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#81
So why wasn't apple sued when they first made the ipod? Nothing about their products were original....
#82
Quote by NotaHamsterBro
So why wasn't apple sued when they first made the ipod? Nothing about their products were original....

Because no one got it right before them? There's being original, then there's being compelling.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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#83
Quote by archenemyfan
Wait, doesn't samsung supply apple with touchscreens and shit?

They supply them with various things ,yes.

Quote by Xiaoxi
Nope. Sorry, Android sucks. Shitty app market and glaring security flaws and Flash and shitty program management/background management. It also highlights the disadvantages of open systems when you chart how fragmented the market is based on which version of Android individual devices are using.


Common misconceptions, none which are true or applicable in the real world.

Apple is pretty much a dumbed down version of a Smartphone OS. You can't do shit, they won't let you do shit, you don't have widgets, you just have the soulless app screens and icons. You can't customize anything, that's what Apple wants because the users are the kind of people who breaks everything if they do. Same reason why some prefer Apple OS over windows: Some people need the training wheels on.
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#84
Quote by Kensai
Common misconceptions, none which are true or applicable in the real world.

I've had an HTC before, that's all based on real time use. Flash is not a "misconception". It's touted as an advantage when in reality it really is a shitty plugin for mobile devices. Adobe's own decision to finally phase out flash in Android just goes to show that it in fact doesn't work.

Quote by Kensai

Apple is pretty much a dumbed down version of a Smartphone OS. You can't do shit, they won't let you do shit, you don't have widgets, you just have the soulless app screens and icons. You can't customize anything, that's what Apple wants because the users are the kind of people who breaks everything if they do. Same reason why some prefer Apple OS over windows: Some people need the training wheels on.

I like how you assume customization is automatically a good thing. Guess what, not everyone, even "geeks", give a shit or have the time to change the theme of the week. Apparently even many in the high tech industries love having training wheels on.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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Last edited by Xiaoxi at Aug 25, 2012,
#85
Quote by Kensai
They supply them with various things ,yes.


Common misconceptions, none which are true or applicable in the real world.

Apple is pretty much a dumbed down version of a Smartphone OS. You can't do shit, they won't let you do shit, you don't have widgets, you just have the soulless app screens and icons. You can't customize anything, that's what Apple wants because the users are the kind of people who breaks everything if they do. Same reason why some prefer Apple OS over windows: Some people need the training wheels on.


So then how does this billion dollar settlement affect that relationship between apple and samsung?

Sorry if sound a bit stoopeed but I'm as dumb as a door when it comes to this kind of stuff.
#86
Quote by Xiaoxi
I like how you assume customization is automatically a good thing. Guess what, not everyone, even "geeks", give a shit or have the time to change the theme of the week. Apparently even many in the high tech industries love having training wheels on.

I'd rather have the ability to customize and not use it, than not have it at all. That's why it's a good thing. And I don't mean just the superificial things like "themes" which are apple fans #1 concern apparently.

But hey, whatever you need to say to justify your $100000+ purchase

Quote by archenemyfan
So then how does this billion dollar settlement affect that relationship between apple and samsung?

Sorry if sound a bit stoopeed but I'm as dumb as a door when it comes to this kind of stuff.


I don't really know, I think it's pretty strange. But both of them depend on eachother
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#87
Quote by Kensai
I'd rather have the ability to customize and not use it, than not have it at all. That's why it's a good thing.

Yes, YOU would. Many people don't to that extent. The fact that you don't see that just shows how little you know about tech and tech design.


Quote by archenemyfan
So then how does this billion dollar settlement affect that relationship between apple and samsung?

Probably nothing. The back-end hardware manufacturing division is almost a separate entity.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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Last edited by Xiaoxi at Aug 25, 2012,
#88
Quote by Xiaoxi
Yes, YOU would. Many people don't to that extent. The fact that you don't see that just shows how little you know about tech and tech design.

Yeah alright buddy, I'm the only one who needs the ability to be able to change things if needed. Let's say that. That's how the innovative tech industry works: Only few people need to have an open-ended approach in tech and tech design which focuses on change and innovation
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#89
Quote by Xiaoxi
Yes, YOU would. Many people don't to that extent. The fact that you don't see that just shows how little you know about tech and tech design.


Probably nothing. The back-end hardware manufacturing division is almost a separate entity.

Many people DO care about customization, that's why you see cars looking like shit due to excessive bumper stickers, shitty profile themes when Myspace was a thing, and millions of idiots downloading malware because it offers them Facebook themes and screensavers and other crap
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
"Trans Princess". You're bitching over nothing, and you know it.
#90
Quote by Xiaoxi
Yes, YOU would. Many people don't to that extent. The fact that you don't see that just shows how little you know about tech and tech design.


Probably nothing. The back-end hardware manufacturing division is almost a separate entity.

TBH, that's more a marketing issue than a design issue.
I'd certainly argue that having customisability built in is a good thing from the developer's perspective, too, since it means you're building the tools to adapt and reuse software in from the very start.
Quote by Diemon Dave
Don't go ninjerin nobody don't need ninjerin'
#91
Quote by Kensai
Yeah alright buddy, I'm the only one who needs the ability to be able to change things if needed. Let's say that. That's how the innovative tech industry works: Only few people need to have an open-ended approach in tech and tech design which focuses on change and innovation

So you're equating open systems with change and innovation? I feel sorry for you.

Quote by Assid Rane
Many people DO care about customization, that's why you see cars looking like shit due to excessive bumper stickers, shitty profile themes when Myspace was a thing, and millions of idiots downloading malware because it offers them Facebook themes and screensavers and other crap

Exactly. Is Facebook customizable?

Quote by slapsymcdougal
TBH, that's more a marketing issue than a design issue.
I'd certainly argue that having customisability built in is a good thing from the developer's perspective, too, since it means you're building the tools to adapt and reuse software in from the very start.

That has nothing to do with the front end of customization. The openness of the Android market also means no standard of quality or security in place.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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Last edited by Xiaoxi at Aug 25, 2012,
#92
Quote by Xiaoxi
So you're equating open systems with change and innovation? I feel sorry for you.


Exactly. Is Facebook customizable?

No, but in case you didn't notice, I specifically said millions of people TRY to customize it. Yeesh.
Also, if people don't care about customization, then why do phone cases sell by the millions? Or ringtones? Why is almost everyone's desktop background different?
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
"Trans Princess". You're bitching over nothing, and you know it.
#93
Quote by Xiaoxi
So you're equating open systems with change and innovation? I feel sorry for you.

Conincidentally I'm transcribing interviews from various high-up bosses in Sweden and other places talking about innovation, and this comes up quite often. The fewer restraints, the more innovation. That should be obvious.

Quote by Xiaoxi
That has nothing to do with the front end of customization. The openness of the Android market also means no standard of quality or security in place.

I think Apple fans imagine google market as some mine field with everyother app being malware. It's obviously not the case...
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#94
Quote by Assid Rane
No, but in case you didn't notice, I specifically said millions of people TRY to customize it. Yeesh.
Yes, I was trying to lead you to the logical conclusion: Because so many people aren't equipped to make sensible customizations (like the shitty MySpace pages), a company like Facebook saw the benefit of having a closed system.

Also, if people don't care about customization, then why do phone cases sell by the millions? Or ringtones? Why is almost everyone's desktop background different?

That's not the kind of customization we're talking about here. Android is essentially easier to jailbreak. That's not mere changing the OS settings, which would be exactly the same on either OS.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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#96
Quote by Kensai
Conincidentally I'm transcribing interviews from various high-up bosses in Sweden and other places talking about innovation, and this comes up quite often. The fewer restraints, the more innovation. That should be obvious.
Because Microsoft is doing so well right?


I think Apple fans imagine google market as some mine field with everyother app being malware. It's obviously not the case...

It's not, but there's not an effective filtering system with many negative implications. Try to not oversimplify everything such as "training wheels."

Quote by NotaHamsterBro
Someone is mad they spent hundreds on an iphone and can't do shit on it

I have a Samsung

...modes and scales are still useless.


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Last edited by Xiaoxi at Aug 25, 2012,
#97
Quote by Xiaoxi
So you're equating open systems with change and innovation? I feel sorry for you.


Exactly. Is Facebook customizable?


That has nothing to do with the front end of customization. The openness of the Android market also means no standard of quality or security in place.

BTW, it's insanely easy to secure a smartphone
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
"Trans Princess". You're bitching over nothing, and you know it.
#98
Quote by Xiaoxi
Because Microsoft is doing so well right?


They are, but if you're comparing market value then you are seriously oversimplyfying things. Just because something sells well doesn't mean it's superior. Jack Daniel's for example is the most sold "whiskey" in the world, but I wouldn't drink that over 18-year-old highland park. There are more factors than that.

Seems you missed my point about open-ended work environments... I don't see how closing the possibilities can ever be a good thing...

Quote by Xiaoxi
It's not, but there's not an effective filtering system with many negative implications. Try to not oversimplify everything such as "training wheels."


I don't even know what filter they are using, I just have never had or heard of anyone with the problems of malware apps.
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#99
Quote by Kensai
They are, but if you're comparing market value then you are seriously oversimplyfying things. Just because something sells well doesn't mean it's superior. Jack Daniel's for example is the most sold "whiskey" in the world, but I wouldn't drink that over 18-year-old highland park. There are more factors than that.

Seems you missed my point about open-ended work environments... I don't see how closing the possibilities can ever be a good thing...


I don't even know what filter they are using, I just have never had or heard of anyone with the problems of malware apps.

Kensai, look at it this way.
We could automate cars for all the retards and drunk-drivers out there, because it would make them safer overall; but still have human-controlled F1 cars for the cool kids.
Quote by Diemon Dave
Don't go ninjerin nobody don't need ninjerin'
#100
Quote by Kensai

Seems you missed my point about open-ended work environments... I don't see how closing the possibilities can ever be a good thing...
Seems like you don't know how "innovation" works. It has nothing to do with front end open-endedness.

I don't even know what filter they are using, I just have never had or heard of anyone with the problems of malware apps.

http://techland.time.com/2011/12/02/report-says-android-market-is-number-one-source-of-mobile-malware/

...modes and scales are still useless.


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#101
You can just jailbreak an iPhone. It's ridiculously easy.
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#102
Quote by slapsymcdougal
Kensai, look at it this way.
We could automate cars for all the retards and drunk-drivers out there, because it would make them safer overall; but still have human-controlled F1 cars for the cool kids.


Yeah I guess. I just wish they would stay in their pen that has every corner padded.

Quote by Xiaoxi
Seems like you don't know how "innovation" works. It has nothing to do with front end open-endedness.


You are so in denial it's not even funny

Quote by Xiaoxi


Never said it was perfect, they need to screen for apps better. Same with windows really. I still prefer both, however
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#103
Quote by Kensai

You are so in denial it's not even funny

Ok, explain in concrete terms how having an open-ended front-end affect back-end innovation.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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#104
Quote by Kensai

You are so in denial it's not even funny

Oh oh oh, Mr. Smartypants!

If it is not funny, why are you laughing? Eh? Contradiction!

Quote by Saint78
That's forever imprinted in my brain in Dwight's voice. Seriously.

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#105
Quote by Xiaoxi
Ok, explain in concrete terms how having an open-ended front-end affect back-end innovation.


How having more options will lead to better and more innovative products? Do I really have to explain that? Try writing a play with only half the keys on your keyboard. That's about how it works using simple terms.

Quote by Dwight.Schrute
Oh oh oh, Mr. Smartypants!

If it is not funny, why are you laughing? Eh? Contradiction!


Touché.

I actually thought about that while typing it but I didn't think anyone would point it out
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#106
Xiaoxi, your argument seems to be that since the average consumer is ignorant, they shouldn't have a need for customization or anything "open." Apple has taken a closed, uniform approach, and, by your logic, that's what makes their OS better.
That's a really crap way to look at it, and would actually be the opposite of innovative.
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
"Trans Princess". You're bitching over nothing, and you know it.
#107
Quote by Kensai
How having more options will lead to better and more innovative products? Do I really have to explain that? Try writing a play with only half the keys on your keyboard. That's about how it works using simple terms.

Yes, you really do have to explain how FRONT-END customization (that's what you're touting) encourages BACK-END innovation (how people making the products benefit). No idiotic analogies.

Quote by Assid Rane
Xiaoxi, your argument seems to be that since the average consumer is ignorant, they shouldn't have a need for customization or anything "open." Apple has taken a closed, uniform approach, and, by your logic, that's what makes their OS better.
That's a really crap way to look at it, and would actually be the opposite of innovative.

That's not my argument at all. I'm simply saying that many people, including high end users, don't have a need for the inane customisations that Android is apparently so famous for. That's because it has no bearing on productivity, security, or innovation.

...modes and scales are still useless.


Quote by PhoenixGRM
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Last edited by Xiaoxi at Aug 25, 2012,
#109
Quote by Kensai
How having more options will lead to better and more innovative products? Do I really have to explain that? Try writing a play with only half the keys on your keyboard. That's about how it works using simple terms.

Thes was wret weth des saed and nat dat saed.
Quote by Saint78
That's forever imprinted in my brain in Dwight's voice. Seriously.

Voted UG's best threadstarter 2014.
#110
Consider that the most important developments in computer graphics have taken place on open source, open ended *nix systems.

Consider that anyone who wants to write powerful, fast software will write for *nix or Windows.
Last edited by Eastwinn at Aug 25, 2012,
#111
Quote by Xiaoxi
Yes, you really do have to explain how FRONT-END customization (that's what you're touting) encourages BACK-END innovation (how people making the products benefit). No idiotic analogies.

I felt I just did and have repeteadly: More options = less restraints = more things to work with = better and more innovative products.

I'm not going to explain this again.
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#112
Quote by rabidguitarist
Really??

Thanks for clearing that up.. I definitely remember learning in school that a billion is a million million, yet every time I look at something that is supposed to be a billion I think there are loads of 0s missing. I never said anything in case anyone thought I was an idiot.

Surely the word is like bi-million, how do you get a thousand million from that?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-52AI_ojyQ
#113
Quote by Eastwinn
Consider that the most important developments in computer graphics have taken place on open source, open ended *nix systems.
Good point. But consider that Windows can't drop its flawed registry system because it caters to the open environment and their best solution to this problem on Windows 8 is to make it easier to "refresh" (meaning get rid of all your shit and start over).

Consider that anyone who wants to write powerful, fast software will write for *nix or Windows.

...what...

Quote by Kensai
I felt I just did and have repeteadly: More options = less restraints = more things to work with = better and more innovative products.

I'm not going to explain this again.

In other words, you have no clue when it comes to the specifics. Might I suggest training wheels.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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#114
Okay, can you please argue my last post, please?
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
"Trans Princess". You're bitching over nothing, and you know it.
#115
Quote by Xiaoxi
In other words, you have no clue when it comes to the specifics. Might I suggest training wheels.


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#116
Quote by Xiaoxi

In other words, you have no clue when it comes to the specifics. Might I suggest training wheels.


Or a carseat, they look like a blast.
Quote by Saint78
That's forever imprinted in my brain in Dwight's voice. Seriously.

Voted UG's best threadstarter 2014.
#118
Quote by Xiaoxi
Good point. But consider that Windows can't drop its flawed registry system because it caters to the open environment and their best solution to this problem on Windows 8 is to make it easier to "refresh" (meaning get rid of all your shit and start over).


The registry is the biggest piece of poo and it always has been. It's existence is a damper of my good time really. I think if the registry disappeared I could probably get off my antidepressant.

There is a simple solution to the registry problem, but the guys at Microsoft have this problem with admitting defeat and then validate it with a cry for "backwards compatibility".

I agree that the registry is mistake that's lasted because Windows is so open ended, but I don't believe that is relevant to innovation, which is what we were arguing about... right?

Quote by Xiaoxi
...what...


The most powerful GUI languages are Windows only. The fastest, most efficient operating systems are *nix.

The only thing Apple has going for it os-wise is stability, looks, and consistency. Which is why I bought an iPad for school.

I'm not saying the various Apple operating systems are trash, they're just not suited for software innovation.
#119
totally absurd case, I think it's a complete joke that this wasn't thrown out of court. Infact the whole patent wars in general between the tech companies are ridiculous. We as consumers are the ones who lose out most when companies can create monopolies by copyrighting basic universal design features. If Apple are so worried about losing business to Samsung, they need to make either a better product or make their existing one cheaper, they can't just copyright the basic design of touch-screen smartphones and tablets. Makes a mockery of the free market
Quote by Rockstar12345
One does not simply walk onto a Chav's lawn
#120
Quote by Diamond Dave

Sure, Apple hasn't invented anything from scratch. But it's hard to argue that it didn't single handedly change the music industry, PCs, and usher in the move to smartphones and tablets.

Quote by Eastwinn

I agree that the registry is mistake that's lasted because Windows is so open ended, but I don't believe that is relevant to innovation, which is what we were arguing about... right?
Because if it wasn't so fixed on catering to everyone, it could be innovative by creating a new, superior OS from scratch.


I'm not saying the various Apple operating systems are trash, they're just not suited for software innovation.

That's not true at all. Different software are being developed on different platforms for one reason or another. I don't think there's any single constant advantage.

...modes and scales are still useless.


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Last edited by Xiaoxi at Aug 25, 2012,