#1
Hi, I hope I'm in the right thread, if now...well that sucks

I was watching Rock Discipline by John Petrucci (why does auto spell says Firetruck? ) and he was talking about out of the box and inside the box picking...

I'm not going to explain what it is, but I'm going to demonstrate through the tab

Inside the box alternate picking:

----u d u d u d
D ----5------5------5----- etc etc
A -3-----3------3---------

Outside the box alternate picking:

----d u d u d u
D ----5------5------5----- etc etc
A -3-----3------3---------


At first Outside-the-box picking felt awkward but I got used to it. I'm still better at inside the box because thats how I've played for years...but the questions are:

1) should I switch to outside the box, because it might have better potential at playing faster?
2)Which way would you play that lick?

Thank you.
#2
Outside the box, to me, seems to have less movement when you play, the pick travels less distance when picking, and again, to me, less distance means less chance of messing up notes, which means a cleaner play style.
Caution:
This post may contain my opinion and/or inaccurate information.

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#3
I'd personally use the outside approach for that; in my opinion, it's a more economical and logical way to play, generally speaking.

As for your first question, it's not a matter of switching to one or the other. One of the principles of practicing alternate picking is that you practice your exercises starting with both an upstroke or a downstroke; since you're using each for 50% of your picking, it only makes sense that you want them to be equally strong. So the point of this idea is to practice it both ways to improve your picking technique, but to ultimately play what's more comfortable when you encounter something like this in a musical setting.
#5
It would be better to practice both... steve morse has quite a few exercises for that. Best to compose your own etude/s in order to be comfortable with either. You just never know what improv will require when you get into one of them zone things.

Other than that, personally i'd use the inside... both inside and outside travel the same pick distance (whomever says no to that, perhaps take a closer look at your picking hand). Reason for me using the inside is I like the accent on that 2nd one... kind of displaces things and feel.

Speed can be attained through either... and should be equal
Last edited by evolucian at Dec 2, 2011,
#6
Outside picking. If the lick started on the D string, then inside picking.

Also, play it in different rhythmic subdivisions such 16ths, 5's, 6's, 7's to a constant tempo.

Experiment with placing accents (clave rhythms etc) on various places within the beat to create displacement. It'll hone your sense of timing.

There's a ridiculous amount of mileage you could get out of those two notes.
#7
To me, outside picking is easier. However, you really need to be able to do both, using whichever one is appropriate for the context. Generally using downstrokes on the strong beats (particularly the first note of a bar) helps keep the rhythm. There are times when you can break this 'rule' but I find it definitely helps timekeeping and rhythm.
#8
You should be able to do both. If you alternate pick stuff, you WILL eventually need them both. Really.

However, if you have the freedom of choice, I prefer outside picking for the sound and consistency. With inside picking I tend to make a lot of unwanted noises.
E:-6
B:-0
G:-5
D:-6
A:-0
E:-3
#9
1) should I switch to outside the box, because it might have better potential at playing faster?
2)Which way would you play that lick?

The whole point of that section of the video is to get you to practice both inside and outside - and bring them up to roughly the same level.
#10
Thanks a lot everybody.
So I'm going to practice both of the two and actually do that John Petrucci exercise when I get time.
I do agree that the same distance is traveled between the two.

So I started playing all of the easy songs using this method...and Intro to Number of the Beast by Iron Maiden is perfect.

When I've play I use economy picking every change I get opportunity too, so alternate picking when I get opportunity to do economy is all new to me.
And this part right here I would naturally play as:

---u-d-d---u-d-d---u-d-d--
D ------7--------7--------7--- repeat
A -5-5-----5-5------5-5------

Alternate picking would mean I would let go of opportunity just to push my pick down and go with the pattern of up down up down....like this:

---u-d-u---d-u-d---u-d-u--
D ------7--------7--------7--- repeat
A -5-5-----5-5------5-5------

I can barely play like that even slow, because I just naturally go to the old ways.
So the question is should I even bother spending my time to learn how to play strictly alternate picking since I've naturally learned how to do economy?

I mean I know economy picking seems more efficient, but a lot of really really really good guitarist stay to strictly alternate.
Last edited by Svin at Dec 2, 2011,
#12
So the question is should I even bother spending my time to learn how to play strictly alternate picking since I've naturally learned how to do economy?

I mean I know economy picking seems more efficient, but a lot of really really really good guitarist stay to strictly alternate.


The main reason to do it one way or the other is the sound - economy picking is smoother, alternate more aggressive.

For metal riffing I would almost always say go alternate - the simple fact is most people don't get the "sweep" bits of economy picking perfectly in time. With metal tightness is essential - so alternate picking might be a little better.

If you're pretty comfortable with economy you can stick with it, just put more work into timing.
#13
Quote by Svin
Hi, I hope I'm in the right thread, if now...well that sucks

I was watching Rock Discipline by John Petrucci (why does auto spell says Firetruck? ) and he was talking about out of the box and inside the box picking...

I'm not going to explain what it is, but I'm going to demonstrate through the tab

Inside the box alternate picking:

----u d u d u d
D ----5------5------5----- etc etc
A -3-----3------3---------

Outside the box alternate picking:

----d u d u d u
D ----5------5------5----- etc etc
A -3-----3------3---------


At first Outside-the-box picking felt awkward but I got used to it. I'm still better at inside the box because thats how I've played for years...but the questions are:

1) should I switch to outside the box, because it might have better potential at playing faster?
2)Which way would you play that lick?

Thank you.


Just play it however it feels comfortable to you. When I play I don't even think about what way I am moving the pick.