#1
got a marshall jcm 900 4102 bout 4 months ago. dont know how old the power valves were or what kind they were cos they didnt have writing on them. sounded awesome though, just what i wanted. valves needed replacing though and it got sent away with me reassured valves would be swapped like for like. it came back with new valves and a bias. tried it and straight away was dissapointed. it seems louder, harsher, muddy at all gain settings on channel "B" and just generally poorer quality.

an example is this:
my setting was (on channel "B")...preamp 5/20.....master 8.5/10.....this was through an attenuator but still loud and sounded great. if i do that now its far muddier and harsher....no clarity. what do you think is wrong? valves nowadays rubbish in comparison? valves not replaced like for like? bias not to my liking? valves just need to bed in?
#2
New tubes need to 'break in' man
ProTone Pedals: Attack Overdrive
Fractal Audio: AxeFX 2
Engl: Fireball 60
Zilla: Fatboy 2x12
Carvin: DC700
Carvin: Vader 7
Schecter: KM-7 MKii
Schecter: Banshee 8 Passive
Jackson: DK2M
#3
do they? ive read different opinions on that......should they not break them in in-store so its ready for you when you get it back?
#4
Not unless you ask. Generally that would mean leaving the amp on for 10-20 hours, which isn't something a shop is likely to do with your amp. Some shops will do it but it's not exactly a 10 minute process. It's not convenient to them to have someone keeping an eye on your amp idling away in a back room all day long for 2 or 3 days, especially when you're going to break the tubes in yourself for free.
#6
Quote by anderson80
ok so would unbroken in tubes show the symptoms i mentioned above?


Can do, like speakers before they break in
ProTone Pedals: Attack Overdrive
Fractal Audio: AxeFX 2
Engl: Fireball 60
Zilla: Fatboy 2x12
Carvin: DC700
Carvin: Vader 7
Schecter: KM-7 MKii
Schecter: Banshee 8 Passive
Jackson: DK2M
#8
Quote by ethan_hanus
Speakers don't break in man, there was a huge argument on it a while ago...

Tubes however, do. Just play it a bunch, and it'll gradually get better.


Celestion and Eminence both have articles on their sites about break in. Don't want to high jack the thread, but if the manufacturer says there is break in, I'm going to listen to them...


After what has already been mentioned, my next guess would be perhaps it was biased differently.. i.e. "hotter" or "colder" than you were used to.


EDIT: What tubes did they put in there anyway?
Last edited by ChrisBW at Oct 5, 2011,
#9
Quote by ethan_hanus
Speakers don't break in man, there was a huge argument on it a while ago...

Tubes however, do. Just play it a bunch, and it'll gradually get better.


Link? I'd love to see how everyone came to the conclusion that speakers don't wear in at all. As in, if you buy them brand new, they don't don't sound at all better after a few days of playing.

Not even a bit.
ProTone Pedals: Attack Overdrive
Fractal Audio: AxeFX 2
Engl: Fireball 60
Zilla: Fatboy 2x12
Carvin: DC700
Carvin: Vader 7
Schecter: KM-7 MKii
Schecter: Banshee 8 Passive
Jackson: DK2M
#10
Quote by ethan_hanus
Speakers don't break in man, there was a huge argument on it a while ago...

Tubes however, do. Just play it a bunch, and it'll gradually get better.


Fail.


"Speaker break-in is no myth and something significant really does happen. "
http://www.eminence.com/2011/06/speaker-break-in/
#11
^^^^^

think about it. massive amounts of vibrations at varying frequencies, and nothing changes over the course of time? speaker will always sound the same, no matter what?


hogwash.
#12
Quote by ethan_hanus
Speakers don't break in man, there was a huge argument on it a while ago...

Tubes however, do. Just play it a bunch, and it'll gradually get better.

What the **** are you talking about? That is the most obviously wrong piece of information I've seen posted on here in earnest. The material the speaker is made of stretches out over time, and the excursion of the speaker effects sound... What more proof of concept do you need?
Quote by Cathbard
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BURN THE WITCH!!!!!
#13
Were the old tubes replaced with the same brand?
Hebrews 12: 29 "For our God is a consuming fire."

Warmoth humbucker-tele (specs soon to change), EHX 44 magnum power amp into 1x12 with WGS Retro 30 and a Barber Electronics Dual Unlimited.
#14
I just spent a couple of months breaking in a greenback clone. It sounds far better now than when I first installed it. Speakers don't need breaking in? Bollocks. The manufacturer even says they take a while to break in and I can confirm it. The sound it is putting out now compared to when it was brand new is chalk and cheese.

Tubes can sound better after they've had a bit of use but the difference is not remarkable. When you change tubes it should make the amp sound like a new one. After all, the ones you pulled out were shot weren't they? Compared to those brand new valves should sound heavenly.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#15
I don't know, Cath, a lot of the new production tubes I've been using recently have had a sort of harsh edge to them that was nearly unpleasant until they had a few hours on them. Sovtek and Tung-sol preamp tubes seem to be the worst offenders. I can definitely see how a person would be disappointed with the initial change.
#16
Perhaps. I stay away from New Sensor stuff as a rule. I'd even prefer Shuguang power tubes. Most of my amps are running JJ or Brimar - apart from my JCM900, it only deserves Shuguangs.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#17
^ I've heard that too about the Tung Sols.

As far as speakers never breaking in - that is pretty dank. Avatar sells broken in Celestions and rebrands them 'Hellatones'. Why? People like their speakers broken in when they buy them. I've had 'stiff' new speakers in several of my amps and there is no doubt they sound better after a couple of weeks/month of playing.

To my ears anyway.
#18
Absolute certainty that speakers break in, that's why my Weber Jensen repros had a bit of a treble spike at first whereas my original 60's Jensens sound like absolute ear sex. It's not subjective, it's fact, speakers DO change their sound as you play them in.
Gear:
Fender AVRI '62 Jazzmaster, Fender Gold Sparkle Strat (custom), Custom Swirled Roswell Rhoads
Marshall DSL15H, Weber Speakers, Fender Champs (x2),
'63 Fender Reverb, Mosrite Fuzzrite, Joe Bonamassa Fuzz Face, Whiteface RAT
Vintage Tubes!
#19
Give them a chance to wear in. Personally I hated my 4102 until I modded it (still not even close to my Abbey but at least it's playable now). Those clipping diodes on channel B are totally unnecessary. Taking them out doesn't even cut the amount of distortion, it just makes it sound better. I don't know what they were thinking.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band