#1
I am a self trained guitar player, probably that is one reason why I face issues when it comes to basics. Was trying the scales lately and had a query hope someone can help me with it?

For eg. If someone with the rythm guitar plays a groove with 3 chords.

say .. .. G, C & D

Now do I need to stick to one scale while playing a lick or shall I switch over notes to the scale for the chord being used. I understand, music is about experimenting but would like to know from the experts what do the basics have to say.

i.e. If rythm plays G chord, I might be playing a lead on G scale and the moment he switches to D chord I need to change over to the notes for D scale ?

Your help will be highly appreciated
#4
I noticed you're a professional, so if you've got the time away from your job to learn some basic theory then great. It'll be worth it, as learning the fundamentals will reduce the need to ask these sort of questions. We'll help ya though... whether you'll understand it is... well... like I said, fundamentals.
#5
The chords aren't considered separate from eachother. In your G C D progression the key is most likely G major. For this reason you would play the G major scale over all the chrods.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#6
Quote by mdc
I noticed you're a professional, so if you've got the time away from your job to learn some basic theory then great. It'll be worth it, as learning the fundamentals will reduce the need to ask these sort of questions. We'll help ya though... whether you'll understand it is... well... like I said, fundamentals.


I tried looking for teachers .. but its tough to find one in today's "corporate" music world.. they try to make money all the time .. I have been practicing as much as I could .. but guess you are right .. its not something that can be learnt over discussions but serious teaching ..
#7
Quote by AlanHB
The chords aren't considered separate from eachother. In your G C D progression the key is most likely G major. For this reason you would play the G major scale over all the chrods.


Now that was some help .. i think i can relate to what you mean here .. much appreciated ... correct me if I am wrong.. but I am supposed to play the scale for the root note .. isn't it?
#8
Quote by sudipt
Now that was some help .. i think i can relate to what you mean here .. much appreciated ... correct me if I am wrong.. but I am supposed to play the scale for the root note .. isn't it?


Nope - a chord gives you three notes. Those three notes are given to you by the rhythm guitarist. The rest is up to you. You don't need to be forced into playing only the notes from the G major scale just because he's playing a G major chord.
#9
Quote by sudipt
Now that was some help .. i think i can relate to what you mean here .. much appreciated ... correct me if I am wrong.. but I am supposed to play the scale for the root note .. isn't it?


I have no idea what that means sorry.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#10
Quote by stratdax
Nope - a chord gives you three notes. Those three notes are given to you by the rhythm guitarist. The rest is up to you. You don't need to be forced into playing only the notes from the G major scale just because he's playing a G major chord.


But in this example you will always be playing the G major scale as the key is G major. You can use accidentals in major and minor keys so you aren't limited at all.
And no, Guitar Hero will not help. Even on expert. Really.
Soundcloud
#11
Quote by sudipt
I tried looking for teachers .. but its tough to find one in today's "corporate" music world.. they try to make money all the time .. I have been practicing as much as I could .. but guess you are right .. its not something that can be learnt over discussions but serious teaching ..

Not necessarily. If you're interested enough in something, anything, not just music, then the motivation will be there to self teach. Seems like you already have that since you say you are self taught. Just find a good book. I actually did this by going to the library... s'all free, so might as well take advantage of it.
#12
Quote by stratdax
Nope - a chord gives you three notes. Those three notes are given to you by the rhythm guitarist. The rest is up to you. You don't need to be forced into playing only the notes from the G major scale just because he's playing a G major chord.


Thank you for that additional help. However, that takes me back to square one. In my mentioned example I shared 3 chords, but what if a groove has few more chords, wont I end up playing almost every note.

I understand I lack the basic knowledge but If you somehow manage to share any tip that would be great.
#13
Quote by mdc
Not necessarily. If you're interested enough in something, anything, not just music, then the motivation will be there to self teach. Seems like you already have that since you say you are self taught. Just find a good book. I actually did this by going to the library... s'all free, so might as well take advantage of it.


Besides being sarcastic, I see a kind soul and a good guitar player in you. Can you suggest me some good pdfs or links to download. I live in a country where it takes ages to find a good book.

I went to a nearby bookstore, all they had were books filled with chord charts and 3 chord theory.
#14
Quote by AlanHB
But in this example you will always be playing the G major scale as the key is G major. You can use accidentals in major and minor keys so you aren't limited at all.

Thanks again Alan, I am trying to google as much as I can but looks like this is the only place which allows enough interactions with Pros like you, mdc, Stratdax and many others, I am getting closer to the answer I guess.
#15
Quote by sudipt
but what if a groove has few more chords, wont I end up playing almost every note.


Do you understand the concept of a musical 'key'?
#16
Quote by greeneyegat
Do you understand the concept of a musical 'key'?


I am not well versed with the music terminologies .. I think.. every song is played on a particular key.. which is also called scale .. the vocalist may change the key if he wants and relatively the chords will change ofcourse .. Am I anywhere closer to the correct answer ?
#17
Quote by sudipt
Besides being sarcastic, I see a kind soul and a good guitar player in you.

Lol, oh yeah? You caught me at a time of day where I needed some shut eye. I try.
Quote by sudipt
Can you suggest me some good pdfs or links to download.

http://www.musicroom.com/se/ID_No/011274/details.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_(music)
Quote by suipt
I am not well versed with the music terminologies .. I think.. every song is played on a particular key.. which is also called scale ..

This quote is from wiki.

In music theory, the term key is used in many different and sometimes contradictory ways. A common use is to speak of music as being "in" a specific key, such as in the key of C major or in the key of F-sharp.

Keys and tonality

Although many musicians confuse key with scale, a scale is an ordered set of notes typically used in a key, while the key is the center of gravity, established by particular chord progressions.
Last edited by mdc at Nov 1, 2011,
#19
I don't know why I'm promoting his stuff... but anyway... you might want to send Sean0913 a message.
#20
Quote by mdc
I don't know why I'm promoting his stuff... but anyway... you might want to send Sean0913 a message.


I will get in touch ... while I am searching some good guitar teachers around ... Its difficult to judge a person from my level.. almost everyone is good..
#21
Quote by sudipt
I will get in touch ... while I am searching some good guitar teachers around ... Its difficult to judge a person from my level.. almost everyone is good..



First of all, I apologize for the delay in responding. The Academy has been super busy these days, and I'm just not around as often as I once was. I'm still here, but it comes and goes.

OK so let's hit your question.

Generally we look at music fitting together as a "key" or tonal center. What this means from a purely diatonic standpoint, (which I think is best to master first) is that chords in G, like in your example, are created from the notes in the G Major scale.

To answer your question then, The scale of G Major would work fine, but there are a few caveats. One, is it is a bit of a finesse to nail the chord change for the I and the IV. You can noodle a bit and do it by ear, but it really sounds better if you are aware that the IV is coming, and transition over a chord tone. Simple terms, when playing a G Major scale and ready to change to a C chord, landing on a C note in your solo over the change would sound good.

In solos and scales, over any given chord, certain notes cause or create tension, and others release it.

Is it possible to say Change from G Major scales to C Major (over C) and then to D Major over D?

Certainly, but you are only changing 2 notes, F# to F and C to C# The other notes are the exact same as G Major.

The best way to learn how to do this, is intentionally learn the notes of any chord instantly, learn to chart out your chords and scales, and then intentionally practice learning to solo through changes based upon the chord tones.

So for G C D, I'd know:

G B D are my notes from the scale that will sound great when playing over the G

C E G are great note choices over the C Chord

D F# and A are great note choices over the D Chord. If its a D7 or in other words a V7 going to the I chord, I might add C to my available note choices, using that b7.

Now when phrasing instead of being random, I'm practicing ending phrasing on one of those notes when that chord is up, and when I'm getting ready to make a change to a new chord, I might target the new chord tones the second the change happens.

It does take some work and I'd consider it as a fairly Advanced level of playing and thinking, but with time and practice, it certainly works wonders. Alex Hutchings is a great example when it comes to this, when the chords change. Then when you couple it with analyzing melodic ideas that you like, tension and resolution etc, and you have the makings of a very effective and intelligent approach to improvising, and the theory is solid.

Good luck, hope this helps. Many times people ask a question, without having the supporting structure to make use of the answers, and if this is you, I'd encourage a study of theory, where you can learn to play intelligently, and open up new doors to your playing.

Best,

Sean
Last edited by Sean0913 at Nov 2, 2011,
#22
G C D progression is in G major.
You can use G major through the whole progression.
D is also possible through the whole progression.
But the most basic is G major.
Because if you look at G major you see that Gmaj C maj D maj are all in there.
D major is not as easy to solo over.
Because there is no C major in D major.
You then use something called accidentals to make it fit to the progression.
C major in D major would require a b7, b means flat and 7 is the seventh scale degree (C#).
#23
Quote by Sean0913


Good luck, hope this helps. Many times people ask a question, without having the supporting structure to make use of the answers, and if this is you, I'd encourage a study of theory, where you can learn to play intelligently, and open up new doors to your playing.

Best,

Sean


I think you have explained it all. I thank you from the core of my heart for taking time out and sharing all these information. I understand for a maestro like you it might be irritating at times to explain just low level stuffs repeatedly. However, I think you gave me enough information to practice on. Thank you so much ... :-)
#24
Quote by liampje
G C D progression is in G major.
You can use G major through the whole progression.
D is also possible through the whole progression.
But the most basic is G major.
Because if you look at G major you see that Gmaj C maj D maj are all in there.
D major is not as easy to solo over.
Because there is no C major in D major.
You then use something called accidentals to make it fit to the progression.
C major in D major would require a b7, b means flat and 7 is the seventh scale degree (C#).



Liampje, I think you made it sound more simpler. Its now becoming easy for me to aim at my home work. In just mere few words you answered it all what I was looking for.

I thank Sean And You, really appreciate your help and time. All my doubts are almost gone now, all I need is to mug up the notes for the scales one by one and practice it more n more :-)
#25
Quote by sudipt
Liampje, I think you made it sound more simpler. Its now becoming easy for me to aim at my home work. In just mere few words you answered it all what I was looking for.

I thank Sean And You, really appreciate your help and time. All my doubts are almost gone now, all I need is to mug up the notes for the scales one by one and practice it more n more :-)

no problem!
EDIT:I thought you were gonna choke on my crappy grammar lol.
Last edited by liampje at Nov 4, 2011,
#26
Quote by sudipt
I think you have explained it all. I thank you from the core of my heart for taking time out and sharing all these information. I understand for a maestro like you it might be irritating at times to explain just low level stuffs repeatedly. However, I think you gave me enough information to practice on. Thank you so much ... :-)


You're welcome, and Im happy to help. It's not a bother, it's my calling to help. The annoying parts are when people ask questions with no intention of applying themselves or putting the "work" into it. I feel I'm just wasting my time, and so the vast majority of questions, that sound like people are trying to take the lazy mans way out, I ignore.

For example

"I wrote this amazing song, what should I use to solo over it?"

Or

"What are the names of these random notes that have a sound like a chord, so I can appear intelligent when I show my friends?"

My answer would be "learn chords, scales, intervals, diatonic harmony and how to understand how chords and scales work together, buy a book, get a teacher, invest in your own development and don't ask me to spoon feed you "answers" when Ive done the work, and you haven't. Go invest in yourself."

Most people want you to teach them for free, or just answer the question outright, and feel that by virtue of having an internet connection, that they should be entitled to that information. So, I usually don't bother answering things like that. I do find those sometimes annoying; most of the time, I just think it shows they aren't ready to grow yet. But, usually someone else will come and "rescue" them by giving them exactly what they are crying for. But, what can ya do? That's life

I like to help sincere seekers who are taking active ownership of their musical pursuits and are ready to work and not give lip service - I'll help people like that all day.

Best,

Sean
Last edited by Sean0913 at Nov 4, 2011,
#27
Quote by liampje
no problem!
EDIT:I thought you were gonna choke on my crappy grammar lol.


I am good with Bad grammar .. lolll ..
#28
Quote by Sean0913


I like to help sincere seekers who are taking active ownership of their musical pursuits and are ready to work and not give lip service - I'll help people like that all day.

Best,

Sean


Thank you so much Sean, I am lucky to have you around. You are not only gifted with this awesome knowledge but you do have a kind heart besides being so humble.

Sorry for wishing you late, I was out practicing and looking for books on scales
I am a professional hence taking time out for music becomes a little issue, yet I do. I hope to learn the scales soon in another 4-5 years

Thanks,
Sudipt