#1
Hi
I used to know everything about secondary dominants and stuff, but now that I need it, I'm not sure anymore.
So I have this chord progression:

Gm7 | Gm7 Dm7 | Bbmaj7    | Gm7 |
C7  | C7      | Fmaj7 Eb7 | D7 :||


The main key is Bb major (or G minor) so from bar 1 till 4 I'd use that.
Then there is a modulation to F major, so far so good.
But then I come to the Eb7 D7 part.
Do I just play Bb major with a c# over Eb7?
And do I play Bb major with f# over D7?

I hope my question is clear,
Karel
#2
Doesn't sound like any modulation to me. I think it is entirely in G minor. So you use the G minor scale over all, use accidentals to accommodate for clashes, no modes.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#3
Quote by Karel Juwet
Hi
I used to know everything about secondary dominants and stuff, but now that I need it, I'm not sure anymore.
So I have this chord progression:

Gm7 | Gm7 Dm7 | Bbmaj7 | Gm7 |
C7 | C7 | Fmaj7 Eb7 | D7 :||


The main key is Bb major (or G minor) so from bar 1 till 4 I'd use that.
Then there is a modulation to F major, so far so good.
But then I come to the Eb7 D7 part.
Do I just play G Minor with a Db over Eb7?
And do I play G Harmonic Minor scale over D7?

I hope my question is clear,
Karel

What I've highlighted above will be more theoretically correct.

Aside from that, your note choice is spot on.
Last edited by mdc at Oct 7, 2011,
#4
Quote by mdc
What I've highlighted above will be more theoretically correct.

Aside from that, your note choice is spot on.


thanks

love your signature btw
Last edited by Karel Juwet at Oct 10, 2011,
#5
S'alright man. Nice progression, I like that sorta stuff.

Side note, the SD causes tonicization of the Fmaj7, but not for long enough to yield modulation.

To be more correct in the use of CST I would use D Phrygian Dominant over D7.
Last edited by mdc at Oct 10, 2011,
#6
Quote by Karel Juwet
Hi
I used to know everything about secondary dominants and stuff, but now that I need it, I'm not sure anymore.
So I have this chord progression:

Gm7 | Gm7 Dm7 | Bbmaj7 | Gm7 |
C7 | C7 | Fmaj7 Eb7 | D7 :||


The main key is Bb major (or G minor) so from bar 1 till 4 I'd use that.
Then there is a modulation to F major, so far so good.
But then I come to the Eb7 D7 part.
Do I just play Bb major with a c# over Eb7?
And do I play Bb major with f# over D7?

I hope my question is clear,
Karel


I would say you're in the key of F
ii - ii vi - IV - ii
V - V - I - bVII - V/ii

Not the most satisfying progression, but to my ears F is "home", not G.

it seems like maybe you were using theory to construct this progression? If so, consider getting the ear into the act. Learn to listen for functionality....... then come back to progression writing when you can hear where each chord is going.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 10, 2011,
#7
Apologies TS, the above is right. There are far more diatonic chords to F major than anything else. You can view the D7 as a SD, and the Eb7 as a passing chord.

Sorry if previous posts have mislead you.
#8
Quote by GuitarMunky
I would say you're in the key of F
ii - ii vi - IV - ii
V - V - I - bVII - V/ii

Fixed?
#9
Quote by mdc
Fixed?


Well, yeah it's a IV. It would be III in Gm. Was thinking about one and typing the other.
shred is gaudy music
#10
Does it sound like F major to you for the whole thing? Or for the first 4 bars in G Minor?
#11
Quote by mdc
Does it sound like F major to you for the whole thing? Or for the first 4 bars in G Minor?


all of it. the Gm7 never sounds home.
shred is gaudy music
#12
Maybe the Gm7 doesn't really sound like home because it's a V7-im7 instead of V7 Imaj7?

oh and this is just the A part of the song, the structure is pretty basic (AABA)
#13
Quote by Karel Juwet
Maybe the Gm7 doesn't really sound like home because it's a V7-im7 instead of V7 Imaj7?

oh and this is just the A part of the song, the structure is pretty basic (AABA)



Tell me this, was your goal for it to be in G minor before actually writing the riff, or did you use your ear to come up with the progression?

Also how familiar are you with the concept of chord function? for instance could you name the primary chords in the key of Gm and describe their function?

I could be wrong, but my instincts tell me that the reason you came up with what you did has to do with the answer to those 2 questions.
shred is gaudy music
Last edited by GuitarMunky at Oct 10, 2011,
#14
I hear it as G Minor the whole time. I definitely don't hear it being in F. There might be a passing key where the C7 - FM7 section is, but it's definitely G Minor to me. The C7 - FM7 would be a V/bVII which uses the Eb7 as a non-functioning dominant to get down to the D7, essentially creating what sounds like a (I -) bVII - bVI - V progression in G Minor, which is very common.


I would solo in G minor up until the section in F Major (C7 - C7 - FM7) which I would use F Major during and then the Eb7 is quick enough you could probably get away with just about anything, but something in Eb Mixo or Ab Minor could sound good and create a nice half-step movement down to the D7, where I would use a G Minor of some sort (Harmonic, most likely).
#15
Quote by AlanHB
Doesn't sound like any modulation to me. I think it is entirely in G minor. So you use the G minor scale over all, use accidentals to accommodate for clashes, no modes.

This.
Like in this little chord progression I came up with.
Amaj7|Gmaj.
This cannot fit diatonically in any key.
But it's still resolved at one chord so there is no modulation which is the Amaj7.
To make it sound good, the only accidental you need to make is a b7 over the G major chord.
Actually what I did was an overused rock idea, the b7 chord.
A major:
A B C# D E F# G# A
A G major triad is formed with the notes G B D.
So you just switch to the mixolydian SCALE for a second.
By highlighting the word SCALE is because you do not play in A mixo mode.
#17
Quote by piszczel
Don't play in scales man, follow chords
Yes but a b7 chord matches the mixolydian scale.
So that is actually following the chords.
#19
Quote by DiminishedFifth
Yes... play nothing but arpeggios!


Works for me!

Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy Sweepy

...

Sweep
#20
Quote by GuitarMunky
Tell me this, was your goal for it to be in G minor before actually writing the riff, or did you use your ear to come up with the progression?

Also how familiar are you with the concept of chord function? for instance could you name the primary chords in the key of Gm and describe their function?

I could be wrong, but my instincts tell me that the reason you came up with what you did has to do with the answer to those 2 questions.


I'm familiar with chord function, but I didn't write this song with G minor in mind.
I started with Gm7 and just played along with chords until I thought, now it's time to get back to the beginning so I used D7 to get back to Gm7

I uploaded a .wav file to show how it sounds with the voicings and other instruments here:
http://www29.zippyshare.com/v/67076886/file.html

(don't mind the 'trumpet' sound, I don't have recording tools so I put it in a DAW)