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sfaune92
Used Register
Join date: Oct 2008
616 IQ
#801
Quote by Dreadnought
uh I have no idea haha

EDIT: Nah, the Nook only has an integrated English dictionary, whereas the Kindle can have a Spanish one. Bummer.

Fair enough, just find a dictionary that works on your platform, and maybe highlight the words you want to look up while reading and then look them up after you're done reading.
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S-Gsus
Guitarist
Join date: Sep 2006
225 IQ
#802
Is there any good "prog" type music with lyrics in languages other than english that anyone can recommend?
Quote by sickman411
S-Gsus wept
JohnnyGenzale
Bitter old sod
Join date: May 2008
292 IQ
#803
Quote by S-Gsus
Is there any good "prog" type music with lyrics in languages other than english that anyone can recommend?


swedish prog. often extremely political

Nationalteatern
Träd, gräs och stenar
Philemon Arthur & the Dung
International Harvester (both swedish and english.)
Contact (Hon kom över mon is a good record)
sometimes I see us in a cymbal splash or in the sound of a car crash
sfaune92
Used Register
Join date: Oct 2008
616 IQ
#804
Rikugo (六合 -- Prog-ish metal
Traumhaus -- Dream Theater-like "tame" prog-metal

I haven't found anything else really. I'm not limiting myself to prog when it comes to foreign music.
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Carlitos Guey
Registered User
Join date: Jan 2015
10 IQ
#805
Best method = moving to the country that speaks the language you want to learn and get yourself a gf/bf there.
chrismendiola
Join date: May 2014
955 IQ
#806
Cool, this is a thread. It's an inactive thread, but maybe this bump will bring some life back into it.

My first language was Filipino, second was English, third was Spanish. I'm studying a bit of French whenever I can squeeze some time. I might try to pick up Italian again but I wasn't that interested in it because I figured it wouldn't be so useful. I've also set a goal for myself to learn American Sign Language- having deaf and/or mute customers has reminded me of that.
Last edited by chrismendiola at Jan 15, 2015,
sfaune92
Used Register
Join date: Oct 2008
616 IQ
#808
Quote by GezzyDiversion
Learning french over the last year, any tips or techniques handy for practicing listening to everyday conversation?

Listen to a lot of French. There's no way around it.

You should find materials that suit your level, as well as your interests. For instance, if you're into gaming, then you should look for "let's play ..." videos, since they are really easy to follow (at least in German, which is my first non-English foreign language). Vlogs, and the Easy Langauges channel on YouTube may be useful as well. Find something that you enjoy, and that will help you keep up your motivation to continue practicing.

That's what worked for me when I was learning German. Also, you should work on expanding your vocabulary, because it's hard to recognise the words you're hearing when you don't know them.
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guitarxo
cat
Join date: Oct 2008
1,649 IQ
#809
I'm focusing on Mandarin and Tamil now. I knew bits of both before (environment and mother tongue, respectively) but not enough.

Mandarin is much easier than Tamil...for now. This is in spite of the fact that I can understand Tamil pretty well. I haven't learned to recognize a lot of Chinese characters yet and I suspect that is where it might get difficult in the future.

However, spoken Tamil is more difficult for me than learning to read and write. Mostly because I have never actually heard the dialect I am learning and written Tamil is only used in official speeches and writing - the spoken variety is like a dialect of its own.
cat
mystical_1
Doomed
Join date: Jul 2008
336 IQ
#810
I've been learning gibberish again, used to be fluent in it, but I let it lapse.

Wow, the internet translator for it really works, sweet.
Quote by Pagan_Poetry
Sadly this is Ultimate-guitar, not Simple-guitar. We can't help you.


chrismendiola
Join date: May 2014
955 IQ
#811
Ayo. :longneck:

I'm picking up my French books again, maybe this time I'll find time for it. Anyway, this page reminded me of the Internet in 2009-2010.

JamSessionFreak
King of the divant
Join date: Dec 2009
711 IQ
#813
le bare hella
Na juriš, na juriš, na juriš,
požgimo vsa gnila drevesa,
zemljo spremenimo v nebesa!
Vsem sonce naj sije,
le radost naj klije!
Na juriš, ohej, partizan,
pred tabo svobode je dan!
sickman411
strč prst skrz krk
Join date: Jan 2009
395 IQ
#814
Anyway I guess I'm kinda learning French by immersion now. I'd learned French previously but I was 14 when that last happened (I'm 23 now). It took some time (or it's taking some time, it's still an ongoing process) to not be too insecure to speak French to people but I'm getting better both in terms of confidence and in terms of skill.
NothingRocks
( ͡͡ ° ͜ &
Join date: Jun 2009
454 IQ
#815
I've been learning some Dutch on the side and it's kind of weird how similar Dutch and English can be at times.

For example:

We are drinking milk.
Wij drinken melk.

Do you have a cat?
Heeft u een kat?
genghisgandhi
Kristaps Porzingis
Join date: Mar 2009
4,324 IQ
#817
bump

really trying to learn spanish now, I'm taking a gap year starting in august b/w uni degrees so I'll have plenty of time to practice. lessons are too expensive but I'm thinking of just doing vocab and grammar stuff on my own and finding someone I could pay to talk to (no shortage in my town) on a weekly or so basis.

it's so daunting doing this on your own, it's hard to believe people actually learn this way without moving to a place that speaks the language. why oh why couldn't I have cared this much in high school

also, something I'm worried about - I'm not the most articulate guy in the world (I mumble and stumble over my words a lot) so I'm worried this is all sort of a fool's errand. like if I can't handle english what hope is there for a faster language?
Last edited by genghisgandhi at Mar 19, 2016,
chrismendiola
Join date: May 2014
955 IQ
#818
Quote by genghisgandhi
bump

really trying to learn spanish now, I'm taking a gap year starting in august b/w uni degrees so I'll have plenty of time to practice. lessons are too expensive but I'm thinking of just doing vocab and grammar stuff on my own and finding someone I could pay to talk to (no shortage in my town) on a weekly or so basis.

it's so daunting doing this on your own, it's hard to believe people actually learn this way without moving to a place that speaks the language. why oh why couldn't I have cared this much in high school

also, something I'm worried about - I'm not the most articulate guy in the world (I mumble and stumble over my words a lot) so I'm worried this is all sort of a fool's errand. like if I can't handle english what hope is there for a faster language?

Spanish is typically spoken faster, but I find that it's more suited for faster speech than English, if that makes you feel better. The way I learned was through immersion at my job, so look into that. I don't know what the ethnic diversity is like in Manchester, but if you find yourself back in NJ, you definitely don't have to pay people to speak Spanish to you. Just force yourself to speak Spanish as much as possible- I recommend much more often than weekly.
genghisgandhi
Kristaps Porzingis
Join date: Mar 2009
4,324 IQ
#819
Quote by chrismendiola
Spanish is typically spoken faster, but I find that it's more suited for faster speech than English, if that makes you feel better. The way I learned was through immersion at my job, so look into that. I don't know what the ethnic diversity is like in Manchester, but if you find yourself back in NJ, you definitely don't have to pay people to speak Spanish to you. Just force yourself to speak Spanish as much as possible- I recommend much more often than weekly.

I stumble over my words speaking english slowly so guess it's just something I'll have to deal with. what was your job? I will be back in NJ and would love to work in a ******* or something like that for that reason but gotta think of the CV.


thinking about it I don't really come in contact with mexican people too often. my town is hella mexican but I don't really talk to them that much (I don't talk to anyone, really), how would I change that? my sister has a friend I would ask but there's no way I'm gonna ask her to talk to me for however long just out of the goodness of her heart. I would make it a lesson, or something
Shabalaba
Registered User
Join date: Dec 2006
1,981 IQ
#820
I'm learning French on duolingo at the minute. Nearly 1/4 of the way through it.

I do at least 5 minutes a day but when I've got more time I tend to have a bigger session (10-20 minutes). Got myself a textbook to work through once I fancy it, and after my PGCE I'll do some courses to really get it down.
Manchester United
genghisgandhi
Kristaps Porzingis
Join date: Mar 2009
4,324 IQ
#821
I don't think you're gonna get anywhere doing 20 minute sessions. also, Duolingo's good for what it is but it doesn't really teach you any grammar
chrismendiola
Join date: May 2014
955 IQ
#822
Quote by genghisgandhi at #33888036
I stumble over my words speaking english slowly so guess it's just something I'll have to deal with. what was your job? I will be back in NJ and would love to work in a ******* or something like that for that reason but gotta think of the CV.


thinking about it I don't really come in contact with mexican people too often. my town is hella mexican but I don't really talk to them that much (I don't talk to anyone, really), how would I change that? my sister has a friend I would ask but there's no way I'm gonna ask her to talk to me for however long just out of the goodness of her heart. I would make it a lesson, or something

Yeah, it's a fast food job, so I have more than enough Latin Americans who would oblige that request at my job, given that some of them don't speak English too well. AFAIK, you're about to graduate, so I imagine you're going to pursue a career, where workplaces are less numerous in Spanish speaking employees.

I honestly believe it's impossible to learn a language to fluency without immersion. I just forced myself to talk to people, even though I'm reserved and generally unsociable. But I had a solid foundation first- I took Spanish every year in high school (I started my job junior year, though) and didn't start talking in Spanish until I felt comfortable enough to put it into practice. Nobody wants to speak to someone in a language for which they don't understand the basics of syntax, grammar, vocabulary, etc. I'd recommend supplementing your book learning/Rosetta Stone/whatever program you choose with immersion after you feel confident enough that you could carry a smaller conversation.

The great thing about Spanish, and Romance languages in general, is that they're very structured and organized compared to English. There are comparatively very few irregular things, and even those irregular things are very consistent. One such characteristic about these languages is called declensions- many English speakers hate them and struggle with them but I find them extremely helpful because my thought process likes structure and linearity. It may take you more time to learn them, but they're very consistent, so once you do, you'll find that these patterns make the transition from learning the basics to practical use pretty easy.

As to how you'd do that in your life, I don't know what to suggest to you. From what I can tell, you're like I am (reserved and generally don't like to talk to new people), but that's really all I know about your situation. For that, what I did was to be friendly with them at first and then had them help me with Spanish. If you encounter someone who is fluent enough in English but also speaks Spanish, you could kindly ask them if they'd speak to you in Spanish as a favor to you. It's not really an insult if you're asking for their help, you know? Or if they take it as one, move on and find someone else to help you. In my experience, people are happy to better your education and yourself by helping you learn another language.

I guess I have one tip- you seem to have this idea that you could successfully undergo immersion through speaking to someone somewhat infrequently (see: the example you had of paying someone to speak to you weekly or so). The few, short conversations don't really help much, but I'm not gonna tell you to avoid them entirely. You'll need to have somewhat consistent relationships with Spanish speakers in which you speak to them very often. I'm not sure how you'll do this since I don't know what your work life will be like. I'd suggest at least trying to compensate somehow- you could try having a penpal/online friend to help you with writing, and you can practice speech by reading out loud. Watch Spanish programmes and practice translating it into English. Try to read newspapers written in Spanish.
Last edited by chrismendiola at Mar 20, 2016,
genghisgandhi
Kristaps Porzingis
Join date: Mar 2009
4,324 IQ
#823
Quote by chrismendiola
and didn't start talking in Spanish until I felt comfortable enough to put it into practice. Nobody wants to speak to someone in a language for which they don't understand the basics of syntax, grammar, vocabulary, etc. I'd recommend supplementing your book learning/Rosetta Stone/whatever program you choose with immersion after you feel confident enough that you could carry a smaller conversation.

this really is my plan. I'm going through Duolingo, making flash cards for vocab that interests me (mostly soccer stuff) and doing verb conjugations in this book I have but don't feel close to being able to converse.

thanks for the long reply, much appreciated. I'm sure I'll think of more stuff to ask about
WCPhils
UnBanned
Join date: Sep 2010
731 IQ
#824
Quote by Shabalaba at #33888042
I'm learning French on duolingo at the minute. Nearly 1/4 of the way through it.

I do at least 5 minutes a day but when I've got more time I tend to have a bigger session (10-20 minutes). Got myself a textbook to work through once I fancy it, and after my PGCE I'll do some courses to really get it down.

I just started doing this. I have a lot of school work atm though so I haven't learned much. Want to really get into it once I'm done this semester and have the summer.

Like it a lot more than Spanish though
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
ali.guitarkid7
Gets Easier
Join date: Oct 2009
2,304 IQ
#825
I haven't improved at French. I need to start practicing speech and listening as opposed to just reading.


Anyway I suddenly have this itch to learn kanji (assuming that's the Japanese alphabet?). I already know hangul and this is just for basic reading, not necessarily knowing the language itself. The apps in the OP look promising.
Quote by Aeolian Harmony
Ali priori / Ali posteriori
Quote by GuitarGod_92
Jesus christ Ali is a nutcase

I actually feel sorry for him, like seriously, get help
genghisgandhi
Kristaps Porzingis
Join date: Mar 2009
4,324 IQ
#826
Quote by genghisgandhi
this really is my plan. I'm going through Duolingo, making flash cards for vocab that interests me (mostly soccer stuff) and doing verb conjugations in this book I have but don't feel close to being able to converse.

thanks for the long reply, much appreciated. I'm sure I'll think of more stuff to ask about

since writing this I've made good progress, I can understand a lot of what this says - http://www.bbc.com/mundo/noticias/2016/05/160524_economia_impacto_crisis_venezuela_lf - which I definitely wouldn't have been able to do two months ago. I have optimistic and pessimistic days, it's all about setting realistic goals

need to work on saying stuff myself, lang-8 is a great website which I would recommend to anyone trying to learn something
NothingRocks
( ͡͡ ° ͜ &
Join date: Jun 2009
454 IQ
#827
Quote by ali.guitarkid7
I haven't improved at French. I need to start practicing speech and listening as opposed to just reading.


Anyway I suddenly have this itch to learn kanji (assuming that's the Japanese alphabet?). I already know hangul and this is just for basic reading, not necessarily knowing the language itself. The apps in the OP look promising.



Kanji is one of the "alphabets." There's Hiragana, Katakana, and Kanji. Hiragana is all smooth and rounded. It generally gets used for grammar particles and for augmenting kanji meanings. Katakana has a bunch of sharp corners and straight lines. It is used for loan-words or made-up words typically. Then there's Kanji which in Japanese is a bit of a nightmare to learn. There can be several meanings to the same Kanji and there are around 2000 commonly used Kanji. So "learning" Kanji is pretty hard unless you also learn the grammar and let the readings all come naturally as you learn.
Last edited by NothingRocks at May 25, 2016,
guitarxo
cat
Join date: Oct 2008
1,649 IQ
#828
I found a French textbook on my e reader so I am teaching myself French from it, and it's helping me recall forgotten Spanish vocab at the same time. my dad speaks French but he refuses to speak to me in anything but Tamil now. I've enlisted the help of my uncle but I don't see him as often so it's definitely not an immersive experience. But I'm glad I know something about phonetics; it's so helpful for learning any type of language! Regardless of my actual skill level I can at least sound confident in my pronunciation.

My cousin is learning Japanese atm and by helping her study I'm picking it up surprisingly fast. I don't think I will make a concerted effort to learn it yet though.

Last week my grandfather passed away and he left me his entire library, much of which is in Farsi, and I found a couple books in there on learning Farsi. So I guess that's my next thing but I don't know anyone who would speak with me in Farsi with any regularity.
cat
Fat Lard
.
Join date: Jun 2006
814 IQ
#829
Do you know which ones were his favorite books?
Reasoning focalized
Receptors activated
ali.guitarkid7
Gets Easier
Join date: Oct 2009
2,304 IQ
#830
Quote by NothingRocks
Kanji is one of the "alphabets." There's Hiragana, Katakana, and Kanji. Hiragana is all smooth and rounded. It generally gets used for grammar particles and for augmenting kanji meanings. Katakana has a bunch of sharp corners and straight lines. It is used for loan-words or made-up words typically. Then there's Kanji which in Japanese is a bit of a nightmare to learn. There can be several meanings to the same Kanji and there are around 2000 commonly used Kanji. So "learning" Kanji is pretty hard unless you also learn the grammar and let the readings all come naturally as you learn.

Yeah I eventually figured this out and am curious as to how it works. Why is it that Japanese adopted kanji in the first place? Is it something actually practical or some sort of class privilege thing?

I mean couldn't you just write everything in kana or does kanji introduce different phonetics into the mix?
Quote by Aeolian Harmony
Ali priori / Ali posteriori
Quote by GuitarGod_92
Jesus christ Ali is a nutcase

I actually feel sorry for him, like seriously, get help
guitarxo
cat
Join date: Oct 2008
1,649 IQ
#831
Quote by Fat Lard
Do you know which ones were his favorite books?


No idea lol. I'll let you know if I figure it out - I'm just cataloguing them now since there's hundreds of them
cat
NothingRocks
( ͡͡ ° ͜ &
Join date: Jun 2009
454 IQ
#832
ali.guitarkid7

I'm not sure of the specifics, but I'm sure it has a lot to do with the prevalence of Chinese culture during the time surrounding nations were developing writing systems. For example: Korean used to be written with Chinese characters before Sejong the Great came along and created Hangul. The reason Korea used Chinese character was because those of higher social status wanted to be more like China. The Chinese writing system for Korean was incredibly difficult for most people at the time to understand. It is similar in a lot of ways to the current Thai writing system in terms of how contradictory and complex it can be. The reason Japan uses it is a bit complex. It has to do with the large amount of very early Chinese influence, but also with the written grammar. Kanji actually makes it easier to grasp the grammar in a lot of ways because you can separate the normal words from the particles fairly easily. A very basic example of this would be something like: noun (particle) noun (particle) verb (ending particle). The nouns and verbs are typically written all in Kanji(unless the person writing it doesn't know the kanji or the word's kanji-written form isn't widely used) while the particles are in Hiragana. It can also make written sentences more compact but that is fairly obvious.