#1
lights shine and the periphery buzzes,
information crosses channels, 'cross lifeforms
at the speed of nothing. i was here but then i wasn't;
i loved the darkness once, the stars and the counting of them.

Lybians wage war across the fence, the world drops the bomb;
presidents cry in closed quarters; your smile is everywhere at once
if that's what i want.

impossible, to walk down my childhood ave
with time and hold its hand. so i turn to you
to maybe return to sleeping on black sofas,
nestle into a sad, sad nova and wait for them
to expand and expand and stretch themselves too thin.

but nowhere is not anywhere to be found.
you move on, and i move with you, following
into the cities traveled, the hearts unraveled
until there's nothing more to know,
nothing left to ask you.

a frontier fallen between two mountains
where constellations lack context
and romance ranges onwards and onwards, for miles.

i feel no bliss, and haven't for a while
here, My Dear, here it is
#4
thanks fellas, hit me up if theres something of yours you want me to look at
here, My Dear, here it is
#5
Quote by SubwayToVenus
lights shine and the periphery buzzes,
information crosses channels, 'cross lifeforms
at the speed of nothing. i was here but then i wasn't;
i loved the darkness once, the stars and the counting of them.

Lybians wage war across the fence, the world drops the bomb;
presidents cry in closed quarters; your smile is everywhere at once
if that's what i want.

impossible, to walk down my childhood ave
with time and hold its hand. so i turn to you
to maybe return to sleeping on black sofas,
nestle into a sad, sad nova and wait for them
to expand and expand and stretch themselves too thin.

but nowhere is not anywhere to be found.
you move on, and i move with you, following
into the cities traveled, the hearts unraveled
until there's nothing more to know,
nothing left to ask you.

a frontier fallen between two mountains
where constellations lack context
and romance ranges onwards and onwards, for miles.

i feel no bliss, and haven't for a while


For me and take this however you will, this is all far too constructed, calculated, thought about. It feels two steps removed from the synapses in your brain that first snapped this piece into action. This feeling is most present in the first stanza, it's too precisely worded to have that spontaneity poets should deliver on the page. You know how sometimes the girls that put the most effort into their looks, the most make up, the best dresses, can come across as a bit "blah". That's what this was.

In effect, it feels that this was written too much with the final consumption in mind. It's like, doing something really crazy and cool with your friends but instead of staying in the present and thinking "this is crazy and fun", you're thinking "I bet when I tell this story to someone they're going to laugh."

This also lacked any verbal aplomb. There's very little enthusiasm put it thinking what sounds or reads nice - there's no beat, no wit to the wording. It's a little dry and this comes off as the above constructed calculated point above. There's too many faux-poetic phrases - the whole first stanza, "but nowhere is not anywhere to be found", " your smile is everywhere at once if that's what i want.". You can't just say these sort of lines and claim poetry - it's trying too hard in my eyes.

I think you'd be better just hammering away in a journal for a while and finding something more true. For me this really sags dry, lacks any emotional cleft, it's almost a politicians rhetoric than a piece of poetry. Let go a little of the preconceptions and expected receptions. Don't be afraid to balls it all up.
#6
^ Fair enough. I can't say that I agree with you because I know that this came from an honest place. I'm actually quite proud of it for the very reason that I thought the parts written from my stream of consciousness did indeed capture my thoughts at the time. Nevertheless, I respect your opinion because you're a good poet and you know a lot about poetry. Thanks for reading and taking the time to comment. Shoot me a link if there's something of yours you want looked at.
here, My Dear, here it is
#7
Frankly, all respect to Jammy, but I disagree. I get the sense (especially from the last line) that there's an emptiness, a starkness attached to this piece. The way it's written reflects that. It all seems to build up to here. It's like a Jazz piece, gradually crescendoing to:
a frontier fallen between two mountains
where constellations lack context
and romance ranges onwards and onwards, for miles.

That feels like a release to me.

i feel no bliss, and haven't for a while
Then this feels like the final tense musical passage, before the final release that closes the song.
#8
^appreciate it man. I see you got a piece up on the first page so I'll take a look at that
here, My Dear, here it is
#9
When I read something like this for you, I can tell the intent behind the words, but it screams that you are not thinking about form.

Before, when you were struggling with finding meaning and how to convey it, I didn't focus on your use of form and poetic tools, but now, as you've crafted the former, I think you need to work on the latter.

For example, you use the word speed, but the use a full stop in the middle of the line and end it on a semicolon. You need to let it run.

You write like I used to write when I didn't count on form and I stopped lines where it felt right and not necessarily where the words would be most enhanced. Later on it became a second nature, when the words and form fell together for me.

Anyway, I'm just saying, I think it's time for you to experiment with poetry in a new way. Not that I think you are not doing your thing in style, I'm just really curious to see you exert yourself and go for the next level.
This is not a pipe
#10
Proper crit very soon. I like where it's started, especially in content, but this lacks some serious development in execution that you usually pull off seamlessly
Quote by Arthur Curry
it's official, vintage x metal is the saving grace of this board and/or the antichrist




e-married to
theguitarist
minterman22
tateandlyle
& alaskan_ninja

#11
Yeah this one was frustrating to write. I knew what I wanted to say but I couldn't get it on the page the way I wanted. I struggled with the end a lot to the point where I said 'f it' and posted it anyway.

And Carmel, I agree with you. I think it's time that try to really focus on form and technique. I usually focus heavily on rhyming and consonance and assonance and usually fail to actually take into account how the words read on the page. I guess my question for you is how to mediate between what you're saying and what Jammy is saying. Jammy was of the impression that this poem seemed too calculated, that it lacked a sense of poetic spontaneity, stream of consciousness. And it seems like you're saying that it's important to calculate how the words read, to take a closer look on form. I guess I want to know where the middle ground exists between those two things, and how to get there.

Perhaps it's just a matter of doing what you did: practicing and practicing until it all becomes second nature.
here, My Dear, here it is
#12
Quote by SubwayToVenus


And Carmel, I agree with you. I think it's time that try to really focus on form and technique. I usually focus heavily on rhyming and consonance and assonance and usually fail to actually take into account how the words read on the page. I guess my question for you is how to mediate between what you're saying and what Jammy is saying. Jammy was of the impression that this poem seemed too calculated, that it lacked a sense of poetic spontaneity, stream of consciousness. And it seems like you're saying that it's important to calculate how the words read, to take a closer look on form. I guess I want to know where the middle ground exists between those two things, and how to get there.

Perhaps it's just a matter of doing what you did: practicing and practicing until it all becomes second nature.


No no, you misinterpret/I probably went on a waffle.

I never talk about stream of consciousness because I detest the term.

Poetic spontaneity, sounds, rhythm, pop, beat, smarts, wit, rhyme, edge, real, sounds, vocals, listen - these are what you need to think about in my eyes. To read this piece out loud is to see that all the focus has gone into content and not into form - you need to be able to calculate form as well as content, to take your message across to your audience as well as write with verve and rhythm and poetic.

There's no middle ground between what I said and what Carmel said, Carmel's just far better at putting across in words what I can only do in abstract ramblings.

And yep, practice practice practice (hence my journal comment above.

Groovy.
#14
let's start with the first line

"lights shine and the periphery buzzes,"

the first phrase doesn't hold the same weight as the second phrase, and I wonder if it's necessary to even have it in there when the latter has such heavy focus in both sound and content. "lights shine" is a phrase we hear so often in everyday use that it invokes very little imagery in contrast to "the periphery buzzes", which immediately captures very specific and sensual relationships, as well as having a very distinct sound and rhythm. the image of lights shining may have individual intent for you as a writer though, in which case bringing attention to it may take more than simply stating it.

this is a common theme among this poem. there are a lot of lines that hold great meaning but are lost in the ebb and flow of things because the phrasing doesn't allow it to be showcased - it's as if the whole thing garners an entirely new force when each line is read individually and taken on its own as separate poem rather than reading as one holistic piece. how can we showcase what it is you want your readers to latch on to?

"but nowhere is not anywhere to be found"

this is the kind of line that ends a poem. when said the way it is said, it needs time to breathe on its own and be reflected upon to really stand in its form and explicate its content. where it is now, it's too easily lost - I love your conversational, genuine tone in many things but in this case it gives the weight of the line a disadvantage. how can you say the same thing and have your readers see it without having to explicitly search for the impact? this happens with a good amount of lines -

"... i was here but then i wasn't;
i loved the darkness once, the stars and the counting of them"

"you move on, and i move with you"

"until there's nothing more to know,
nothing left to ask you."

I want to feel those the way you feel those.


there's another small thing - you and I both tend to do this, where a word that expresses continuity and motion and vastness is repeated for added effect -

"to expand and expand"
"onwards and onwards, for miles"

natural to do this because of the essence of the word, often effective but often ineffective. it's a little confusing here in the holistic image - many of the phrases of this poem seem calculated, precise, while other parts seem to flow more organically, like these bits - I think leaning more towards one or the other would be a better move for the piece. assess whether the repitition really adds to what you want your poem to be or if it just seemed appropriate at the time of writing.


hope this is helpful
Quote by Arthur Curry
it's official, vintage x metal is the saving grace of this board and/or the antichrist




e-married to
theguitarist
minterman22
tateandlyle
& alaskan_ninja

#15
Someone mentioned the empty sadness of the piece. I feel that. Rearranged, it could be really great, like the nowhere is not anywhere line moving the end, and taking the current last line and putting it somewhere useful, like above something that explains it better than nothing, like the Impossible stanza, which was stellar in a sad way. the mention of Lybians and presidents and bombs is all a bit unfounded, but I understand that you're asking me to understand severity. It's a quiet question that will go unanswered.

I see pieces of your writing here, in pieces. where are you?
Last edited by spike_8bkp at Apr 6, 2012,
#16
thanks both of you. everything you're telling me is very helpful, truly
here, My Dear, here it is