Meanwhile, the US House is voting to make the U.S. motto "In God We Trust"

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#1
This is sure to solve everything. I'm so glad they figured out how to best spend their time. Oh and it passed.

Some clarification, this doesn't actually do anything new, it's been the US motto since the 50s.

[IN PHIL WE TRUST]


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Last edited by SteveHouse at Nov 1, 2011,
#2
Don't be ridiculous, SteveHouse. Surely this was a constructive use of their time. I'm certain this vote will singly solve all of our economic and social woes!


...it didn't even make it the motto. It "reaffirmed" it. What the damnity-damn hell? Why did that need to be done? What did this accomplish? What does that even mean?
#3
that's it... everyone in the government gets one **** punch.
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#5
Fuck Congress...
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#6
I don't see the problem on principle; the First Amendment refers to an 'established church' (aka the Church of England back in the day) which is a specific concept which the Founding Fathers opposed. It also doesn't prohibit the free exercise of religion. Therefore it's not unconstitutional. Although it seems silly and a waste of time.
#7
Quote by Pagan-Pie
I don't see the problem on principle; the First Amendment refers to an 'established church' (aka the Church of England back in the day) which is a specific concept which the Founding Fathers opposed. It also doesn't prohibit the free exercise of religion. Therefore it's not unconstitutional. Although it seems silly and a waste of time.

This explicitly rejects polytheism and atheism, therefore endorsing monotheistic religious, therefore being against that big piece of paper that governs Congress in name only.

[IN PHIL WE TRUST]


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#8
Quote by SteveHouse
This explicitly rejects polytheism and atheism, therefore endorsing monotheistic religious, therefore being against that big piece of paper that governs Congress in name only.

This.

this is so dumb. (the motto, not this post)
pinga
#10


and the worst part is....

i am not surprised about any part of this...the religious part and the why the fvck are you doing this part....
I haz gotten gud
#11
anything out there listing the yays-nays yet?

"As our nation faces challenging times, it is appropriate for members of Congress and our nation - like our predecessors - to firmly declare our trust in God, believing that it will sustain us for generations to come," he said.

ha.
#12
Nice to see they're earning their wages doing something important.
Sing me to sleep.
#13
That kind of shit happens all the time. They're just finding other issues to solve that don't make any difference at all and turning a blind eye to the real issues.
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#14
Quote by Pagan-Pie
I don't see the problem on principle; the First Amendment refers to an 'established church' (aka the Church of England back in the day) which is a specific concept which the Founding Fathers opposed. It also doesn't prohibit the free exercise of religion. Therefore it's not unconstitutional. Although it seems silly and a waste of time.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


No it doesn't.
#15
Quote by uhh_me?
anything out there listing the yays-nays yet?

house.gov has it up here.

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[IN PHIL WE TRUST]


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Last edited by SteveHouse at Nov 1, 2011,
#16
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#19
Quote by Dirge Humani
No it doesn't.


What are you suggesting? Nothing of what I said was incorrect.

Quote by SteveHouse
This explicitly rejects polytheism and atheism, therefore endorsing monotheistic religious, therefore being against that big piece of paper that governs Congress in name only.


I don't see how it is. The motto doesn't prohibit free practice of religion, and it doesn't set up an established church.
Last edited by Pagan-Pie at Nov 1, 2011,
#20
Quote by SteveHouse
house.gov has it up here.

ugh. my rep, who is typically displays pretty good sense, voted yea. i suppose that representing a fairly moderate distract probably played into it.

and seriously, only 9(!!!) people voted against this nonsense? way to do important things, guys.
#21
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#22
HA! HA! SILLY AMERICANS! HA! HA!

Seriously, what the fuck. Their country is falling apart and they decide the best use of their time is to reaffirm that they endorse believing in some kind of made up wizard?

I feel sorry for you guys, I really do.

DON'T MAKE ME DESTROY YOU!


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#24
Quote by -xCaMRocKx-
HA! HA! SILLY AMERICANS! HA! HA!

Seriously, what the fuck. Their country is falling apart and they decide the best use of their time is to reaffirm that they endorse believing in some kind of made up wizard?

I feel sorry for you guys, I really do.

I lolled really hard....
and then went back to hating my government
#25
Quote by Pagan-Pie
What are you suggesting? Nothing of what I said was incorrect.

Quote by Pagan-Pie
I don't see the problem on principle; the First Amendment refers to an 'established church' (aka the Church of England back in the day) which is a specific concept which the Founding Fathers opposed. It also doesn't prohibit the free exercise of religion. Therefore it's not unconstitutional. Although it seems silly and a waste of time.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Please find that in the amendment for me.
#27
Quote by Dirge Humani
Please find that in the amendment for me.



Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion...

If you consider the historical and intellectual background, it seems obvious to me that they were referring to established religion.
#28
Quote by Pagan-Pie
I don't see the problem on principle; the First Amendment refers to an 'established church' (aka the Church of England back in the day) which is a specific concept which the Founding Fathers opposed. It also doesn't prohibit the free exercise of religion. Therefore it's not unconstitutional. Although it seems silly and a waste of time.

Yes, but there is this whole concept of separation of church and state, which the Founding Fathers supported, and the whole "In God We Trust" thing is clearly aligning government and religion.
#29
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#30
Quote by Pagan-Pie
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion...

If you consider the historical and intellectual background, it seems obvious to me that they were referring to established religion.

http://www.humanismbyjoe.com/meaning_of_establishment.htm
Consistent with the Constitutional Convention's decision to deny the government any power to deal with religion, the language adopted for the First Amendment bans not just a national church. Instead, it prohibits any laws "respecting" an establishment of religion. Church-state scholar John Swomley explains that the word "respecting" meant then, as it does now, concerning, touching upon, in relation to, or with regard to.

Moreover, constitutional historian C. Herman Pritchett states: "The phrase ‘establishment of religion’ must be given the meaning that it had in the United States in 1791, rather than its European connotation. . . . It was . . . nonpreferential assistance to organized churches that constituted ‘establishment of religion’ in 1791 and it was this practice that the Amendment forbade Congress to adopt."

Pritchett's view is supported by the fact that in the six states that still retained establishments in 1791, none had an establishment of a single church. Each supported multiple denominations of Christianity.

Of course, those six states eventually followed the example of the federal government by separating church and state. In doing so, they interpreted the separation principle as calling for an end to their nonpreferential support of religion.

I feel like we may be arguing the same point.
#33
Quote by Darkness in Zero
Yes, but there is this whole concept of separation of church and state, which the Founding Fathers supported, and the whole "In God We Trust" thing is clearly aligning government and religion.


I know, I'm not saying it's a clear cut matter. But I think the Founding Fathers were more inclined to specifically oppose a state sanctioned church, as in an institution, not the association of the state with theism. If you look at the 1786 Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom, even it begins 'Whereas, Almighty God hath created the mind free...' blah blah blah. The religious references continue throughout, and it was written by Thomas Jefferson, who was probably a form of Deist.
#34
Quote by Dirge Humani
http://www.humanismbyjoe.com/meaning_of_establishment.htm

I feel like we may be arguing the same point.


Well I would argue that it's primarily concerned with the institution of an established church. I don't agree with that guy on the significance of the word 'respecting' which in my view only takes on the multiple connotations he gives it if you remove it from the context of the sentence. But I'm no legal scholar
#35
Quote by -xCaMRocKx-
Seriously, what the fuck. Their country is falling apart and they decide the best use of their time is to reaffirm that they endorse believing in some kind of made up wizard?


It's not like Congress got together and said "we really need to reaffirm our motto; forget about that other shit!" It was just a simple bill that came to the floor, and the Republican-majority House made it an easy vote.

I really think this was a good call. There really are more important things going on right now. So instead of wasting time debating and getting the media involved surrounding a useless arbitrary thing that's been around since the 50's, they can focus on more pertinent matters.

In a time like this, it would have probably been much worse to vote against the reaffirmation anyways. By affirming it, you just get the typical responses of "" and "lol america" whereas removing the motto could have had some serious repercussions. We don't need that shit right now. So why not let this one go? Let this stupid thing just pass by instead of acting like
Quote by Darkness in Zero
I lolled really hard....
and then went back to hating my government

continuing this ridiculous lack of confidence in the government for such illogical reasons. You want to get our nation back on track? Stop bitching about the small things.


/ugh
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LET'S GO BUCKS
#36
Quote by Vince Sixx
Hey Canadians, can I come live in Vancouver, BC? I promise I won't say aboot. And on the plus side, we're all part of Cascadia, so we're the same culture!

Neither will we, you ignorant jackass
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A SIGNATURE.
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#38
Considering the majority in this ****ed up country. It would cause a pretty big shitstorm if they did not pass this. Though the media wouldn't be allowed to jump all over it.
#39
That's it, I'm leaving. I'm thinking New Zealand.
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#40
Honestly, I don't even care. I'm atheist as hell. But the motto doesn't really make much a difference to me.
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