#1
Hey guys, I have a question about chord harmonization

A while ago I looked up a lesson and this is what I understand now

Let's say we're in C major so C D E F G A B

If you want to see what chord works with this scale, you take the 1 - 3 - 5 note out of this scale (for 3 note triads)

So C would be: C E G which is a C major chord,
D would be D F A, which is a D minor chord.

This way you can find out all the triads for the notes in this scale.

Then he said: You can also use this to make other chords, like sus4 chords.
This confused me though, would you just take the 1 - 2 - 4 notes out of the scale?

Help would be appreciated,

Thanks!
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#2
A scale is a compilation of some notes. A chord is a compilation of two or more notes. Therefore, you can make chords from whichever scale and whichever notes in the scale.
#3
Quote by Stereojunkie
Hey guys, I have a question about chord harmonization

A while ago I looked up a lesson and this is what I understand now

Let's say we're in C major so C D E F G A B

If you want to see what chord works with this scale, you take the 1 - 3 - 5 note out of this scale (for 3 note triads)

So C would be: C E G which is a C major chord,
D would be D F A, which is a D minor chord.

This way you can find out all the triads for the notes in this scale.

Then he said: You can also use this to make other chords, like sus4 chords.
This confused me though, would you just take the 1 - 2 - 4 notes out of the scale?

Help would be appreciated,

Thanks!


Yes pretty much. Though a sus4 is actually 1-4-5

To make any chord you start with root, 3rd, 5th and then add/takeaway as appropriate
e.g in C major a 7th chord on E = 1-3-5-7 = E-G-B-D = Em7

common signals:
susX = remove 3 add X (e.g. sus4 = 145 sus2 = 125)
7 = add 7
9 = add 2 and 7
11 = Add 7, 4 (and 2)
13 = add 6 and 7 (and 2, 4 in some circumstances)


EDIT: I should probably point out at this point that you don't normally do it this way round, you normally come from the approach of "So I have a E G B and D, what chord is that?" that's because it's perfectly possible/quite common for notes outside the scale to be included in chords
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Last edited by doive at Mar 29, 2012,
#4
Sus4 would be 1 - 4 - 5 but you can't get it for example if you start from the fourth degree of the scale
#5
Oh sorry, kinda mixed it up with sus2 there :P

But if you take the 1 - 4 - 5 out of the scale, will it still sound good? and can you do this with any chord type?
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#6
Quote by Stereojunkie
Oh sorry, kinda mixed it up with sus2 there :P

But if you take the 1 - 4 - 5 out of the scale, will it still sound good? and can you do this with any chord type?


It will sound like a chord, I'm not quite sure what you mean by "good" in this context.

You can make any chord from any notes and name it in some way, but that doesn't mean it will sound good - you can also take notes outside the scale and add them to chords and that can sound good depending on how you do it.

Sticking in C major, I can play the notes: F-B-C-E and play them as a chord and give it a name Fsus(maj9) = 1-2-5-7, but it probably won't sound "good" unless there is soe very specific context for it.

Just because you 'can' make and name a chord using only notes from the scale doesn't mean they'll sound nice together all the time.
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#8
Thanks for the help all but i think we have a misunderstanding :P

I mean, i get how you can form minor major and seventh chords out of a scale,

I understand how chords are built (sus2 is 1 - 2 - 5 so that would be C D G)

Im just confused how you harmonize the chords to make a proper sounding progression
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#10
Quote by Stereojunkie
Hey guys, I have a question about chord harmonization

A while ago I looked up a lesson and this is what I understand now

Let's say we're in C major so C D E F G A B

If you want to see what chord works with this scale, you take the 1 - 3 - 5 note out of this scale (for 3 note triads)

So C would be: C E G which is a C major chord,
D would be D F A, which is a D minor chord.

This way you can find out all the triads for the notes in this scale.

Then he said: You can also use this to make other chords, like sus4 chords.
This confused me though, would you just take the 1 - 2 - 4 notes out of the scale?

Help would be appreciated,

Thanks!


Yes, you are on the right track. At least for basic (Diatonic) harmony, where every chord is made from notes directly from the attending scale. And a Sus 4 is a 1, 4, 5 not 1, 2, 4. But glad to see you're getting it. I'm surprised how many people do NOT get it, so it's good to see someone that's doing it right for a change!

Best,

Sean
#11
Quote by Sean0913
Yes, you are on the right track. At least for basic (Diatonic) harmony, where every chord is made from notes directly from the attending scale. And a Sus 4 is a 1, 4, 5 not 1, 2, 4. But glad to see you're getting it. I'm surprised how many people do NOT get it, so it's good to see someone that's doing it right for a change!

Best,

Sean


Really appreciate that

So i was testing this method on a song just to make sure i understand,

I used "Cowboys from hell" by Pantera,
I found out the intro and main riff is played in E pentatonic blues, so E - G - A - A# - B - D

So the tonic chord would be E A B which is a Esus4, right?
then comes the G and that would be G - A - D which is Gsus2

This is the correct method right?
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#12
Quote by Stereojunkie

then comes the G and that would be G - A - D which is Gsus2



Should be G A# D which makes Gminor
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#13
Quote by Stereojunkie
Should be G A# D which makes Gminor


Gm is G Bb D

Yes A# and Bb are the same pitch but A# isn't in the G minor scale

G minor scale:
G A Bb C D Eb F G

The reason why there is no A# is because there would be 2 A's (A and A#).
#14
Quote by d1sturbed4eva
Gm is G Bb D

Yes A# and Bb are the same pitch but A# isn't in the G minor scale

G minor scale:
G A Bb C D Eb F G

The reason why there is no A# is because there would be 2 A's (A and A#).


Ah yes makes sense
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#15
Quote by Stereojunkie
Really appreciate that

So i was testing this method on a song just to make sure i understand,

I used "Cowboys from hell" by Pantera,
I found out the intro and main riff is played in E pentatonic blues, so E - G - A - A# - B - D

So the tonic chord would be E A B which is a Esus4, right?
then comes the G and that would be G - A - D which is Gsus2

This is the correct method right?


The tonic "chord" I would say is an E5 - but the "feel" is definitely E minor, specifically, Em Blues, because it has a b5 in the riff. Key wise, I'd say E Minor. You shouldn't use the riff to figure out the chords, in other words, but work out the chords themselves, and then examine the melody.

Also, not all songs will be purely diatonic, many times you will see a bit more "advanced" harmony, so the song you "test" may not "prove" anything. It's better to get an idea of diatonic harmony and cadences, and see if you FIND examples, but if they don't "work" with the songs you choose, it could be that there's other stuff going on. That's why I say "as a start" get your diatonic harmony down first.

When we teach it at the Academy, we do it that way, and then we get into chord functions, cadences, tendencies, and things of that nature.

By the way we teach this and everything else theory wise, online at the link below, so if you're ever looking for a school to get all your stuff down, and we can help, keep us in mind!

Best,

Sean
#16
Quote by Aralingh
A scale is a compilation of some notes. A chord is a compilation of two or more notes. Therefore, you can make chords from whichever scale and whichever notes in the scale.

I just want to point out that a chord is at least 3 notes not two. so technically a powerchord isn't really a chord at all its just the root, fifth and the octave meaning its really only two different notes.
Quote by Dirk Gently
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#17
Alright thanks for all the help guys! really appreciate it,

I will check out some more online lessons on diatonic harmony


Thanks again!
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