#1
So pit monkeys I have a question about how in the English language we spell the word colour and honour and other various words.

I have read somewhere that that the "ou" part of these words is the French influence on the English language.

Does anybody know if this is true??
Thor! Odin's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Your destiny awaits Thor! Hlödyn's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Ragnarök awaits


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#2
It better not be, I can't stand the French
Quote by lambofgod127
btw im in hs and im almost 18 so if u do think she was flirting with me dont say that its wrong im almost a grown man.




༼ ▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ ༽ WE ARE ROB ༼ ▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ ༽
#3
Probably because ou is gay and so are the French.
Check out my band Disturbed
#4
Yep. From Old French into Old English.
Quote by synestershadows
Shai Hulud mother****er.
#5
Most words ending in an unstressed -our in British English (e.g. colour, flavour, harbour, honour, humour, labour, neighbour, rumour) end in -or in American English (cf. color, flavor, honor, harbor, neighbor, rumor, labor, humor). Wherever the vowel is unreduced in pronunciation, this does not occur: e.g. contour, velour, paramour and troubadour are spelled thus the same everywhere.
Most words of this category derive from Latin non-agent nouns having nominative -or; the first such borrowings into English were from early Old French and the ending was -or or -ur.[5] After the Norman Conquest, the ending became -our in Anglo-French in an attempt to represent the Old French pronunciation of words ending in -or,[6] though color has been used occasionally in English since the 15th century.[7] The -our ending was not only retained in English borrowings from Anglo-French, but also applied to earlier French borrowings.[5] After the Renaissance, some such borrowings from Latin were taken up with their original -or ending; many words once ending in -our (for example, chancellour and governour) now end in -or everywhere. Many words of the -our/or group do not have a Latin counterpart; for example, armo(u)r, behavio(u)r, harbo(u)r, neighbo(u)r; also arbo(u)r meaning "shelter", though senses "tree" and "tool" are always arbor, a false cognate of the other word. Some 16th- and early 17th-century British scholars indeed insisted that -or be used for words of Latin origin (e.g. color[7]) and -our for French loans; but in many cases the etymology was not completely clear, and therefore some scholars advocated -or only and others -our only.[8]
Webster's 1828 dictionary featured only -or and is generally given much of the credit for the adoption of this form in the United States. By contrast, Dr Johnson's 1755 dictionary used the -our spelling for all words still so spelt in Britain, and others where the u has since been dropped: ambassadour, emperour, governour, perturbatour; inferiour, superiour; errour, horrour, mirrour, tenour, terrour, tremour. Johnson, unlike Webster, was not an advocate of spelling reform, but selected the version best-derived, as he saw it, from among the variations in his sources: he preferred French over Latin spellings because, as he put it, "the French generally supplied us".[9] Those English speakers who began to move across the Atlantic would have taken these habits with them and H L Mencken makes the point that, "honor appears in the Declaration of Independence, but it seems to have got there rather by accident than by design. In Jefferson's original draft it is spelt honour."[10] Examples such as color, flavor, behavior, harbor and neighbor scarcely appear in the Old Bailey's court records from the 17th and 18th century, whereas examples of their -our counterparts are numbered in thousands.[11] One notable exception is honor. Honor and honour were equally frequent until the 17th century;[12] Honor still is, in the UK, the normal spelling as a person's name.
Derivatives and inflected forms
In derivatives and inflected forms of the -our/or words, British usage depends on the nature of the suffix used. The u is kept before English suffixes that are freely attachable to English words (for example in neighbourhood, humourless and savoury) and suffixes of Greek or Latin origin that have been naturalised (for example in favourite, honourable and behaviourism). However, before Latin suffixes that are not freely attachable to English words, the u:
may be dropped, as for example in honorary, honorific, honorist, vigorous, humorous, laborious and invigorate;
may be either dropped or retained, as for example in colo(u)ration and colo(u)rise); or
may be retained, as for example in colourist).[5]
In American usage, derivatives and inflected forms are built by simply adding the suffix in all environments (for example, favorite, savory etc.) since the u is absent to begin with.
Exceptions
American usage, in most cases, retains the u in the word glamour, which comes from Scots, not Latin or French. Glamor is occasionally used in imitation of the spelling reform of other -our words to -or. The adjective glamorous usually omits the first "u". Saviour is a somewhat common variant of savior in the US. The British spelling is very common for honour (and favour) in the formal language of wedding invitations in the US.[13] The name of the Space Shuttle Endeavour has a u in it since this spacecraft was named after Captain James Cook's ship, HMS Endeavour. The special car on Amtrak's Coast Starlight train is known as the Pacific Parlour car, not Pacific Parlor.
The name of the herb savory is thus spelt everywhere, although the related adjective savo(u)ry, like savo(u)r, has a u in the UK. Honor (the name) and arbor (the tool) have -or in Britain, as mentioned above. As a general noun, rigour /ˈrɪɡər/ has a u in the UK; the medical term rigor (often /ˈraɪɡɔr/)[citation needed] does not, such as in "rigor mortis", which is Latin. Words with the ending -irior, -erior or similar are spelt thus everywhere.
Commonwealth usage
Commonwealth countries normally follow British usage. In Canada -or endings are not uncommon, particularly in the Prairie provinces. In Australia, -or endings enjoyed some use throughout the 19th and 20th centuries, and are still found in some regions,[8] usually in local and regional newspapers, although in recent years most major Australian newspapers have switched from "-or" endings to "-our" endings. The most notable countrywide use of -or is for the Australian Labor Party, which was named in hono(u)r of the American labo(u)r movement.[14] Aside from that, -our is now almost universal. New Zealand English, while sharing some words and syntax with Australian English, follows British usage.


Quote by DartS17
Yep. From Old French into Old English.


Doubt that.
#6
Wow Aralingh you really are an Intelligent person.

thanks for that.
Thor! Odin's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Your destiny awaits Thor! Hlödyn's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Ragnarök awaits


E-ARCH NEMESIS of girlgerms007
#7
Quote by deathdrummer
Wow Aralingh you really are an Intelligent person.

thanks for that.


I know, I didn't even read that text, just copied from wikipedia.
#8
Quote by DartS17



Doubt that.

That's what my copy of Webster's Third says
Edit: Forgot old english was it's own form of language. I just meant English a while ago.
Quote by synestershadows
Shai Hulud mother****er.
Last edited by DartS17 at Mar 28, 2012,
#9
Quote by Aralingh
I know, I didn't even read that text, just copied from wikipedia.



Also isnt English a different form of German??
Thor! Odin's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Your destiny awaits Thor! Hlödyn's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Ragnarök awaits


E-ARCH NEMESIS of girlgerms007
#10
Quote by deathdrummer
Wow Aralingh you really are an Intelligent person.

thanks for that.


Quote by lambofgod127
btw im in hs and im almost 18 so if u do think she was flirting with me dont say that its wrong im almost a grown man.




༼ ▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ ༽ WE ARE ROB ༼ ▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ ༽
#11
Quote by deathdrummer
Also isnt English a different form of German??


English is a West Germanic language that arose in the Anglo-Saxon kingdoms of England and spread into what was to become south-east Scotland under the influence of the Anglian medieval kingdom of Northumbria.

I actually read that this time.
#12
Quote by Aralingh
English is a West Germanic language that arose in the Anglo-Saxon kingdoms of England and spread into what was to become south-east Scotland under the influence of the Anglian medieval kingdom of Northumbria.

I actually read that this time.


I think I read it started when the Protestant religion was gaining a foothold in England.

that may or may not be true.
Thor! Odin's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Your destiny awaits Thor! Hlödyn's son Protector of mankind Ride to meet your fate Ragnarök awaits


E-ARCH NEMESIS of girlgerms007
#13
Quote by deathdrummer
I think I read it started when the Protestant religion was gaining a foothold in England.

that may or may not be true.


A coincidence.
#15
lol I'm listening to Manau.

Just found out there's a western part of France called Bretagne (Britain, or Brittany?)

Be interesting to know why if it has anything to do with actual Britain.

*chime in anytime smart guy who's been talking about languages*

seriously though, I like learning about the history of languages.
#16
Quote by metalblaster
lol I'm listening to Manau.

Just found out there's a western part of France called Bretagne (Britain, or Brittany?)

Be interesting to know why if it has anything to do with actual Britain.

*chime in anytime smart guy who's been talking about languages*

seriously though, I like learning about the history of languages.


that's where i live
looks very similar when you fly overhead...
and does share many common Celtic roots.

but hey, and don't know that much about french or english culture
#17
Quote by CrAzY-RiLeY
that's where i live
looks very similar when you fly overhead...
and does share many common Celtic roots.

but hey, and don't know that much about french or english culture

But this is what I'm wondering. I thought the celts were only in (what is now) British territory.

I saw a map of the evolution of France, and it start in the far north east with the early Franks and it spreads, except dans la Bretagne. Which is what I don't get. Is it because the celts from up north were already there?
#18
Quote by metalblaster
But this is what I'm wondering. I thought the celts were only in (what is now) British territory.

I saw a map of the evolution of France, and it start in the far north east with the early Franks and it spreads, except dans la Bretagne. Which is what I don't get. Is it because the celts from up north were already there?


yea, i think its something to do with vikings, but bretagne has never considered itself part of france, and has only been a part of it since the 19th century or sometime round then.

And thats why all the roads here are free, it was one of the conditions for the breton princess to marry some french king.

but yea, their was definitely some celtic shit going down, since their are these gigantic rocks randomly(?) placed around bretagne.
#19
Quote by CrAzY-RiLeY
yea, i think its something to do with vikings, but bretagne has never considered itself part of france, and has only been a part of it since the 19th century or sometime round then.

And thats why all the roads here are free, it was one of the conditions for the breton princess to marry some french king.

but yea, their was definitely some celtic shit going down, since their are these gigantic rocks randomly(?) placed around bretagne.


Yeah I'm looking it up now and from what I understand Great britain essentially took it's name from Bretagne. And that make sense also, considering that map I saw didn't include bretagne so I guess they were kind of like seperatists or they always wanted to stay on their own.

Idk, I'm just getting this info from wiki and the astérix and obélix books I used to read as a kid
#20
Quote by metalblaster
Yeah I'm looking it up now and from what I understand Great britain essentially took it's name from Bretagne. And that make sense also, considering that map I saw didn't include bretagne so I guess they were kind of like seperatists or they always wanted to stay on their own.

Idk, I'm just getting this info from wiki and the astérix and obélix books I used to read as a kid


yea, its all in the astérix and obélix books
#21
Quote by deathdrummer
Also isnt English a different form of German??


It's a Germanic language, due to the fact that is built on Anglo-Saxon (old English). It isn't a 'form of German'.

And yes; ou is French in origin, as is a vast amount of our language.
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#22
Quote by deathdrummer
So pit monkeys I have a question about how in the English language we spell the word colour and honour and other various words.

I have read somewhere that that the "ou" part of these words is the French influence on the English language.

Does anybody know if this is true??


Yeah... it's true.