#1
Im looking at getting a mixer for doing recordings. The 2 Im looking at is either a Behringer Xenyx 1202FX or a Mackie 802-VLZ3. Opinions on which would be a better buy for someone that is starting out?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#3
The mackie is twice as expensive, and almost certainly better.tbh you'd be better buying it cause you'll only have to replace the behringer down the line.

Might I suggest the focusrite sapphire models, although that really depends on how much you've got to spend and how many iputs to need, the Mic-pres on the focusrite are really good.
#4
Having used both, I'm seriously not sure if you'd really notice a difference. Sound quality will be basically identical. They're both built in China. The colours will be different. I've never had any real issues with Behringer build quality. Mind you, I take care of my stuff. Maybe if you're one of those people who treats their gear like crap, then your results might be different.

To get noticeably better, check out Soundcraft, Allen and Heath, Crane Song and even some of the Yamaha or Tascam boards.

That said, are you sure you even need a mixer? What, exactly, do you want to do?

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#5
Mackie Onyx 1640i is the only mixer for recording :p
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#6
Quote by axemanchris
Having used both, I'm seriously not sure if you'd really notice a difference. Sound quality will be basically identical. They're both built in China. The colours will be different. I've never had any real issues with Behringer build quality. Mind you, I take care of my stuff. Maybe if you're one of those people who treats their gear like crap, then your results might be different.

To get noticeably better, check out Soundcraft, Allen and Heath, Crane Song and even some of the Yamaha or Tascam boards.

That said, are you sure you even need a mixer? What, exactly, do you want to do?

CT


What mixers would you recommend other than these?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#7
^ Let's take a step back here...

You may well not need a mixer. I used to use one. I had a Behringer UB2442-FXPRO mixer that did the trick just nicely. Although all my mixing was done "in the box", I used a mixer because:
- my Delta 1010 interface did not have preamps built in
- I could set up independent headphone mixes with the mixer and send them to my headphone amp so, say, if the bass player wanted more kick drum and the singer wanted more vocal, I could give them each that.

I don't use a mixer anymore because I upgraded my interface, and it has preamps built in (that are far superior to the Behringer ones), and my updated version of Cubase allows me to set up independent headphone mixes and send them back to the interface from there.

You might not need a mixer at all. This is why I'm asking why, exactly, you want one.

From there, if you insist that you need one, then you have to consider your budget. If your budget doesn't allow you to go any higher than Mackie or Behringer, then you're pretty much stuck with one or the other. There's nothing wrong with them. They're very usable. They're just very utilitarian. They're like the Ford Focus of the mixer world. They'll get you from A to B, but they're hardly in the same league as a Rolls Royce, Mercedes or even a Lexus. In fact, they're not even on par with a Honda. Of course, to get the difference in quality from a Ford Focus to a Honda, you ARE going to pay for it significantly, and then significantly again to go up to the Lexus, and then again to the Benz, and then again to the Rolls.

The first four songs on my profile were done with most of the tracks going through the Behringer mixer into the Delta 1010, except for the lead vocals and the bass, which went through a tube preamp.

The last three songs on my profile have the drums only going through the Behringer mixer, at which point, I upgraded my gear.

But if your budget allows, check the brands I listed. They'll all be measurably better than either of the Mackies or the Behringers.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#8
Quote by axemanchris
^ Let's take a step back here...

You may well not need a mixer. I used to use one. I had a Behringer UB2442-FXPRO mixer that did the trick just nicely. Although all my mixing was done "in the box", I used a mixer because:
- my Delta 1010 interface did not have preamps built in
- I could set up independent headphone mixes with the mixer and send them to my headphone amp so, say, if the bass player wanted more kick drum and the singer wanted more vocal, I could give them each that.

I don't use a mixer anymore because I upgraded my interface, and it has preamps built in (that are far superior to the Behringer ones), and my updated version of Cubase allows me to set up independent headphone mixes and send them back to the interface from there.

You might not need a mixer at all. This is why I'm asking why, exactly, you want one.

From there, if you insist that you need one, then you have to consider your budget. If your budget doesn't allow you to go any higher than Mackie or Behringer, then you're pretty much stuck with one or the other. There's nothing wrong with them. They're very usable. They're just very utilitarian. They're like the Ford Focus of the mixer world. They'll get you from A to B, but they're hardly in the same league as a Rolls Royce, Mercedes or even a Lexus. In fact, they're not even on par with a Honda. Of course, to get the difference in quality from a Ford Focus to a Honda, you ARE going to pay for it significantly, and then significantly again to go up to the Lexus, and then again to the Benz, and then again to the Rolls.

The first four songs on my profile were done with most of the tracks going through the Behringer mixer into the Delta 1010, except for the lead vocals and the bass, which went through a tube preamp.

The last three songs on my profile have the drums only going through the Behringer mixer, at which point, I upgraded my gear.

But if your budget allows, check the brands I listed. They'll all be measurably better than either of the Mackies or the Behringers.

CT


So how bout the Soundcraft Notepad 124FX Mixer? I am not needing a top of the line mixer but I would like a nice one that will last me till I get better and start recording a lot. Im just starting out and I would like good quality mixer to get myself into recording.

Thats why I was looking at the Behringers and Mackie because I had read a lot of good reviews on them.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#9
Quote by Ultrakd
So how bout the Soundcraft Notepad 124FX Mixer? I am not needing a top of the line mixer but I would like a nice one that will last me till I get better and start recording a lot. Im just starting out and I would like good quality mixer to get myself into recording.

Thats why I was looking at the Behringers and Mackie because I had read a lot of good reviews on them.

You're still failing to answer his question. Why do you feel you NEED a mixer? Unless it has USB or FireWire support, a mixer shouldn't even be in your vocabulary for recording on a budget.
Quote by Dave_Mc
I've had tube amps for a while now, but never actually had any go down on me
Quote by jj1565
maybe you're not saying the right things? an amp likes to know you care.





www.SanctityStudios.com
#10
Quote by MatrixClaw
You're still failing to answer his question. Why do you feel you NEED a mixer? Unless it has USB or FireWire support, a mixer shouldn't even be in your vocabulary for recording on a budget.


I was going to use a mixer to record into through my sound card on my computer.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#11
Skip the mixer. Skip the soundcard. Get an interface.

How many inputs would you like... or more to the point... how many do you need?

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#12
Quote by Ultrakd
I was going to use a mixer to record into through my sound card on my computer.

Record what?

How many inputs do you need (how many mics do you need to record at once)?


I can almost guarantee a mixer is not what you want. Recording through your computers sound card is going to sound fairly poor, no matter what you plug into it, because the converters are junk; not to mention you gain nearly no advantages of recording digitally, since you can only send one stereo mix out of the mixer. That means once you hit record, you better have all your levels, EQs, and effects set exactly how you want them, because you won't be able to do much once its recorded.
Quote by Dave_Mc
I've had tube amps for a while now, but never actually had any go down on me
Quote by jj1565
maybe you're not saying the right things? an amp likes to know you care.





www.SanctityStudios.com
#13
My sound card isnt a cheesy one. It can record up to 24bit studio quality. Im going to be micing my amp and I needed stereo for my keyboard. But I wanted the option of having more than 2 mic inputs. I wanted to get one thing that would last me longer and not have to get something in the near future.

What makes a interface better than a mixer for recording when mixers are made for recording as much as interfaces are? Also I was able to find mixers in my price range that did what I wanted and had room for expansion than I could interfaces.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#14
Quote by Ultrakd
What makes a interface better than a mixer for recording when mixers are made for recording as much as interfaces are?


Basically, heres the general rule of thumb:

Mixers = Live Sound
Interface = Multi-Track Recording

With a mixer, unless you have one of the higher end Mackie, Presonus or Yamaha boards, all a mixer is going to be is all the inputs from the mixer squished down into 2 tracks that you cant mix or edit as well as you can with an interface. Take for example a drum kit. You have 4 mics (2 overheads, kick and snare). With a Mixer, you're going to have to have everything sounding exactly the way you want for the kit going into the mixer because you won't be able to tweak the sound of anything individually after. So, you wouldn't be able to compress the kick, add an EQ to the snare or bring down the overheads. With an interface, since everything goes into its own separate track, it makes for editing it after recording much easier and more professional.

Don't get me wrong, you can get a good sound out of a mixer (made several early punk songs on one). But, in my opinion (and many others), you'll get much better results with an audio interface.
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#15
See, "sound cards" are designed to have great sounding outputs. The whole Soundblaster/Audigy/etc series cards at least gave some thought as to what the inputs would sound like, but in the end, they do not live up to what an even half-way decent interface will give you. Other than that, the inputs of a soundcard are basically made with things like webcams in mind.

Just because it is 24 bit doesn't mean they sound good. People talk about "CD quality", but it doesn't take much effort to put a song on CD that sounds absolutely awful. You say "studio quality." That's nice. What does that mean?

All of your mixing will take place in the computer. All you need is something to get those audio tracks there in the first place, with each on their own track so you're not stuck with something already mixed before you can even get at it on the computer.

Consider most mixers:
INputs 1-8: four drums, bass, two guitars and a vocal
Master output: to stereo line in on soundcard.

You know what you've recorded? The whole band as a single stereo track. What are you going to do with that? What if the kick drum is too loud? What if the singer flubs a lyric?

Consider a simple interface:
Inputs 1-4: four drum tracks
Inputs 1-4 (again): players listen to drum tracks while overdubbing bass, two guitars, and singer.

The outputs go directly to their own track in your software meaning that if the kick is too loud, you turn it down, or if the singer flubs a lyric, you can edit and overdub it again.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#16
Ohhhh ok I was wondering about that. What about the USB mixers? Because my problem is every interface Ive wanted is to expensive, Ive been looking on ebay for everything trying to see if I can find it a little cheaper.

Because right now I dont have a band. Its just me and I was wanting something that I could get better recording that using my web cam mic. I was liking the Xenyr USB models but I could figure out when the smaller models came out. I liked mixers because of the ability to have record and do live in case I ever had a chance to.

What interfaces would you recommend or usb mixers?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#17
What interfaces would you guys recommend? I would like at least 2 mic inputs.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#18
What opinions do you have on these? Would one of these be better?


Peavey PV 6 or 8 USB
Focusrite Saffire 6
Focusrite Scarlett 8i6


I appreciate all of your help.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
Last edited by Ultrakd at Mar 27, 2012,
#19
I'd go with either the Saffire 6 or Scarlett 8i6 (though I've heard some ehh things about the Scarlett series)

As for USB mixers, they're nothing like interfaces. The way most of them under the $600 range is that it takes all the tracks and combines them down to 2 track stereo and records them to your PC. You're basically getting the same result as a mixer going line in but without having to go through a sound card.

If you are looking to get a mixer that also works as an interface, you're looking at $1000+ for one that I'd consider live worthy as well as studio worthy.
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#20
So the best bet would be the Saffire 6? What about it only using USB1.1, does that make any difference? What about the Saffire Pro 14?

Is there a different interface you would recommend?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
Last edited by Ultrakd at Mar 27, 2012,
#21
id go for the scarlett 8i6 out of those. peavey builds some solid gear, but as people have said, a mixer isnt what you neccessarily want for recording (even USB). ive heard the saffire and scarlett have the same preamps, though some people have said the ones on the saffire might be better. if i was sure on them being better, thats the way i would go. but otherwise, the scarlett offers you some better options on the I/O capabilities (such as 2 line inputs). if you can go with firewire instead of USB, id look at the saffire 10.
#22
Whats the difference of Firewire and USB?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#23
Firewire has a higher Bandwith. Firewire can be 400-800mbps, USB 2.0 maxes out at 480mbps. I recommend Firewire if you plan on doing more than 4 tracks in at the same time
Derpy Derp Derp Herp Derp
#24
So get either the Saffire 6 or Pro 14? How does firewire connect to the computer?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#25
I was wondering, what is the benefit of having faster bandwidth?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#26
Firewire will connect to your computer via a firewire card. They're about $30. Just make sure to get one with a Texas Instruments chipset, because audio interfaces with firewire can be VERY picky otherwise.

The benefit of faster bandwidth is more tracks going in and out. Think of it as a "data highway." The more bandwidth you have, the more lanes of traffic you can have coming in and out of Computerville.

CT
Could I get some more talent in the monitors, please?

I know it sounds crazy, but try to learn to inhale your voice. www.thebelcantotechnique.com

Chris is the king of relating music things to other objects in real life.
#27
So the Saffire Pro 14 will allow me to record more than the Saffire 6 will? Is that the only upside to it? I think I may actually have a firewire port on my computer. But what if I wanted to record on my laptop, how do I record to a laptop that doesnt have a firewire port?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
Last edited by Ultrakd at Mar 28, 2012,
#28
Oh and I dont know if htis makes a difference or not but I have Windows 7 64bit running on my computer.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#29
a brand other than focusrite, what other interfaces would you recommend?
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
#30
I am currently using an Alesis MultiMix8 Firewire. Up to 8 track simultaneous recording, though, only 4 mic pres. Some crappy effects built in. Picked it up for $150 at a pawn shop.
"Let me tell you something about Rebels, Obi-Wayne. They want you to come get them, they LOVE it."
#31
I really want to get the Saffire Pro 14 but I dont have the money right now, and wont any time soon. So Im going to have to go with a cheaper option for recording. I dont need the best right now. Just something that will do the job good and be training wheels till I start recording more. Does anyone have any opinions on these interfaces?

Alesis io2 Express
PreSonus FIREBOX
PreSonus AudioBox 22VSL USB
and maybe the M-Audio Fast Track Pro if I can find one cheaper on ebay. Thanks for all your help and patience, I really appreciate it.
Chris

My Gear-
Guitars: Ibanez S570DXQM, First Act VW GarageMaster
Amps: Peavey ValveKing 112, Roland 15XL
Pedals: Big Muff w/ Tone & Wicker, Original Crybaby w/ Modifications, BYOC Overdrive 2, Danelectro Cool Cat Chorus, Boss PH-3,
Last edited by Ultrakd at Apr 4, 2012,