Page 3 of 4
#81
Quote by technicolour
Compare the amount of effort and thought gone in to song composition, phrasing, dynamics, flow of the piece, are there ideas being put forward? are these ideas realized? etc.

Peoples' tastes are subjective, certain elements of music are not.


And you have records of how much effort and thought he put into compositions, phrasing, dynamics, flow of the piece and so on?

Without that, I don't know why anyone would take your point seriously at all, or even if you did.
#82
Quote by technicolour
Compare the amount of effort and thought gone in to song composition, phrasing, dynamics, flow of the piece, are there ideas being put forward? are these ideas realized? etc.

Peoples' tastes are subjective, certain elements of music are not.

If do all those things but my piece is still awful then am I talented? Putting hours into painstakingly constructed chords, following fundamental rules of composition. No parallel fifths or octaves, no tritone leaps, correct space between voices. I could put years into a piece that has all the things you listed and people might still hate it. It would still be "bad" music. If you're talking about the rules of music then it isn't subjective. If you're speaking of talent in a world where there are no rules then it's all subjective. There are no rules to Deathcore.

People like you have always existed. Always acting the authority on what is talent or trash. Keep in mind, I pretty much hate this guy's music. This doesn't mean I have any authority over what his music is or isn't.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#83
Died from a motorcycle crash on Halloween night. Condolences for his family and all that, but that's one of the most metal ways to die.
#84
I knew there was going to be some kind of flaming in this thread and it seems I was correct.

For christ's sake guys, this is a thread dedicated to the memory of a man who died.

What you think of the man's music is irrelevant, and this is not the place to be discussing it.

I didn't know who the guy was until earlier today when I heard he died. I don't like his music, but that doesn't matter because I came here to say RIP.
#85
Just came home from an ETID show where they had a moment silence for him.

EDIT: Although, I was quite drunk and did not realise why everybody had went dead silent until it was all over.
Quote by neidnarb11890
the chinese take-out place my family always ordered from gave you chopsticks, so as a kid it was fun to try & eat with chopsticks
now i just use a fork, 'cuz nothing is fun anymore & i just want to shovel food into my mouth to fill the void
Last edited by guitarist41 at Nov 1, 2012,
#86
rip brother

Quote by technicolour
well that's some cop-out bullshit right there. By that argument, someone who argues Bach wasn't talented is just as right as someone who argues he was.

They're talented at making generic deathcore, and if you think that requires an acceptional amount of talent, you crazy.

Again, if you want an example of a real talented vocalist/lyricist in the core subgenre: Jacob Bannon.

Biggest load of bullshit I've read in a while.
#87
i don't see why people had to start shit, i mean if you're gonna be negative you could at least be half-respectable about it instead of acting like an asshole.

that being said, RIP, decent vocalist. didn't really dig their music too much aside from their newest album, but the guy's screams and how he layered them made them stand out to me.
#88
Quote by ProgFripp74
Bit of respect bro please?

The guy was talented for the genre, I've not listened to the band for like 4 years but he had some pipes. I'm no fan but no one deserves to die, so a bit of respect for the deceased yeah?



He's dead. He doesn't care.
Check out my band Disturbed
#89
Quote by Pagan_Poetry
Not a fan of the band, but that's a shitty way to go.

Also that final tweet is... really eerie.

RIP

**** man.

281-330-8004, that's my cell phone number, hit me up on the low
#90
Quote by willT08
And you have records of how much effort and thought he put into compositions, phrasing, dynamics, flow of the piece and so on?

.


I'd imagine, in general it takes longer, and more thought goes in to composing classical music than any derivative of rock. Just think about how long the pieces are, the amount of instruments, the various harmonies and melodies, etc.

Why do you think the music is still appreciated and known by those familiar with music?

Quote by BladeSlinger
If do all those things but my piece is still awful then am I talented? Putting hours into painstakingly constructed chords, following fundamental rules of composition. No parallel fifths or octaves, no tritone leaps, correct space between voices. I could put years into a piece that has all the things you listed and people might still hate it. It would still be "bad" music. If you're talking about the rules of music then it isn't subjective. If you're speaking of talent in a world where there are no rules then it's all subjective. There are no rules to Deathcore.
.


There are rules to deathcore: over emphasis on breakdowns, sterile production, complete lack of what defined the genre of death metal.

I should've said as a general rule the more time and therefore effort and thought that goes into a piece the better chance it has of being well put together, but of course there's exceptions.

Besides, these guys (SS) even say in interviews that they play this kind of music because it's fun and an excuse to hang out. Sure people are allowed to do that, but don't compare them to people who are actually passionate about music in itself.

Quote by Portuguese_boy
rip brother


Biggest load of bullshit I've read in a while.


Which part? and present an argument if you disagree.
Sounds like a knee jerk reaction of a fan boy.
Last edited by technicolour at Nov 1, 2012,
#91
Quote by technicolour
I'd imagine, in general it takes longer, and more thought goes in to composing classical music than any derivative of rock. Just think about how long the pieces are, the amount of instruments, the various harmonies and melodies, etc.

Why do you think the music is still appreciated and known by those familiar with music?


There are rules to deathcore: over emphasis on breakdowns, sterile production, complete lack of what defined the genre of death metal.

I should've said as a general rule the more time and therefore effort and thought that goes into a piece the better chance it has of being well put together, but of course there's exceptions.

Besides, these guys (SS) even say in interviews that they play this kind of music because it's fun and an excuse to hang out. Sure people are allowed to do that, but don't compare them to people who are actually passionate about music in itself.

You're not even trying to debate this. I've been through my two harmony classes for my music minor. That's next to nothing compared to a music major but I've been educated enough and done enough harmonic analysis to know that most music is exactly the same. It made me appreciate the older composers much more than I had, which was a lot, but it also made me see that any attempt to define "talent" is bullshit.

Most music we consider "talented" is bland as shit musically and is made of the stuff that's been rehashed for centuries. Don't be so pretentious. I don't even like this band and I couldn't stand it.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#92
Quote by technicolour

Which part? and present an argument if you disagree.
Sounds like a knee jerk reaction of a fan boy.


Not a fan boy at all, hate their music with a passion actually. Like the other guy said, who the **** are you to measure someone's talent?
#93
I don't care for a debate like this, that is, if it's in the band thread or in a thread that it'd fit. A thread about the death of a band member, however, is not that kind of thread.
#94
The fact is there is an objective difference between music and noise (that's science, ask a physicist) and deathcore objectively isn't music.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#95
Quote by Morphogenesis26
I don't care for a debate like this, that is, if it's in the band thread or in a thread that it'd fit. A thread about the death of a band member, however, is not that kind of thread.

It was that until had to start being cunts about it.
Quote by Fat Lard
Why would you spend tens of thousands of dollars to learn about a language you already speak? It was over before it even started dude

Quote by captainsnazz
brot pls
#96
what's wrong with making music for fun? or making music with the intention for people to have fun? sometimes I want to listen to something predictable, it entertains me in a different way "serious" music does.
#97
Quote by Morphogenesis26
I don't care for a debate like this, that is, if it's in the band thread or in a thread that it'd fit. A thread about the death of a band member, however, is not that kind of thread.




yeah right, there's just too few people in that thread to piss off. why not here?
#98
i liked some of their music . no time to bleed was a really good metal album. other then that im kinda sad

A painter paints pictures on canvas. But musicians paint their pictures on silence
#99
Quote by BladeSlinger

Most music we consider "talented" is bland as shit musically and is made of the stuff that's been rehashed for centuries. Don't be so pretentious. I don't even like this band and I couldn't stand it.


examples?
#100
Have to say I'd never heard any of his music, but it's always incredibly sad when a fellow musician dies. RIP
Fender Lite Ash --> TC Polytune --> Digitech Whammy V --> MXR Phase 90 --> EHX Small Clone --> Strymon Orbit --> TC Flashback X4 --> Rivera R55
#101
Quote by technicolour
I'd imagine, in general it takes longer, and more thought goes in to composing classical music than any derivative of rock. Just think about how long the pieces are, the amount of instruments, the various harmonies and melodies, etc.

Why do you think the music is still appreciated and known by those familiar with music?

Oh you imagine do you? Oh well, please, I concede to you eternally...

I wrote, recorded and mixed a classical piece in 2 hours the other week for a film. It's not some impenetrable thing that only the top tier of human minds can do.

Also, you're saying "the amount of instruments" as if every classical piece is performed by a whole orchestra. String quartets apparently have not made much of an appearance to you which seems odd because you seem so well versed in Classical music.

Also, turns out harmony and melody turn up in 99% of music you can name. If you honestly think harmony and melody are exclusive to Classical music you're delusional.
#102
Quote by willT08
Oh you imagine do you? Oh well, please, I concede to you eternally...

I wrote, recorded and mixed a classical piece in 2 hours the other week for a film. It's not some impenetrable thing that only the top tier of human minds can do.

Also, you're saying "the amount of instruments" as if every classical piece is performed by a whole orchestra. String quartets apparently have not made much of an appearance to you which seems odd because you seem so well versed in Classical music.

Also, turns out harmony and melody turn up in 99% of music you can name. If you honestly think harmony and melody are exclusive to Classical music you're delusional.


Never said you couldn't write a classical piece in a short amount of time. I'm sure Beethoven's 7th however, wasn't.

Never said I was well versed in classical, but it doesn't take much to realize it's superiority to contemporary rock. I actually don't even listen to classical that much, but I respect it. Writing music for a string quartet is probably more difficult than each individual member of say a 4 piece band writing their own part. And even if only one person in that band wrote parts for each instrument, they don't necessarily have to know treble and bass cleff, or much theory at all for that matter. Just get the bass to play the guitar chord root notes, etc.

I can't believe how much you assumed on that last point. I realize melodies and harmonies exist in basically all forms of music. My point was that the melodies and harmonies that exist in classical are more complex in their phrasings.
#103
Quote by technicolour
Never said you couldn't write a classical piece in a short amount of time. I'm sure Beethoven's 7th however, wasn't.

Who compared Suicide Silence to Beethoven?

Anyone can do this, it's cheap.

Never said I was well versed in classical, but it doesn't take much to realize it's superiority to contemporary rock. I actually don't even listen to classical that much, but I respect it. Writing music for a string quartet is probably more difficult than each individual member of say a 4 piece band writing their own part. And even if only one person in that band wrote parts for each instrument, they don't necessarily have to know treble and bass cleff, or much theory at all for that matter. Just get the bass to play the guitar chord root notes, etc.

I wrote my piece without any knowledge of music theory whatsoever and wrote for strings, brass and woodwind. You seem to want to put classical on some pedestal but you're not really sure why you do.

I can't believe how much you assumed on that last point. I realize melodies and harmonies exist in basically all forms of music. My point was that the melodies and harmonies that exist in classical are more complex in their phrasings.

Are they?...

Because Twinkle Twinkle Little Star is the peak of complex melodic phrasing
#104
Quote by willT08
Who compared Suicide Silence to Beethoven?

Anyone can do this, it's cheap.


I wrote my piece without any knowledge of music theory whatsoever and wrote for strings, brass and woodwind. You seem to want to put classical on some pedestal but you're not really sure why you do.


Are they?...

Because Twinkle Twinkle Little Star is the peak of complex melodic phrasing


The point of comparing the two is to show a distinct difference. There's going to be a gradient, so it's easier to take bands that are closer to opposite ends of the spectrum.

How did you write it, on guitar pro or some similar program? Did you just pick notes that sounded pleasing together or..? I put classical on a pedestal because he represents the height of music creativity. Many others who have more experience with music and culture than I do agree.

Funny guy.
#105
Quote by technicolour
The point of comparing the two is to show a distinct difference. There's going to be a gradient, so it's easier to take bands that are closer to opposite ends of the spectrum.

No, you made a very cheap point by taking an absolute legend like Beethoven and going "See! They're not as good as him so all bands like them suck".

How did you write it, on guitar pro or some similar program? Did you just pick notes that sounded pleasing together or..? I put classical on a pedestal because he represents the height of music creativity. Many others who have more experience with music and culture than I do agree.
Funny guy.

On a Piano, and then I wrote it all out as MIDI in my DAW and whipped out my sample libraries. And it was for a horror film so pleasing wasn't my intention

I don't agree at all that it's the height of musical creativity, and I have more experience with music and culture than you. Classical music as you seem to be thinking about it is fundamentally limited by the number of timbres available to composers. How anything other than Electronic music can be the height of musical creativity is beyond me.
#106
R.I.P Mitch. He left behind a wife and daughter too.....


"You're not hardcore unless you live hardcore"
#107
Quote by willT08
No, you made a very cheap point by taking an absolute legend like Beethoven and going "See! They're not as good as him so all bands like them suck".


On a Piano, and then I wrote it all out as MIDI in my DAW and whipped out my sample libraries. And it was for a horror film so pleasing wasn't my intention

I don't agree at all that it's the height of musical creativity, and I have more experience with music and culture than you. Classical music as you seem to be thinking about it is fundamentally limited by the number of timbres available to composers. How anything other than Electronic music can be the height of musical creativity is beyond me.


Well that's my standard. I can make an even further stretch by comparing a classical composer to say..Kesha.

I think electronic music is an interesting phenomenon. It certainly has more potential than deathcore, or most rock based sub genres. I have a friend who listens to a lot, but I don't venture into it often.
#108
Kid on Facebook wrote "RIP Mitch Luker"

At first I was like "Isn't that that guy from Suicide Silence?"

Then I was like "No, wait, it's Lucker."


Then I saw this thread.
This ends now, eat the goddamn beans!
#110
All the kids at my school are freaking out. I didn't like his music at all, and that's been getting me crucified.
Plus, no one here was fazed by Dimebag dying, but now everyone is freaking over Mitch. The **** man.
#111
Quote by DevKyleBASS
All the kids at my school are freaking out. I didn't like his music at all, and that's been getting me crucified.
Plus, no one here was fazed by Dimebag dying, but now everyone is freaking over Mitch. The **** man.


It's begun.
#112
Quote by DevKyleBASS
All the kids at my school are freaking out. I didn't like his music at all, and that's been getting me crucified.
Plus, no one here was fazed by Dimebag dying, but now everyone is freaking over Mitch. The **** man.

Pantera was even worse than these guys tho.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#113
technicolour's argument: They aren't as good as Bach, therefore they're untalented.

By that logic pretty much everyone is completely untalented.

Don't be a pretentious **** - trolling isn't amusing, or even mildly interesting. As far as I can tell all the people who've been defending Suicide Silence haven't even been fans of the band (I'm not, Bladesinger isn't and I don't know about WillT08). The point is simply that anti-fanboyism is just a pathetic as the fanboyism your trying to claim you're doing. If you think the band suck then fine, leave and think they suck somewhere else - don't wander into a thread about the lead singer dying and rail about they're awful. Unless you're also going to visit the funeral and do much the same outside the gates then all your doing is being petty and pathetic, and cowardly. So kindly leave?
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#114
Don't ride motorcycles. Seriously.
*-)
Quote by Bob_Sacamano
i kinda wish we all had a penis and vagina instead of buttholes

i mean no offense to buttholes and poop or anything

Rest in Peace, Troy Davis and Trayvon Martin and Jordan Davis and Eric Garner and Mike Brown
#115
Quote by element4433
Don't ride motorcycles. Seriously.

For real.

I had a friend get killed by a driver whilst he was riding his motorbike only a month or so ago.
#116
Quote by willT08
For real.

I had a friend get killed by a driver whilst he was riding his motorbike only a month or so ago.
I'm constantly hearing about people dying in motorcycle accidents. I've ridden one once or twice. It's fun, but not worth dying.
*-)
Quote by Bob_Sacamano
i kinda wish we all had a penis and vagina instead of buttholes

i mean no offense to buttholes and poop or anything

Rest in Peace, Troy Davis and Trayvon Martin and Jordan Davis and Eric Garner and Mike Brown
#117
Quote by DevKyleBASS
Plus, no one here was fazed by Dimebag dying, but now everyone is freaking over Mitch. The **** man.

whos dimebag
Quote by Pleasure2kill
The truth is, Muslims never apologized for their faith having something to do with the attacks on 9/11.
#118
Quote by willT08
For real.

I had a friend get killed by a driver whilst he was riding his motorbike only a month or so ago.

One of my friends did last summer. It sucks

Quote by Todd Hart
technicolour's argument: They aren't as good as Bach, therefore they're untalented.

By that logic pretty much everyone is completely untalented.

Don't be a pretentious **** - trolling isn't amusing, or even mildly interesting. As far as I can tell all the people who've been defending Suicide Silence haven't even been fans of the band (I'm not, Bladesinger isn't and I don't know about WillT08). The point is simply that anti-fanboyism is just a pathetic as the fanboyism your trying to claim you're doing. If you think the band suck then fine, leave and think they suck somewhere else - don't wander into a thread about the lead singer dying and rail about they're awful. Unless you're also going to visit the funeral and do much the same outside the gates then all your doing is being petty and pathetic, and cowardly. So kindly leave?

+ everything
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
Last edited by WCPhils at Nov 2, 2012,
#119
Guys...
Just... Let me point it out there.
Every time there is a thread like this, or one of any sort of controversy, including one where a UG member's relative was murdered, technicolour has been causing fights.
Just... His avatar is an insect for a reason. If you don't move or react, it will go away, but if you seem to be bothered by it, it will attack.
If his intentions weren't clear enough by now, I hope I've made them so.


Quote by DevKyleBASS
All the kids at my school are freaking out. I didn't like his music at all, and that's been getting me crucified.
Plus, no one here was fazed by Dimebag dying, but now everyone is freaking over Mitch. The **** man.


Who are you again?
#120
Quote by Pagan_Poetry
Guys...
Just... Let me point it out there.
Every time there is a thread like this, or one of any sort of controversy, including one where a UG member's relative was murdered, technicolour has been causing fights.
Just... His avatar is an insect for a reason. If you don't move or react, it will go away, but if you seem to be bothered by it, it will attack.
If his intentions weren't clear enough by now, I hope I've made them so.

Shit, you're right.
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...