#1
ok, so the theory side of stuff FINALLY started to make sense to me, the formulas, maj, min, pentationics, harmonics, melodics, CAGED system etc.

but im stuck with this problem:

I was working out how chords are constructed, starting with the major triads, I worked out the D MAJ SCALE using the formula and got D E F# G A B C# D. I checked this myself using my neck chart and then wikipedia and its right.

I built the scale for "position 1" on the neck and I can't show the tab but it follows the above scale I wrote. I tried to build the major d chord uisng the 1st, 3rd and 5th steps but it looks nothing like the d maj chord "xx0232".

Where am I going wrong?

thank you
#2
Quote by Laharl
melodics

More specific? Melodic what?
I tried to build the major d chord uisng the 1st, 3rd and 5th steps but it looks nothing like the d maj chord "xx0232".

Can you tab it? Many shapes can be made out if the same notes.
#3
I will tab out and by melodics I mean melodic minor scale

could take me several mins to tab this out
#4
You're not necessarily wrong if it doesn't look like xx0232, because there are multiple ways to play those same notes all over the neck. If you're only using a root, a 3rd, and a 5th you wouldn't ever get xx0232, because the "3" in the tab is an octave of the root.
As long as your chord contains the root, a major third, and a fifth you have the chord your after, though its voicing may be different that the xx0232.
#6
E--------------|-------------|---------------|-----------------|
B--------------0-2-3-3-2-0-------|---------------|--------------|--------------|
G--------0-2-4--|------------4-2-0------|---------------|--------------|
D-0-2-4---------|-------------------4-2-0-|----------------|-----------------|
A-----------------|-----------------|-----------------|----------|
E-----------------|-----------------|-----------------|-----------------|

not perfect but hopefully you get the idea
#7
Quote by Laharl
I will tab out and by melodics I mean melodic minor scale

Can you tab that out?
#8
the chord I was trying to play (E-e) xx4200 which is an f# or somthing. im confused...

if you quoted what was here I have now realised the paragraph i deleted is wrong
Last edited by Laharl at Nov 20, 2011,
#9
I did not produce a melodic minor scale because im trying to the get the majors down first
#10
xx0232

The 0 is the root, 2 is the 5TH, 3 is an octave of D and the 2 on the high E string is the 3RD.
The intervals are just in a different order.
#11
Quote by -Mantra-
xx0232

The 0 is the root, 2 is the 5TH, 3 is an octave of D and the 2 on the high E string is the 3RD.
The intervals are just in a different order.


thank you, that does make sense.

so it's played like that because its the only practical way to get all the notes needed to make the d major chord?

(the 1st the 3rd and 5th?) as I can't see anyway (that is humanly possible) to get all those notes elsewhere in the full d maj scale
#12
Quote by Laharl
thank you, that does make sense.

so it's played like that because its the only practical way to get all the notes needed to make the d major chord?

(the 1st the 3rd and 5th?) as I can't see anyway (that is humanly possible) to get all those notes elsewhere in the full d maj scale

It's played like that because it's a convenient fingering that's close to a lot of other commonly used chords. There are plenty of ways to play a D major chord across the neck, but that's the most popular.
#13
I built the scale for "position 1" on the neck and I can't show the tab but it follows the above scale I wrote. I tried to build the major d chord uisng the 1st, 3rd and 5th steps but it looks nothing like the d maj chord "xx0232".
#15
Quote by Laharl
ok, so the theory side of stuff FINALLY started to make sense to me, the formulas, maj, min, pentationics, harmonics, melodics, CAGED system etc.

but im stuck with this problem:

I was working out how chords are constructed, starting with the major triads, I worked out the D MAJ SCALE using the formula and got D E F# G A B C# D. I checked this myself using my neck chart and then wikipedia and its right.

I built the scale for "position 1" on the neck and I can't show the tab but it follows the above scale I wrote. I tried to build the major d chord uisng the 1st, 3rd and 5th steps but it looks nothing like the d maj chord "xx0232".

Where am I going wrong?

thank you


It's not that you are going wrong anywhere, its just that any combination of those notes , and not only 1 3 5 order, can form the triad. In your example, You have a D, A, D and F# - D Major is D F# A, so you have all the notes present. Strings and fingers will dictate the order of the notes, not some theory rule. Simply speaking, all the notes need to be present somewhere, sometimes there is more than one instance in a shape. This is where knowing theory and the notes on the neck help. Because I may be doing a 7th chord, but my knowledge of the neck tells me my fingers can only reach a R 5 b7 3, and not a R 3 5 b7 in that order.

Best,

Sean
#16
As long as you play these three notes together : D F# A, you are playing a D major chord.

Of course there are some very common shapes/patterns to playing a D major which are probably the ones you learn first... eg xx0232, x57775

Depending on which note you choose as the bass note, the D major chord will have a slightly different name...

When the 1st note of the chord is used as the bass note, it is called the Root position (for a D major chord this note would be D, an example of this would be the xx0232

When the 2nd note is used as the bass note it is called a 2nd inversion (D major 2nd inversion), in a D Major chord that would be the F#... an example chord of this would be 200xxx...

When the 3rd note is used it is called a 3rd inversion chord... Using D major as an example once more one would be... xx777x

The last two examples are more uncommon examples of D chords... but they are nonetheless
#17
Quote by Gregory Pantin

When the 2nd note is used as the bass note it is called a 2nd inversion (D major 2nd inversion), in a D Major chord that would be the F#... an example chord of this would be 200xxx...

When the 3rd note is used it is called a 3rd inversion chord... Using D major as an example once more one would be... xx777x


Not quite - when the third is in the bass, the fifth above it, and the root note above that, that is known as the first inversion, not second.

When the 5th is in the base, root above that, and the third stacked above the root, that is known as the second inversion, not third inversion as you said here.

Edit: A third inversion can happen only when the chord has 4 (or more) tones. For example, 7 chords. Those are when the 7th is in the bass, the root above the 7th, the 3rd above the root, and the fifth above the third.
Last edited by stratdax at Nov 25, 2011,
#18
There can be different voicings of one chords. For example:

D major chords

xx0232
x00232
200232

A Dmaj chord contains the notes D F# and A.
We have D A D F# in the first one. In the second, we have A D A D F#. In the third, we have the same, with F# stuck in the bottom.
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#19
Quote by stratdax
Not quite - when the third is in the bass, the fifth above it, and the root note above that, that is known as the first inversion, not second.

When the 5th is in the base, root above that, and the third stacked above the root, that is known as the second inversion, not third inversion as you said here.

Edit: A third inversion can happen only when the chord has 4 (or more) tones. For example, 7 chords. Those are when the 7th is in the bass, the root above the 7th, the 3rd above the root, and the fifth above the third.

The notes in the chord don't have to follow a set order from the bass note.

A first, second or third inversion can be called thus, as long as the 3rd, 5th or 7th respectively are in the bass. The remaining notes can be in any order.
Last edited by mdc at Nov 25, 2011,
#20
Quote by mdc
The notes in the chord don't have to follow a set order from the bass note.

A first, second or third inversion can be called thus, as long as the 3rd, 5th or 7th respectively are in the bass. The remaining notes can be in any order.


Yeah you're right, on guitar I guess that's true, because we guitarists don't typically stack our triads "in order" anyway (as Sean was talking about). I learnt theory on piano first and it kind of stuck with me.
Last edited by stratdax at Nov 25, 2011,
#21
Quote by stratdax
Yeah you're right, on guitar I guess that's true, because we guitarists don't typically stack our triads "in order" anyway (as Sean was talking about). I learnt theory on piano first and it kind of stuck with me.

Yes, just wanted to clear up the inversion thing. Us guitarists can still form the intervals sequentially in any inversion if we want to though.

In some cases it's just hard to do as a closed voicing. There's cool ways outta that though, like open and drop voicing's placed in SATB.
Last edited by mdc at Nov 25, 2011,