#1
i got a job teaching to little youngsters like 10 to 12 years old ... who have never even really picked up an instrument .... i dont really know where to start .... i mean i know they say to teach them like scale exercises ...but how am i spossed to do that if they cant even hold down a clean note .... how do you teach this...how do you teach them to hold down a note ....or just to hold it to start.... i know this is gonna be tuff... help i need some wisdoms
"A girl and a boy bump into each other - surely an accident.
A girl and a boy bump and her handkerchief drops - surely another accident.
But when a girl gives a boy a dead squid - _that had to mean something_."
#3
If they have never picked up an instrument before I would teach them some basic chords maybe?
#4
Maybe they'll be better than you think.
I could play decent classical guitar at 11.
"I wanted water but I'll walk through the fire"
#5
Just start them off with strumming an open string, then 1st fret, then 2nd fret with correct finger placements etc.
#6
Start with the absolute basics. Teach them the names of the parts, because when you know what the things are, you'll know where things have to happen. Teach them how told hold it, and how to position themselves. Then teach them basic picking, and holding notes. Next, either basic scales or chords (there's a bit of dispute over which should be taught first), and then a very simple song. That's how I learned. Just don't be one of those pricks that yells at them to anchor their palm on the bridge, or always keep their thumb in the dead center of the neck.

Best of luck.
#7
There are a bunch of good method books out there. Parkening has one I use for my young students. It's classical guitar but the reading and simple technique will apply to anything in the future really. IF YOU don't know where to start, I'd start with a method book. I teach older students without one but find that I frequently follow the book to some degree anyway, even if I don't ask them to purchase it.

MAKE SURE THEY LEARN HOW TO READ STANDARD NOTATION.
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#8
Quote by Sean0913
Why do you have a job that you're in no way prepared for?

Best,

Sean


+1
#9
Quote by Sean0913
Why do you have a job that you're in no way prepared for?

Best,

Sean



ive taught before just never an absolute beginner
"A girl and a boy bump into each other - surely an accident.
A girl and a boy bump and her handkerchief drops - surely another accident.
But when a girl gives a boy a dead squid - _that had to mean something_."
#10
Quote by lesbian seagull
ive taught before just never an absolute beginner


OK, Got ya. Thanks for clarifying that!

The thing is, you have to get their buy in, make it fun to learn, and sneak in things that they enjoy doing and that actually comprise learning.

Unfortunately, you have your work cut out for you, because you're dealing with an age range where learning guitar is probably not something most of them care too much about if its not fun 100 percent of the time. You also have the challenge of shorter attention spans and personality management.

Approach this first and foremost from their eyes. What would make you excited and motivated to stay with you, pay attention, practice and most of all progress? If their parents will make them practice and you have their buy-in, you have an easier time ahead of you; if the parents intend to use the value of your teaching to their kid to serve as the sole motivator to practice...you've got a long road ahead.

"Jimmy took 3 lessons, but I guess he wasn't into it because although the guy was nice, I guess he just didnt interest Jimmy enough to go practice"

Happens all the time, and reports like that, fair or not can hurt your business. I always audition and interview before I accept a student, and there are plenty of ways that I winnow through candidates to choose only those who are ready to learn, and who have the attending support system in place to do well.

And just to stir the pot with a controversial statement (which I can readily back up if called to debate it):

IF YOU WANT TO LOSE YOUR KIDS AND FAIL... TEACH THEM STANDARD NOTATION!

Best,

Sean
Last edited by Sean0913 at Jan 10, 2012,
#11
what do you thinks a good way to get em interested.. just play some sick licks till they cant stand it anymore and they just have to learn it or will that make it seem harder? and also you got any advice for teaching in groups?
#12
I can't see why you wouldn't want to teach them standard notation....that cripples anyone that wants to be a musician. I don't think it should be at the forefront of learning by any means, there's so much more to music than reading but by far my biggest regret was never being taught to read. I had to learn when I went to college and it was awful. Of course you have to make it fun and give them a reason to want to practice but reading is an essential skill.

I teach all of my students how to read standard notation as well as tab AND use their ears and they're much better off for it. Why should a guitarist be any different from any other musician? Not teaching them contributes to the stereotype that guitarists are ignorant. You would fail miserably if you tried to give piano, violin, really any lessons without teaching the student how to read.
Winner of the 2011 Virginia Guitar Festival

Protools HD
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Focusrite ISA828 pres
Waves Mercury
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#13
Quote by Artemis Entreri
You would fail miserably if you tried to give piano, violin, really any lessons without teaching the student how to read.


Shin'ichi Suzuki disagrees with you...
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#14
Quote by Sean0913
And just to stir the pot with a controversial statement (which I can readily back up if called to debate it):



May I hear your viewpoints on this even without a debate?
#15
Quote by Arby911
Shin'ichi Suzuki disagrees with you...



Very true. I also know 3 violinists who learned on the Suzuki method and....aren't very good. Now that's not reflective of the method by any means, probably much more reflective of the players. That being said, I've never seen it be successful in my personal life. I'd love to but I haven't. Learning by Suzuki as part of the process is great but it can't be a be all end all. Being able to learn and play by ear is wonderful but has it's limitations. Students of Suzuki also tend to become dependent on listening to reordings and other players which obviously doesn't work if you're auditioning for an orchestra and have to sight read.

I may seem like I'm being strict about notation but I taught myself, from tablature and by ear without ever bother to learn notation or being taught it. Biggest regret. Not every musician wants to be professional like me but they never really know until they're called to make a decision, sometimes even after. I didn't think I could be until college and my biggest hang up for studio work was the notation.
Winner of the 2011 Virginia Guitar Festival

Protools HD
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Mojave, Sennheiser, AKG, EV etc mics
Focusrite ISA828 pres
Waves Mercury
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PRS CE 22
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Taylor 712
Last edited by Artemis Entreri at Jan 10, 2012,
#16
Giving the average long-term playing and rather skilled former Suzuki student a piece of new music is a disaster. I try to avoid them when distributing my compositions.
#17
Quote by Vlasco
Giving the average long-term playing and rather skilled former Suzuki student a piece of new music is a disaster. I try to avoid them when distributing my compositions.


I don't disagree. What we need to remember is that the reasons for learning to play an instrument are as varied as the people doing so.

Suzuki does introduce sight reading/standard notation later in the process, but becoming a 'great' musician isn't the purpose of the Suzuki method.

People who want to become professional musicians should of course know how to use standard notation, but let's be honest, the OP was about beginner kids...and they simply aren't competent to make those decisions, nor should they be forced to.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#18
To be honest, I don't think you should be teaching. I'm not trying to be harsh, but after your last thread in MT, I don't think you solid enough foundations.
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#19
Quote by Vlasco
May I hear your viewpoints on this even without a debate?


Sure. It's boring, asks a lot, and has almost no useful application today unless you are going to be doing the following:

1. Taking classical guitar
2. Going into a jazz ensemble
3. Going into composition.

The fact is, that most people that start a book one, I believe the percentage was 83% (Its been a few years, but this was white papered at a seminar I attended at the NAMM show in 2006) never make it to book 2. By that reasoning, you give someone a 17 percent chance of success, and 83% chance of giving up.

Tablature accomplishes something that's germane to the instrument, it also reduces any confusion because the guitar has unisons, where a piano does not. It makes much more sense to read and learn to sight read if you are a pianist, that's the language. But tablature is notation that goes way back to old lute music.

With classical studies it makes a lot of sense, its endemic to the material that's used for studies, but it also has position cues to isolate which pitch is within range.

But for all the work and time that is required, the payoff seems very questionable for learning sheet music. I firmly believe that there's this "emperors new clothes" mentality that ascribes learning sheet music as "important" and is rarely challenged. And, it's almost always unpleasant.

Now, I do teach sheet music to people at the end of the Academy, but by then they do it for personal fulfillment. Imagine you walk out, after a couple years with us, and can do almost everything and understand it, and the obvious thing "missing" is sightreading. Because that skill is now personally meaningful to them, they want to cap it off with an understanding of sheet music (by the way, rhythm development doesn't need sight reading to be understood either, I teach my students how to play, read and count rhythm, which I do teach when going over how to strum and read and write slash patterns).

So at that point only (or in instances where the goals coincide with the 3 numbered points above) would I advocate the study of sight reading. Because then when they get into counterpoint, 4 part SATB writing, etc, the skill set makes sense, but no...not for brand new beginners. I'm not an advocate of it, and the evidence supports their success rate. I'm not saying that it's the same for everyone, because some people just have a knack for teaching sight reading to kids and they experience success, so I understand there would be no reason for them to be swayed by my opinion, however, again I say that early on, for the derived benefit (with the exception to the above 3 instances) there's more work and time expended than it's worth it.

I'd sooner get them playing songs, strumming and enjoying the guitar with their families, and show them how cool and fun it is - at least that's the platform I've been working from for over 10 years and who knows how many hundreds of students.

I frankly am not interested in appeasment of ignorant people who think that guitar players aren't musicians because they aren't sight reading. Really? I should feel some impulse to have the approval of narrow ignorant elitists? The next time I care about that, will also make the first time.

If that's someone's viewpoint, keep your club to yourself, I don't want to be a member - not interested. If I show up to be a session player at a paid gig, then I'll make sure that I am schooled in the vernacular of that industry, which includes sight reading. But if a guy wants to simply strum Jimmy Buffett after a day with his buddies chasing bass on the lake, I'm not going to insist upon sight reading.

Painting everyone with the same narrow brush = fail. And most musicians ego fueled judgements are worth less than the pick they are using (that goes for mine as well) We sometimes forget that we are creating music for those who are not musicians, they only know if they like a song or not. Its us that get wrapped up on tube amps, scales, modes and voice leading our way out of I IV V's. We are the ones that have it wrong most of the time, because we miss the simple fact that it comes down to whether something sounds good to those who hear us.

*steps off soapbox*

Best,

Sean
Last edited by Sean0913 at Jan 10, 2012,
#20
ya dude your right i prolly shouldnt be teaching guitar .... but theres very few teachers around here ... wich is why im not very good .. if i would have had a teacher back when i was first begining maybe id be a little better ... but like i said there arent any around here ... well not unless you wanna pay 25 dollars an hour for ' em ... i only charge 10 and i go to their house..... i really enjoy teachin guitar... ive only given a few lessons but what i taught helped them improve ... i cant make em worse can I?..... and on standard notation ... ya i think it should deffinatly be taught .... but not just so you can read music but to help understand it ....at least when your teaching theory .. but when it comes to just starting out and teaching technique i wouldnt worry about it much if at all
"A girl and a boy bump into each other - surely an accident.
A girl and a boy bump and her handkerchief drops - surely another accident.
But when a girl gives a boy a dead squid - _that had to mean something_."
#21
What you have to watch out for is people who actually know what they're talking about. Honestly, if you aren't good, someone will realise, in the UK, 10 dollars is about 6, 7 pounds, that doesn't even buy a set of strings, and if I saw someone asking for that, I'd wonder why they were so desperate for business. I reckon that you should focus on being worth 25 dollars, because a good guitar teacher is worth every pound, and when (if) your students get better, you're gonna be 'that moron who thought so and so was right', I've met so many guitarists who realised too late that their teacher knew absolutely nothing.
#22
Quote by lesbian seagull
ya dude your right i prolly shouldnt be teaching guitar .... but theres very few teachers around here ... wich is why im not very good .. if i would have had a teacher back when i was first begining maybe id be a little better ... but like i said there arent any around here ... well not unless you wanna pay 25 dollars an hour for ' em ... i only charge 10 and i go to their house..... i really enjoy teachin guitar... ive only given a few lessons but what i taught helped them improve ... i cant make em worse can I?..... and on standard notation ... ya i think it should deffinatly be taught .... but not just so you can read music but to help understand it ....at least when your teaching theory .. but when it comes to just starting out and teaching technique i wouldnt worry about it much if at all


Don't down yourself...just try to think of what you'd want to learn if you were in their shoes. One of the first questions I ask a student is, "Why do you want to learn to play the guitar?" I ask the parents, the kids, etc. And that answer plays greatly into their motivation, and the "carrot" that will motivate them to continue learning.

Again, dont put yourself down; your heart seems to be in the right place and I cant begrudge you for trying to help with all you know. In fact if you didn't know, I have a free mentoring service here and if I can help you with specific questions as you move forward, just hit me with a PM, and I'll do my best.

Best,

Sean