#1
I need help, I have about 45 measures to do and I can't seem to figure out how to do it.

If anybody can help me fill in the first line and explain it, it would be really helpful.

It is about the theory errors.
http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m561/jacks902101/Picture001.jpg


This second part is about writing the roman numerals. I have no idea how to fill it it and determine whether or not it is open or closed. I have about 5 songs to do. This is this first one, if you could explain it to me, it would help!

http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m561/jacks902101/Picture002.jpg
#3
That is why I came here. I have no idea how to figure out how to do it. I have 45 more measures left to do for the first part and I have 5 songs to do on the second part.
#4
Direct 8ves - Octave approached by similar motion
Parallel 5th or 8ve - a 5th moving to a 5th or 8ve moving to an 8ve in the same direction, i.e. moving in parallel.
Consecutive 5ths in contrary - self-explanatory
Spacing error - my guess is it's referring to adjacent voices being more than an octave apart.
Chord with no third...

Roman numerals are like I ii iii IV V vi vii. They refer to which chord from the key is being sounded and whether it's major (I) or minor (i). Close position chords have all tones within an octave, open position tones expand beyond an octave.
#5
Quote by jackpotmoney
That is why I came here. I have no idea how to figure out how to do it. I have 45 more measures left to do for the first part and I have 5 songs to do on the second part.


It looks like you take a class right? Do they assign you homework without teaching you the essentials to solve the homework? Do they not give you any form of instruction whatsoever?

It looks like you're saying "I take a class, I have responsibility to do homework, but Ive learned nothing, so can you help me by telling me the answers, so I can turn in homework, and have the right answers?"

Am I understanding things correctly?

Best,

Sean
#6
Quote by jazz_rock_feel
Direct 8ves - Octave approached by similar motion
Parallel 5th or 8ve - a 5th moving to a 5th or 8ve moving to an 8ve in the same direction, i.e. moving in parallel.
Consecutive 5ths in contrary - self-explanatory
Spacing error - my guess is it's referring to adjacent voices being more than an octave apart.
Chord with no third...

Roman numerals are like I ii iii IV V vi vii. They refer to which chord from the key is being sounded and whether it's major (I) or minor (i). Close position chords have all tones within an octave, open position tones expand beyond an octave.


A spacing error would be more than an octave between anything but the bass and tenor. Bass and tenor, in classical part-writing, are allowed to have more than an octave but you can't have more than an octave between any other voice. (there must be less than an octave between the tenor and alto, and the alto and soprano)

Also, a note on directs, they usually have to have a leap in an upper voice (e.g; soprano)
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Last edited by ZeroYuy at Nov 16, 2011,
#7
Quote by Sean0913
It looks like you take a class right? Do they assign you homework without teaching you the essentials to solve the homework? Do they not give you any form of instruction whatsoever?

It looks like you're saying "I take a class, I have responsibility to do homework, but Ive learned nothing, so can you help me by telling me the answers, so I can turn in homework, and have the right answers?"

Am I understanding things correctly?

Best,

Sean


Some people need a little help. It's not like he's coming and saying "Hey, can you do all my homework?". He's asking for clarifications on concepts. I've met teachers who went far beyond the scope of a class and over complicated things. You might wanna consider lightening up a little.
Paint it black and white if you like
The story's all the same.
#8
Quote by Sean0913
It looks like you take a class right? Do they assign you homework without teaching you the essentials to solve the homework? Do they not give you any form of instruction whatsoever?

It looks like you're saying "I take a class, I have responsibility to do homework, but Ive learned nothing, so can you help me by telling me the answers, so I can turn in homework, and have the right answers?"

Am I understanding things correctly?

Best,

Sean

I am taking a class, but I am just not understand it.

And I only took a pic of the first line of my homework. I still have 45 more measures and 5 songs to go. I just wanted you guys to help me with the first line and explain it so I can understand it.
#9
Quote by ZeroYuy
A spacing error would be more than an octave between anything but the bass and tenor. Bass and tenor, in classical part-writing, are allowed to have more than an octave but you can't have more than an octave between any other voice. (there must be less than an octave between the tenor and alto, and the alto and soprano)

Also, a note on directs, they usually have to have a leap in an upper voice (e.g; soprano)



I am still confused. For example, on measure 1, note 1, is that note okay? I just don't know if it is okay or not. Like in number two, my teacher said it was a spacing error and from note 1 to note 2, there is a parallel octave. So I am still confused and why it is like that.
#10
Quote by ZeroYuy
A spacing error would be more than an octave between anything but the bass and tenor. Bass and tenor, in classical part-writing, are allowed to have more than an octave but you can't have more than an octave between any other voice. (there must be less than an octave between the tenor and alto, and the alto and soprano)

Also, a note on directs, they usually have to have a leap in an upper voice (e.g; soprano)


True on the spacing bit, should've mentioned that. And yeah, direct fifths and octaves are only sensitive between bass and soprano, and typically if the soprano moves by step it's fine. It would be impossible to do part writing without any directs at all.

EDIT: ^Did you read my post explaining what everything was? Find those things.
Last edited by jazz_rock_feel at Nov 16, 2011,
#11
Direct 8ves - Octave approached by similar motion
Parallel 5th or 8ve - a 5th moving to a 5th or 8ve moving to an 8ve in the same direction, i.e. moving in parallel.
Consecutive 5ths in contrary - self-explanatory
Spacing error - my guess is it's referring to adjacent voices being more than an octave apart.
Chord with no third...

________________________________

Is an octave eight full steps or eight half steps? And how do you count that on the staff paper? and what do you mean by "similar motion"?

and I don't understand Consecutive 5ths in contrary.
#12
Quote by jackpotmoney
I am still confused. For example, on measure 1, note 1, is that note okay? I just don't know if it is okay or not. Like in number two, my teacher said it was a spacing error and from note 1 to note 2, there is a parallel octave. So I am still confused and why it is like that.


I found, what was helpful when I did this, was to write it all out as i see it on paper, except with notes. So, for instance:

Chord 1
S C
A E
T E
B C

You continue with all the chords (obviously it'd be very hard for me to write that ALL out on here). From this point, you look for the things that Jazz listed.

Are there any notes that move from a fifth (C to G) to another fifth (G to D) by anything other than oblique motion? (Oblique motion is when one tone moves but they other remains the same)

Or maybe it's an octave movement which can typically happen if you double the leading tone (B and B going to C and C).

Does the soprano leap? This would be a good place to check to make sure you don't have direct octaves or fifths (So, for instance, maybe the bass is B going to C and your soprano is G going to C. This would give you the same effect as a parallel octave, just in a different way)

For spacing error, just look for the distance between the tones. Is there more than an octave between the tenor and the alto? No? Check the Soprano. If that checks out, you have no spacing error. However, if a problem occurs between ANY of those voices, you have a spacing error.

Hope this helps! Remember, we analyze between the one chord and the next chord. The next chord becomes our starting point and we continue so:

Chord 1 is analyzed to chord two. For chord two, chord two is analyzed to chord three, for chord three, it's analyzed to four, and so on.

EDIT: An octave is just eight notes. So, for instance, C, D, E, F, G, A, B, C. You don't need to complicate it more than it needs to be by thinking half steps and whole steps. It's just eight notes.
Paint it black and white if you like
The story's all the same.
Last edited by ZeroYuy at Nov 16, 2011,
#13
Is there a way to remember a chord?

Like for G chord I know it is, G,B,D,G,B,G. I only can figure out it while having a guitar on hand.
And the only reason why I know that is from playing guitar, but I can't bring a guitar to my test XD
#15
Quote by jackpotmoney
Is there a way to remember a chord?

Like for G chord I know it is, G,B,D,G,B,G. I only can figure out it while having a guitar on hand.
And the only reason why I know that is from playing guitar, but I can't bring a guitar to my test XD


Chords are (not accounting for inversions) always thirds from the root. So, when you go in to your test, write out A B C D E F G on a piece of paper or the test. From A, count up three notes (A, C, E), form B count up three (B, D, F) from C count up three (C, E, G), so on, so fourth.

It should look like:
A | B | C
C | D | E
E | F | G

From there, you just apply the keys for each chord (You apply the key of A major to A, B major to B, C major to C). And then from there, you just remember that minor, you lower the third a half step (A, C, E | B, D, F# | C, Eb, G)

How are you looking at part writing right now? I hate to agree with Sean, but this seems way beyond your level of understanding.


I'm starting to agree with this a little. Is it just a disconnect of the concepts or did you test out of music fundamentals thinking that whatever you got in highschool was enough to get you through?
Paint it black and white if you like
The story's all the same.
Last edited by ZeroYuy at Nov 16, 2011,
#16
I am not sure too sure, because we are just now starting to part write.

The only thing we learned are pretty much the basics like what notes are, how long they are, triads, seventh chords. The only thing I am confused about when you guys are talking when notes "leap","move", "motion", "parallel". I just get confused after that.
#17
Quote by Sean0913
It looks like you take a class right? Do they assign you homework without teaching you the essentials to solve the homework? Do they not give you any form of instruction whatsoever?

It looks like you're saying "I take a class, I have responsibility to do homework, but Ive learned nothing, so can you help me by telling me the answers, so I can turn in homework, and have the right answers?"

Am I understanding things correctly?

Best,

Sean


My theory class consists of a basic explaination and some examples in the textbook and assigned homework. So, coming to UG would be beneficial. The textbook will provide a good outlook for the most part though.
#18
Quote by jackpotmoney
I am not sure too sure, because we are just now starting to part write.

The only thing we learned are pretty much the basics like what notes are, how long they are, triads, seventh chords. The only thing I am confused about when you guys are talking when notes "leap","move", "motion", "parallel". I just get confused after that.


Your book should have introduced these terms to you already.

Leap is when a tone moves more than a third from the original tone

Move is essentially when one note goes to another note.

Motion is the way that tone moves with another tone, Parallel is a type of motion.

Parallel: Two tones (For instance, S and A; though we can have any combination) move the same interval to the same direction (Up and up, Down and down)

Edit:

OBJECTIONAL Parallelism: This is when two tones that are a 5th apart (For instance, G and B) move in parallel motion. This will ALWAYS be objectionable. There is no way to avoid it. They will always move to parallel fifths which is objectionable. The distinction should be made though: Parallels are not always objectionable. You can have parallel sixth's which is just fine.
Paint it black and white if you like
The story's all the same.
Last edited by ZeroYuy at Nov 16, 2011,
#20
Quote by jazz_rock_feel

Spacing error - my guess is it's referring to adjacent voices being more than an octave apart.


The bass and tenor can be more then an octave apart. Besides that you're right, all the other voices should be within an octave of eachother.