#1
Hey guys,

I was just researching my term paper for Comparative Politics of the Developing world and I just read this report by the UN. It's really quite mind blowing when you put in into context of how many problems could be solved in the 3rd world with better communication that is taken for granted in here in the 1st world.

Any opinions on this guys? How could we solve this, could we?

UN report
http://www.fao.org/fileadmin/user_upload/ags/publications/GFL_web.pdf

Article Containing Analysis
http://www.nature.com.proxy.bib.uottawa.ca/nature/journal/v478/n7369/full/nature10452.html#/ref-link-118

TL;DR
Mass amounts of food in 3rd world is wasted due to poor communication and transportation


FYI, Not asking you guys to do my homework. This isn't actually a main part of my report, just a minor bit of data used to show the importance of investment in infrastructure
#2
this is why they need new amps and smoke machines for better communications
ಠ_ಠ
<|>
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Tell me what nation on this earth, was not born of tragedy-Primordial
#3
Well there's aid and all that but we know that there is a massive amount of waste even there. And when the UN decides to deliver aid themselves, some groups can get aggressive or the government (they might say it is against their national sovereignty). All in all, a very difficult problem.
#4
Hunger solves some issues. IN 3rd world countries people give birth much more often, since they mostly can't get good education there, they mostly can't contribute to the development of the human race. So basically they contribute nothing, and spread lightning fast, do we really want to provide all of them with food supply so that they would spread even faster?
#5
Either leave em alone. Or give em electricity. Give em high bandwidth connections. Give them iPads with specialized farming apps.
Quote by denizenz
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Art & Lutherie
#7
Quote by Jawlytomtom
My life is much worse.


Do entertain us the story.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#8
People eat food?
“being in a room and sitting there with a ghost, hearing their voice in your head and seeing them as clearly as I'm seeing you right now.”
#9
Quote by tissue-box
People eat food?


People eat people? Possible solution?

Edit: Someone post 'A Modest Proposal'.
Last edited by Tastytaco at Nov 6, 2011,
#10
Quote by Zeletros
Hunger solves some issues. IN 3rd world countries people give birth much more often, since they mostly can't get good education there, they mostly can't contribute to the development of the human race. So basically they contribute nothing, and spread lightning fast, do we really want to provide all of them with food supply so that they would spread even faster?


People have large families because of a high mortality rate, as well as the need to large amount of labour to maintain they subsistence lifestyle. Improved harvesting techniques would decrease the advantage of the large family as a small family could be just as effective and more cost efficient.

This increased efficiency leads to specialization which is then the basis of highly skilled workers through the means of education. Although behind us now, due to technology already being available they will be able to close the information gap quickly, and become productive members of society. Actually read that first article, im personally specializing in Chad, mainly because its landlocked and has 0 infrastructure.

Factors that hold the 3rd world back;
Capitalization of information. (Meaning we patent,ect technologies and other ideas that would drastically improve their productivity. However they are too poor to afford them from us)
Political and Economic instability (However, better infrastructure will highly contribute to fixing this)
Religion and Other Traditional Belief systems
#11
Quote by metharian
Factors that hold the 3rd world back;
Capitalization of information. (Meaning we patent,ect technologies and other ideas that would drastically improve their productivity. However they are too poor to afford them from us)
Political and Economic instability (However, better infrastructure will highly contribute to fixing this)
Religion and Other Traditional Belief systems


How about living in places where you have zero chance of producing an agricultural surplus? There are too many people for what the earth can actually offer in terms of food and water.
Quote by Carmel
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#12
actually, that point is covered in 1 of the 2 links I posted. It is true certain areas are inhospitable to growing crops. However, the percentage of crops being wasted is more than enough to feed those sections of the world. The problems arising is the people in that land can not afford the food, and the infrastructure is not there to support it. Communication lets the markets know where food is required and how much, further development in transportation technology and services. This actually meaning just paved roads.... thats there big upgrade. Would allow the produce to be moved. On another note, a change in diet would also be required as meat products are highly ineffective way of feeding people. It is too costly to do and does not provide enough calories,fat or protein compared to what is put into them
#13
Quote by metharian
actually, that point is covered in 1 of the 2 links I posted. It is true certain areas are inhospitable to growing crops. However, the percentage of crops being wasted is more than enough to feed those sections of the world. The problems arising is the people in that land can not afford the food, and the infrastructure is not there to support it. Communication lets the markets know where food is required and how much, further development in transportation technology and services. This actually meaning just paved roads.... thats there big upgrade. Would allow the produce to be moved. On another note, a change in diet would also be required as meat products are highly ineffective way of feeding people. It is too costly to do and does not provide enough calories,fat or protein compared to what is put into them


And why don't they have communication and infrastructure? Because they never had an agricultural surplus and could not spend time on that stuff. Kinda chicken-egg situation.

Meat is indeed a highly ineffective way of feeding people. But when you live in a place where there is only some grass growing, you don't have a choice. Only animals can convert this into edible products.
Quote by Carmel
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#14
Quote by metharian
*pain, suffering, and sorrow*


Brotha, those systems are in place so that wealth can pass around between a relative few who care a good deal about money, power and ownership of everything.

It's a land that has seen the rough of the sun for millenia, and it is tired. It does not want to grow crops. It does not need to see water anymore. The land is dying - the people are dying.

The only solution is to feed them all, educate them all, train them all in their certifications of choosing, and there you go. You have a few million capable entry-level workers working to make their way in the capitalist world. Since the leadership won't help the people get education, it's up to private groups. Will you step up? I will.
Quote by denizenz
I'll logic you right in the thyroid.

Art & Lutherie
#15
Quote by metharian
actually, that point is covered in 1 of the 2 links I posted. It is true certain areas are inhospitable to growing crops. However, the percentage of crops being wasted is more than enough to feed those sections of the world. The problems arising is the people in that land can not afford the food, and the infrastructure is not there to support it. Communication lets the markets know where food is required and how much, further development in transportation technology and services. This actually meaning just paved roads.... thats there big upgrade. Would allow the produce to be moved. On another note, a change in diet would also be required as meat products are highly ineffective way of feeding people. It is too costly to do and does not provide enough calories,fat or protein compared to what is put into them



It is true that there is enough food in the word to feed our current population, but I think that saying that these countries do not have the money to pay for them is a bit of a simplistic way of putting it. The EU used to dump (sell at a very low price - usually lower than the cost of producing) overproduced food on 3rd world markets (usually Africa countries) and that has had a result of severely damaging the local food producers and thus the countries' economies.
In fact, some countries tend to avoid food donations because of that fact (there are usually other factors of course).
#17
Quote by Neo Evil11
How about living in places where you have zero chance of producing an agricultural surplus? There are too many people for what the earth can actually offer in terms of food and water.

Malthus said the same thing.

O, waitaminutelol
Quote by Vornik
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to put it, along with your other advice, into a book, the pages of which I will then use to wipe my ass.
#18
Quote by dann_blood
Malthus said the same thing.

O, waitaminutelol


I meant in subsaharan africa.

and who the **** is Malthus?
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Last edited by Neo Evil11 at Nov 6, 2011,
#20
Quote by captaincrunk
Really?


Yeah, I don't see a username with that name.
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#21
Quote by Neo Evil11
I meant in subsaharan africa.

Not really. The biggest problems seem to be institutional instability, the inability of the population to get access to food because of poverty and a lack of investment due to the internationalisation of finance. There's a wealth of evidence that indicates that African agriculture can certainly be improved upon massively despite their limited resources:
http://www.ifpri.org/publication/accelerating-food-production-sub-saharan-africa
http://www.energybulletin.net/stories/2011-06-20/african-agricultural-innovations-boost-continental-food-production
http://www.jstor.org/pss/4314273
http://www.jstor.org/pss/1240976
http://www.ers.usda.gov/AmberWaves/September10/Features/FoodSecurityAfrica.htm
http://www.un.org/africa/osaa/reports/Achieving%20Food%20Security%20in%20Africa-Challenges%20and%20Issues.pdf

Even then it's almost irrelevant in terms of aggregate world production, it's the distribution and waste which is the biggest problem.

and who the **** is Malthus?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Robert_Malthus

I thought you studied economics?
Quote by Vornik
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to put it, along with your other advice, into a book, the pages of which I will then use to wipe my ass.
Last edited by dann_blood at Nov 6, 2011,
#22
Quote by dann_blood
Not really. The biggest problems seem to be institutional instability, the inability of the population to get access to food because of poverty and a lack of investment due to the internationalisation of finance. There's a wealth of evidence that indicates that African agriculture can certainly be improved upon massively despite their limited resources:
http://www.ifpri.org/publication/accelerating-food-production-sub-saharan-africa
http://www.energybulletin.net/stories/2011-06-20/african-agricultural-innovations-boost-continental-food-production
http://www.jstor.org/pss/4314273
http://www.jstor.org/pss/1240976
http://www.ers.usda.gov/AmberWaves/September10/Features/FoodSecurityAfrica.htm
http://www.un.org/africa/osaa/reports/Achieving%20Food%20Security%20in%20Africa-Challenges%20and%20Issues.pdf

Even then it's almost irrelevant in terms of aggregate production, it's the distribution and waste which is the biggest problem.

I will check those links later. However I agree that the world as a whole can produce enough food to feed the world population. So in that sense distribution and waste and institutional instability are the biggest problems.

As an earth scientist however it seems counter intuitive that countries living with falling air in the Hadley cell can be selfsupporting. They do not have the rain so they cannot feed themselves (unless they have rivers etc). Economic theory dictates that they need a comparative advantage in something else then to be able to trade. Do these countries have resources or something? I don't know. So their cheap labour would be the key to growth. However because of political instability, disease, not enough roads etc. this will not happen.

^Why would I remember names of people and scientists? I also study earth sciences btw.
Quote by Carmel
I can't believe you are whoring yourself out like that.

ಠ_ಠ
#23
Quote by Neo Evil11
I will check those links later. However I agree that the world as a whole can produce enough food to feed the world population. So in that sense distribution and waste and institutional instability are the biggest problems.

Kewl.

As an earth scientist however it seems counter intuitive that countries living with falling air in the Hadley cell can be selfsupporting. They do not have the rain so they cannot feed themselves (unless they have rivers etc).

Ya, climate is a strong determinant, and alot of the focus has been on technological solutions that specifically work in Africa. IIRC African agriculture relies heavily on both large-scale and small-scale irrigation.

Africa also has rather extensive river systems.

Economic theory dictates that they need a comparative advantage in something else then to be able to trade. Do these countries have resources or something? I don't know.

What type of resources? Africa's oil and mineral rich, most of which remain untouched because of war over the resources.

So their cheap labour would be the key to growth. However because of political instability, disease, not enough roads etc. this will not happen.

That and the natural resources Africa does have are already being exploited by Western countries

^Why would I remember names of people and scientists? I also study earth sciences btw.

Malthus is a biggie. He's like a Friedman, or Keynes, or Smith.
Quote by Vornik
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to put it, along with your other advice, into a book, the pages of which I will then use to wipe my ass.
#24
Maybe they can eat dirt. I have eaten dirt to survive, before. If you know what I mean.
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You are EXTREMELY WRONG! I have played it. I own an 18W and it would be an awful stereo amp, it's way too bright, breaks up too easily and so on. Secondly, why would a guitar store sell an hifi amp.