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T00DEEPBLUE
Boba FRETT
Join date: Oct 2010
2,247 IQ
#122
Quote by due 07
I've been hella interested in like spirituality lately. I'm too skeptical and guarded to be spiritual, but maybe one day. ;~;

It depends on what spirituality you're looking into.
Regarding the furry fandom from the man himself:
Quote by Axelfox
Please understand how little we as a community care
willT08
Banned
Join date: Jul 2009
2,923 IQ
#123
Quote by due 07
I've been hella interested in like spirituality lately. I'm too skeptical and guarded to be spiritual, but maybe one day. ;~;

It's not like, something you should do on a whim because you think it'll be good

I suspect *raises hands* aliens.

Why?

Its better than assuming some magical being from no where added this higher consciousness while we were apes. Plus, mushrooms help explain a lot of religions and such.

Assuming it was mushrooms doesn't sound a whole lot more logical to me. Why would you think mushrooms have a consciousness-giving property?
Ssargentslayer
Registered Abuser
Join date: Sep 2007
782 IQ
#124
Quote by willT08
It's not like, something you should do on a whim because you think it'll be good


Why?


Assuming it was mushrooms doesn't sound a whole lot more logical to me. Why would you think mushrooms have a consciousness-giving property?

Its called the stoned ape theory, don't argue with me about the validity of it, its just more logical than humans being giving consciousness.
crazysam23_Atax
Feuergesicht
Join date: Oct 2009
5,710 IQ
#125
Quote by Ssargentslayer
Its called the stoned ape theory, don't argue with me about the validity of it, its just more logical than humans being giving consciousness.

I'm fairly certain that no one in the scientific world takes theories like this seriously.
Todd Hart
Do Sadists go to Hell?
Join date: Sep 2009
153 IQ
#126
What is with the assumption that consciousness is somehow alien to nature? We know that there are many other species that are almost certainly conscious - higher mammals like elephants and dolphins, and even dogs and cats; and many species of Corvid and Psittacine display all the traits of being a conscious creature. This fact within itself utterly disproves any theory of mushrooms playing a roll, and given the speciesism is most religions would seem to imply that a 'divine' origin is incredibly unlikely. Consciousness is just the way that complex neural systems manifest.
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
willT08
Banned
Join date: Jul 2009
2,923 IQ
#127
Quote by Todd Hart
Consciousness is just the way that complex neural systems manifest.

This
Arby911
Finding the Pattern
Join date: Jul 2010
832 IQ
#129
Quote by Todd Hart
What is with the assumption that consciousness is somehow alien to nature? We know that there are many other species that are almost certainly conscious - higher mammals like elephants and dolphins, and even dogs and cats; and many species of Corvid and Psittacine display all the traits of being a conscious creature. This fact within itself utterly disproves any theory of mushrooms playing a roll, and given the speciesism is most religions would seem to imply that a 'divine' origin is incredibly unlikely. Consciousness is just the way that complex neural systems manifest.


Is it your contention then that a sufficiently complex man-made 'neural' system must/will (?) achieve consciousness?
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
Todd Hart
Do Sadists go to Hell?
Join date: Sep 2009
153 IQ
#130
Quote by Arby911
Is it your contention then that a sufficiently complex man-made 'neural' system must/will (?) achieve consciousness?


I don't know that complex neurology always produces consciousness, but it does appear to do so (if we assume that Corvids and high mammals are conscious*) so it wouldn't surprise me. However, I don't think it's anything we'll see soon - our computer technology is inferior to biological neurology by a massive degree.

*It's hard to define consciousness, but I think if we can assume that other human are conscious then we can assume that intelligent animals are as well. Of course that's a big leap, there's no real way that I can prove that the rest of you are conscious, but I dislike solipsism and hubris so I'm forced to assume that other people are.
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
Arby911
Finding the Pattern
Join date: Jul 2010
832 IQ
#131
Quote by Todd Hart
I don't know that complex neurology always produces consciousness, but it does appear to do so (if we assume that Corvids and high mammals are conscious*) so it wouldn't surprise me. However, I don't think it's anything we'll see soon - our computer technology is inferior to biological neurology by a massive degree.

*It's hard to define consciousness, but I think if we can assume that other human are conscious then we can assume that intelligent animals are as well. Of course that's a big leap, there's no real way that I can prove that the rest of you are conscious, but I dislike solipsism and hubris so I'm forced to assume that other people are.


Thanks, and of course I agree that we haven't even approached the requisite level of complexity yet.

I don't know enough about it to venture an opinion, but it wouldn't surprise me either way.

* I'm happy to extend to you the same courtesy...
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
Ssargentslayer
Registered Abuser
Join date: Sep 2007
782 IQ
#132
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
I'm fairly certain that no one in the scientific world takes theories like this seriously.

And surprisingly we take religion seriously
bradulator
normcore
Join date: Jul 2007
2,452 IQ
#133
Quote by triglide5
Tried the spirituality thing way back in the early teens. Went to church many times to see if I "felt" anything. The only thing I ever felt while in church was a strong desire to get the f#ck outta there!

I always kinda liked church. Even after I kinda stopped believing all of it I went with my family once and it just made me feel good, everybody being all happy and optimistic in the attainment of the same goal. It's a nice feeling of belonging so it's totes understandable why somebody would dig that sorta thing.
TheChaz
Other Barry
Join date: Jun 2008
543 IQ
#134
You and me baby ain't nothing but mammals, so let's do it like they do on the discovery channel.

Not crazysam specifically, just you know... generally.
SlackerBabbath
Est. 1966.
Join date: Apr 2007
264 IQ
#136
I think it's important to consider that we don't actualy need a concept of 'gods' in order for 'religion' to exist. In some religions, such as several sects of Buddhism, gods are really not considered as important and some sects of Buddhism can actualy be considered as atheistic. Gautama Buddha himself did not endorse belief in a creator deity, refused to express any views on creation and stated that questions on the origin of the world are worthless.

Religious thinking probably started out as a simple prehistoric view or hope that our conciousness somehow continues after death, which could have happened anytime after our ancestral species became intelligent enough to be aware of their own impending deaths (think of it as a coping strategy)... while the concept of gods, eventualy leading to the development of the concept of a monotheistic 'God' in the Middle East (which later spread to eventualy become an almost global concept via the Roman Empire and several empires that followed) seems to be something that started as a by-product of religious thinking. There's evidence to suggest that the earliest gods were probably leaders that were worshipped in life and continued to be worshipped after death, as if they still existed in some supernatural way and were still watching over their descendants. Over many generations, different civilisations of people started to consider their ancestral gods as patron deities that influenced their lives in some way.

We can actualy think of the development of the concept of God almost in terms of an arms race.
When two civilisations went to war, the victor was often considered as the civilisation with the most powerful patron gods, people in turn started to come up with concepts of more and more powerful gods, possibly as a form of deterrence to neighbouring civilisations. As a result, we eventualy see the emergence of the concept of 'all-powerful' gods, omnipotent leaders of pantheons of lesser gods who are said to have created the world, this in turn led to the development of the concept of a 'god of gods', the most powerful god in existence. Then all that is required is a rejection of all the other gods, either as insignificant or even as non-existent, leaving us with the concept of an all-powerful monotheistic 'God'.
Last edited by SlackerBabbath at Dec 6, 2012,
20Tigers
1
Join date: Jun 2008
640 IQ
#138
Quote by SlackerBabbath
Gautama Buddha himself did not endorse belief in a creator deity, refused to express any views on creation and stated that questions on the origin of the world are worthless.

When I studied religion we learned that one of the goals of the buddhist is to attain elightenment and ultimately a state of nirvana. Their four noble truths are that life is suffering, suffering is caused by desire, to cease suffering one must cease desire, this can be attained through the eightfold path.

Now the funny thing is that following the buddhist path requires a desire to achieve a sate of nirvana.

I told this to my tutor and he could not see the solution.

A good movie that seems to have a lot of buddhist principles told in modern setting is American Beauty (in many aspects but most overtly in Kevin Spacey's character's journey toward enlightenment and eventually achieving enlightenment and entering a state of nirvana. - good movie
Si
Sleaze Disease
UnBanned
Join date: Sep 2006
420 IQ
#139
Quote by T00DEEPBLUE
Even from a Christian POV, saying that God is in everyone is meaningless because God is in everything in the universe according to the bible- It's not impressive at all.

Oh, ffs--guarantee she wasn't trying to be "impressive" by saying it.
Honestly, she was probably just saying it to be nice and not start a huge debate.
You people are reading far too much into this.
Quote by SteveHouse
This thread is officially about sucking Sleaze off for a sig.


Quote by tayroar
Hey Sleaze I'll give you a blowjob if you sig me. Maybe even some nudey photos?


Quote by crazy8rgood


Sleaze, that made me lulz in my pants.


Quote by 36mikeyb36
hahaha Sleaze i'd give you my mom for that one.
SlackerBabbath
Est. 1966.
Join date: Apr 2007
264 IQ
#141
Quote by 20Tigers
When I studied religion we learned that one of the goals of the buddhist is to attain elightenment and ultimately a state of nirvana. Their four noble truths are that life is suffering, suffering is caused by desire, to cease suffering one must cease desire, this can be attained through the eightfold path.

Now the funny thing is that following the buddhist path requires a desire to achieve a sate of nirvana.

I told this to my tutor and he could not see the solution.



eGraham
Rattle That Lock
Join date: Oct 2008
1,541 IQ
#142
Quote by triglide5
Wow! What if he turned out to be Ozzy Osbourne?

Or a ski ball player
Quote by Trowzaa
I wish I was American.

~ A Rolling Potato Gathers No Moss ~
Jyrgen
Used Register
Join date: Jan 2010
2,056 IQ
#143
Quote by brownshirt1
What if god was one of us?

He is. He is in all of us and everywhere at once
brownshirt1
Registered User
Join date: Aug 2009
38 IQ
#144
That comment was in reference to a shitty song that was released sometime in the 90's.
SlackerBabbath
Est. 1966.
Join date: Apr 2007
264 IQ
#145
Quote by Jyrgen
He is. He is in all of us and everywhere at once

This of course would beg the question, if that's the case, does God influence us or do we influence God?
TooktheAtrain
Banned
Join date: May 2012
184 IQ
#146
Quote by SlackerBabbath
This of course would beg the question, if that's the case, does God influence us or do we influence God?


I suppose we'd be components of 'his' psyche.
T00DEEPBLUE
Boba FRETT
Join date: Oct 2010
2,247 IQ
#148
Quote by Sleaze Disease
Oh, ffs--guarantee she wasn't trying to be "impressive" by saying it.

I doubt she wasn't trying. Christianity still exists these days for two reasons; it's a coping strategy and/or their parents and/or peers had Christian principles. The latter exists originally because of the former. As Slacker proved, we have historical evidence of this hypothesis.
Quote by Sleaze Disease

Honestly, she was probably just saying it to be nice and not start a huge debate.
You people are reading far too much into this.

You've completely missed the point of this thread. I'm all for happiness, I'd take happines over intellect any day of the week. But because of the evidence we have, the 'happiness' based around Christian principles has become untenable.

It's not even a 'happy' religion anyway; it's fucking arrogant and bigoted.

And for the record; if eternal life, eternal happiness and eternal meaning are not things worth looking into, I don't know what is.
Regarding the furry fandom from the man himself:
Quote by Axelfox
Please understand how little we as a community care
Last edited by T00DEEPBLUE at Dec 7, 2012,
metacarpi
Too old for this ****
Join date: Aug 2007
895 IQ
#149
Quote by brownshirt1
What if god was one of us?


Just a stranger on the bus?
Quote by GLP_Arclite
Pooping is well good though, to be fair.


I've got a handle on the fiction.

I'm losing my grip, 'cos I'm losing my fingers.
brownshirt1
Registered User
Join date: Aug 2009
38 IQ
#150
Quote by metacarpi
Just a stranger on the bus?


Trying to make his was home.
metacarpi
Too old for this ****
Join date: Aug 2007
895 IQ
#151
Back up to heaven all aloooone
Quote by GLP_Arclite
Pooping is well good though, to be fair.


I've got a handle on the fiction.

I'm losing my grip, 'cos I'm losing my fingers.