#1
Basically how do some of the old vet guitar players here feel about games like Rocksmith, that teach you guitar all without having to open up a book or see a teacher.

Starting to learn guitar myself, I'm going to be using Rocksmith to help me. I will be entirely self taught, as I prefer to go my own pace. I'll be using Rocksmith, Youtube and Books most likely.

Of course I have more then enough friends to make sure im doing my technique right.


Just wondering because just browsing some forums here and a lot of people seem very bitter about rocksmith. I think they don't know about all the minigames and stuff it has to actually teach you guitar, I think they think its just another guitar hero rip off.

Would love to hear some older guitar players opinons on future generations learning guitar from things like Rocksmith and Google, other than teachers like you guys had to do it.
#3
I guess i dont really have a problem with the game itself. I just would never want to use it as my only source of learning guitar because then I would not have any music theory background. Plus i don't have passion in video games so it would be hard for me to learn that way but if it makes playing guitar cool again, i can't complain.
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#4
Quote by GKDAIR
I will be entirely self taught


No you will not. You are using a source of information to learn. Therefore you are not self taught. This jerks my chain when people say that and are not politically correct.

I don't like the way it's glamorized by a game. It seems any average joe now is a "Pro Guitarist" because of stuff like this. I worked very hard to get my chops and some Joe plays this game for a week and plays and everyone kisses his feet because he now has played an overly popularized song.

Now being serious (My first paragraph is serious... Second, not so much.) I don't really mind it. Don't brag about it though, or think it'll make you instantly a master. This is great to get people who can't focus on a book long started, but you should find a teacher and a book to compliment your learning.

I, myself, have never tried it. Seems okay, but it's not my cup of tea. I perfer to rock out with my nice amp turned to 11.

Cheers,
Xter
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#5
Yeah I don't care what other people do at all. I'm definitely not bitter because learning guitar was not "hard" and was/is always incredibly fun for me. I never felt like it was work or I was "having" to open a book or see a teacher.

If people need to incorporate a video game that's fine, it's a free country and you can do whatever you want. I'll see you on stage.

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#6
I've heard that the minigames are a nice change of pace for practicing while still learning a bit, but I haven't tried it. Don't rely on it though, use it more as a fun activity to do, kind of like if you play a sport. If you play soccer, you won't become an amazing player by simply doing skirmishes at practice, you need to do drills to develop and perfect technique.
#7
You can't "learn to play the guitar" from Rocksmith. End of discussion. You'll learn to use a guitar as a controller for Rocksmith - not the same thing.

It's a way to make some elements of practicing fun, it's a fun game and it's arguably more productive for you than playing FIFA or COD. But it's still a game, no matter what they claim it's not going to teach you how to play the guitar, but at the same time playing the game whilst getting proper lessons or studying the correct resources on the internet/from books would probably be beneficial to the overall learning process.

Here's the absolute number one flaw in Rocksmith which is inescapable - it presents playing the guitar as an exercise in hand-eye co-ordination, especially from a timing point of view and in the real world there are no visual cues when playing the guitar. You end up learning to play in a way that suits the game, but doesn't actually equate to playing the guitar well. If a game is scoring you you're naturally going to assume that a higher score means you're "better" when it's not going to be the case.

Singstar has exactly the same flaws, if you want to get high scores in it you actually have to sing badly, it only cares about pitch and note duration so if you want to "win" you need to ensure your tone is pure, any funky overtones that would sound awesome in a performance situation will throw off the pitch tracking. Pitch changes are stepped, not smooth so you're better off mmicing that too As far as timing goes again, yo're watching a bar, not listening to the music, and you have to sing your words staccato in order to finish them bang on time rather than allow them to trail off naturally.
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#9
If you can come away shredding like Loomis or Becker, I support it.
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#10
As a video game, Rocksmith does all that intends for it to do and with flying colors; to give the user a fun and unique way to learn and/or improve their skills with the instrument. I've had the game for a few weeks and, although the game starts out slow (granted, I've been playing for five years and the game assumes you can't even fret a note) and the notation is an adjustment if you are used to TABs, it is a very fun way to learn some songs.

However, as Steven pointed out, the game is not going to make you a great guitarist even if you can ace the songs. The game forces you into a "Guitar Hero"-mindset in which it's all about hitting the notes it gives you at the right time rather than actually playing the instrument. A song is more than just notes on a page: you can play all the right notes and the song can sound nothing like the recording if you are hitting extra strings (which, in Rocksmith, I've randomly hit extra strings a few times and it still counts that note as correct), you don't mute the strings at the proper times, you don't bend a note to the perfect pitch (the notation for a bending doesn't give you any signals for how far to bend and accuracy is only judged in one of the minigames), or you don't do subtle things like add vibrato over a long note. What Rocksmith scores as "correct" might not be considered "correct" if you were to play the same thing in front of another person.

My largest complaint with Rocksmith is that, no matter how much the game gives you to simply play music without scoring, it never gives you the knowledge needed to create your own music. Yes one can simply node around and eventually come across some cool music, but to move beyond playing a video game and actually playing an instrument the user needs to know, for instance, what chords sound good together or what notes sound good over a particular key. I understand why the developers chose to ignore theory, but without theory or years of experience playing the player is never given the knowledge to write and play original songs; a problem that keeps the user tethered to the game rather than truly becoming a guitarist.

It's not that Rocksmith is a bad teaching tool; it teaches the skills needed for a person to play songs. Just don't go in thinking that the game alone will make you a great musician.
#11
Rocksmith's main flaw IMO is not content, not techniques it tries to teach...but! Its not hook up friendly to basic HDMI HDTV setups...i get nasty audio latency with it which throws me off bad when playing the songs. Most people offer advice on running seperate audio from the 360/PS3 into a home theater system or seperate speakers etc....Kind of angry i got a game that looks fun and i was happy when i unlocked my first pedal but unless i buy other crap i cant really enjoy it.
#12
I played the game for 6 weeks but now I'm bored with it. Still like to use it for scale runner though. I prefer the Gibson L&M series for serious practicing now.

Don't get me wrong, the game is awesome. I just find it has no structure for someone that is serious about learning.
#13
So basically from what im reading here is that as long as you dont use rocksmith as your only way of learning you'll be fine.

I plan on picking up some books over music theory (I was in band but have no idea how to read guitar music) and watch youtube videos and take advice from friends and stuff so I think I will be fine.
#14
Quote by steven seagull


Here's the absolute number one flaw in Rocksmith which is inescapable - it presents playing the guitar as an exercise in hand-eye co-ordination, especially from a timing point of view and in the real world there are no visual cues when playing the guitar. You end up learning to play in a way that suits the game, but doesn't actually equate to playing the guitar well. If a game is scoring you you're naturally going to assume that a higher score means you're "better" when it's not going to be the case.


well, tabs and sheet music do the same thing to the average person up to the point of memorization.

i don't really care for the idea as a learning tool, but honestly, guitar's one of those instruments you just stumble over for a while no matter what until the lightbulbs start flashing and you realize how much you used to suck. at least, IMO - it was one of the instruments i didn't ever take lessons for or anything but there's a lot to grasp, with lessons even, most beginners really don't see the "big picture" for a very long time.
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#15
Yeah i've noticed around this board some people will quickly vent their fiery passion about rocksmith and why they hate it but 2 posts later they will be recommending someone a tab. Wtf?
#16
None of my concern. I still want to play it.
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#17
Quote by Xter
No you will not. You are using a source of information to learn. Therefore you are not self taught. This jerks my chain when people say that and are not politically correct.

I don't like the way it's glamorized by a game. It seems any average joe now is a "Pro Guitarist" because of stuff like this. I worked very hard to get my chops and some Joe plays this game for a week and plays and everyone kisses his feet because he now has played an overly popularized song.

Now being serious (My first paragraph is serious... Second, not so much.) I don't really mind it. Don't brag about it though, or think it'll make you instantly a master. This is great to get people who can't focus on a book long started, but you should find a teacher and a book to compliment your learning.

I, myself, have never tried it. Seems okay, but it's not my cup of tea. I perfer to rock out with my nice amp turned to 11.

Cheers,
Xter

+1

"Self teaching" means not taking YouTube lessons or playing Rocksmith.
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#18
Quote by Xter
No you will not. You are using a source of information to learn. Therefore you are not self taught. This jerks my chain when people say that and are not politically correct.

Awesome. Just like self help books. There's no such thing. If you're reading a self help book, that's not self help, that's help!


Anywho back on topic...

Rocksmith will not help. It may make practicing more fun and thus you might keep at it for a bit longer, but as far as actually teaching you, there's no substitute for a good teacher.
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#19
I really would get a teacher if I were you, at least for a few months first while you get the basics. If you're not getting a teacher just so that you could say you're "self taught" then you probably should look into getting one.
#20
Lord people are so anal on this site.

I'm not avoiding a teacher simply to prove a point. And what would you classify as self help? How the hell am I supposed to know chords unless I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help.

I'm avoiding a teacher because anything a teacher will teach I could easily find online or on youtube to make sure im doing it right. Also, they'll have me practicing a D chord for 58 hours before I can move up to the *gasp!* G chord! No thanks.
#21
I jumped on the RS bandwagon last year and it did help me get going but I'm starting to agree with the forum members who are more experienced than me. Like steven seagull said there are issues with how you are scored. I've had lots of issues with bends and timing. If you hit a note just milliseconds early or late you don't advance. If your bend/slide/whatever doesn't hit just right you don't advance. If the sound engine hears part of the last note played it might effect the next notes played. Also the dynamic difficulty is ridiculously stupid. It doesn't build phrases based on root notes. It just picks random notes to add. And I agree it doesn't do much to teach. For me it was fun to play at first but it's gotten old.

Hey if it works for you that's great but don't put all of your eggs in one basket. Right now I've switched over to Rock Prodigy. Similar concept but you can see all of the notes and they have lessons like the Dave Mustain App where Dave teaches you how to play Megadeth.
#22
Quote by GKDAIR
Lord people are so anal on this site.

I'm not avoiding a teacher simply to prove a point. And what would you classify as self help? How the hell am I supposed to know chords unless I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help.

I'm avoiding a teacher because anything a teacher will teach I could easily find online or on youtube to make sure im doing it right. Also, they'll have me practicing a D chord for 58 hours before I can move up to the *gasp!* G chord! No thanks.

A good private teacher of anything will move at the student's pace, not set the pace.
#23
Quote by GKDAIR
Lord people are so anal on this site.

I'm not avoiding a teacher simply to prove a point. And what would you classify as self help? How the hell am I supposed to know chords unless I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help.

I'm avoiding a teacher because anything a teacher will teach I could easily find online or on youtube to make sure im doing it right. Also, they'll have me practicing a D chord for 58 hours before I can move up to the *gasp!* G chord! No thanks.

Dude, either accept our opinions or move on. Why did you ask how we feel if you don't even care? If your intention was to debate that you're always correct then don't even pretend to ask a question.
The reality is that rocksmith is a video game and guitar teachers... teach guitar! No matter how many times you make a new thread about you learning the guitar you're still going to run into people with different views, so maybe it's time to stop posting.

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#24
Quote by GKDAIR
Lord people are so anal on this site.

I'm not avoiding a teacher simply to prove a point. And what would you classify as self help? How the hell am I supposed to know chords unless I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help.

I'm avoiding a teacher because anything a teacher will teach I could easily find online or on youtube to make sure im doing it right. Also, they'll have me practicing a D chord for 58 hours before I can move up to the *gasp!* G chord! No thanks.

Lose the attitude please, there's no reason to act like a dick.

This is a public forum, you post a thread and people can post whatever they want in response subject to the rules. If you don't like what people post you can always ignore it, but it's not your job to police your own threads. Besides considering you can't actually play the guitar you're not really qualified to be passing judgement on the best way to learn, are you? People who know far more than you about this subject are being helpful enough to take the time to share their experience with you - if you keep acting like a bratty know-it all people will stop bothering pretty quickly.
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#25
Quote by GKDAIR
I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help.

a teacher will teach


Lololol
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#26
Quote by GKDAIR
I'm avoiding a teacher because anything a teacher will teach I could easily find online or on youtube to make sure im doing it right. Also, they'll have me practicing a D chord for 58 hours before I can move up to the *gasp!* G chord! No thanks.




...

nope, still funny

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#27
Quote by GKDAIR
Lord people are so anal on this site.

I'm not avoiding a teacher simply to prove a point. And what would you classify as self help? How the hell am I supposed to know chords unless I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help.

I'm avoiding a teacher because anything a teacher will teach I could easily find online or on youtube to make sure im doing it right. Also, they'll have me practicing a D chord for 58 hours before I can move up to the *gasp!* G chord! No thanks.


We are anal because we get a lot of threads from newbies, who can barely strum the three most basic chords, that ask for opinions and when we list them, said newbie has to turn around and act all high and mighty thinking they know it all.

Self help is where you only use your self. You won't get that information, that's why being self taught sucks. You can't communicate with other musicians.

Did I read right, use a teacher? "I find the information myself or use a teacher, thus self help." That is quoted from your own words. A teacher does not count as "self help". That's like me getting a degree in Aeronautics and saying I was a self taught astronaut. Let's see how long till NASA takes up that offer

You are avoiding a teacher because anything they teach you could find online and make sure you're doing it right? Your grammar is worse then my run on sentences or you don't know what you are talking about. A teacher is suppose to help you and making sure you are doing it right. Why else would you pay them? An online lesson only gets so interactive with the audience (you!). A teacher can point out technique flaws you can't see, a teacher can address issues with timing and phrasing, and so much more. You might think you are correct, but a teacher can prove you are not. Plus teachers can shot down massive egos quick

If they have you practicing a D chord for 58 hours, chances are you need it. Just my two cents.

Cheers,
Xter
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#28
I put down my guitar after 2 years of practice for like.... 6 or 7 months and lost all interest in it. Then Rocksmith came along and I figured why the hell not? The game is fun as hell and gets me motivated to do more. I've been playing since shortly after it's release, I've learned a few songs, I'm MUCH MUCH better at playing without looking at the guitar itself, and on those days where I say "man, I don't feel like practicing today", I just boot up Rocksmith and within minutes of playing, I'm all fired up again and will move on to real practice later.

The be-all end-all to learning guitar? No.
An excellent tool to inspire and motivate you? Absolutely.
Worth the money? Most definitely (if you don't just put it in a dusty corner after a few weeks).