#1
I know this might sound like an incredibly stupid question, but do you ever feel like legato is cheating?

I posted up a question on here a few months back, asking for help with a Jeff Loomis solo. Embarrassingly in retrospect, I didn't realize how awful my right-hand technique was. Finding that out really made me start to get strict with my practicing- mainly in economy picking. 1-2 hours each day of strictly scales with only economy picking. It has made a night/day difference in my playing and I'm shocked with the progress.

But, here's the thing. Now that I've put so much emphasis on economy picking, any legato technique that I use makes me feel like I'm cheating. I realize that it is a 100% totally legitimate technique that gives a totally different sound than alternate/economy picking. I saw a video in which John Petrucci discusses how he uses a mix of legato and alternate picking (I guess JP doesn't use economy much) to get sounds that you otherwise can't do with either technique alone.

Any advice? Is this just because I have been focusing so much on one technique?
#2
I don't think it's cheating, I mean anything Joe Satriani considers a trademark has gotta be valid! And besides, I find Legato impossible!!!
Been Dazed and Confused...
#3
You've pretty much answered your own question.

It's only "cheating" if you're using it to cover up for a lack of picking skill on something that's supposed to be played using consistent picking. I used to do this as well, but I don't consider legato to be any less of a technique. It's the same the other way; playing something with pickstrokes because your legato technique blows would be "cheating" under this definition as well.
#4
Quote by ZeligtheAxMan
I don't think it's cheating, I mean anything Joe Satriani considers a trademark has gotta be valid! And besides, I find Legato impossible!!!


Oh I know it's totally valid. I have a lot of respect for players who can mix it in with other techniques rather than just relying on one or the other. It's just that when I started trying to improv stuff, I relied heavily on legato and my right hand technique suffered for it. Now that I'm trying to "level" both hands, I'm feeling like I should pick notes that I'm playing legato to get that well-defined sweeping sound you get when playing at Yngwie speed.

I once read that if you can't pick at the same rate that you can play legato, your right hand technique needs work.
#5
Quote by :-D
You've pretty much answered your own question.

It's only "cheating" if you're using it to cover up for a lack of picking skill on something that's supposed to be played using consistent picking. I used to do this as well, but I don't consider legato to be any less of a technique. It's the same the other way; playing something with pickstrokes because your legato technique blows would be "cheating" under this definition as well.



Ahhh that hit the nail right on the head.
#6
look at a solo classical piece of music for any other instrument. There are notes that you need to toungue (pick) and notes that are tied together (legato). It adds expression, depth, drive and variety to a piece of music.
#7
It depends, really. If you want a really smooth sound, legato just sounds better. If you want to sound articulate, nothing beats alternate picking.
I tend to combine the two tbh, just using the occasional legato so that I can economy pick.
Current gear:
Carvin CT6M
TC Electronics Dark Matter distortion
Harley Benton 2x12, with Celestion V30s
Laney Ironheart 60w tube amp
#8
If i could, i would play everything with legato.
I just love the sound

Avoid those "should i learn this or that debates in your head", it is rarely a VS, just see everything as different methods and excel at all the techniques you come across(that you like) that way you are not giving up on any level of expression.

Please dont quote me on this someday when im correcting someones technique, but at the end of the day it really comes down to wether you could play exactly what you wanted exactly how you wanted it to sound.
Last edited by Slashiepie at Dec 18, 2011,
#10
Like others have said, it's only "cheating" if someone is explicitly using it as a crutch to avoid something that is supposed to be picked. Otherwise, it's just a tool like any other, and some guitar players just so happen to have a strong left-hand technique that they use a lot.

Also, in various contexts of the use of legato, especially "pure legato" (a long section or line in which there is simply no picking used at all), it is often showcased as something that's supposed to be impressive precisely because they don't have to *rely* on picking to smoothly and cleanly articulate something complex on the guitar, because they have developed left-hand strength.
#11
What the hell is cheating?? last time I checked, guitar was an art, not some celebrity contest or game. In the world of guitar, cheating is a meaningless term only used by the people who are missing the whole point of playing. Everyone plays differently to some degree. Even if you were to play someone else's work differently, it's just your own rendition. There's no law in music that says you have to play it exactly the same.

Just play and have fun. There is no cheating, only what you want to hear. If what you want to hear is beyond your technical level, you will strive to expand your knowledge and put yourself within those technical boundaries.
#12
Legato is a technique to elicit a sound. Smooth, connected notes is as cheating as much as horrible distortion and ice-pick notes from picking everything is cheating.
Ibanez RG2228 w/ EMG808Xs | Line 6 POD HD500 | Mackie HD1221
#13
Quote by realbebop
What the hell is cheating?? last time I checked, guitar was an art, not some celebrity contest or game. In the world of guitar, cheating is a meaningless term only used by the people who are missing the whole point of playing. Everyone plays differently to some degree. Even if you were to play someone else's work differently, it's just your own rendition. There's no law in music that says you have to play it exactly the same.

Just play and have fun. There is no cheating, only what you want to hear. If what you want to hear is beyond your technical level, you will strive to expand your knowledge and put yourself within those technical boundaries.


this

its your art, its not a competition, do what you need to to express yourself
#14
Quote by InfestedRabite
this

its your art, its not a competition, do what you need to to express yourself

was erm
Quote by Nexium
For a 10'er you certainly have found a good avatar.
#15
I'd say it's "cheating" if you want to play something fast, and can't pick it so you compromise with legato.
It's not when you can play something however you want, but you choose legato for the sound or whatver
"Yeees I am your god!" John Petrucci, Phsyco excercises
#16
TLDR.

Just saw the title of the thread to say that is the stupidest thing i've ever heard.
#17
If legato is cheating i am the biggest cheater in the world, cause the majority of my leadplaying is based around legato and tapping.
Fusion and jazz musician, a fan of most music.

Quote by Guthrie Govan
“If you steal from one person it's theft, and if you steal from lots of people it's research”


Quote by Chick Corea
"Only play what you hear. If you don't hear anything, don't play anything."
#18
Quote by :-D
You've pretty much answered your own question.

It's only "cheating" if you're using it to cover up for a lack of picking skill on something that's supposed to be played using consistent picking. I used to do this as well, but I don't consider legato to be any less of a technique. It's the same the other way; playing something with pickstrokes because your legato technique blows would be "cheating" under this definition as well.


Pretty much. And I am totally the kind of person who would "cheat" by using picking because my legato is meh
#19
Quote by :-D
It's only "cheating" if you're using it to cover up for a lack of picking skill


</thread>
Anfangen ist leicht, Beharren eine Kunst.
#20
Quote by Sickz
If legato is cheating i am the biggest cheater in the world, cause the majority of my leadplaying is based around legato and tapping.


I like the idea of being very independend of comfortable tone. If someone puts a random guitar with a random amp in my hands I still want to be able to play sick as shit. I imagine it to be very challenging with legato and tapping as main features.
If one is still able to play sweet in bad circumstances it´s not cheating.
#21
Quote by Facecut
I like the idea of being very independend of comfortable tone. If someone puts a random guitar with a random amp in my hands I still want to be able to play sick as shit. I imagine it to be very challenging with legato and tapping as main features.
If one is still able to play sweet in bad circumstances it´s not cheating.


Maybe, i just prefer the sound of legato runs and tapping licks.
I'm working hard on my alternate picking though, since i also quite enjoy long picking runs.
Fusion and jazz musician, a fan of most music.

Quote by Guthrie Govan
“If you steal from one person it's theft, and if you steal from lots of people it's research”


Quote by Chick Corea
"Only play what you hear. If you don't hear anything, don't play anything."
#23
Legato is a technique used in every aspect of instrumental playing. If players are cheaters, I'm a triple offender.

I just kinda read through, it's the picking velocity that gives him the sound.
╘MESHUG╦G╗AH





Ibanez ARX 350
Dunlop 535Q
Ibanez TS9
Peavey TransTube Supreme
DRIVE Elite straight 412
Last edited by bastards at Mar 2, 2012,
#24
I'm still not good enough not to use hammers and pulls
Not sure if a sig is a necessity.