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#41
The way I see it modern metal tone is basically a combination of a high gain American/German voiced amp (rarely British) and multiple tracks.
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You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
#42
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
Thanks Craig. That is what my opinion is. I realize post production and multi-tracking etc play a part too. I think it is pertinent to this forum in particular because metal seems to be the number one genre and people looking for new amps typically play metal BUT.....have a lower budget than say Rig-Talk.

Lower budget usually means what?

*Simpler circuit
*lower wattage
*smaller transformers
*corners cut

??

In other words, if I have the right circuit can I still get modern metal out of the amp if it is 5 watts? 20 watts? $400 new?

Can I get a compressed, thick, tight, bass heavy tone with a low watt low budget amp?


i failed pretty bad with the jet city, so im guessing no. then again gear jsut teach you multiple lessons. just have to learn.
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#43
Quote by oneblackened
The way I see it modern metal tone is basically a combination of a high gain American/German voiced amp (rarely British) and multiple tracks.


I agree with this.


And Romeo- everyone pretty much buys one turd first. Or at least one amp that doesn't get them quite were they want to be.
#44
The modern metal tone is a terribly eq'd 6505/5150 with a tubescreamer thrown in front with a noise gate. Then use a guitar with emg's and the guitarist plays like a bitch because he is far too conserned with playing "perfectly" that he or she forgets metal is supposed to be heavy and aggressive.

As for modern rock add a crap ton of effects and use fenders, oh and don't forget to play like a bitch because its all about sounding perfect and pretty.

I find the lack of additude in modern guitar based music disturbing
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#45
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
...

Does 'Modern' (metal) guitar tone mean something created in the last decade like Avenged Sevenfold or Children of Bodom? If so, why?

or-


Does 'Modern' (metal) guitar tone mean something created from an amp that creates a desired tone? If so, why?

...

I just got off the phone with Randall and I agree it was created from an amp design beginning with the MB Triple Rec (older 2 channels and the same beef as the Bogner Uberschall Twin Jet) and the Diezel VH4.

I associate the Brit tone of the Splawn, Marshall, Orange, Laney, etc. with Classic/Dinosaur Rock.

#47
Quote by losing battle
The modern metal tone is a terribly eq'd 6505/5150 with a tubescreamer thrown in front with a noise gate. Then use a guitar with emg's and the guitarist plays like a bitch because he is far too conserned with playing "perfectly" that he or she forgets metal is supposed to be heavy and aggressive.

As for modern rock add a crap ton of effects and use fenders, oh and don't forget to play like a bitch because its all about sounding perfect and pretty.

I find the lack of additude in modern guitar based music disturbing

We got a hipster, guys.

Quote by Ippon
I just got off the phone with Randall

What.
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#48
Quote by romeozdistress
i failed pretty bad with the jet city, so im guessing no. then again gear jsut teach you multiple lessons. just have to learn.

I'm trolling a bit (more like pushing for concurrence) because I pretty much already know the answer. It is really tough to get good modern tones on a low watt amp. The amp simply breaks up to soon and chords sound fizzy. I'm sure your Jet City was decent for Thrash though right?


Quote by bassmastamitch
What.

I'm pretty sure he was trolling.

KSE gigged with Splawn Nitros and I wouldn't consider Jim Root to be playing classic rock either. Now....if he's got a direct line to Randall then
#49
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
I'm trolling a bit (more like pushing for concurrence) because I pretty much already know the answer. It is really tough to get good modern tones on a low watt amp. The amp simply breaks up to soon and chords sound fizzy. I'm sure your Jet City was decent for Thrash though right?


I'm pretty sure he was trolling.

KSE gigged with Splawn Nitros and I wouldn't consider Jim Root to be playing classic rock either. Now....if he's got a direct line to Randall then


it was okay. just not ballsy enough for me.
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#51
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
In other words, if I have the right circuit can I still get modern metal out of the amp if it is 5 watts? 20 watts? $400 new?

Can I get a compressed, thick, tight, bass heavy tone with a low watt low budget amp?
IMHO: Modern metal is generally more about preamp distortion, so with a correctly biased phase inverter and a good PPIMV and a 12AU7 you could probably design a great sounding 2Watt metal amp, but it can be done with ~3W triode connected single ended amps too, not sure if anything decent on the market would be easily modded to do it though
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#52
Quote by GABarrie
IMHO: Modern metal is generally more about preamp distortion, so with a correctly biased phase inverter and a good PPIMV and a 12AU7 you could probably design a great sounding 2Watt metal amp, but it can be done with ~3W triode connected single ended amps too, not sure if anything decent on the market would be easily modded to do it though


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANND you just created a market niche for yourself.
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#53
Quote by LaidBack
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANND you just created a market niche for yourself.
haha, I recon I could do it for $400 new too, although shipping to the US might go on top of that
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#54
Well, even at $100 shipping, it would fit into the usual, "I have $500 and want to play teh br00talz".
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#55
Quote by GABarrie
IMHO: Modern metal is generally more about preamp distortion, so with a correctly biased phase inverter and a good PPIMV and a 12AU7 you could probably design a great sounding 2Watt metal amp, but it can be done with ~3W triode connected single ended amps too, not sure if anything decent on the market would be easily modded to do it though

Why is no one doing that?

People come in here all the time looking for a low cost, low watt metal amp

I would think some high headroom and big transformers also plays a part in that 'modern' tone.


wait....does anyone know more about the Baron Snott Watt?
#56
The combination of a Peavey 5150, EMG pickups, an Ibanez TS808, a Mesa cab with V30's, miced with an SM57 (or two) through a Neve style preamp, is the modern guitar tone.

Replace the 5150 with either a Recto or ENGL of some sort, and the Mesa cab with an ENGL traditional 4x12 for the other traditional modern tone.

The tone taken from amplifiers which share circuitry design with the Soldano SLO preamp, or heavily modded Marshalls is "modern". The Celestion Vintage 30 is also heavily responsible for modern guitar tones, especially when put into an "oversized" cabinet, and paired with the aforementioned recording setup of a 57 into a Neve style preamp
Then there's this band called Slice The Cake...

Bunch of faggots putting random riffs together and calling it "progressive" deathcore.
Stupid name.
Probably picked "for teh lulz"

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Last edited by Shinozoku at Sep 12, 2012,
#57
311, you're right. We know that big iron=big tone. But in a small amp, that's not doable.

As for the Snott Watt, where's Kylen when you need him?
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#58
yeh, you do loose a lot of the bass response with a small transformer, which obviously budget and low watt amps use, but there's other ways of generating it to compensate

just to clarify, I say compensate, not replace, you're still gonna get a much fatter tone with a 100W amp than a 2W

as for the head room, triodes are very difficult to push into distortion, so that would help
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Last edited by GABarrie at Sep 12, 2012,
#59
Well for home use, that's to be expected. If you're using it for recording, then multi-tracking, as stated earlier in the thread, is the way to go for "huge" sounds.
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#60
already sketched out the pre and power amp designing the power supply now
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#61
Quote by Ippon
I just got off the phone with Randall and I agree it was created from an amp design beginning with the MB Triple Rec (older 2 channels and the same beef as the Bogner Uberschall Twin Jet) and the Diezel VH4.

I associate the Brit tone of the Splawn, Marshall, Orange, Laney, etc. with Classic/Dinosaur Rock.


Cool story, bro. This clip has had absolutely 0 post porocessing, not even a HPF, which most "modern metal" amps need. I defined the modern metal sound in my last post, but these are people thinking outside the box.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SR82ybzuZ9Y

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Orzc5gpLxc

I think this one might have had some mixing, but not much.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEu0DbXRTfQ
Then there's this band called Slice The Cake...

Bunch of faggots putting random riffs together and calling it "progressive" deathcore.
Stupid name.
Probably picked "for teh lulz"

Mod in UG's Official Gain Whores
Last edited by Shinozoku at Sep 12, 2012,
#62
Quote by GABarrie
already sketched out the pre and power amp designing the power supply now


Shouldn't you be fixing amps, not designing them?


^Shinzoku, those are all 404.
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#63
Tried embedding, didn't work. Fixing them now.

EDIT: Done. Modern metal tones with Marshalls. Mind you, the last two are a modded JMP2203 and the first is the Kerry King model, but the Beast switch was off on that one. Watch all of them in 1080.
Then there's this band called Slice The Cake...

Bunch of faggots putting random riffs together and calling it "progressive" deathcore.
Stupid name.
Probably picked "for teh lulz"

Mod in UG's Official Gain Whores
Last edited by Shinozoku at Sep 12, 2012,
#64
Quote by LaidBack
Shouldn't you be fixing amps, not designing them?


^Shinzoku, those are all 404.

Day off today...
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#65
What we call modern guitar tone all started when Carlos Santana first plugged into a Mk1 Mesa Boogie. So what was that 1970? Not really that modern is it?
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#66
Nice tones you found there, Shin. I agree, plenty of the bands I listen to use British voiced amps for high gain applications.

Gordon, nice!

Cath, yea yea yea, we get it, you were the first generation of "modern" tones. Now get off OUR lawn!
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#67


The forgers of modern guitar tone.
Then there's this band called Slice The Cake...

Bunch of faggots putting random riffs together and calling it "progressive" deathcore.
Stupid name.
Probably picked "for teh lulz"

Mod in UG's Official Gain Whores
#69
design is finished, can almost definitely do it in head format for £250 ($400) or less, that's with a rectified heater supply and everything, but I'm not gonna bother building a prototype before my new gigging amp unless someone was genuinely interested in the first one, it's not something I would use myself.
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#70
Quote by darkwolf291
As you said in WTLT 311, I'd argue Metallica had a hand in popularizing the scooped, bassy, heavily distorted tone we've come to know and love/hate.

Not according to Cathbard.

1970 is when it all began.
#71
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH

Does anyone care?


i do not. too confusing thread.
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#73
Tele through a hi-fi speaker.
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