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#1
hey guy, so im wondering, should i start getting some individual pedals or just get a new board? i have a rp 500 now and want something not so digital. i play metal and rock, but i also use cleans a ton. so im thinking it would be cheaper for a boad. im thinking the zoom gt9.2tt for a board and not sure on idivuidual pedals since ive never owned any. thoughts?
#2
The RP500 is not "so digital". If you think the RP500 sounds digital then I don't recommend getting another multifx. Get analog pedals. That way when you think they don't sound right you can call it something else.
#3
you mean another multi-fx unit right? if you want to go pedals then you have to be sure they can do the sounds you want with a reasonable amount of ease of use. i use pedals myself but my set up is pretty simple and doesn't requier a bunch of fancy dance moves to turn the stuff on an off. if you have a lot of sound changes when you play then rack mounted or floor mfx may be the better bet.
#5
Quote by lucky1978
Multifx in home, pedals out.

I am the exact opposite. At gigs I want MIDI and carefully programmed patches written for specific songs in the set list. When just screwing around at home or jamming with mates pedals are much easier.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#6
^ I'll bet your multifx is way better than the me50 I use.
Last edited by lucky1978 at Mar 26, 2012,
#7
Quote by fly135
The RP500 is not "so digital". If you think the RP500 sounds digital then I don't recommend getting another multifx. Get analog pedals. That way when you think they don't sound right you can call it something else.

next to your name it says cheap gear enthusiast. i dont wanna be rude, but how about you go lay down and not tell me how i think something sounds
#8
Quote by Vicious_Turtle
next to your name it says cheap gear enthusiast. i dont wanna be rude, but how about you go lay down and not tell me how i think something sounds
I think you do want to be rude. But seeing as you are asking for advice about cheap gear, you should be more respectful. BTW, I've owned both an RP1000 and a G9.2TT. Both are cheap gear.
#10
The point I was making is that if you find the RP500 too digital then don't expect other multifx to not be too digital as well. Dialing in tones with a multifx is tricky because of the large number of parameters, amp and cabinet modeling that makes interacting with a guitar amp difficult, and the huge number of FX.

The RP1000 and RP500 are right up there with the state of the art in modeling for units in the $500 and under range. That's why I said if the RP500 doesn't sound good then looking at another low end multifx probably won't fix your problem.
#11
I was just about to post this question.

I have an Digitech RP355, and was debating on selling it for more straight forward pedals, like the tube screamer, MXR fuzz, bad monkey etc..

EDIT
I should just save for a nice friggin amp... taking donations btw
Last edited by spadeswyld at Mar 26, 2012,
#12
spadeswyld, there are a million pedals out there and it's a shot in the dark as to what ones will speak to you. I would suggest holding on to your RP355 and purchasing a few separate pedals to go along with it. The best way to really see what your RP355 will do is to A/B it's onboard distortion stomps with individual pedals.

I found that I could dial in the RP's Redline distortion stomp to sound just like my MXR Classic Overdrive. I A/B'd my M5's Big Muff stomp against my Russian Big Muff and find I could get them really close. I had a Hafler T3 preamp that had a nice Marshall tone on the overdrive channel. I was able to dial in one of the RP1000 amp models to an almost exact match once I realized that the cabinet model was a significant factor in the tone.

Here's my pedalboard with 3 multifx in the chain...

#13
Quote by fly135
spadeswyld, there are a million pedals out there and it's a shot in the dark as to what ones will speak to you. I would suggest holding on to your RP355 and purchasing a few separate pedals to go along with it. The best way to really see what your RP355 will do is to A/B it's onboard distortion stomps with individual pedals.

I found that I could dial in the RP's Redline distortion stomp to sound just like my MXR Classic Overdrive. I A/B'd my M5's Big Muff stomp against my Russian Big Muff and find I could get them really close. I had a Hafler T3 preamp that had a nice Marshall tone on the overdrive channel. I was able to dial in one of the RP1000 amp models to an almost exact match once I realized that the cabinet model was a significant factor in the tone.

Here's my pedalboard with 3 multifx in the chain...



Thanks for the reply.

and just out of curiosity, Does anyone know if the Carl Martin Pedals worth the price tags? I dont see that many people using them.
#15
Quote by Vicious_Turtle
the only reason i would go with the zoom is cause its twin tube
The G9.2TT is a nice multifx, but I wouldn't go with it now. The G9.2TT is a generation behind the G3 in FX and amp models.

In about 2 months the G5 will be released. It has more FX and amp models than the G3, a Z-Pedal, more FX in the chain, and a tube.
#16
Quote by lucky1978
^ I'll bet your multifx is way better than the me50 I use.

Yep, mine are rack units.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#17
well this threade hasn't gone all that well .

to Fly 135 : yes there are a million pedals out there and many of them do have unique sounds this is kinda the point of getting pedals. mfx units have their "sounds" and that is it they all sound the same. if one craps out then you can just buy a new one and expect it to sound exactly the same. this is often not the case with analog pedals. some just seem to sound better than others of the same brand and make. being able to custom make my set up is the appeal of pedals for me (that and i just plain don't need a lot of fancy stuff). in the end i have my sound and you may have to look hard for another guy who uses the same setup. nothing wrong with mfx and certainly you have the best of both worlds which obviously works for you.

Spadeswyld : look at my answer to the OP. thats what you should be asking yourself if you decide to go to pedals. pedals can cost you a fair buck for a far more limited set up than a mfx. be sure that is what you want.
#18
i would say individual, one fx board is likely more affordable, but more of the time its more complicated. For Ex, i used to have the Boss GT - 6 multi fx processor, i would have a lot of troublb removing some gain or removing effects. With individual pedals you can simply add or remove a pedal from your board. its simple, also its rather fun to collect different styles of pedals, sometimes the artwork is great, most of the time the sound is better.
#19
Get individual pedals. You'll have a custom set up with all the sounds you need, and without a bunch of extra crap you never use. It might cost more in the long run. It might take a few tries to get it right. Get into it and it can be an enjoyable experience.

Also, if you have to deal with less fx for a while, it'll make you a better player. You won't have a smoke screen to hide behind. And depending on the amp you're using, it could let the amp shine in a way you've never heard (admittedly I don't remember if you even mentioned your amp).

IMO 'Tis better to have a bunch of stuff that sounds as it was intended and ultimately makes you sound like you, not an exact replica of someone else and something you don't actually have
ΦΚΣ


Life is short. PLAY LOUD!
#20
Quote by bpdeem
IMO 'Tis better to have a bunch of stuff that sounds as it was intended and ultimately makes you sound like you, not an exact replica of someone else and something you don't actually have

Not all MFX are copies of existing pedals. For example TC Electronic has created some original stuff.

And also, a lot of pedals are clones of the famous ones. Think of how many Tubescreamer clones there are, for example...
#22
Quote by bpdeem
IMO 'Tis better to have a bunch of stuff that sounds as it was intended and ultimately makes you sound like you, not an exact replica of someone else and something you don't actually have
The day a multifx can make me sound like anyone else is the day I sell all my multifx that can't do that and buy the one that can.

Some of this stuff you guys are saying is ludicrous. I.E. it's better not to have a bunch of fx that you don't use. As if you really know which ones you won't use if you never had them.

Or that a multifx only has one sound, but you can find more with separate pedals. Anyone asking whether to buy a multifx or separate pedals obviously doesn't know enough to have is own special sound. There are plenty of sounds in a multifx.

If you really want to make a valid argument then you could say... That separate pedals are easier to use because the controls are always visible and not hidden in menus. Or that having separate pedals makes your FX immediately available instead of having to be configured ahead of time. Or that the large number of tone affecting parameters, usually scattered across multiple menus, in a multifx can cause the tone to be off, but finding exactly why is more complicated than in separate pedals.

But the idea that you can't sound unique using a multifx is not the least bit plausible. How you sound has far more with you and your ability than any selection of pedals.
#24
Quote by Jyrgen
Not all MFX are copies of existing pedals. For example TC Electronic has created some original stuff.

And also, a lot of pedals are clones of the famous ones. Think of how many Tubescreamer clones there are, for example...


I totally get what you're saying and do agree. I should have probably expanded a little... a large part of my thinking is remembering that I don't like amp modeling from MFX.

For digi stuff, take Strymon for example. The Strymon El Capistan is one of the BEST sounding tape delays I've ever heard. It IS a delay pedal. It does that one thing and that one thing EXTREMELY well. It very much has its identity and does not give it up. On the other hand, MFX are more shape shifters. They don't have a specific identity.

Its like my take on amps. I don't like modeling amps (aside from tone... different talk all together) because to me, an amp worth having will sound like itself, not try to be 10 other amps. It will have its own gain structure, its own response, its own tonal quarks, and (hopefully) do what it was made to do very well.

I like your example of TCE. I have a Flashback delay and LOVE it! I have used and enjoy using over half of the preset delay patches on it and switch them around regularly. This deeply contrasts with the RP (I forget the number) I had, which I really only had a clean, dirty, phase, and wah with varying amounts of delay or verb in each. I didn't use most of what the unit was capable of. At least 9 amp types (some of which were decent ish), 3 types of delay, 6 reverbs, flange, phase, tremolo, pitch shift, wah, ya (like wah but different vowel sounds) noise gates, pickup adjustment, etc... Now I have a few stompboxes and get 1000% of what they're able to do rather than just breaking the surface.

On tubescreamers... a tubescreamer is a tubescreamer. They are all a little bit different. BUT they're all tubescreamers. If you have one, you know what you've got. No questions asked.

Not trying taking any digs if it comes off like that. Sorry for starting out vague.
ΦΚΣ


Life is short. PLAY LOUD!
Last edited by bpdeem at Mar 27, 2012,
#25
multi fx offer lots of versatility, but I've never heard one that sounds as good as a well-planned chain of individual stompboxes.

you pay for what you get
Audio Ecstasy Productions!

Guitar/Backline Tech in the Los Angeles area and on tour!
Custom guitar pedals and cabling for stage and studio!

I set up DAWs and tweak computers to record audio. Hit me up @ audioecstasyproductions[at}gmail.com
#26
If I was starting again building a gigging rig I think I'd just buy a TC G-System. Those things rock, you can even rack mount them and separate the switchboard.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#27
Quote by Cathbard
If I was starting again building a gigging rig I think I'd just buy a TC G-System. Those things rock, you can even rack mount them and separate the switchboard.

I'd love to try a G-System. Probably the only "multi-fx" unit I could ever see myself buying.
#28
I'm still very happy with my rig. The GP-8 is awesome, it's just 8 Boss pedals in one MIDI controllable box. Tbh I don't even use many of the effects in it anyway but it makes a brilliant clean boost. It also doubles as my MIDI controller for the effects unit I do use a lot which is the Quadraverb in the loop - which also doubles as a secondary programmable master volume.
The only downside of the GP-8 is that there is a slight delay between hitting the footswitch and it actually changing. You have to pre-empt it by a split second. When I was using it in the studio I'd control it from the sequencer and program in the exact time delay. I can't remember what that was exactly, around 300 ms iirc.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#29
Quote by bpdeem
Its like my take on amps. I don't like modeling amps (aside from tone... different talk all together) because to me, an amp worth having will sound like itself, not try to be 10 other amps. It will have its own gain structure, its own response, its own tonal quarks, and (hopefully) do what it was made to do very well.


So if they made a tube amp that had 4 channels and they could be the exact sounds from any 4 channels of any amp ever made you would not want it?

If amp A is worth having because it sounds like amp A; amp B also sounds like amp A but is somehow not worth having because it has no true identity other than mimicking amp A?

IMO all that matters is end result. Low end multi-fx is great if your exploring effects. Individual pedals can get super addicting and expensive. If you're not happy with your current mfx you may be more of an individual pedal person. You won't know until you play it.
/rig
#30
Quote by mespinos
So if they made a tube amp that had 4 channels and they could be the exact sounds from any 4 channels of any amp ever made you would not want it?

If amp A is worth having because it sounds like amp A; amp B also sounds like amp A but is somehow not worth having because it has no true identity other than mimicking amp A?

IMO all that matters is end result. Low end multi-fx is great if your exploring effects. Individual pedals can get super addicting and expensive. If you're not happy with your current mfx you may be more of an individual pedal person. You won't know until you play it.

If he did wouldn't he just buy a Randall MTS? They aren't everybody's cup of tea.
I like the fact that my Abbey is unique. It has a Voxy sound and a Mesa-like sound to it but it has its own character and I like that. I modded it and not for tone, I wanted an FX loop for the Quadraverb. I was more than happy with its tone. Of course every tube, including the 6L6's are NOS and that doesn't hurt at all.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#31
Quote by Cathbard
If he did wouldn't he just buy a Randall MTS? They aren't everybody's cup of tea.
I like the fact that my Abbey is unique. It has a Voxy sound and a Mesa-like sound to it but it has its own character and I like that. I modded it and not for tone, I wanted an FX loop for the Quadraverb. I was more than happy with its tone. Of course every tube, including the 6L6's are NOS and that doesn't hurt at all.


Randall MTS is a pretty awesome idea, but its still just versatility not 'THE' sound IMO. My point is if you could get the sound of your Abbey out of an MFX, would you just say that's stupid because its trying to copy your Abbey or would you think.. Awesome I just simplified my rig.
/rig
#32
My Abbey is very touch sensitive. If an MFX could replicate that properly as well as the basic tone I may consider it. If an amp doesn't talk to me I'm not interested in it. Might I add; even though I use two MFX units none of that includes amp modelling. I'm really not interested in amp modelling. You can have one without the other.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#33
Quote by Cathbard
My Abbey is very touch sensitive. If an MFX could replicate that properly as well as the basic tone I may consider it. If an amp doesn't talk to me I'm not interested in it. Might I add; even though I use two MFX units none of that includes amp modelling. I'm really not interested in amp modelling. You can have one without the other.


Agreed, and it is all preference. I am just arguing it is about the sound and feel and not how you got there. I don't care if my DAS METAL patch sounds like a diezel VH4 or herbert.. I care that its juicy, thick, and saturated. If you can close your eyes and be happy, that is what matters.
/rig
Last edited by mespinos at Mar 27, 2012,
#34
Well there is a little more to it with me. I like poking around inside my amp and I like tubes. There is something olde worlde and almost agricultural about a tube. There's the tech in me to satisfy, not just the musician.
It is easy to understand what is going on inside a tube (piss off quantum mechanics guys. ) whereas transistors nobody understands. It's alien shit with more theories around trying to explain how they function than you can poke a stick at.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#35
Quote by Cathbard
Well there is a little more to it with me. I like poking around inside my amp and I like tubes. There is something olde worlde and almost agricultural about a tube. There's the tech in me to satisfy, not just the musician.
It is easy to understand what is going on inside a tube (piss off quantum mechanics guys. ) whereas transistors nobody understands. It's alien shit with more theories around trying to explain how they function than you can poke a stick at.



There is no argument to that. All valid. Variety of sound is what gets me going.
/rig
#36
Why bicker about whther its digital or not?

Just tweak it till it sounds good. Modelling has reached the point where even a basic sub 500 dollar unit will sound good when setup right. It wont sound like a 3000 dollar MFX, nor will it sound like a real amp. But that doesnt mean it cant sound good
#37
I've got the best of both worlds; analog MFX out front of a multi channel valve amp with digital MFX in the loop. No modelling needed and MIDI everywhere.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#38
Quote by Cathbard
I've got the best of both worlds; analog MFX out front of a multi channel valve amp with digital MFX in the loop. No modelling needed and MIDI everywhere.


and it is midi that is my one true love..
/rig
#39
MIDI rocks.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#40
Quote by fly135
The day a multifx can make me sound like anyone else is the day I sell all my multifx that can't do that and buy the one that can.

Some of this stuff you guys are saying is ludicrous. I.E. it's better not to have a bunch of fx that you don't use. As if you really know which ones you won't use if you never had them.

Or that a multifx only has one sound, but you can find more with separate pedals. Anyone asking whether to buy a multifx or separate pedals obviously doesn't know enough to have is own special sound. There are plenty of sounds in a multifx.

If you really want to make a valid argument then you could say... That separate pedals are easier to use because the controls are always visible and not hidden in menus. Or that having separate pedals makes your FX immediately available instead of having to be configured ahead of time. Or that the large number of tone affecting parameters, usually scattered across multiple menus, in a multifx can cause the tone to be off, but finding exactly why is more complicated than in separate pedals.

But the idea that you can't sound unique using a multifx is not the least bit plausible. How you sound has far more with you and your ability than any selection of pedals.


umm.... i guess you're going to join the crowd then as you seem to state your opinion as fact. what exactly is wrong with not wanting a bunch of fx you don't need and who said you don't know this already not everyone is a noob. there are plenty of fx that aren't part of my style or would be used so little that it's not worth bothering with. i may use certain fx in a studio situation that i wouldn't use live but to me that's a different situation. i've never had a Digital Whammy doesn't mean i don't know that they do at all. your argument is based soley on ignorance which not all of us are.

often when people ask about seperate pedals vs multifx they do so with the idea that perhaps one or the other would be better for finding that "special sound". obviously they don't have it already or they wouldn't be asking for advice.

no one is saying that you can't have a unique sound with a mfx set up. you are stuck with the parameters that they give you though. if you don't care for say the delay sounds or the chorus sounds then to bad that's what you have. of course the same can be said for pedals but chances are you will buy a pedal for it's sound. it's much more difficult to try out a mfx unit due to the time it takes to get sounds. if you're mfx unit craps out you're screwed this isn't the case with individual pedals. you just can't use whatever one crapped out.

there is no right or wrong it's all about what works for you. i prefer pedals but i don't push that on anyone. i do my best to give advice that is geared toward the posters needs. sometimes it isn't what i like or would use but if the right thing for them then it's good advice.
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