#1
Hey ug,

A friend wanted to buy headphones, but he doesnt know which one is good..

So he asked me foe advise, i said i will ask better people ( you! )

So: he wants to buy headphones
He lives in eindhoven
He wants to use it for playing through his pod and guitar
And also for listening to music everywhere
he plays and listens mostly to devildriver and folk metal bands ( dont know their names )
It need to be small when packed, but still over ears
His budget is around 150-250€
And he is willing to buy from internet

Thanks in advance
Quote by RetroGunslinger
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My Colourful Rig:
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Last edited by Tunder250 at Nov 27, 2011,
#3
Thanks for the response!
What model, to be exactly?
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#5
I like AKG a lot. Best headphones I've ever heard were AKG cans. All their headphones are pretty good, especially if you have a few bucks to spend.
Gilchrist custom
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Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
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Atomic Amplifire
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Cathbard Amplification
My band
#6
It really depends. There is definitely more than one answer to your question:

1) Open or closed cans? The pros of open cans is that they're usually more accurate sound-wise, but they don't isolate the listener. My Grado SR80i headphones, for example, let sound in like I'm not wearing anything over my ears when there's no music playing. Closed cans have a tendency to be more bass-heavy and forward in their sound, but can isolate users from outside noise. It sounds like your friend would prefer closed cans if he wants to use them "everywhere."

2) What type of sound? Not all headphones are built the same. Grados/Alessandros, for example, have a very forward sound with accented mids and trebles, whereas Sennheisers are more open-sounding, putting the listener a few rows back from the stage (so to speak). A little research will give your friend general impressions of the sound signatures of particular headphones.

3) Does he plan on using a headphone amp? Some headphones, such as the Grado line or Sennheiser HD line, generally have lower ohms (32-50), which make them compatible with iPods or other non-amplified sources with no loss of sound quality. Other headphones, however, push the ohms as high as 600 and require external amplification to get the best results. Basic amps are very inexpensive.

There are a lot of options for that price range. AKGs, as mentioned, make good headphones. Denon is another good company that makes quality closed headphones. Fischer is an up-and-coming Russian company that makes well-regarded products that offer a lot of bang for your buck, but usually require at least some amplification as they usually have higher ohm ratings.
Hi, I'm Peter
Last edited by Dirk Gently at Nov 27, 2011,
#8
^ Probably wouldn't recommend the AD series as they're open-back. The A700 is closed, though. They're nice cans, as well.
Hi, I'm Peter
#9
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
S E N N H E I S E R


+311

i have a pair of HD212Pro sennheiser headphones i have had for maybe even 10 years, i really don't remember. the sound great to me, but i really haven't had a lot of comparison. the have held up great except for they are a little warped as far as left/right goes.
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#10
Quote by Dirk Gently
It really depends. There is definitely more than one answer to your question:

1) Open or closed cans? The pros of open cans is that they're usually more accurate sound-wise, but they don't isolate the listener. My Grado SR80i headphones, for example, let sound in like I'm not wearing anything over my ears when there's no music playing. Closed cans have a tendency to be more bass-heavy and forward in their sound, but can isolate users from outside noise. It sounds like your friend would prefer closed cans if he wants to use them "everywhere."

2) What type of sound? Not all headphones are built the same. Grados/Alessandros, for example, have a very forward sound with accented mids and trebles, whereas Sennheisers are more open-sounding, putting the listener a few rows back from the stage (so to speak). A little research will give your friend general impressions of the sound signatures of particular headphones.

3) Does he plan on using a headphone amp? Some headphones, such as the Grado line or Sennheiser HD line, generally have lower ohms (32-50), which make them compatible with iPods or other non-amplified sources with no loss of sound quality. Other headphones, however, push the ohms as high as 600 and require external amplification to get the best results. Basic amps are very inexpensive.

There are a lot of options for that price range. AKGs, as mentioned, make good headphones. Denon is another good company that makes quality closed headphones. Fischer is an up-and-coming Russian company that makes well-regarded products that offer a lot of bang for your buck, but usually require at least some amplification as they usually have higher ohm ratings.


1. I also think closed caps are better for him, didnt really know there was a difference
He is easily distracted so im sure its better xD

2. Will ask him asap

3. I think he prefers without a headphone amp, as he also wants touse it for listening to music

Thanks for the great input and will show him asap!


Quote by Cathbard
I like AKG a lot. Best headphones I've ever heard were AKG cans. All their headphones are pretty good, especially if you have a few bucks to spend.


Will let him know the brand, all though not lot of shops has them iirc... To test

Any specific models, please?

For all other inputs: thanks, will show to him asap!
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#11
I have a pair of sennheisers, and they are awesome. Haven't really tried other brands, but these sound great, and only set me back around $100
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#12
ATH M-50's are a solid bet. Cheap, closed back design, huge bass response for a set of cans. Great for everyday listening on amateur ears, and the overall sound will compliment guitar-monitoring. Forget the Senn's, they're all junk below the HD555's.

Cathbard's AKG suggestion stands out too, though I don't think he'll listen to me when I say to buy a set of K701/702's. Best headphones I've ever owned by a million goddamn miles. Also way out of his budget.
#13
Quote by Tunder250
1. I also think closed caps are better for him, didnt really know there was a difference
He is easily distracted so im sure its better xD

2. Will ask him asap

3. I think he prefers without a headphone amp, as he also wants touse it for listening to music

Thanks for the great input and will show him asap!


Will let him know the brand, all though not lot of shops has them iirc... To test

Any specific models, please?

For all other inputs: thanks, will show to him asap!

Check Amazon.com. They usually deeply discount headphone prices over retail. The AKG K701s, for example, go for $250 on the American site; their MSRP is over $500.

As far as headphone amps, they can be tiny. For example, a popular line of headphone amps called "cMoy" are built inside Altoid tins and are battery powered. They sell for about $60 in the US. A lot of people who own cMoys will rubber band them together with their iPods since they're of a similar size.
Hi, I'm Peter
Last edited by Dirk Gently at Nov 27, 2011,
#14
Really depends on what you're going to use them for and how much your'e willing to spend.

I run a pair of Denon AH-D2000's and a Fiio E7, you can probably snag both for about $310. If you get a quality pair of cans you'll probably want to invest in an decent amp, it'll make a big difference in volume and clarity.
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#15
i spoke to him, he prefers Denon 1100's and he is thinking about getting a FiiO E11..
But they don't ship them to europe ( via amazon.. only the headphones themselves.. )

thanks a lot!

Found a site that sends them to the Netherlands
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
Last edited by Tunder250 at Nov 29, 2011,
#16
Audio Technica ATH-M50s are easily the best headphones you can get under $3-400.

They come with a little bag and fold up to about half the size of your normal headphones.
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#17
Quote by Tunder250

Will let him know the brand, all though not lot of shops has them iirc... To test

Any specific models, please?
Well, if you have the money a pair of K240's but any of the K series are pretty good, depends on how much money you have.
The K271's and K171's are awesome too. The K240's are proper studio reference headphones and the K271/K171 phones are more of a hifi set. Some find the K240's too clinical but if you want to isolate flaws in a mix it's hard to beat them. The K271's are more for listening to music, not analysing it.
Those are the top of the range, expensive ones. The cheaper ones are quite good too for the money. Like I said, depends on how much cash you have to spend.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#18
Quote by Cathbard
Well, if you have the money a pair of K240's but any of the K series are pretty good, depends on how much money you have.
The K271's and K171's are awesome too. The K240's are proper studio reference headphones and the K271/K171 phones are more of a hifi set. Some find the K240's too clinical but if you want to isolate flaws in a mix it's hard to beat them. The K271's are more for listening to music, not analysing it.
Those are the top of the range, expensive ones. The cheaper ones are quite good too for the money. Like I said, depends on how much cash you have to spend.


Lucky we got a AKG store in the neighbourhood, thanks for the info! :P

Quote by MatrixClaw
Audio Technica ATH-M50s are easily the best headphones you can get under $3-400.

They come with a little bag and fold up to about half the size of your normal headphones.


did you mean these ( or are these fake? ) http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-ATH-M50-Professional-Monitor-Headphones/dp/B000P62ND6/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1322586122&sr=1-2
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#19
Quote by Dave_Mc
I've had tube amps for a while now, but never actually had any go down on me
Quote by jj1565
maybe you're not saying the right things? an amp likes to know you care.





www.SanctityStudios.com
#22
Quote by Cathbard
I like AKG a lot. Best headphones I've ever heard were AKG cans. All their headphones are pretty good, especially if you have a few bucks to spend.


Quote by Cathbard
Well, if you have the money a pair of K240's but any of the K series are pretty good, depends on how much money you have.
The K271's and K171's are awesome too. The K240's are proper studio reference headphones and the K271/K171 phones are more of a hifi set. Some find the K240's too clinical but if you want to isolate flaws in a mix it's hard to beat them. The K271's are more for listening to music, not analysing it.
Those are the top of the range, expensive ones. The cheaper ones are quite good too for the money. Like I said, depends on how much cash you have to spend.


I COMPLETELY agree, as I have a set of AKG K77's on my ears as I type this. I absolutely love these, and I think I only paid about $50 USD for them. I hear the K99's are a good choice as well, but I don't remember the price or anything. The K77's have a very flat EQ to them, which I prefer since I listen to many genres of music and because it gives me more control over the sound of my music. They're pretty good when it comes to noise, as well, considering I've never had complaints from sleeping or awake room mates at College and I can't hear much of anything going on around me with music playing. I completely recommend AKG.
#23
No offense to AKGs, since I'm coming from more of a sonic standpoint of being able to monitor and hear everything accurately with little hype, but nearly ever pair of AKGs, Grado, Sennheisers and Beyerdynamic headphones under $300 are highly inaccurate at some part of the spectrum. Most are hyped in the lowend and/or have a mid scoop/hump, often this is good for your average listener, as those tweaks are often likable qualities to modern listeners. However, if you're looking for the truest reproduction of the sound, so you can hear it the way the engineer intended it to be heard, then they are false representations of the sound.

It's up to your friend to decide which he likes the sound of more and what's more pleasing to his ears, but at the price he's paying, I really don't understand why someone would want to pay that much money for a pair of headphones that don't accurately reproduce the original frequencies. If he just wants a decent set of consumer-grade listening headphones, I'd point him to the cheapest Sennheisers he can buy that feel comfortable on his ears. No point in paying $200+ for a pair of listening headphones IMO. I can find many better uses to spend that much cash on.
Quote by Dave_Mc
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www.SanctityStudios.com
#24
Quote by MatrixClaw
No offense to AKGs, since I'm coming from more of a sonic standpoint of being able to monitor and hear everything accurately with little hype, but nearly ever pair of AKGs, Grado, Sennheisers and Beyerdynamic headphones under $300 are highly inaccurate at some part of the spectrum. Most are hyped in the lowend and/or have a mid scoop/hump, often this is good for your average listener, as those tweaks are often likable qualities to modern listeners. However, if you're looking for the truest reproduction of the sound, so you can hear it the way the engineer intended it to be heard, then they are false representations of the sound.

It's up to your friend to decide which he likes the sound of more and what's more pleasing to his ears, but at the price he's paying, I really don't understand why someone would want to pay that much money for a pair of headphones that don't accurately reproduce the original frequencies. If he just wants a decent set of consumer-grade listening headphones, I'd point him to the cheapest Sennheisers he can buy that feel comfortable on his ears. No point in paying $200+ for a pair of listening headphones IMO. I can find many better uses to spend that much cash on.


Well, since he's using them to play guitar through and listen to music, it doesn't seem like he's going to be engineering music and worrying about having an absolute exact recreation of the original mix. I honestly don't see the logic in this at all, for the following reasons:

First of all, you're assuming that every song he's listening to has been engineered by someone that's using a pair of headphones that cost more than $300. While I may be incorrect in saying this, I highly doubt that every album in my song library was mixed by someone wearing headphones that cost that much. Let's assume, however, that they were produced using this.

Now, if the engineer of said albums was worth his weight in salt, you would think he might ponder for a second on the idea that 90% of the earth's population doesn't own headphones of the quality that he's using. Realizing that, you would think he would take that into account when producing said music so that it sounds good through as many pairs of headphones as possible. I mean, if they produce something that sounds great through their headphones but sounds like utter shit through normal quality headphones, I'll bet that not many people are going to listen to anything produced by said engineer. It would be like an artist painting with glasses on that have lenses that are half blue and half yellow, then expecting everyone to appreciate his art in the same way he does without the glasses. It makes very little sense.

I'm not saying that what you said isn't true, I'm saying that this is one of those things that a decent engineer would take into consideration when producing an album using headphones of that quality.

I do disagree that buying $200 headphones is pointless, however. A few years back, I used to go with a pair of $10 earbuds that would last me about a month, maybe two before one of the ears would go bad. Realizing that if I bought a $20 pair that would last me twice as long it would save me gas on how many trips I made to the store, I spent the extra money. I then realize that headphones have a level of audio quality to them. The new headphones sounded great and lasted longer. After buying those for a few years, I finally decided I would try more expensive headphones that would hopefully last longer and sound even better. I was not disappointed. Spending $50 on my current headphones, I realized that you get exactly what you pay for when buying headphones. These ones sound amazing and have lasted much longer. Once these crap out on me, I'll probably spend $100 on my next set, increasing the sound quality, material quality, and overall durability of the product.

Now, having said that, not everyone has ears that can tell the difference between $20 headphones and $400 headphones. Most people could tell the difference, but not everyone. Plus, if the audio files you're listening to aren't of good quality, it won't make a difference anyway. Listening to lossless files on $10 phones won't be much different than listening to .mp3's that are 128kbps on $400 phones. For the average musician, though, I would recommend headphones that are anywhere from $50 to $200 and audio files that are at least 256kbps, or good quality VBR.
Last edited by Blktiger0 at Nov 30, 2011,
#25
^Well, first of all. I highly doubt any engineer mixing 90% of the music that people would be listening to, is using headphones to mix. Obviously, music is mixed to sound good on many listening sources, but with such a wide variety available to consumers, it's silly to think that he/she can make it sound great on the vast majority of them. Chances are, if he or she is mixing some form of rock music, they're still checking through headphones that have a flatter response than most of the run of the mill headphones out there today, otherwise they'd be altering a lot of frequencies that define the genre. They're probably referencing earbuds like those that come with iPod more, as that's the medium most listeners will be listening through.

I'm merely stating that, by getting a pair of headphones that is more akin to the frequency response an engineer would be mixing on with his/her studio monitors, you're going to have a much more accurate representation of sound. To some, this can be fatiguing to the ears, because the frequencies aren't relaxed or hyped in some parts of the spectrum. So, it's really up to the listener and the application.

The proof is in the pudding, though - Try listening to your favorite album on your car speakers (assuming you're not running anything high end), then listen through your stereo, a good pair of headphones and some studio monitors. Chances are, the mix will sound vastly different through all of them. Your car may make the guitars sound muddy, but the drums sound clear and punchy, your stereo will probably have significantly more lowend, but a tighter response than your car, while being clear in the highs and more relaxed in the mids. Your headphones are most likely also hyped in the lowend, as their frequency response goes into sub frequencies where lowend build up occurs but your studio monitors will have a more flat response with much less bass (unless you have a sub).

With headphones, the biggest issue in accuracy is in the lowend. Nearly all lowend headphones have far too much bass response than needed, to accommodate for the large amount of bass found in modern day hip hop. If you're intending on listening to a lot of rap, or nearly anything they play on MTV now, then that's just fine and dandy, but for rock music, most headphones are hyped in all the wrong frequencies.
Quote by Dave_Mc
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maybe you're not saying the right things? an amp likes to know you care.





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#26
Quote by MatrixClaw
^Well, first of all. I highly doubt any engineer mixing 90% of the music that people would be listening to, is using headphones to mix. Obviously, music is mixed to sound good on many listening sources, but with such a wide variety available to consumers, it's silly to think that he/she can make it sound great on the vast majority of them. Chances are, if he or she is mixing some form of rock music, they're still checking through headphones that have a flatter response than most of the run of the mill headphones out there today, otherwise they'd be altering a lot of frequencies that define the genre. They're probably referencing earbuds like those that come with iPod more, as that's the medium most listeners will be listening through.

I'm merely stating that, by getting a pair of headphones that is more akin to the frequency response an engineer would be mixing on with his/her studio monitors, you're going to have a much more accurate representation of sound. To some, this can be fatiguing to the ears, because the frequencies aren't relaxed or hyped in some parts of the spectrum. So, it's really up to the listener and the application.

The proof is in the pudding, though - Try listening to your favorite album on your car speakers (assuming you're not running anything high end), then listen through your stereo, a good pair of headphones and some studio monitors. Chances are, the mix will sound vastly different through all of them. Your car may make the guitars sound muddy, but the drums sound clear and punchy, your stereo will probably have significantly more lowend, but a tighter response than your car, while being clear in the highs and more relaxed in the mids. Your headphones are most likely also hyped in the lowend, as their frequency response goes into sub frequencies where lowend build up occurs but your studio monitors will have a more flat response with much less bass (unless you have a sub).

With headphones, the biggest issue in accuracy is in the lowend. Nearly all lowend headphones have far too much bass response than needed, to accommodate for the large amount of bass found in modern day hip hop. If you're intending on listening to a lot of rap, or nearly anything they play on MTV now, then that's just fine and dandy, but for rock music, most headphones are hyped in all the wrong frequencies.


Ok, I misunderstood and thought that you were suggesting that he buy headphones that expensive because if not you're not hearing the song the way it was meant to be heard.

I've listened to music through plenty of sources before, and I appreciate audio quality quite a bit. If I would have had more money at the time, I would be wearing much more expensive headphones right now. I also plan on completely revamping the speaker setup in my car instead of doing the typical thing of adding two 1000 watt sub-woofers. I can't stand the amount of bass those produce...it usually just adds so much sound pressure to the car that I get a headache. I do agree with you on how bassy headphones tend to be anymore. I can't stand the Beats by Dr Dre headphones everyone rants and raves about because they're way too damn bassy. That's why I made sure in my post to mention that the K77's I have are very flat when it comes to EQ, and respond well to EQ settings on the files. I go through iTunes and set each of my songs to an EQ that is appropriate for it, which generally makes it sound better though just about anything.
#27
You use headphones in a studio to hone in on something you know is there that shouldn't be but can't quite isolate it through the monitors. Most of the time you use good studio monitors like JBL's and then switch to Yamaha NS-10's to get a better idea of how it sounds in everyday stereos. Then you try to reach a compromise. How good you are at making that compromise is what separates the men from the boys.
When using them that way MC is right, you need the top end headphones and for that you have to spend the dollars.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
Last edited by Cathbard at Nov 30, 2011,
#28
Quote by Tunder250
Lucky we got a AKG store in the neighbourhood, thanks for the info! :P


did you mean these ( or are these fake? ) http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-ATH-M50-Professional-Monitor-Headphones/dp/B000P62ND6/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1322586122&sr=1-2


It took some getting used to, but these things are amazing!!! The burn in time is about 5 hours and the make my head sweat, but the sound is fun-nominal . The stereo width is great, not synthetic like the hd280 pros. I am going to stick with these for a long long time.

#29
Thanks for the really massive texts! Really clears up a lot for me
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#32
Okay, so he went to the shop and liked the beyerdynamics a lot!

He's basicly thinking about the 660 or the 860... ( both around the same price )

Wjats the best?

( not wanna change it into a vs thread )

AM: he prefers to buy headphones, i also prefer in ears while listening music in public
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#34
Quote by FearMyLightning
Tell him to get sum Skull Kandys and to get rid of that POD and get a Line 6 Spider 75W


Wtf???

Just be serious!
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#35
Quote by FearMyLightning
Tell him to get sum Skull Kandys and to get rid of that POD and get a Line 6 Spider 75W

(Invalid img)
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#37
Quote by FearMyLightning
I have some Audio Technica ATH M20s, they're pretty decent.


but he likes to test them before buying... and there is no dealer in the netherlands...
Quote by RetroGunslinger
using nines for drop C# is like stringing the guitar with spaghetti


My Colourful Rig:
ESP M-ii Deluxe
ENGL E570
Mesa/Boogie Simul 295 Stereo
Framus FR212 v30
#38
Quote by Tunder250
but he likes to test them before buying... and there is no dealer in the netherlands...


Well they're really comfortable and they sound good, but sometimes they can be a little quiet.