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#1
Can you be considered the best of the best in a sport if you have never won a championship in the sport?

There are a lot of great players in every sport that are considered top notch, but do they compare to other athletes that have won it all?

Inspired from hearing the tv in the other room...something to the effect of..."Until Lebron has won 6 championships, he doesn't come close to Jordan."
#2
Yeah, they can.

He hasn't won a major tournament but a lot of people consider him to be up there.
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#3
Totally guessed this would be about little kids who think Lebron is better than Jordan.
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#4
"Until Lebron has won 6 championships, he doesn't come close to Jordan."

Lebron, like Jordan, is one person. Usually, in team sports, the team wins championships.

A player can be the best and never win anything.
#5
Rex Grossman is considered the best QB of all time but he's never won a Super Bowl
#8
It's just one of the issues that comes up in team sports.
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#9
Depends on the sport imo. The Lebron criticism is somewhat fair since a single player has such a tremendous impact on the success of the team, whereas it's ridiculous to make the same criticism of say, a football or baseball player since those sports are much more team oriented.
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#10
Sports are usually a team effort. It doesn't matter if you have the best player ever if the rest of the team sucks.
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#11
Hard to win championships if you aren't on a good team. Not every great player ends up getting the necessary support to have a successful team to play on.
#12
Dan Marino was an incredible QB and a model teammate, he never won a super bowl.
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#13
Of course. Gilles Villeneuve and Stirling Moss are considered among the best, despite not winning F1 championships.
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#15
Quote by devourke
A good team is infinitely better than 9 good players.


True story, case in point, the Manchester derby in 10 hours, United will destroy City due to their team mentality even though City have arguably equal players.
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#16
Phil Kessel is currently the best hockey player in the NHL, and thus the best hockey player in the world right now, but he hasn't won a championship.
#17
Quote by Thrashtastic15
Phil Kessel is currently the best hockey player in the NHL, and thus the best hockey player in the world right now, but he hasn't won a championship.

Lol, this guy.

Just because Kessel has the most points doesn't mean he's the best hockey player in the league. Give it another two weeks and I guarantee you won't even be able to say that about him. Kessel is an above average forward, not an elite player.
#18
Quote by RU Experienced?
Lol, this guy.

Just because Kessel has the most points doesn't mean he's the best hockey player in the league. Give it another two weeks and I guarantee you won't even be able to say that about him. Kessel is an above average forward, not an elite player.

Kessel is a guy who could score 50+ easily with the right supporting cast/right motivation. He's an incredibly young player who oozes talent. He can score 30 with ahl players on his line easily, that's saying something. He's continuing to drastically improve his game in all facets, he's become a 200 foot player who can be relied upon in your own defensive zone with the game on the line. He's a dynamic offensive player who can do it all by himself, but if you surrounded him with a few other elite players, would be simply unstoppable. He hasn't even come close to his prime yet, that's the terrifying thing.

Look what he's done so far with a pathetic crew of Bozak and Lupul. You're just mad that Phil Kessel is a better player than anyone on the Caps. He's the American Sidney Crosby, just without the tears.
#19
Depends on how you rate "the best"?

Quote by Thrashtastic15
Kessel is a guy who could score 50+ easily with the right supporting cast/right motivation. He's an incredibly young player who oozes talent. He can score 30 with ahl players on his line easily, that's saying something. He's continuing to drastically improve his game in all facets, he's become a 200 foot player who can be relied upon in your own defensive zone with the game on the line. He's a dynamic offensive player who can do it all by himself, but if you surrounded him with a few other elite players, would be simply unstoppable. He hasn't even come close to his prime yet, that's the terrifying thing.

Look what he's done so far with a pathetic crew of Bozak and Lupul. You're just mad that Phil Kessel is a better player than anyone on the Caps. He's the American Sidney Crosby, just without the tears.

You run out of maple syrup or something?
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#21
Quote by Thrashtastic15
Kessel is a guy who could score 50+ easily with the right supporting cast/right motivation. He's an incredibly young player who oozes talent. He can score 30 with ahl players on his line easily, that's saying something. He's continuing to drastically improve his game in all facets, he's become a 200 foot player who can be relied upon in your own defensive zone with the game on the line. He's a dynamic offensive player who can do it all by himself, but if you surrounded him with a few other elite players, would be simply unstoppable. He hasn't even come close to his prime yet, that's the terrifying thing.

Look what he's done so far with a pathetic crew of Bozak and Lupul. You're just mad that Phil Kessel is a better player than anyone on the Caps. He's the American Sidney Crosby, just without the tears.

He's off to a hot start, if he can sustain it I'd be very impressed. Honestly I haven't seen a Leafs game this season yet so I can't say for sure if he has improved as much as you say he has. With Bozak and Lupul on his line he's sort of forced into doing more, who's to say we wouldn't see a drop in offensive production if he's paired up with competent players

I'd still maintain that it's too early to say he's the best in the league, but I was admittedly being overly abrasive in my initial post. He's still young, so he may continue to improve, I hope for your sake that I will eat my words in the future.
#22
Quote by RU Experienced?
He's off to a hot start, if he can sustain it I'd be very impressed. Honestly I haven't seen a Leafs game this season yet so I can't say for sure if he has improved as much as you say he has. With Bozak and Lupul on his line he's sort of forced into doing more, who's to say we wouldn't see a drop in offensive production if he's paired up with competent players

I'd still maintain that it's too early to say he's the best in the league, but I was admittedly being overly abrasive in my initial post. He's still young, so he may continue to improve, I hope for your sake that I will eat my words in the future.

You're already eating your words, Phil Kessel is, bar none, the best hockey player in the entire world right now.

As soon as Lupul got to Toronto Kessel started producing at over a ppg clip. It's obvious what he's producing at now. Kid is the real deal, he'll be scary once Colborne develops into a Canadian Sundin and Kadri puts everything together. Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup. Thank god I have so many different parade plans amassed.

I've already proven, through math, that Kessel will score at the very least 40 goals this year. As you've seen so far, math doesn't lie. Suck a **** OV dickrider
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COblVEDhIME&feature=related
Last edited by Thrashtastic15 at Oct 21, 2011,
#24
Transcendence of self.
Encouragement of self sacrifice.
Assimilation of self into the collective goal
Make them pay for doubting your resolve.

There are no great individuals.
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#25
I think winning a championship is more important in a retrospective, historical sense.
#26
Quote by Thrashtastic15
You're already eating your words, Phil Kessel is, bar none, the best hockey player in the entire world right now.
You know as well as I do that players can go through streaks.

As soon as Lupul got to Toronto Kessel started producing at over a ppg clip. It's obvious what he's producing at now. Kid is the real deal, he'll be scary once Colborne develops into a Canadian Sundin and Kadri puts everything together. Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup after Cup. Thank god I have so many different parade plans amassed.

I've already proven, through math, that Kessel will score at the very least 40 goals this year. As you've seen so far, math doesn't lie. Suck a **** OV dickrider
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COblVEDhIME&feature=related

Let's start with baby steps and aim for a playoff berth first. Impressive job finishing top shelf with Butler breathing down his junk, but the stretch pass was pretty integral to that play too.
#28
Kessel who? Everyone knows Bobby Silver Ryan is the best American hockey player playing now




#29
Quote by FireHawk
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Bad team?
#32
I wish hockey was broadcast over here
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#33
To be fair Kessel was pretty great with the Bruins too.
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#34
Quote by Trowzaa
I wish hockey was broadcast over here


I feel like trying to find somewhere that would stream it online, but I'd just feel weird watching sports on a computer. Something about it would be unnatural.
#35
Quote by devourke
I feel like trying to find somewhere that would stream it online, but I'd just feel weird watching sports on a computer. Something about it would be unnatural.


Yeah, I don't do that every saturday afternoon cos I can't afford SkySports <.< That'd be weird.
dirtbag ballet by the bins down the alley
as i walk through the chalet of the shadow of death
everything that you've come to expect


#36
Quote by oneblackened
To be fair Kessel was pretty great with the Bruins too.

Sure, but unless he keeps up this offensive production can you really say he was worth two first rounders and a second?
#37
Quote by RU Experienced?
A PP one-timer and an assist against Winnipeg is the best you got?

No, but I'm trying to fap now so **** off.
#39
Quote by darkcheef
Rex Grossman is considered the best QB of all time but he's never won a Super Bowl


#40
Quote by darkcheef
Rex Grossman is considered the best QB of all time but he's never won a Super Bowl


Seriously? You've got to be joking.

Ryan Leaf was far and away a better qb.
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