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#41
Quote by HotspurJr


... but the notion that you can't just use a V7 I and be in the new key is insane. It happens in literally thousands of pop and rock songs. It's the most common modulation there is.


only poor niggas use V7s blood, there ain't no money in it, he says
Quote by Kevätuhri
Hail isn't too edgy for posts, posts are not edgy enough for Hail.


Quote by UseYourThumb
You win. I'm done here.
#42
Quote by HotspurJr
Perhaps you meant this study:

http://www.hooktheory.com/blog/i-analyzed-the-chords-of-1300-popular-songs-for-patterns-this-is-what-i-found/

In which case you're remembering it wrong. Vs are more common than IVs.

(I love it when somebody is dead wrong, and their reaction is to try to get everybody to stop talking. You're flat out wrong here. Vs are all all over Led Zeppelin and AC/DC.)



I was gonna look for that study, but you ninja'd me to it. I was also gonna say I wasn't gonna STFU but you ninja'd me there too.

Just to add another thing, there is no such thing as "baroque style harmony". It is not the harmony which characterizes the baroque period. Baroque harmony is the same harmony as in the rest of tonal music.
Quote by Xiaoxi
The Byzantine scale was useful until the Ottoman scale came around and totally annihilated it.
#43
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Don't ask me, I'll never tell
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I trade my soul for a wish
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Your stare was holding
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I took no time with the fall
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I beg and borrow and steal
Have first sight and it's real
I didn't know I would feel it, but it's in my way
Your stare was holding
Ripped jeans, skin was showing
Hot night, wind was blowing
Where you think you're going, baby?

Hey, I just met you, and this is crazy
But here's my number, so call me maybe
It's hard to look right, at you baby
But here's my number, so call me maybe

Hey, I just met you, and this is crazy
But here's my number, so call me maybe
And all the other boys, try to chase
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Hey, I just met you, and this is crazy
But here's my number, so call me maybe
And all the other boys, try to chase me,
But here's my number, so call me maybe

Before you came into my life I missed you so bad
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And you should know that
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#44
Most posts are only perpetuating my confusion....I think I'll wait to work on this, or just ask my teacher at my next lesson >.>

Anyway, this is probably going to bring more confusion to me, but are there any examples of multiple keys at once in more modern music? I remember learning that Stravinsky did that in a few of his pieces.
#45
Sorry for all the confusion... First of all, focus on how to establish a key, before moving on to more complex stuff
Quote by Xiaoxi
The Byzantine scale was useful until the Ottoman scale came around and totally annihilated it.
#46
Quote by mrkeka
First of all, focus on how to establish a key, before moving on to more complex stuff


can i just get this tattooed on my eyelids
Quote by Kevätuhri
Hail isn't too edgy for posts, posts are not edgy enough for Hail.


Quote by UseYourThumb
You win. I'm done here.
#47
to establish a key, other than having the notes in the scale, i have the song/piece/progression feel "centered" at the first note in the key?

is that right?
#48
Quote by Green_Ghoul
to establish a key, other than having the notes in the scale,

no

i have the song/piece/progression feel "centered" at the first note in the key


yes

it's not the "first note" though. music is not sequential, it is not vertical, it is not consecutively dispersed and it is not a physical manifestation of common intervallic patterns.

just the idea that the piece is "centered" on the first note is nonsensical - when ascending or descending a given set of tones, there will be a first and last note, but music isn't a series of ascension and descension. it's like the wonkavator - it goes up, down, diagonal, sideways, upside down, below the floor and above the ceiling. there's a centric tone, but you can't think of a key as "7 notes put together based on the 1st note"

what if a progression is in C major but starts on a G?
Quote by Kevätuhri
Hail isn't too edgy for posts, posts are not edgy enough for Hail.


Quote by UseYourThumb
You win. I'm done here.
#49
i didn't mean started on the first note, sorry if it sounded that way. what was trying to say is that, as the song is being played, the piece as a whole sort of gravitates to the C, or does it go towards other notes too? Maybe a riff or lick ends at the key note?

I don't really know how to put what I'm thinking into words =\

I like the wonkavator analogy
#50
lol we should do a thread on modulations (one of my favorite things in the world besides Popeyes chicken)

...modes and scales are still useless.


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Voted for Patron Çıldırdı.

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#52
Quote by Xiaoxi
(Popeyes chicken)


muso's best friend, on tuesdays they have $1 for a leg+thigh piece over here

Quote by :-D
g mixolydian

idiot


i just lost all my shit, i just don't know where it went, it disappeared
Quote by Kevätuhri
Hail isn't too edgy for posts, posts are not edgy enough for Hail.


Quote by UseYourThumb
You win. I'm done here.
#53
Quote by Green_Ghoul
Most posts are only perpetuating my confusion


Try this: http://www.teoria.com/tutorials/hf/mod01.php

Quote by Green_Ghoul
Are there any examples of multiple keys at once in more modern music?


It's called 'polytonality'. There are examples of music on that page.
Quote by Hail
oh shut up with that /mu/ bullshit. fidget house shouldn't even be a genre, why in the world would it deserve its own subgenres you twat
Last edited by Sleepy__Head at Sep 21, 2012,
#54
Quote by CarsonStevens
This may or may not be mildly helpful, but one of my favorite/most obvious examples of a song where the band changes key is "Tattooed Women" by Tijuana Sweetheart (formerly Vagiant). Hellion actually screams "key change!" to signal that it's about to occur, and the relationship between the new key and the old key is pretty obvious at that point.


I'll use this method in future, and I recommend everyone else do the same.
#55
Do you think we can convince Xiaoxi to do this when playing Bach?
Quote by Hail
oh shut up with that /mu/ bullshit. fidget house shouldn't even be a genre, why in the world would it deserve its own subgenres you twat
#56
Quote by Hail
can i just get this tattooed on my eyelids


You could... though I think it would be less painful to sig it... or maybe tattoo it somewhere else

Quote by Xiaoxi
lol we should do a thread on modulations


Yes, please!
Quote by Xiaoxi
The Byzantine scale was useful until the Ottoman scale came around and totally annihilated it.
#57
Quote by steven seagull
Regardless of what you think of them their songs are well-written and full of great examples of harmony...keep your opinions to yourself if they're going to get in the way of helping someone.


Apologies. Offending post removed.
Quote by Hail
oh shut up with that /mu/ bullshit. fidget house shouldn't even be a genre, why in the world would it deserve its own subgenres you twat
#58
Quote by Sleepy__Head
Do you think we can convince Xiaoxi to do this when playing Bach?

do what

...modes and scales are still useless.


Quote by PhoenixGRM
Hey guys could you spare a minute to Vote for my band. Go to the site Search our band Listana with CTRL+F for quick and vote Thank you .
Quote by sam b
Voted for Patron Çıldırdı.

Thanks
Quote by PhoenixGRM
But our Band is Listana
#59
Quote by Green_Ghoul
Most posts are only perpetuating my confusion....I think I'll wait to work on this, or just ask my teacher at my next lesson >.>

Anyway, this is probably going to bring more confusion to me, but are there any examples of multiple keys at once in more modern music? I remember learning that Stravinsky did that in a few of his pieces.


This may not be what you meant, but the idea of borrowing chords from a parallel key, as well as the use of secondary dominants, are both kind of "multiple keys at once" sort of ideas, although not really.

My knowledge of classical music ends pre-Stavinsky, so I can't talk intelligently about what he did. Certainly there was a movement towards atonal music, but you have to work really hard to make music truly atonal, and it tends not to be very rewarding, so i don't know how much people have ever really done that in pop or rock.
#60
Quote by Xiaoxi
do what


Quote by CarsonStevens

This may or may not be mildly helpful, but one of my favorite/most obvious examples of a song where the band changes key is "Tattooed Women" by Tijuana Sweetheart (formerly Vagiant). Hellion actually screams "key change!" to signal that it's about to occur, and the relationship between the new key and the old key is pretty obvious at that point.


Every time there's a modulation shout out "Key Change!"
Quote by Hail
oh shut up with that /mu/ bullshit. fidget house shouldn't even be a genre, why in the world would it deserve its own subgenres you twat
#61
Quote by Mr.-Bungle
Get a qualified locksmith.

Yep. TS, basically ask the locksmith about pivot chord modulation, direct modulation techniques, and voice leading.
#62
Quote by Sleepy__Head
Every time there's a modulation shout out "Key Change!"

Psh boring.

...modes and scales are still useless.


Quote by PhoenixGRM
Hey guys could you spare a minute to Vote for my band. Go to the site Search our band Listana with CTRL+F for quick and vote Thank you .
Quote by sam b
Voted for Patron Çıldırdı.

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Quote by PhoenixGRM
But our Band is Listana
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