyds, if you take care of them, they can last a long time, depending on how much you abuse them. If you take really good care of them, and only wank on them when they are perfectly set up, you should get at least 5 years out of the trem. Possibly even 10. If you don't abuse the trem, and only use it for light vibrato, and you set it up perfectly, I see no reason why you wouldn't be able to get 15-20 years out of it.

But personally, after many dumb purchases and learning everything I know the hard way, I'd advise you to invest in the better guitar now. You'll save a lot of money if you just get the "real thing" early on. The FRT-1000's aren't quite at the level of OFR, but they're still damn good trems. They use really good metals.
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Last edited by Offworld92 at Oct 3, 2011,
#7
thanks alot Offworld92! now i'm gonna aim for the one that doesn't have the special version. but the problem is it cost alot!
#8
Pickups are different too. On the regular Hellraisers, you've got EMG 81TW and 89 pickups, both of which can be split to activate a single coil sound. On regular humbuckers, that means you only use one coil. EMGs work like that too. It's a single coil housed in there that activates when tapped. Specials come equipped with the standard 81/85 which can't be tapped. Cool thing with EMGs though is that changing pickups is really easy. Licensed trems can be a pain sometimes, but with any Floyd or it's licensed counterparts all it takes is an understanding about how it actually works. Once you know that, they aren't too bad.

However, I wouldn't really trust one for too long. Problem is, they're still not built like the OFR. Schaller licensed units being the exception. The only trems I trust are Edge and OFR. I personally haven't seen licensed units last that long. Usually the owner switches it out. I've had old guitars with 20+ year old OFR and Edge trems that still work perfectly. Point is, while some things are more expensive and we're all impatient to save up for them, in the long run you'll be far better off. Trust me, save that extra month or so to get the better one.
Last edited by Fenderexpx50 at Oct 3, 2011,
#12
Quote by philipk
nope, why?

Because Schecters are cheap used here. Are you sure a Schecter is the best deal for your money?
#13
Quote by W4RP1G
Because Schecters are cheap used here. Are you sure a Schecter is the best deal for your money?

in the link i gave him theres basically the guitar he wants just with a different top and finish, for 600$ instead of 900$, and its new
i'd say its a pretty good deal
#14
Quote by philipk
in the link i gave him theres basically the guitar he wants just with a different top and finish, for 600$ instead of 900$, and its new
i'd say its a pretty good deal

Well, I was actually asking the TS if he was in the US. Sorry, I should have made that more clear.
#15
i have the original hellraiser before they swapped the 81/85 to 81tw/89. even though the specs appear to be the same, the tuners dont add up to my grovers, (does schecter even use grover anymore?).

the special just feels kinda cheap.i only played the string thru special so i didnt play the FR special but like others said an OFR will hold up better.
Ibanez RG1550 Prestige
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Peavey 6505+ 112 combo
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#16
Quote by GibsonMan321
No coil tapping on the special either.

OH GOD NO
WHAT AN EXPENSIVE FEATURE TO BE MISSING.
#17
Quote by coolstoryangus
OH GOD NO
WHAT AN EXPENSIVE FEATURE TO BE MISSING.


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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
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#19
egad
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#20
Quote by coolstoryangus
OH GOD NO
WHAT AN EXPENSIVE FEATURE TO BE MISSING.


Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
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Ibanez RGA42E
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#21
Pretty much the Hellraiser C1 has better binder and inlays IMO and has coil tapping and a better Floyd. Go to different music stores and try to find a good deal on either of the guitars. The music store I always go to is selling Hellraiser C1 FR brand new at lower price than it originally sells for, and it's one of the models with an OFR instead an FRT-1000, which I plan on buying as soon as I can afford it. Also, always check the Shopping section of Google (100% serious.) I saw a Hellraiser C1-FR in black selling for $649 on a music site that received good reviews. That's something to keep in mind. Good luck shopping.
#22
Quote by xShade
Pretty much the Hellraiser C1 has better binder and inlays IMO and has coil tapping and a better Floyd. Go to different music stores and try to find a good deal on either of the guitars. The music store I always go to is selling Hellraiser C1 FR brand new at lower price than it originally sells for, and it's one of the models with an OFR instead an FRT-1000, which I plan on buying as soon as I can afford it. Also, always check the Shopping section of Google (100% serious.) I saw a Hellraiser C1-FR in black selling for $649 on a music site that received good reviews. That's something to keep in mind. Good luck shopping.


AFAIK, Schecters have never had OFR's. They just called them that, even though they were FRT-X000's. Could be wrong, maybe someone can confirm this for sure
Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
Fractured Instinct
(For fans of Death/Groove/Prog Metal)

Ibanez RGA42E
Ibanez S420
LTD H-301
Ibanez RG520
Peavey Predator USA
Douglas Grendel 725
Line 6 Pod HD500X
#23
just to point out, as no-one seems to have mentioned it yet, one seemed to have a maple neck while the other had mahogany. While neither is "better", they'll probably sound a bit different.

Quote by Offworld92
AFAIK, Schecters have never had OFR's. They just called them that, even though they were FRT-X000's. Could be wrong, maybe someone can confirm this for sure


+1

Unless I had good reason to believe it (like... they take apart the trem on a stock schecter straight from the factory and i see the made in germany stamp), I would assume that every korean-made guitar which claims to have an OFR actually has an frt-x000.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

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Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Oct 4, 2011,
#24
Quote by Dave_Mc
just to point out, as no-one seems to have mentioned it yet, one seemed to have a maple neck while the other had mahogany. While neither is "better", they'll probably sound a bit different.


+1

Unless I had good reason to believe it (like... they take apart the trem on a stock schecter straight from the factory and i see the made in germany stamp), I would assume that every korean-made guitar which claims to have an OFR actually has an frt-x000.

Go on YouTube and search for a review on the Hellraiser C1-FR. ProGuitarShop did one and said that it had an OFR. I would send you a link but I'm on my phone so I can't. Sorry.
#25
Quote by Dave_Mc
just to point out, as no-one seems to have mentioned it yet, one seemed to have a maple neck while the other had mahogany. While neither is "better", they'll probably sound a bit different.


+1

Unless I had good reason to believe it (like... they take apart the trem on a stock schecter straight from the factory and i see the made in germany stamp), I would assume that every korean-made guitar which claims to have an OFR actually has an frt-x000.

Mine has a OFR...but it was an earlier run. Doesnt have coil tapz!!! either.
Guitars:
LTD KH-602
LTD M-15
Schecter Hellraiser FR (for sale w/hsc, pm me.)
BC Rich Bronze WarCock
BC Rich Ironbird1
Tokai Voyager
Jackson JS30 Kelly
Vester: Metal flake gold/black crackle
Vester: rainbow crackle
Carvin V220
#26
^ a schaller one? the made in germany stamp and all?

as you say, though, if it's an early one that may be so, the frt-x000 is a reasonably recent thing. But certainly now, unless proven categorically otherwise, i'd assume frt-x000.

I know i had a bc rich gunslinger retro for a little while (and before i bought it i even emailed them to ask and they said it was a schaller), and I'm pretty sure it was the korean floyd. I didn't take it out to see the "made in germany" stamp (as i was sending it back and didn't want to ding it or something daft), but the string clamps looked like the characteristic frt-xooo ones.

Quote by xShade
Go on YouTube and search for a review on the Hellraiser C1-FR. ProGuitarShop did one and said that it had an OFR. I would send you a link but I'm on my phone so I can't. Sorry.


a lot of people use the term interchangeably... that doesn't really prove anything, unfortunately. My local shop swore blind that the charvel US production models had proper OFRs, despite the charvel website saying they have frt-x000s.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Oct 4, 2011,
#27
Quote by Dave_Mc
^ a schaller one? the made in germany stamp and all?

as you say, though, if it's an early one that may be so, the frt-x000 is a reasonably recent thing. But certainly now, unless proven categorically otherwise, i'd assume frt-x000.

I know i had a bc rich gunslinger retro for a little while (and before i bought it i even emailed them to ask and they said it was a schaller), and I'm pretty sure it was the korean floyd. I didn't take it out to see the "made in germany" stamp (as i was sending it back and didn't want to ding it or something daft), but the string clamps looked like the characteristic frt-xooo ones.


a lot of people use the term interchangeably... that doesn't really prove anything, unfortunately. My local shop swore blind that the charvel US production models had proper OFRs, despite the charvel website saying they have frt-x000s.

Last time i checked, i have bad memory though, i'll check next time its apart. Gotta clean that girl to a shine before i sell it. the FRT's werent around at the time i bought it, i believe.
Guitars:
LTD KH-602
LTD M-15
Schecter Hellraiser FR (for sale w/hsc, pm me.)
BC Rich Bronze WarCock
BC Rich Ironbird1
Tokai Voyager
Jackson JS30 Kelly
Vester: Metal flake gold/black crackle
Vester: rainbow crackle
Carvin V220
#28
FR is Crap on the specials mate.. xD
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#29
Quote by BreeBreeMiikey
Last time i checked, i have bad memory though, i'll check next time its apart. Gotta clean that girl to a shine before i sell it. the FRT's werent around at the time i bought it, i believe.


yeah that's possible

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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#30
Maple will make the guitar sound a bit brighter as opposed to an all mahogany build. It also clarifies the tone a bit when paired with a warmer wood. Makes the bass less present. It's really down to the guitarist to decide. Both are good, just different.
#31
Quote by Dave_Mc
^ a schaller one? the made in germany stamp and all?

as you say, though, if it's an early one that may be so, the frt-x000 is a reasonably recent thing. But certainly now, unless proven categorically otherwise, i'd assume frt-x000.

I know i had a bc rich gunslinger retro for a little while (and before i bought it i even emailed them to ask and they said it was a schaller), and I'm pretty sure it was the korean floyd. I didn't take it out to see the "made in germany" stamp (as i was sending it back and didn't want to ding it or something daft), but the string clamps looked like the characteristic frt-xooo ones.


a lot of people use the term interchangeably... that doesn't really prove anything, unfortunately. My local shop swore blind that the charvel US production models had proper OFRs, despite the charvel website saying they have frt-x000s.


I understand. Here's the link incase: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foHziXC-N3k

To be honest I've never had anyone tell me that a guitar has an OFR but really means to say that it has an FRT. Don't get me wrong, it's better than a licensed POS trem, but if I'm paying a lot for a guitar that is supposed to have one it better have it. They also supposedly changed the necks from neck-thru to set necks. I wonder why.
#32
Didn't floyd rose start making cheap trems because he didnt make money from licensed ones anymore?

A while back original floyd rose meant original floyd rose..
#33
Quote by xShade

To be honest I've never had anyone tell me that a guitar has an OFR but really means to say that it has an FRT. Don't get me wrong, it's better than a licensed POS trem, but if I'm paying a lot for a guitar that is supposed to have one it better have it. They also supposedly changed the necks from neck-thru to set necks. I wonder why.


Schecter and BC Rich have been doing it for a while - this is the first time I've seen a Schecter that actually says it has an FRT-X000. But I know even just a few months ago that they still said OFR, which even despite whether the older models had them or not, is probably a lie.

It is true that older models might have OFR's. I didn't realize how new FRT's were. Old LTD Deluxe's have OFR's too, it seems. They changed the name on their site in '06 or '07.

Again, not saying FRT's are bad trems, they're not, just a matter of honesty. Stuff like this is why some people hate Blackstar.

About the neck build, they most likely changed it for the reason that they changed from OFR's to FRT's. It's cheaper.
Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
Fractured Instinct
(For fans of Death/Groove/Prog Metal)

Ibanez RGA42E
Ibanez S420
LTD H-301
Ibanez RG520
Peavey Predator USA
Douglas Grendel 725
Line 6 Pod HD500X
#34
Quote by xShade
I understand. Here's the link incase: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foHziXC-N3k

To be honest I've never had anyone tell me that a guitar has an OFR but really means to say that it has an FRT. Don't get me wrong, it's better than a licensed POS trem, but if I'm paying a lot for a guitar that is supposed to have one it better have it.


yep, same here the frt i had was useable (some of the cheapo ones you alluded to aren't ), but noticeably not as nice as a schaller OFR, gotoh, etc.

Quote by coolstoryangus
Didn't floyd rose start making cheap trems because he didnt make money from licensed ones anymore?

A while back original floyd rose meant original floyd rose..


yeah i think so. the patent ran out on the non-low profile ofr. And rather than let companies put their own FR on it, floyd decided to manufacture his own version of the licensed ones at a price that meant it was daft for the guitar companies not to use them. Plus having the name "Floyd Rose" on them, rather than "licensed", would probably shift a fair few more units.

I mean even someone like me who knows exactly what's going on is more likely to buy something with an FRT or special than a generic licensed floyd, because those licensed ones can be a crapshoot. And at least the floyd-branded ones, if the worst comes to the worst, can be replaced pretty easily by an ofr.

Quote by Offworld92

Again, not saying FRT's are bad trems, they're not, just a matter of honesty. Stuff like this is why some people hate Blackstar.


+1. I mean i'd rather have an frt than just about any licensed floyd, other than the known kickass ones (schaller, gotoh, original edge, etc.).

Just don't try to pretend it's a schaller-made OFR, or that it's exactly the same as one.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
Last edited by Dave_Mc at Oct 5, 2011,
#35
ahahahahaha that pro guitar shop vid says it has a flame maple top as well. that's clearly a quilt.

So yeah, don't put too much stock in what they're saying- i like their vids, but get your specs from the manufacturer's website.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#36
Quote by Dave_Mc
ahahahahaha that pro guitar shop vid says it has a flame maple top as well. that's clearly a quilt.

So yeah, don't put too much stock in what they're saying- i like their vids, but get your specs from the manufacturer's website.

Back when I saw the video I didn't even have a electric. I was still playing on an acoustic.

Quote by Offworld92
Schecter and BC Rich have been doing it for a while - this is the first time I've seen a Schecter that actually says it has an FRT-X000. But I know even just a few months ago that they still said OFR, which even despite whether the older models had them or not, is probably a lie.

It is true that older models might have OFR's. I didn't realize how new FRT's were. Old LTD Deluxe's have OFR's too, it seems. They changed the name on their site in '06 or '07.

Again, not saying FRT's are bad trems, they're not, just a matter of honesty. Stuff like this is why some people hate Blackstar.

About the neck build, they most likely changed it for the reason that they changed from OFR's to FRT's. It's cheaper.

What happened with Blackstar? I only found out about them recently through a guitar magazine.

You're right about the honesty part. I'm not saying set neck and an FRT-X000 are bad but I don't want a set neck and now the only neck thru OFR equipped Schecter's are artist sigs and custom shops, which I can't afford.

EDIT:
Quote by Dave_Mc
+1. I mean i'd rather have an frt than just about any licensed floyd, other than the known kickass ones (schaller, gotoh, original edge, etc.).

Just don't try to pretend it's a schaller-made OFR, or that it's exactly the same as one.

+1. I remember being interested in the Jackson RR24 and reading that it had an OFR on it and pearl inlays when I read something on here and a few other sites that it had a licensed Floyd and plastic inlays. What made me upset was that it cost $1200 and they don't have the nice features that you expect out of expensive guitars.
Last edited by xShade at Oct 5, 2011,
#37
Quote by xShade
(a) Back when I saw the video I didn't even have a electric. I was still playing on an acoustic.


(b) What happened with Blackstar? I only found out about them recently through a guitar magazine.

(c) You're right about the honesty part. I'm not saying set neck and an FRT-X000 are bad but I don't want a set neck and now the only neck thru OFR equipped Schecter's are artist sigs and custom shops, which I can't afford.

EDIT:

(d) +1. I remember being interested in the Jackson RR24 and reading that it had an OFR on it and pearl inlays when I read something on here and a few other sites that it had a licensed Floyd and plastic inlays. What made me upset was that it cost $1200 and they don't have the nice features that you expect out of expensive guitars.


(a) ahaha no worries

(b) they strongly imply that their ht series amps are all-tube, when they have a lot of ss stuff going on in the signal path.

(c) ah it sucks when you're all set to buy something and then they change the specs for the worse

(d) yeah. I mean at their old prices (~£600 in the UK) i'd have put up with an FRT. But considering a lot of them now are pushing the £1k mark, I'd really want a schaller OFR.
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Quote by K33nbl4d3
I'll have to put the Classic T models on my to-try list. Shame the finish options there are Anachronism Gold, Nuclear Waste and Aged Clown, because in principle the plaintop is right up my alley.

Quote by K33nbl4d3
Presumably because the CCF (Combined Corksniffing Forces) of MLP and Gibson forums would rise up against them, plunging the land into war.

Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Et tu, br00tz?
#38
to the guy who said the Specials feel cheap......I just bought one and it is one beautiful guitar....right up there with my American Fender in the feel of it..... the only real difference in the specials is no coil tapping, a maple a neck, and a Floyd Rose made of a zinc alloy. and for the record a zinc alloy is a very sturdy metal. Much stiffer then stainless steel.
#39
Quote by Offworld92
The biggest difference is that the Floyd on the Special is way worse than the one on the regular Hellraiser.

Basically with floyds, the cheaper ones are made out of metal that is soft, and so eventually, it will wear down, and the guitar won't stay in tune. It can sometimes be dealt with, but in some cases, the guitar can become unusable if the bridge has worn enough.

Coil tapping is a feature on some pickups that lets you essentially only use half the power of the pickup, so you get more of a single coil esque tone. It really doesn't make your humbuckers sound like single coils, but it does give you more tonal options.

EDIT: With the cheaper floyds, if you take care of them, they can last a long time, depending on how much you abuse them. If you take really good care of them, and only wank on them when they are perfectly set up, you should get at least 5 years out of the trem. Possibly even 10. If you don't abuse the trem, and only use it for light vibrato, and you set it up perfectly, I see no reason why you wouldn't be able to get 15-20 years out of it.

But personally, after many dumb purchases and learning everything I know the hard way, I'd advise you to invest in the better guitar now. You'll save a lot of money if you just get the "real thing" early on. The FRT-1000's aren't quite at the level of OFR, but they're still damn good trems. They use really good metals.

The bridge on my guitar still stays in tune after almost 17 years (and I'm only 14 )
#40
Could get the special if you don't mind the neck and swap out the floyd for an ofr or gotoh and add coil taps with push pull pots if possible, and have a near identical guitar except for the look/neck wood.
EDIT: Cheaper that way too I believe.
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