#1
Anybody know any chord-scale practice patterns for bass?

I am not talking about note-scales.....
#2
You mean arpeggios?

And yes, I do. Thank you for asking.
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#3
Now I am not entirely sure what you are asking. If you want to play a scale using chords as notes the order would be Major1 minor2 minor3 Major4 Major5 minor6 dim7. But something tells me that isn't what you are asking for. I just don't know what to say here.

Also don't use that stupid "english learn to speak it." link. That's just rude.
Strauss!
"I am hitting my head against the walls, but the walls are giving way." - Gustav Mahler.

Quote by AeolianWolf
absolutely what will said

Yay, my first compliment!
#4
Quote by will42
Now I am not entirely sure what you are asking. If you want to play a scale using chords as notes the order would be Major1 minor2 minor3 Major4 Major5 minor6 dim7. But something tells me that isn't what you are asking for. I just don't know what to say here.

Also don't use that stupid "english learn to speak it." link. That's just rude.


nope... I know scales and modes....

I am talking about patterns made up of chord scales, not note scales, and not arpeggios either, although arpeggios a close....imagine instead of playing arpeggios (R, 3rd, 5th, 8th...with a 7th sometimes thrown in) melodically ascending and descending through a couple's of octaves, you build patterns with those intervals with the occasion passing tones or a 4t or 6th...

watch this video of Carol Kaye and she talks about chord scales, and calls them "jazz patterns"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9idtdWAAEA
#5
Well I'm not entirely sure what is getting us on to modes that's just something completely different. If I am correct (and i'm not sure if I am) what you are talking about is walking and yes it is a very common thing in jazz. There really is no basic walking pattern it's just whatever that bassist wanted to use. A lot off the time in jazz they don't explicitly write out the pattern for you and you just need to outline the chord with notes and I think that may be what you are referencing.

Personally i like walking as 1-3-5-6-m7-6-5-3 but that's just me and I do change it depending on the feel of the song.

I use passing tones to make a smooth voice leading from chord to chord but that's not their only use nor is it the only way to have a smooth voice leading.
Strauss!
"I am hitting my head against the walls, but the walls are giving way." - Gustav Mahler.

Quote by AeolianWolf
absolutely what will said

Yay, my first compliment!
Last edited by will42 at Jan 24, 2012,
#7
I have never hear the words she's talking about.

She touched on the fact that apparently scales don't count in jazz, that you have to play everything arppegiated(sp?).
She mentions upper extensions. These are what you see on lead sheets where it'll say A7(b9 #13)
That means that the chord played is formed (from bottom up A C# E G Bb F##). A 9 is an octave and a step above the root note, 10 is an octave and a 3rd, 11 is an octave and a 4th and so on.

To make it simple:
an A7 chord with all the natural upper extensions is:
A C# E G B D F#
Every note goes up a 3rd (as she says in the video)
But when re-arranged, it spells
A B C# D E F# G
Look familiar? Thats an A Mixolydian scale (Or dominant, or a D scale built on the 5th)

Whatever she's explaining she doens't do a good job of explaining, she brings up these diminished patterns and then plays them with some passing tones and says "Those are jazz patterns, you can't find them with scales." However, you can when you learn the chords to a song, you may have substituted chords or whatever, but they're just licks.

Shes just talking about licks. Listen to guys play, transcribe, observe what they're doing over the chords.
Also when practicing soloing, set goals or parameters for yourself. Look for the 3rd and 7th relationships.
But mainly, LISTEN.

Does any of that make sense?
Quote by Banjocal
sht up u flthy librl foogit stfu u soo mad n butthurdt ur ass is an analpocolypse cuz ur so gay "my ass hrts so mcuh" - u. your rectally vexed n anlly angushed lolo go bck 2 asslnd lolol
#8
^this. Carol Kaye may be a great bass player but god that woman can pontificate and bullshit better than anyone in her age bracket.

The other thing I will add is that if you really want to delve into this, get some theory and then come back and ask for specific advice on how to apply it.
#9
Quote by King Of Suede
I have never hear the words she's talking about.

She touched on the fact that apparently scales don't count in jazz, that you have to play everything arppegiated(sp?).
She mentions upper extensions. These are what you see on lead sheets where it'll say A7(b9 #13)
That means that the chord played is formed (from bottom up A C# E G Bb F##). A 9 is an octave and a step above the root note, 10 is an octave and a 3rd, 11 is an octave and a 4th and so on.

To make it simple:
an A7 chord with all the natural upper extensions is:
A C# E G B D F#
Every note goes up a 3rd (as she says in the video)
But when re-arranged, it spells
A B C# D E F# G
Look familiar? Thats an A Mixolydian scale (Or dominant, or a D scale built on the 5th)

Whatever she's explaining she doens't do a good job of explaining, she brings up these diminished patterns and then plays them with some passing tones and says "Those are jazz patterns, you can't find them with scales." However, you can when you learn the chords to a song, you may have substituted chords or whatever, but they're just licks.

Shes just talking about licks. Listen to guys play, transcribe, observe what they're doing over the chords.
Also when practicing soloing, set goals or parameters for yourself. Look for the 3rd and 7th relationships.
But mainly, LISTEN.

Does any of that make sense?


she said the chords move like a diminished chord
"up 3 frets and it's the same chord"...which is not true unless she is including substitutions...

patterns built out of chord tones...roots, 3rds, 5ths, and 7ths....PATTERNS.....NOT ARPEGGIOS...
#10
What on Earth are you talking about. Seriously, learn to express your ideas in a coherent manner if you want anyone to understand what the hell you are talking about.

patterns built out of chord tones...roots, 3rds, 5ths, and 7ths....PATTERNS.....NOT ARPEGGIOS...


What do you mean. Perhaps I should write it in a way you might understand? DON'T....NOT WRITING....UNDERSTAND....BETTER?
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#11
Quote by Killerfridge
What on Earth are you talking about. Seriously, learn to express your ideas in a coherent manner if you want anyone to understand what the hell you are talking about.


What do you mean. Perhaps I should write it in a way you might understand? DON'T....NOT WRITING....UNDERSTAND....BETTER?



here is a pattern.....1, 5, 3, 7...repeat

or

1, 6, 2, 8, 3, 9...etc....


HERE IS AN ARPEGGIO

1, 3, 5, 8

OR

1, b3, b5, 6, 8


what part of ....PATTERNS....NOT ARPEGGIOS DIDN'T YOU UNDERSTAND?????
#12
Well, it might have been the part where you described an arpeggio as a pattern

patterns built out of chord tones...roots, 3rds, 5ths, and 7ths
Current Gear:

Warwick Thumb BO 4
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AccuGroove Tri12l
Sansamp VT Bass
Line6 BassPodXT Live

CHECK OUT MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL!
#13
So you already know what to do... Take arps and play them differently.

And yes, if you take a Fully Diminished 7th chord and move the shape up or down 3 frets, it's the same thing, inverted.
Thats why Fully Diminished 7 chords are normally used for modulation:
Say I have an Ao7 (Resolves to Bb)
A C Eb Gb A
This is the same as a Co7 (Resolves to Db)
C Eb Gb Bbb(enharmonically as A) C
Same as Ebo7 (Resolves to Fb)
Eb Gb A Dbb(enharmonically C) Eb
Blah blah...

But thats not what you want.
I guess play over an Ao7
C Eb A Gb.

Looks like a pattern to me O.o
Quote by Banjocal
sht up u flthy librl foogit stfu u soo mad n butthurdt ur ass is an analpocolypse cuz ur so gay "my ass hrts so mcuh" - u. your rectally vexed n anlly angushed lolo go bck 2 asslnd lolol
#14
Quote by Killerfridge
Well, it might have been the part where you described an arpeggio as a pattern


oh really??? ...here is what I said...."imagine instead of playing arpeggios (R, 3rd, 5th, 8th...with a 7th sometimes thrown in) melodically ascending and descending through a couple's of octaves, you build patterns with those intervals with the occasion passing tones or a 4t or 6th..."
Last edited by jtkguitar at Jan 26, 2012,
#15
So you didn't in fact say the part that I quoted? I can take a screenshot if you like?

But either way, surely you have answered your own question?
Current Gear:

Warwick Thumb BO 4
Musicman "StatusRay" Stingray 4 - Carbon Fibre Neck
Musicman Stingray 5 HH
Sadowsky MV4 Jazz

Markbass LittleMark II
AccuGroove Tri12l
Sansamp VT Bass
Line6 BassPodXT Live

CHECK OUT MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL!
#16
Quote by King Of Suede
So you already know what to do... Take arps and play them differently.

And yes, if you take a Fully Diminished 7th chord and move the shape up or down 3 frets, it's the same thing, inverted.
Thats why Fully Diminished 7 chords are normally used for modulation:
Say I have an Ao7 (Resolves to Bb)
A C Eb Gb A
This is the same as a Co7 (Resolves to Db)
C Eb Gb Bbb(enharmonically as A) C
Same as Ebo7 (Resolves to Fb)
Eb Gb A Dbb(enharmonically C) Eb
Blah blah...

But thats not what you want.
I guess play over an Ao7
C Eb A Gb.

Looks like a pattern to me O.o


I am looking for "patterns" built predominantly out of chordal-tones....R, M3/m3, 5th, M7/m7, 8....
#17
Quote by Killerfridge
So you didn't in fact say the part that I quoted? I can take a screenshot if you like?

But either way, surely you have answered your own question?



knock yourself out...
#18
You know, people are trying to help. People who have training and educational background in music theory. You either like trolling or you need to grow up and calm down.

We are a very reasonable bunch but your inability to explain yourself and then casting derision on people who try to clarify what the hell you want is getting old.
#19
Quote by anarkee
You know, people are trying to help. People who have training and educational background in music theory. You either like trolling or you need to grow up and calm down.

We are a very reasonable bunch but your inability to explain yourself and then casting derision on people who try to clarify what the hell you want is getting old.



this forum really highlights the decline of the worlds educational system...

I don't know why I bother with it as 9/10 of the people on it can't even play...
#20
Then find some place else if this doesn't suit you. Its a relatively free internet and there are many other bass and music related sites to pester if you feel you are wasting breath here. And watch for that swinging door when you leave cause it swings back fast.
#21
Quote by jtkguitar
this forum really highlights the decline of the worlds educational system...

I don't know why I bother with it as 9/10 of the people on it can't even play...


Warned for flaming. If you ask for help, don't insult the people who you are seeking said help from.
Quote by skater dan0
Damn you and your ninja-like modding
#22
#23
if you know "scales and modes", you don't need shapes.
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#24
Quote by jtkguitar
Anybody know any chord-scale practice patterns for bass?

I am not talking about note-scales.....

Go ask the remaining Beatles or Cream how much theory and scales they knew.
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#25
Quote by jtkguitar
I am looking for "patterns" built predominantly out of chordal-tones....R, M3/m3, 5th, M7/m7, 8....


Heres some:

M3, m7, #11, b9, 8, b7, 5

m7, 6, M3, 4, R, 5, R, 6, b7 #9, M10, 8

Play them in all 12 keys.
Is that what you want?
Quote by Banjocal
sht up u flthy librl foogit stfu u soo mad n butthurdt ur ass is an analpocolypse cuz ur so gay "my ass hrts so mcuh" - u. your rectally vexed n anlly angushed lolo go bck 2 asslnd lolol
#26
Quote by jtkguitar
this forum really highlights the decline of the worlds educational system...

I don't know why I bother with it as 9/10 of the people on it can't even play...


world's**

Then just go away. Just run the scales and pick some notes you want out of it, it is just a matter of getting comfortable with the tonality of each degree of the scale and then using specific notes.

This is unrelated but Anarkee is also 100% correct.
Strauss!
"I am hitting my head against the walls, but the walls are giving way." - Gustav Mahler.

Quote by AeolianWolf
absolutely what will said

Yay, my first compliment!