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#1
Exactly, yesterday I found outa random site pirating my music. They've apparently gotten most of my music from my bandcamp page meaningit's 128kbps or something not high quality. I'm not really frantic about it, can't say I'm totally fond of it either but when I think of it, it's some sort of respect already!

you guys ever had your music pirated? What did you think of it when you found it out? What did you do about it?

Share your stories gentlemen
#2
think of it this way... someone likes your music so much they need to steal it to listen to your amazing art.
I play guitar.
#5
think of it this way... music is no one's property. Art belongs to society.
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#7
think of it this way... at least it's low quality. You can give them that much for free.

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#8
think of it this way... people are downloading your music illegally.

also, i listened to your stuff one time and didn't like it very much.
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#9
Quote by bendystraw
Try thinking of it this way:




Hey! I never thought of it that way!
#11
Quote by bendystraw
Try thinking of it this way:



Good logic!
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#13
Quote by Vendetta V
I'm not really frantic about it, can't say I'm totally fond of it either but when I think of it, it's some sort of respect already!

you guys ever had your music pirated? What did you think of it when you found it out? What did you do about it?


Curious if you've ever pirated music yourself?

And, nothing personal, but there's only one answer to that question that I'll believe.

Pirating music unambiguous sucks for musicians. I know an indie film producer - highly-regarded stuff, trying to find a breakthrough hit - who consistently finds his stuff online, and it's very frustrating because those people buying tickets or DVDs would actually make a real difference in his ability to get his next movie made.

I suspect a lot of people start pirating because they can convince themselves that its something they would never buy, or that the artist won't miss the money. But then they get in the habit and they start checking to see if they can pirate stuff right away.

And I don't know anyone who's consistently gone back and bought stuff that they already had on their computer if they really liked it.
#14
Idk if being pirated is something to be proud of or angry about.

1) It spreads your name

2) It sort of is a insult to you because people say shit like this: "Oh, I'll pirate it and if I like it I'll buy it"
Basically, they're assholes who think they're entitled to free stuff, and decide whether or not if you deserve the money even though they're benefiting from the music either way.

Nice to see some signs of popularity though.

Edit: With this V thing, I'm surprised you're not playing a flying v

Quote by TimTheWizard
think of it this way... music is no one's property. Art belongs to society.


Says who? Crackpot theorys (excuses) like this just support pirating music, while trying to sound deep and optimistic when really its just shit they made up by some random guy who has no idea what he's talking about.

Thats like saying anyone craft should be free, which means I'm entitled to go to a store and just start taking shit because "It belongs to society".
Last edited by zomgguitarz1234 at Oct 23, 2011,
#15
If they pirate and don't buy, odds are they wouldn't buy whether they pirated or not. It's a common misconception that this constitutes a loss: it doesn't.

There are a lot of people who will buy your album after they've heard the work, then other people who wouldn't buy whether they'd heard it or not. Because of this, there's two things to consider: 1) as above, you're not actually losing anything, but you do have potential for profit, and 2) it's free advertisement.

Tosin Abasi from AAL said that, when the AAL debut album was completed, he shared it with people on various forums he supported for free, and that gave them a fanbase for free. Yes, you might not be making money, but free publicity is huge in the music business. You're not going to start playing gigs in stadiums for $5k a night - you're gonna play free gigs supporting other bands in dingy bars. This is exactly the same as being torrented in low quality in little torrent sites - you're just playing a free show for all of them, and later when you blow up they'll buy your album to say "Oh yeah, I knew that guy before all of you".

No, you're not making a lot of money like this, but if you seriously planned on making a comfortable living with music, you're in for a surprise. That's what college and day jobs are for - I believe Alan's a lawyer by day and Batman/musician by night, for example, and I don't imagine him eating Ramen because he didn't sell enough shirts at a gig cause people torrented them.
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#16
Quote by Hail
If they pirate and don't buy, odds are they wouldn't buy whether they pirated or not.


Really? Because I remember before I use to pirate I bought albums and songs of iTunes, then I got into pirating and didn't spend a dime on any music, then I started buying cd's again.
#17
Quote by Hail
No, you're not making a lot of money like this, but if you seriously planned on making a comfortable living with music, you're in for a surprise. That's what college and day jobs are for - I believe Alan's a lawyer by day and Batman/musician by night, for example, and I don't imagine him eating Ramen because he didn't sell enough shirts at a gig cause people torrented them.


Haha. That I am!

I think a lot of the "pro-pirating" arguments are largely without basis. The pure truth is that the majority of pirated material is from artists who do rely upon music sales to make a living. I'm not sure who would want to pirate my music! People are much more likely to pirate a Metallica album than one of mine.

Additionally it's a bit hard on artists who are just starting out. If they say get a $50,000 deal from the record label, and they are expected to make an album and tour, paying that $50,000, it's a bit harsh when they actually invest the amount of money into the album, then rather than receiving cash back from it they get nothing because their music was pirated instead. That leaves them with debt, and you can't expect any more music from them because the record did not make money.

As for "I'll pirate it and pay if I like it", I don't know anybody who does this. Instead I prefer the reasoning "if I can get it for free, why pay?". Would you pay for something you already have? Of course you wouldn't...I wouldn't.

If I get "free publicity" from it....the record company won't give a toss. Oh lots of people like you? Well that's not making us money. Too bad.

Additionally, if you want to argue that "I don't know what it sounds like so I won't buy it until I hear it", I personally find that's one of the great things about albums - you're hearing it for the first time. Sometimes it's crap, sometimes it's good. You just have to learn to take risks

In short, if you wish to support your favourite artists, buy their music. If you don't, don't. Just don't be too surprised when they decide to quit music and go to something with a more reliable income.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#18
The only "pro-pirating" sentiment I can think of is that I listen to a lot of music relatively unknown, and buying the albums (That have no rerelease!) is quite the hassle money wise, and frankly, I don't have much money to spare.

However, I often buy their music after hearing it from torrent, if I enjoyed it that is. Sometimes I'll buy on a whim too, if that price isn't over the top.

Artists should go to a reliable income first. Then when they have money, launch their career into outer space because they can just buy fans. Wink wink.

Or you have the money for your desired sound too, but whatevs.
#19
My mates band had thousands of people pirate their album, everyone said good things about it but how many of them bought it?
#20
Quote by AlanHB

As for "I'll pirate it and pay if I like it", I don't know anybody who does this. Instead I prefer the reasoning "if I can get it for free, why pay?". Would you pay for something you already have? Of course you wouldn't...I wouldn't.


I see that comment on this website all the time whenever there's a news article regarding pirating. Like someone being financially ****ed because they got caught.

I wonder what's stopping the bureaucracy from cracking down more on pirating, and just going over kill on random individuals rather than going all over the place.

Also since you went into detail about how pirating can **** over people with a record deal, do you know if you actually need a record deal to take being a musician seriously (as in touring and making albums)
Last edited by zomgguitarz1234 at Oct 23, 2011,
#21
Quote by AlanHB


As for "I'll pirate it and pay if I like it", I don't know anybody who does this. Instead I prefer the reasoning "if I can get it for free, why pay?". Would you pay for something you already have? Of course you wouldn't...I wouldn't.
lol ive done it for two bands, scar symmetry and avenged sevenfold
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#22
Pirating really screws over small-medium size bands, but particularly small ones because their gigs do not pay much yet so they have to get more of their revenue from selling CDs. Big bands like Metallica either own their own studios or get a carte blanche to go into a studio for however long they want and make most of their money from gigs, merch, and some sales.

Conversely, pirating can be decent exposure if you can't stop it. Having music in hand means someone is more likely to tell their close friends about it, and on down the line.
#23
Quote by Mike
lol ive done it for two bands, scar symmetry and avenged sevenfold


Sounds great - now post a list of all the music in your collection. Divide it into 3 columns. First, have the music you have pirated. Second, the music you have purchased. Third, the music in both columns. How much larger is the first column than the third?


Quote by cowless
Conversely, pirating can be decent exposure if you can't stop it. Having music in hand means someone is more likely to tell their close friends about it, and on down the line.


And one day...someone will actually pay for the product!


Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Also since you went into detail about how pirating can **** over people with a record deal, do you know if you actually need a record deal to take being a musician seriously (as in touring and making albums)


Well a record deal is basically a loan - the record company gives the band a loan to make a product (album), and they expect to be paid back for it. Any money not paid back means the band will have to pay for it through other means. You don't NEED a record deal to become successful, but the money will have to come from somewhere. Either the band is going to pay for it themselves (Independent) or a record company will give the band a loan and will be paid back (Label-sponsored).

Running a band is basically the same as running a business. You create a product, you market the product, you sell the product. What pirating does is take away a portion of the income. If the income doesn't meet the expenses, business runs into debt, goes bankrupt. If the only reason your business went bankrupt was because people were taking your product and not paying for it, you'd be pretty pissed off.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
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#24
Quote by AlanHB

Well a record deal is basically a loan - the record company gives the band a loan to make a product (album), and they expect to be paid back for it. Any money not paid back means the band will have to pay for it through other means. You don't NEED a record deal to become successful, but the money will have to come from somewhere. Either the band is going to pay for it themselves (Independent) or a record company will give the band a loan and will be paid back (Label-sponsored).

Running a band is basically the same as running a business. You create a product, you market the product, you sell the product. What pirating does is take away a portion of the income. If the income doesn't meet the expenses, business runs into debt, goes bankrupt. If the only reason your business went bankrupt was because people were taking your product and not paying for it, you'd be pretty pissed off.


Any bands become "Big" taking that route?
#25
yeah guys lets ban myspace and youtube too, facebook and spotify for good measure as well, how dare they let bands be distributed for free! no major labels support those, whatsoever
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You win. I'm done here.
#27
Quote by AlanHB

As for "I'll pirate it and pay if I like it", I don't know anybody who does this. Instead I prefer the reasoning "if I can get it for free, why pay?". Would you pay for something you already have? Of course you wouldn't...I wouldn't.

You do now. I got into quite a few bands that way. Case in point: Sonata Arctica. I now own four of their CDs (and I don't have a huge CD collection), and as it happens, I'm wearing a SA shirt right now.
Since then I've just stopped downloading music first, and moved on to streaming it (after either buying or deleting everything I downloaded). It's more like digital busking, in a sense: If I stream a song a couple times and like it, I'll buy it, to pay for the enjoyment I've already got out of it and get a copy to listen to some more. If I don't like it... well, why would I listen to it again?
My third column is as big as my first.
Quote by Blind In 1 Ear
uhhh....no. thats not how it works and its not how it should work either.

Well, to be fair, that's how it worked in some cultures (hence all the songs credited to "Traditional"), but not anymore.
Last edited by Cavalcade at Oct 23, 2011,
#28
Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Any bands become "Big" taking that route?


Any bands become big by getting a record deal? Or successful independently? Or successful in general?

I'm not exactly sure what you're trying to hint at. Where exactly do you think the money comes from?


Anyway I know how this thread goes. Nobody wins. The pirates continue pirating and no effect is made. You can reason with yourselves and others all you wish.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#29
Quote by AlanHB
Any bands become big by getting a record deal? Or successful independently? Or successful in general?


Indie. I think most bands that are majorly successful had a record deal.
#30
Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Indie. I think most bands that are majorly successful had a record deal.


The Offspring is a good example of a successful indie band, who were signed to a major label after the release of Smash. In Australia we currently have an indie artist at number one on our charts (Goyte). Practically nobody "starts" with record backing.

In order to secure a label, you generally need some success as an indie artist first, making your own music and money. Once you prove you can make money for yourselves, the labels will be interested in you making money for them.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#31
Quote by bendystraw
Try thinking of it this way:



I'm not quite sure as of how to understand this good sir :3


Quote by theogonia777
think of it this way... people are downloading your music illegally.

also, i listened to your stuff one time and didn't like it very much.

well... what did you listen to? I have a really wide genre arsenal or how dya call it? if you like heavy-ish stuff check out the link in my sig, go to the newest releases, I'd give you the link but I'm not sure if that's not gonna be called spamming later on


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ok now on for the more serious (read long) posts


Quote by HotspurJr
Curious if you've ever pirated music yourself?

And, nothing personal, but there's only one answer to that question that I'll believe.

Pirating music unambiguous sucks for musicians. I know an indie film producer - highly-regarded stuff, trying to find a breakthrough hit - who consistently finds his stuff online, and it's very frustrating because those people buying tickets or DVDs would actually make a real difference in his ability to get his next movie made.

I suspect a lot of people start pirating because they can convince themselves that its something they would never buy, or that the artist won't miss the money. But then they get in the habit and they start checking to see if they can pirate stuff right away.

And I don't know anyone who's consistently gone back and bought stuff that they already had on their computer if they really liked it.

well to be honest, Yes that has happened, actually it's surprisingly legal in this country though I have never pirated a CD or music of someone of the same caliber as me, it was yeah stuff like an album that sold millions of copies and all! and usually i listen to music online.

I understand what you mean, right now I'm trying to get some money to get my guitar's frets leveled and recrowned for the upcoming projects but I have no money! Idk if that's the piracy's fault but I just know what you mean.

I'm actually against piracy cause it's just all over the place here starting from music going to software like pro tools, reason, etc. to even movies where you constantly here Saw's theme music in a local-made serial or something the latter totally pisses me off cause yeah you can be unable to afford a plugin for only home use but putting scores and stuff like that on the movies really kills the even little opportunity to earn some money for the composers and musicians in here if you get what I mean


Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Idk if being pirated is something to be proud of or angry about.

1) It spreads your name

2) It sort of is a insult to you because people say shit like this: "Oh, I'll pirate it and if I like it I'll buy it"
Basically, they're assholes who think they're entitled to free stuff, and decide whether or not if you deserve the money even though they're benefiting from the music either way.

Nice to see some signs of popularity though.

Yeah I was thinking the same, about the first point. As for the second, I have most of my music available for online streaming and few songs (about 5-10) are available online and people often ask me for a song or two and I just email them a higher quality product I also guess it's somewhat a nice personal contact with your listeners huh?


Edit: With this V thing, I'm surprised you're not playing a flying v


Says who? Crackpot theorys (excuses) like this just support pirating music, while trying to sound deep and optimistic when really its just shit they made up by some random guy who has no idea what he's talking about.

Thats like saying anyone craft should be free, which means I'm entitled to go to a store and just start taking shit because "It belongs to society".

totally agreed, music is like a painting for an artist so downloading it for free is the same as taking something physical...

and yeah well I don't play a V thing. Other than Vendetta I've mostly got nothing to do with the movie also haha. And yeah I think I'd love to have 7 string V (dreams~~)
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#32
Quote by AlanHB

Well a record deal is basically a loan - the record company gives the band a loan to make a product (album), and they expect to be paid back for it. Any money not paid back means the band will have to pay for it through other means. You don't NEED a record deal to become successful, but the money will have to come from somewhere. Either the band is going to pay for it themselves (Independent) or a record company will give the band a loan and will be paid back (Label-sponsored).

Running a band is basically the same as running a business. You create a product, you market the product, you sell the product. What pirating does is take away a portion of the income. If the income doesn't meet the expenses, business runs into debt, goes bankrupt. If the only reason your business went bankrupt was because people were taking your product and not paying for it, you'd be pretty pissed off.


dude I totally agree with you, seems like you've been thru a lot of hassle with the whole pirating thing??

didn't fit in one post :P

Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Any bands become "Big" taking that route?

I don't think that's what he meant. What he's saying is that you have a product (be it piece of art or whatever) and you've put your time and money (be it the loan you get from a record deal or your monthly earnings) into it. You're expecting income from it right? Not necessarily millions but enough to get your money back and a bit more to put into your next project/product
#33
Never had my music pirated, but I have had some of our songs stolen by other bands and claimed as originals. Shit sucks man.


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#34
Quote by Scowmoo
Never had my music pirated, but I have had some of our songs stolen by other bands and claimed as originals. Shit sucks man.


Copyright that shit!
#35
Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Copyright that shit!

or jsut go beat the shit out of them in the dark backyard or something

EDIT: not to sound like a prick, I wrote it as going to a court with a shitty band like that who steals your music would be far more of a pain in the ass, they wouldn't deserve it haha
#36
Quote by zomgguitarz1234
Copyright that shit!


Oh, they're copyrighted now, We forced the guys to take down the videos of our songs..apparently legal paperwork scares people :P


Quote by Saint78
Jackal is like 90.

Quote by Jackal58
Buy stock in Viagra. Imma gonna fuck you in the ass.
#37
Quote by Vendetta V
dude I totally agree with you, seems like you've been thru a lot of hassle with the whole pirating thing??


Well not personally, but I have invested a couple of grand into recordings in the past - although I haven't broke even I still wouldn't appreciate it if somebody just felt that the results of my work and cash somehow "belonged" to them. If people like my music, cool, give me $10 for the EP like everyone else.


Quote by Vendetta V
You're expecting income from it right? Not necessarily millions but enough to get your money back and a bit more to put into your next project/product


And futhermore, if money doesn't come in, guess what. The product stops being made. You enjoy that pirated album? Cool. Unfortunately the band didn't receive anything and now they're not making any more music.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#38
Quote by Scowmoo
Oh, they're copyrighted now, We forced the guys to take down the videos of our songs..apparently legal paperwork scares people :P


How exactly do you figure out when people steal your song and use it as their own? Are they local bands or something?
#39
Quote by AlanHB



And futhermore, if money doesn't come in, guess what. The product stops being made. You enjoy that pirated album? Cool. Unfortunately the band didn't receive anything and now they're not making any more music.


On the other hand, more 'unique' bands can come to prominence now than when the average people relied on buying albums.

Look at Stump, wonderful 80s band that never caught on because the only method was label support. Hell, Primus is about the only absolutely 'unique' band I can recall from that period that got anywhere. These days, with universalized filesharing methods (youtube, last.fm, pandora, etc. being included in piracy due to the 'free' ability to receive the data), those bands can grow to fruition rather than big-label releases being the major artists available.
Quote by Kevätuhri
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Quote by UseYourThumb
You win. I'm done here.
Last edited by Hail at Oct 24, 2011,
#40
Not read the thread properly, but, it's music from your bandcamp page, it's not like they can't listen to the tracks (assumably, I looked at your page once when you made a thread promoting it, and I could hear any of the tracks on there).

It's just a case of them actually having those samples on their computer.

It's not like you've released a CD which is only available to listen to via that CD/iTunes/AmazonMP3/whatever that someone's downloaded.

EDIT:

To answer your question, I've never had my music pirated because I've never released any music to be sold. Think it's a bit hard to try that until you get a fanbase big enough to justify selling your tunes.
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