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#161
Quote by ErikLensherr
What didn't happen? We're out of recession and steadily adding jobs every month and the unemployment rate's under 8%.


Meanwhile, people have stopped trying to find work (hence the drop in unemployment), hiring is still sputtering, the national debt is humungous, more people than ever before are on welfare and and food stamps, we import way more than we export, the stock market just dropped off to a new, record post-election low because of near unanimous lack of confidence in the economy, and we're potentially facing another recession in a few short months if we fall over the ever-looming fiscal cliff.

Looking good!
Quote by Overlord
It's not hard to be nice, but it's nice to be hard
#162
Quote by WCPhils

I already mentioned this in one of the other threads last night, but it was ignored, probably because it was right before Obama's speech.
#163
Quote by Carnivean
Meanwhile, people have stopped trying to find work (hence the drop in unemployment), hiring is still sputtering, the national debt is humungous, more people than ever before are on welfare and and food stamps, we import way more than we export, the stock market just dropped off to a new, record post-election low because of near unanimous lack of confidence in the economy, and we're potentially facing another recession in a few short months if we fall over the ever-looming fiscal cliff.

Looking good!


People have started looking for work, hence the small rise in unemployment last month. But we also added something like 170,000 jobs. The debt is bad, but no one was ever going to fix that in one term, or two or three even. The priority is digging us out of recession first which we've done. The stock market was at a 5 year high a few weeks ago and there are too many factors involved to blame any single day drop solely on the election. Basically, a bunch of petty stuff that doesn't mean anything. We're on a good track long-term.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#164
Quote by ErikLensherr
People have started looking for work, hence the small rise in unemployment last month. But we also added something like 170,000 jobs. The debt is bad, but no one was ever going to fix that in one term, or two or three even. The priority is digging us out of recession first which we've done. The stock market was at a 5 year high a few weeks ago and there are too many factors involved to blame any single day drop solely on the election. Basically, a bunch of petty stuff that doesn't mean anything. We're on a good track long-term.


We're on a shaky and bleak track long-term, which is why the stock market has suddenly plummeted. And the debt was WORSENED by Obama, so now, yes, it'll probably take a century to fix after what has transpired in the last 4 years. Also, the jobs gains this month and last month can be described as moderate at best, and it coincides with a continuing collapse in the labor force participation rate. This is all underlined by a pathetic 1.5% overall growth of the economy.
Quote by Overlord
It's not hard to be nice, but it's nice to be hard
#165
Quote by Carnivean
We're on a shaky and bleak track long-term, which is why the stock market has suddenly plummeted. And the debt was WORSENED by Obama, so now, yes, it'll probably take a century to fix after what has transpired in the last 4 years. Also, the jobs gains this month and last month can be described as moderate at best, and it coincides with a continuing collapse in the labor force participation rate. This is all underlined by a pathetic 1.5% overall growth of the economy.

I just told you the labor force participation rate went up last month (that's not speculation or opinion, that's fact) and you just repeat that it's collapsing, lol. Our jobs gains are modest but trending upwards. A few months ago we added 90,000 now it's nearly double. It's going to keep growing, virtually every mainstream economist thinks so. The one thing that might derail that is the negotiations surrounding the fiscal cliff, but if that happens I'm placing blame squarely on the recalcitrant Republican House who played the same childish games with raising the debt limit, not the President.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#167
Quote by ErikLensherr
I just told you the labor force participation rate went up last month (that's not speculation or opinion, that's fact) and you just repeat that it's collapsing, lol. Our jobs gains are modest but trending upwards. A few months ago we added 90,000 now it's nearly double. It's going to keep growing, virtually every mainstream economist thinks so. The one thing that might derail that is the negotiations surrounding the fiscal cliff, but if that happens I'm placing blame squarely on the recalcitrant Republican House who played the same childish games with raising the debt limit, not the President.


Yay, the LFP rate is back up to where it was in January of 2012!!... which was lower than it was in January of 2011, which was lower than it was in January of 2010, which was lower than it was in January of 2009. You wanna talk long-term? Okay, then. Over the long-term, it has collapsed. And predictions on job growth are one thing, results are another, as evident by the last 4 years' results.
Quote by Overlord
It's not hard to be nice, but it's nice to be hard
#168
Quote by Carnivean
Yay, the LFP rate is back up to where it was in January of 2012!!... which was lower than it was in January of 2011, which was lower than it was in January of 2010, which was lower than it was in January of 2009. You wanna talk long-term? Okay, then. Over the long-term, it has collapsed.

We haven't fully recovered from the recession yet, well spotted.

But the trajectory has reversed. It's going up now, the economy is improving now. In the long term, over the next 3-4 years we will work our way back to normal.

If you don't believe me, fine, just wait and see.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#169
Quote by ErikLensherr
We haven't fully recovered from the recession yet, well spotted.

But the trajectory has reversed. It's going up now, the economy is improving now. In the long term, over the next 3-4 years we will work our way back to normal.

If you don't believe me, fine, just wait and see.


I hope you're right, otherwise Sir Obama will go down as one of the most disappointing presidents in American history.
Quote by Overlord
It's not hard to be nice, but it's nice to be hard
#170
i'm setting a notification on iCalendar to remind you of that prediction 4 years from now, Erik.
#171
Ha, even if I'm wrong I'll probably have quit UG by then.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#172
Quote by ErikLensherr
Ha, even if I'm wrong I'll probably have quit UG by then.


Unlikely. Just like your predictions. BAAAZZZIINNNNGGGGG
Quote by Overlord
It's not hard to be nice, but it's nice to be hard
#173
Quote by Ninja#117
Have you not seen the fact that despite Bush and Obama being supposed total opposites that he has continued right in his footsteps and continued or signed into law many of the policies that Bush started.

Or that since the 70s all this has been recurring topics that no one has fixed? Im not even that old and i can see through the BS. We've have been getting worse and worse regardless of president. Its a huge sham. A facade. A giant mess that can only be fixed by tearing it down and restarting fresh.

Romney wasnt going to fix shit. He was going to do what was best for Romney and do what those who supported and funded him want. He wa going to be a good little figure head and goat when the time came which is all they need or want.

Kinda like Obama

And Bush

and Clinton

and Other Bush

and Reagan

And on and on and on.


I can see how one could think this way, and I'll agree that the president himself is, for the most part, just a puppet, but Reagan does not belong on that list at all. Reagan was the man. We need another Reagan.

EDIT: To add, yes a complete tear-down and restart is needed. Get rid of partys. Have your candidates, state what you are for and against, behead all lobbyists, put congressmen on social security retirement and have a flat tax rate. Something so simple is so far out of reach.

Last edited by FenderBender72 at Nov 7, 2012,
#174
Quote by ErikLensherr
We haven't fully recovered from the recession yet, well spotted.

But the trajectory has reversed. It's going up now, the economy is improving now. In the long term, over the next 3-4 years we will work our way back to normal.

If you don't believe me, fine, just wait and see.



I really hope you right. I dont like either candidate, I think if the republicans had a better candidate they would have won flat out, most people voted based on the lesser evil, which is a horrible way to vote, but sometimes must be done. I think obama has done some very good things, he has kept the economy afoat, but the whole bengazi attack and operation fast and furious left a bad taste in my mouth, plus he's kept some of bush's policies like the Patriot Act etc..

I thought obama would win as most people on here did, some guy on the bodybuilding.com forums bet his entire savings of 80k on obama, wish i did the same now haha.
#175
Quote by Carnivean
I hope you're right, otherwise Sir Obama will go down as one of the most disappointing presidents in American history.

"Why should we subsidise intellectual curiosity?"
-Ronald Reagan

"Knowledge is in every country the surest basis of public happiness."
-George Washington
#176
^Yeah that guy was a fukhead
Quote by Overlord
It's not hard to be nice, but it's nice to be hard
#177
Quote by Duce180
most people voted based on the lesser evil


No, most people voted according to which party they belonged, as they do every election.
#178
Quote by ErikLensherr
We haven't fully recovered from the recession yet, well spotted.

But the trajectory has reversed. It's going up now, the economy is improving now. In the long term, over the next 3-4 years we will work our way back to normal.

If you don't believe me, fine, just wait and see.


P.S. don't hold your breath people...

#179
Quote by FenderBender72
P.S. don't hold your breath people...


Coming from someone who thinks Ronald Reagan was "the man," I think I'll pass.
#180
Quote by TunerAddict
No, most people voted according to which party they belonged, as they do every election.

Do think people vote more according to issues or according to personality and what party they think they belong to?
Edit: ^ - I'm personally rather fond of Reagan. The only president I cant think of after 45 that cut spending (well, non-defense).
Last edited by Tastytaco at Nov 7, 2012,
#181
Quote by Tastytaco
Do think people vote more according to issues or according to personality and what party they think they belong to?
Edit: ^ - I'm personally rather fond of Reagan. The only president I cant think of after 45 that cut spending (well, non-defense).

The latter.
#182
Quote by TunerAddict
No, most people voted according to which party they belonged, as they do every election.



Yeah your right, the majority votes that way, but alot of people this election have voted on the "lesser evil", I heard it a lot this election. Poor people see romney as mr. burns from the simpsons.
#183
Quote by Tastytaco
Do think people vote more according to issues or according to personality and what party they think they belong to?
Edit: ^ - I'm personally rather fond of Reagan. The only president I cant think of after 45 that cut spending (well, non-defense).


Reserach has shown that partisanship is the number one factor in voting patterns. People will vote for those in their party at around an 80% clip.
#184
Quote by Duce180
Yeah your right, the majority votes that way, but alot of people this election have voted on the "lesser evil", I heard it a lot this election. Poor people see romney as mr. burns from the simpsons.


People mention that "lesser evil" shit all the time. I don't buy it as it actually justifying their voting habits, I think it is more of a way that they're saying they aren't satisfied with the candidates, so they're going to vote their party's candidate because he is better then someone from outside of their party.
#185
Quote by TunerAddict
Coming from someone who thinks Ronald Reagan was "the man," I think I'll pass.


So you ARE going to hold your breath? Hows the kool-aid taste?

#186
Quote by FenderBender72
So you ARE going to hold your breath? Hows the kool-aid taste?


What koolaid? Are you trying to insinuate that because I'm black I drink koolaid?

I don't understand what you're getting at.
#187
Quote by TunerAddict
What koolaid? Are you trying to insinuate that because I'm black I drink koolaid?

I don't understand what you're getting at.


koolaid refering to full on cult status obama-followers have attained. And why would you think it foolish to support Reagan? And why did you edit your post later to add in the "black" remark? atta way to bring race into this

#188
Quote by Tastytaco
Do think people vote more according to issues or according to personality and what party they think they belong to?
Edit: ^ - I'm personally rather fond of Reagan. The only president I cant think of after 45 that cut spending (well, non-defense).

Clinton. Clinton also managed to not increase the deficit.

Also, Reagan had the whole "drug war" thing, and the whole Contras thing. Probably should have took less advice from his astrologer.
"Why should we subsidise intellectual curiosity?"
-Ronald Reagan

"Knowledge is in every country the surest basis of public happiness."
-George Washington
#189
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#190
Quote by FenderBender72
koolaid refering to full on cult status obama-followers have attained. And why would you think it foolish to support Reagan? And why did you edit your post later to add in the "black" remark? atta way to bring race into this


1) I do not vote nor do I support any political party. I am an outside observer. I like to watch and see what happens, and the analyze the results. Also like to make predictions. Your entire electoral/political process is a source of entertainment for me.

2) Did not say it was foolish to support Regan, just that labeling him as "the man" was foolish, being that he was not some great president. His economic policies proved to be nothing of great importance in the short run and damaging in the long run, while scandals like the Iran-Contra Affair were disastrous. People try to build him up as some great president when he was incredibly average.

3) Because it was funny.
#191
Quote by Tastytaco
Do think people vote more according to issues or according to personality and what party they think they belong to?
Edit: ^ - I'm personally rather fond of Reagan. The only president I cant think of after 45 that cut spending (well, non-defense).

i think it goes Party, Personality and then Policies in that order.
#192
Funny butthurt stories?

Kid (huge twat, I despise him) came in my class extremely angry screaming about how Obama is "THE WORST" person who could possibly be in office and that "if an election is close they should incorporate policies of the runner-up."

****ing wat.
#194
Quote by Eastwinn
nah, TunerAddict. "average" is too good for him. he was crap.


Agreed, but I felt like being generous to the guy since he so clearly idolizes the man.
#195
Quote by Ur all $h1t
Clinton. Clinton also managed to not increase the deficit.

Also, Reagan had the whole "drug war" thing, and the whole Contras thing. Probably should have took less advice from his astrologer.

In terms of domestic policy, Reagan cut spending and bureaucracy and slowed monetary growth to bring down inflation. Back in the early 80s, the problem wasn't unemployment or debt (well to the extend we have today), but inflation, which ran in the double digits in the previous decade.
Clinton followed some spending cuts that Reagan implemented but also implemented other things that I'm not fond of.
Anyways, I don't really want to get in a argument over Reagan, Clinton or whoever.
#196
Quote by Bob_Sacamano
"if an election is close they should incorporate policies of the runner-up."

****ing wat.

Heh, people are such hypocrites.
Although if you guys did have a decent sized third party and nobody got enough votes, you might have to do something like what the UK did when forming a coalition at our last election's hung parliament. Imagine that, they might actually have to cooperate.
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#197
Romney was a liar and a fraud, and so is Obama.
And voting third-party is a waste of time.
Anarchy ftw.
That being said, Election Night was a great excuse for a party, so there was that.
Over all though, it was just a tremendous waste of time, energy, and resources.
#198
^Did you vote?
But boys will be boys and girls have those eyes
that'll cut you to ribbons, sometimes
and all you can do is just wait by the moon
and bleed if it's what she says you ought to do
#199
Quote by Le Fantome
Romney was a liar and a fraud, and so is Obama.
And voting third-party is a waste of time.
Anarchy ftw.
That being said, Election Night was a great excuse for a party, so there was that.
Over all though, it was just a tremendous waste of time, energy, and resources.


You were about right until you mentioned anarchy as a legitimate alternative.
#200
Quote by Tastytaco
In terms of domestic policy, Reagan cut spending and bureaucracy and slowed monetary growth to bring down inflation. Back in the early 80s, the problem wasn't unemployment or debt (well to the extend we have today), but inflation, which ran in the double digits in the previous decade.
Clinton followed some spending cuts that Reagan implemented but also implemented other things that I'm not fond of.
Anyways, I don't really want to get in a argument over Reagan, Clinton or whoever.

Reagan instituted spending cuts, but increased the deficit. Pointing out that his spending cuts were great, when they didn't do anything other than cause harm to those who depended on them misses the point.

Also, if the best people can do for Reagan is credit him with presiding over the business cycle (slowdown of economic growth leads to deflation), that's not the mark of a good president. A trained monkey could reduce inflation during a recession (the trick is to not do anything).
"Why should we subsidise intellectual curiosity?"
-Ronald Reagan

"Knowledge is in every country the surest basis of public happiness."
-George Washington