#1
Ok guys, this is the truth:
I did most of my guitar playing at home, with GuitarRig 4.
I played with other people just 6-7 times in a rehearsal room with their equipment, amp etc. I just brought the guitar.
This is really a PROBLEM for me beacuse I'm not used to play with others, and I ABSOLUTELY don't know anything about amplification.
But, since I want to form a band to play with other for people, I really need to play in the right way. I don't want to become a Amp geek or something, I just want to understand basic things to sound like I want.

Ok, let's start:
I play mostly heavy and power metal, I have a Jackson DK2S Dinky, Guitar Rig 4 and that's all.
When I started I used a cheap ibanez guitar and 10watt amp, now I always play with guitar rig through headphones (BAD!!! ).

Sometimes I use a MARSHALL MS2R Mini linked to a Boss DS-1 , just to assure myself I can play through an amp (kind of).

WHAT I NEED:
I need a basic guitar set-up to play at home for training (also with headphones), recoding on pc (with Reaper), I can possibly use in live situations.

THE TONE:
I like heavy but clear tones, not too noisy and overdistorted.
I DON'T like additional effects except for delay and wah sometimes.
When I play this kind of music (heavy, power) I like guitar tones like: Vinnie Moore (maybe my favourite), Y.Malmsteen, Timo Tolkki etc.
I found that they use simple combination, which is what I want to recreate. Something like this:

Guitar --> Noise Gate --> Overdrive (max gain) --> AMP --> Delay

This means I need a Noise Gate, an Overdrive, an AMP and a Delay... but which one?! And also, at what price?

So I thought of buying a Multi effect Pedal which contains all theese effects (and much more) and I can link via USB to my PC to record with Reaper.
For this I can spend 200$ and I found interesting these two:
- BOSS ME-25
- LINE6 Floor POD PLUS

These two multieffect pedal should contain what I need (I think):
- They can be customized to recreate some tone or effect. My doubt is: HOW customizable are they? I can just change the gain/volume/tone over the default Presets, or can I set a chain with the effects I want?
- They can be linked via USB to record on Reaper (or other DAW)


So, my question is:
do you know these models? what you think about? Do you reccommend to me this or that? What about the customization?
I friend of mine said he doesn't reccommend me these two, instead he reccommend multieffect with valve (I don't know if they exist, and if exist if they are included in 200$ range).

PLEASE, don't tell me models over 200/250 $ at maximum.


ABOUT THE AMP:
I have many doubt about buying an amp for many reasons:
I'd play through it just for live (only a few times), but I won't ever play it in my house without headphones (I can't unfortunately). Also I don't know anything about amps

In the possibility a live performance, I could rent and AMP like many does...
so, do you think that if I play my guitar through a multieffect pedal and my pc (or my marhsall mini) it would be enought JUST FOR TRAINING PURPOSE?
For a live I'd rent one... but which one?? When I think of an amp I see Marshall, but I don't know what model. Is there a "standard model?


Sorry if I bothered you, but this forum is the ONLY way I can learn something.
Thank you for the patience-
#2
POD is good choice, go used and your money will do more. There is the HD model which has revamped tones for a few amps to address some criticism. At a minimum go for the PODxt, or floor model. There are additional sound packs you can pay to download, try to find one with them already downloaded.

I can't understand the rest of your post.
#3
Holy mega-post Batman!

Can't you record with Guitar Rig? I've never used it, but I thought you could.

To be honest, it sounds like you don't really need a multi-effects pedal, considering all you want is NG/OD/Delay.

I would stick with your Guitar Rig, for home use and recording. Then spend your money on an amp. Worry about pedals later, you can always wait and save for them.
How much are you willing spend on an amp? And where are you?

A Vypyr 60 sounds like it would do you pretty well. But without a budget I'm just stabbing in the dark.
RIP Adam
#5
Used POD X3 or XT with all the model packs. *Might* be able to find a used POD HD for that price, which would be the best.
Quote by Dave_Mc
I've had tube amps for a while now, but never actually had any go down on me
Quote by jj1565
maybe you're not saying the right things? an amp likes to know you care.





www.SanctityStudios.com
#6
Quote by Armhan
Ok guys, this is the truth:
WHAT I NEED:
I need a basic guitar set-up to play at home for training (also with headphones), recoding on pc (with Reaper), I can possibly use in live situations.

THE TONE:
I like heavy but clear tones, not too noisy and overdistorted.
I DON'T like additional effects except for delay and wah sometimes.


PLEASE, don't tell me models over 200/250 $ at maximum.


Zoom G3 @ $199.00(new) or $150ish (used)
Examples of what it can do?
High Gain Vid
Mid Gain Vid
Low Gain Vid
Ambient Stuff
Edit: Click on one of the above to view it.
The 40 sec looper is cool & fun. The drum machine can be a bit chessy. The unit can be powered with batteries so its a fun box to take around as a backup or practice during travels.
Only drawback of the unit is that you can use only 3 slots at once.
Last edited by steven_ferns84 at Dec 19, 2011,
#7
Thank you for all your answers!

Can't you record with Guitar Rig? I've never used it, but I thought you could.
To be honest, it sounds like you don't really need a multi-effects pedal, considering all you want is NG/OD/Delay.


Yes I can, but don't want to get used to guitar rig and not being able to play on a real amp with other people...
About AMPs I fount Line6 Spider IV very interesting as it is an amp, but it also does what I want from a multieffect pedal (togheter with a separate foot control).
What do you think about?

Anyway, for just a multieffect my range is 200/250 $, BUT for an AMP I'd spend also 350/400 $.

Zoom G3 @ $199.00(new) or $150ish (used)
Examples of what it can do?
High Gain Vid
Mid Gain Vid
Low Gain Vid
Ambient Stuff

The 40 sec looper is cool & fun.
Only drawback of the unit is that you can use only 3 slots at once.


Wow, this is really REALLY nice!
I searched on internet and found this is very simple and intuitive...
really good advice thanks, I think this is what I'm searching for.
It is also and audio interface that let me record via usb on my pc!

Just a couple of question, using my chain exaple (n.gate-od-amp-delay)
- If I play with it via headphones or via PC (to record), my chain would be like: noise gate - overdrive - amp. After I can put delay/reverb with my DAW... is it right?
- If I play with a Real Amp, my chain would be: n.gate-overdrive-delay, I think...
or should I put always my amp model in one of the 3 slots??
- Are there preset I can download, or defalut preset I can play with?

Thank you
#8
^The Line 6 Spider is a very bad amp. Avoid like the plague.

I liked the ambient stuff on those G3 videos, but everything else sounded really thin and is was quite evident that it was a digital modeler making the sounds

A used POD X3/XT (with all model packs) or HD (MAYBE a Boss GT-8 or 10) are what you should be looking at, trust me. Nothing else can compare until $1000+ more.


This was done entirely with POD Farm Platinum (the software version of the POD X3, or the XT with the Metal Shop pack):

http://youtu.be/LraKmcC9Ojc

I believe this is POD Farm too, but the quality isn't as good cause I just threw some random presets on the guitar and drums

http://youtu.be/T36dLZ9zUiM
Quote by Dave_Mc
I've had tube amps for a while now, but never actually had any go down on me
Quote by jj1565
maybe you're not saying the right things? an amp likes to know you care.





www.SanctityStudios.com
#9
Quote by Armhan
Thank you for all your answers!


Yes I can, but don't want to get used to guitar rig and not being able to play on a real amp with other people...
About AMPs I fount Line6 Spider IV very interesting as it is an amp, but it also does what I want from a multieffect pedal (togheter with a separate foot control).
What do you think about?

Anyway, for just a multieffect my range is 200/250 $, BUT for an AMP I'd spend also 350/400 $.


Wow, this is really REALLY nice!
I searched on internet and found this is very simple and intuitive...
really good advice thanks, I think this is what I'm searching for.
It is also and audio interface that let me record via usb on my pc!

Just a couple of question, using my chain exaple (n.gate-od-amp-delay)
- If I play with it via headphones or via PC (to record), my chain would be like: noise gate - overdrive - amp. After I can put delay/reverb with my DAW... is it right?
- If I play with a Real Amp, my chain would be: n.gate-overdrive-delay, I think...
or should I put always my amp model in one of the 3 slots??
- Are there preset I can download, or defalut preset I can play with?

Thank you

A typical high gain sound chain on it would be like this
Noise gate>Amp model>FX(any of your choice)

If you are using it with an amp then you can either use it up front or in the fx loop of the amp. I wouldn't worry about noise gates too much for non high gain stuff, thus for mid & low gain stuff you could try using an OD instead of a gate. The unit rather is very easy to use, a bit too simple than compared to the rest, but it does sound good & can compete with the POD HD/Digitech RP stuff in the tonal department. Zoom may release a bigger version of it later, you could either wait for that or get this one, for the price of this one you could actually pick up two used ones and use them together & thus have six slots to play with.
I think the user on youtube whose clips i linked above has posted the patches or settings for those somewhere, it will be mentioned somewhere in the vid description or comments, try looking into.

Edit: Like mentioned by the guy above me, avoid getting a practice amp to run these units into. That would include amps like Marshall MG, Line 6 Spiders. And it does sound a bit thin on the high gain clips, but at the budget you have, there isn't much else that could be used live that i can recommend for you.
Last edited by steven_ferns84 at Dec 19, 2011,
#10
The G3 is a great unit. I disagree that the G3 sounds digital compared to the Pod X3/XT. You won't need a noise gate except for high gain stuff. You will probably want to use and amp model when recording direct. And even sometimes when using your amp. Quite of few of the songs in my link below were done with the G3 and it's looper/drum machine.
#11
The reason I did not recommend any of the POD series to TS was because I've had issues with those cutting through the mix live when running them FoH or through a FRFR system. At louder volumes they just seem to get lost in the mix when run this way. The effect is like having a stereo home audio system on stage, too much processed & woofy sounding tones. They definitely have their place in the Recording department though, you can get a very realistic recording done with them. At their price range, they definitely have the Boss GT stuff beat for recording realistic amp tones. But the GT stuff doesn't exhibit this issue when used live direct, although it's not like having a real amp but atleast it can cut through and get heard easily, granted it's got its own cocked wah issues in its high gain sounds. At the $500 range there isn't a perfect solution out there yet, each unit has it's weakness in specific areas, some compromises have to be made depending on application.

The new Zoom unit works in both areas & well too. I believe it's the simplicity in the control layout of the unit. It's easy to make tweaks to it in real time.
Also that high gain vid I had linked was supposed to demo a Dimebag Scooped high gain sound & it seems to have been recorded direct without post processing the tone, perhaps the reason why it sounds so thin. I bet with a bit of post EQ'ing the recorded tracks, would help a lot to get a better tone overall.
#12
Thank you for all your advices!
I think I'm going to buy Zoom G3
#14
Zoom g3 or rp355.
Guitars: Fender FSR Standard Strat, Squire Affinity Strat, Epiphone Nighthawk
Amps: Vox AC15C1, Roland Cube 15x, Peavey KB-1
Pedals: Digitech RP355, HD500, Joyo AC-Tone, EHX Soul Food
#15
Zoom g3 or rp355

rp355... for some reason this does not convince me.
If I have to chose I'd go with zoom g3, or boss me25 at least, not digitech..

Why not a Peavey Vypyr 30? $200 US.

This is not bad at all!
But there's always the same problem: I can't use it at home except with headphones...
I don't know if with headphone I can really understand what this amp is capable of.
Also I don't know if 30w is enough for live indoor (such as pubs) etc.
#16
Quote by Armhan
rp355... for some reason this does not convince me.
If I have to chose I'd go with zoom g3, or boss me25 at least, not digitech..


This is not bad at all!
But there's always the same problem: I can't use it at home except with headphones...
I don't know if with headphone I can really understand what this amp is capable of.
Also I don't know if 30w is enough for live indoor (such as pubs) etc.

What's wrong with digitech?
Guitars: Fender FSR Standard Strat, Squire Affinity Strat, Epiphone Nighthawk
Amps: Vox AC15C1, Roland Cube 15x, Peavey KB-1
Pedals: Digitech RP355, HD500, Joyo AC-Tone, EHX Soul Food
#17
Nothing, I just think it equals the other multieffect I mentioned (in that $ range), but I'd prefer Zoom or Boss just because I have other boss accessories and they was fine,
also I found Zoom G3 more "solid" (maybe it's just my conviction)
#18
Quote by Armhan
rp355... for some reason this does not convince me.
If I have to chose I'd go with zoom g3, or boss me25 at least, not digitech..


This is not bad at all!
But there's always the same problem: I can't use it at home except with headphones...
I don't know if with headphone I can really understand what this amp is capable of.
Also I don't know if 30w is enough for live indoor (such as pubs) etc.


You'll still have the option to play through the built in speaker when no one is around. You wont have that option with the multi-fx If you play pubs, they'll mic your amp (usually), or you can just run it direct to the PA. The only problem your going to have is getting over a drummer at practice - but you'll have the same issues with a multi-Fx solution.

You said you wanted multi-fx and a real amp. This is your best bet,for your budget. I don't think you'll be happy with just a multi-fx

You might be able to find a 60 watt close to your budget.
Last edited by 667 at Dec 20, 2011,