Poll: Leslie's Soda Tax
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View poll results: Leslie's Soda Tax
I'd vote in favor of the tax
52 38%
I'd vote against the tax
70 51%
I'm not sure
16 12%
Voters: 138.
Page 3 of 6
#81
Quote by Epi g-310
I, personally, (were I of voting age) would vote in favor. The shit is not healthy for you. I love soda, but when you think about it, you're paying taxes for people to be obese. They get medication for their obesity-related health issues from government-funded healthcare programs, which are funded by your tax dollars.

Sure, it puts that burden on the poor, as they are the largest soda-drinking demographic, but they could buy, say, water, and maybe be a little bit healthier for it? They aren't going to die of a lack of soda. If it changes what they spend their money on, great, that's wonderful, they'll be healthier, huzzah. If not, at least they're paying a little more money towards their own medication.

Basically, what ChrisBW said. I wrote that stuff and then read his post, and I don't feel like erasing what I wrote. So, there you have it. Again, I'm a minor, so this wouldn't even really affect me, beyond what little soda I do drink. Economically, it just makes sense to me, not to mention the obvious health benefits of consuming less soda.




There are some very very underserved places I volunteer at with kids, and the quality of water is atrocious in these areas. The government should at least get their act together to provide these areas with decent drinking water, or give them water filters to use.
I have a huge fear if rays.
#82
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
The government should NOT be paternalistic

I disagree
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#84
Can I just ask - who actually buys thee XXL sugary drinks? And why?
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#85
Quote by Hydra150
Can I just ask - who actually buys thee XXL sugary drinks? And why?

I buy large sized drinks, because I like the taste of said drinks and I am often especially thirsty, so I can't make a drink last as long as others I know. If I get a glass of water at night, I draw a full, large glass, chug it, then draw another and drink over half of it by the time I go to sleep. So if I go to a drive thru, I would plow through a medium in minutes and want more.
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#86
The only responsibility the government has is to make sure the products are marketed appropriately.

After that it's up to the consumer to decide whether or not they want to get diabetes.
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#87
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
The point is, no one should try to force (meaning make it illegal) or coerce (meaning tax) you into living a healthy lifestyle.

So do you have a problem with the size and budget of the marketing department for the likes of McD's and Coke? If that isn't coercion, then I don't know what is.
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#88
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
Why exactly should the government be promoting the health of society? If it's going to do that, shouldn't it be done in a non-intrusive manner, like running PSAs? Besides, can't people educate society on the benefits of good health? Isn't that much better than taxing pop?


Btw, just take a look at cigarettes/chewing tobacco. A few decades back, the US government decided that smoking and chewing tobacco was unhealthy. (Which it is, and research proves this.) However, people still smoke and still chew. It could be argued that by taxing the hell out of tobacco, more people quit. However, it could also be argued that those people were going to quit anyway. Taxing something for health reasons doesn't magically mean that everyone decides to stop doing it (or, in the case of tobacco, new people don't pick up the habit). All you really do is place a burden upon those who are poor but also wish to enjoy whatever unhealthy behavior is in question.


Lol, it can be argued that those people would quit anyway? PSAs and taxing has caused tobacco consumption to drop at lot. For some reference for the chart:
First surgeon general warning about smoking and health: 1966.
By the 70s, every state had their own taxes in addition to the federal tax.
As you are probably aware, these taxes have continued to increase.

Not directly relevant to the graph, but this is important: Higher taxes on cigarettes have a major impact on the amount of teenagers who take up smoking.



Here's another good graph to think about:




As I've said, I don't think a tax is really the best solution. We would almost certainly be better off without such a tax, as any government intervention in anything has unintended consequences, one of which is what this thread is about! Corn subsidies = cheaper HFCS = cheaper soda and more consumption of soda.
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#89
I buy huge, sugary drinks often. I'm also in fantastic shape
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#90
We subsidize corn crops and then tax corn syrup products. That's smart.
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#91
Quote by Dreadnought
I buy huge, sugary drinks often. I'm also in fantastic shape


Irrelevant.

Quote by StewieSwan
We subsidize corn crops and then tax corn syrup products. That's smart.


It actually is truly brilliant, at least from a politician's standpoint.
#92
Quote by TunerAddict
Irrelevant.


Oh ok Captain SeriousInternetGuy
My God, it's full of stars!
#95
Quote by Dreadnought
I buy huge, sugary drinks often. I'm also in fantastic shape


A friend of mine and myself both drink a decent amount of soda, but are also in amazing physical shape. We go to the gym all the time, but additionally our metabolisms give us a major leg up over other people when it comes to eating crap food.

The problem is most people don't work out or get any exercise at all.
I have a huge fear if rays.
#96
Quote by ChrisBW
A friend of mine and myself both drink a decent amount of soda, but are also in amazing physical shape. We go to the gym all the time, but additionally our metabolisms give us a major leg up over other people when it comes to eating crap food.

The problem is most people don't work out or get any exercise at all.


Let's tax people who don't work out
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#97
Quote by Dreadnought
Let's tax people who don't work out

+1
___

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she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#98
Or we can just allow their insurance premiums to go up.
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#99
Did I say that? I had typed it's another problem that needs to be addressed but I don't know how without involving the government.

But I deleted it. Looks like I should have left that in there.
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#100
Btw, 'PSA' isn't a term I was at all familiar with, Sam, guess it's more of an American dealio.
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#101
Quote by ChrisBW
Lol, it can be argued that those people would quit anyway? PSAs and taxing has caused tobacco consumption to drop at lot. For some reference for the chart:
First surgeon general warning about smoking and health: 1966.
By the 70s, every state had their own taxes in addition to the federal tax.
As you are probably aware, these taxes have continued to increase.

Not directly relevant to the graph, but this is important: Higher taxes on cigarettes have a major impact on the amount of teenagers who take up smoking.

This is all true, but people still smoke. People will continue to smoke. If anything, it's the PSAs and the health facts that have caused a decrease in smoking, not the taxes. Assuming a tax is going to prevent people from being unhealthy is naive.

Oh, and a graph can mean whatever you want it to mean. I'm not saying you're using the graphs to prove your point, but I am saying that the graphs just prove smoking has decreased, not the reasons as to why it decreased. I'm saying taxes are not why.

Quote by Hydra150
Btw, 'PSA' isn't a term I was at all familiar with, Sam, guess it's more of an American dealio.

No worries. They're usually just commercials sponsored and funded by the government, usually to support things like "quit smoking" or "don't do drugs", etc.
Last edited by crazysam23_Atax at Sep 30, 2012,
#102
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
This is all true, but people still smoke. People will continue to smoke. If anything, it's the PSAs and the health facts that have caused a decrease in smoking, not the taxes. Assuming a tax is going to prevent people from being unhealthy is naive.


It's a combination of both factors AND societal factors of what is accepted and not.


Quote by Hydra150
Btw, 'PSA' isn't a term I was at all familiar with, Sam, guess it's more of an American dealio.


I thought Prostate Specific Antigens was pretty good
I have a huge fear if rays.
Last edited by ChrisBW at Sep 30, 2012,
#103
Quote by Dreadnought
Let's tax people who don't work out


We'd be able to if you didn't put your foot in front of our socialist secret-muslim christian-hating baby killing paradise!!!
#105
Quote by Dreadnought
wut. I'm neither Christian nor anti-Islam

how does it feel to be one of the few people in the military that are not christian or vote republican every election?
#106
Quote by ChrisBW
It's a combination of both factors AND societal factors of what is accepted and not.

Yes...and the PSAs and medical research has been an aid in what society views as acceptable. Taxes have merely been a bother to most serious smokers.

Quote by BDR_23
how does it feel to be one of the few people in the military that are not christian or vote republican every election?

Wtf are you smoking, man?...
#107
Quote by Gibson_SG_uzr55
I buy large sized drinks, because I like the taste of said drinks

I love Coke (Diet, actually, but not because I'm watching my weight) and irn-bru, but I can only drink if from cans or bottles - I find that getting it from a tap like in mcdonalds or the cinema gives you a very different tasting drink, it can be more syrupy and goes flat really quickly (making large cups useless for me), so you basically end up with a cup of shitey tasting sugary water.
Not to mention that the size is annoying, and the ones we get are rather flimsy so grasp it too tight and the lid falls off or you spill the stuff, and you can't keep it in the fridge because it's too big and tastes worse the longer you leave it anyway so if you want it cold you need a ton of ice, which just makes it more watery. Bottles are much more practical (and in my experience tastier), as you can seal it and keep it for later without losing the fizz.
Quote by Gibson_SG_uzr55

and I am often especially thirsty

Do you have a medical condition that drains you of so much liquids?
Quote by Gibson_SG_uzr55
So if I go to a drive thru, I would plow through a medium in minutes and want more.
Do you think that you would require so much quenching if you instead had a large cup of water with your food - do you think you'd want to go back and order another cup? I know that if I drink too much of cerain sodas I crave the sweeteners or whatever they put in it, and want to drink it even when my body isn't telling my that I'm thirsty. Water'd be healthier anyway, you don't need that much energy if you're just driving about.

Quote by StewieSwan
We subsidize corn crops and then tax corn syrup products. That's smart.
Yeah, that is really stupid. I think the more important part of that problem is the first bit, though - end the subsidies and the price would go up anyway so I guess a tax wouldn't be necessary. Then again, there's a lot of money in the unhealthy end of the food industry, and money can buy a politician's ear. Lobbying, I mean, not the selling of human organs.

Quote by crazysam23_Atax
Assuming a tax is going to prevent people from being unhealthy is naive.
It will help pay for the consequences though.
I think the price of cigs is a big part in the decision to stop smoking, was for people I've spoken to about it.

Quote by crazysam23_Atax
No worries. They're usually just commercials sponsored and funded by the government, usually to support things like "quit smoking" or "don't do drugs", etc.

Don't

But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
Last edited by Hydra150 at Sep 30, 2012,
#108
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
Yes...and the PSAs and medical research has been an aid in what society views as acceptable. Taxes have merely been a bother to most serious smokers.


How about the idea that medical costs could be cheaper? Do you not consider that viable, and if not, why?
#109
Quote by Mudmen190
How about the idea that medical costs could be cheaper? Do you not consider that viable, and if not, why?

I don't think the government should be paying for healthcare.

However, they do (at partially, in the US). So, frankly, I think that people who continue to smoke or stay obese should not be eligible for government healthcare.
#110
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
Yes...and the PSAs and medical research has been an aid in what society views as acceptable. Taxes have merely been a bother to most serious smokers.


Wtf are you smoking, man?...

a lot of mushrooms
#111
Quote by crazysam23_Atax

However, they do (at partially, in the US). So, frankly, I think that people who continue to smoke or stay obese should not be eligible for government healthcare.

But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#112
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
I don't think the government should be paying for healthcare.

However, they do (at partially, in the US). So, frankly, I think that people who continue to smoke or stay obese should not be eligible for government healthcare.


I didn't really follow the whole healthcare thing that heavily, but wouldn't that fall under the whole "preexisting condition" thing that it was supposed to try and eliminate?
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#113
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
I don't think the government should be paying for healthcare.

However, they do (at partially, in the US). So, frankly, I think that people who continue to smoke or stay obese should not be eligible for government healthcare.

People who skateboard should not be eligible for government healthcare.
People who are poor (poverty seems to be inextricably linked with illness) should not be eligible for government healthcare.
#114
Quote by due 07
People who skateboard should not be eligible for government healthcare.
People who are poor (poverty seems to be inextricably linked with illness) should not be eligible for government healthcare.

That's sort of what I was touching upon, due.

See, if you let the government start dictating what you can do, whether it via taxes or via laws or via eligibility for healthcare, it's a slippery slope.
I know that's not what Mudmen was getting at originally, but ultimately that's why I believe the government should not be paternalistic. It's one of those situations with no potential end.

Quote by necrosis1193
I didn't really follow the whole healthcare thing that heavily, but wouldn't that fall under the whole "preexisting condition" thing that it was supposed to try and eliminate?

Depends. If I start smoking while receiving government healthcare, is it a preexisting condition? No. But if I was already a chronic smoker, then it is.

Although, there's some US laws that prevent Medicaid or Medicare from rejecting people due to preexisting conditions. So, basically, the taxpayers pay for them anyway.
Last edited by crazysam23_Atax at Sep 30, 2012,
#116
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
It's one of those situations with no potential end.

It's pretty simple - if you're broken, they'll fix you.
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#117
Quote by Hydra150
It's pretty simple - if you're broken, they'll fix you.

So...if you're a smoker, they'll make you quit? If you're obese, they'll make you go on a diet and start exercising? If you're ingesting too much sugar, they'll make you balance out your daily diet? If you're a skateboarder, they'll make you stop skateboarding? See where I'm going with this?


Well...shit, welcome to 1984, man. Instead of the thought police, it's the health police though.
Last edited by crazysam23_Atax at Sep 30, 2012,
#118
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
That's sort of what I was touching upon, due.

See, if you let the government start dictating what you can do, whether it via taxes or via laws or via eligibility for healthcare, it's a slippery slope.
I know that's not what Mudmen was getting at originally, but ultimately that's why I believe the government should not be paternalistic. It's one of those situations with no potential end.

Perhaps I read your post wrong, but I thought you were proposing that we let the government dictate lifestyles via eligibility for healthcare.
#119
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
So...if you're a smoker, they'll make you quit? If you're obese, they'll make you go on a diet and start exercising? If you're ingesting too much sugar, they'll make you balance out your daily diet? If you're a skateboarder, they'll make you stop skateboarding? See where I'm going with this?


Well...shit, welcome to 1984, man. Instead of the thought police, it's the health police though.


I'm curious what your opinion is on the corn subsidies. As far as tobacco goes, if people want to smoke then let them smoke. That's fine, I guess. But would you want the government to subsidize tobacco farmers so they could sell their product for less than what it costs to produce (as is the case with corn)?

We should fix one of the major roots of the problem, which is the government subsidization of corn.
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#120
^ wut. how is the problem anything other than people making shitty decisions?
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