Karan_
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2012
212 IQ
#1
I bought a guitar in a online auction, which is supposedly an Epiphone Les Paul Royale.
Upon checking the guitar personally I noticed the biggest difference: the pickguard was black instead of gold. I asked the owner about it and he told me that there were two versions of this guitar, in case someone finds gold to be too flashy.
Upon coming home, I did some research and found absolutely nothing about this version. Did I buy a super rare guitar or some cheap fake?
Also, what are the glue traces around the inlays? The owner claimed them to be the sloppiness of the manufacturer, but I doubt Epiphone would make such a bad work for a limited edition guitar. The guitar was shipped from the USA by marksguitarstuff.com (which has, by now changed it's name). I bought this guitar for $300 and I still have the option to return it. What should I do?

Here are some photos
Karan_
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2012
212 IQ
#3
Quote by SlenderMan`
how does it play?


The tone is okay for the price but I still find it fishy that I can't find any information about a guitar which was produced a few years ago.
Malchius
....
Join date: Jul 2008
113 IQ
#4
Apart from the tone.volume knobs it looks the same as my mates Epi Les Paul Custom but i'm no expert.
Last edited by Malchius at Dec 9, 2012,
Wisthekiller
UG's Nigel Tufnel
Join date: Dec 2009
1,897 IQ
#5
The knobs are also wrong, real ones would have the silver tops.

The alignment of the knobs are wrong, the inner ones should be directly below the pickguard screw.

And the thing that gives away it's DEFINITELY not a Royale line, is that it uses the normal headstock logo, the Royale line uses a different where the "n" in Epiphone doesn't swoop down.

Compare (it's small but you can see it) to
.


Return the hell out of it and tell him he's full of shit. There were also no black pickguard versions.
Last edited by Wisthekiller at Dec 9, 2012,
leony03
UG's Lord of Timey Wimey
Join date: Jan 2006
3,503 IQ
#6
Also, the serial number on the back of the headstock should have 2 letters in front of it such as EE04091253. I tried putting the number in your picture into this but because it doesn't follow the same format as mine or the example, this doesn't look real.

Imo, it looks like a standard LP that has been painted over and had that bogus number stuck on the back.
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Robbgnarly
Tab Contributor
Join date: Feb 2011
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#8
You didnt think it was strange that the serial # is a diff color and the area isn't even remotely symetrical?

Send it back, it is not real.
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Mephaphil
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#9
It could be that the guy you bought it from was duped too.

Luckily you have the Internet who hate it when people get screwed over but he may not have noticed.

Still, it's not your fault and he's the one who has sold a fake item as genuine and is potentially in breach of copyright legislation.

When I bought an Epi les paul standard in white a few years ago it arrived with a snapped neck. It was also obviously fake. They said it was an error and they got screwed over, they sent me a replacement, also fake.

Needless to say, I reported them to trading standards and soon their ebay store was shut down.

Ebay will give you a refund. If the guy tries to tell you it's genuine just send him all the evidence.

Let us know what happens!
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57Goldtop
Piano Player in Disguise
Join date: Jan 2011
1,473 IQ
#10
The pickguard isn't the issue. Anybody can swap those out for really cheap if they want to give it a different look. This guitar has much bigger clues that it's not real. The pickup covers are wrong, the knobs are wrong, the Epi logo is wrong, and I've never seen glue residue that bad on a fretboard inlay (even on a budget brand). But all those aside, that serial number on the back is totally bogus. Epiphone would NEVER have left that one square unfinished when the rest of the neck is white. Return that guitar asap!
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paruwi
€pi Wiki Team
Join date: Aug 2009
12 IQ
#12
It is a 'factory second' or refurbished.....

all of them have gold stickers with the serial# starting 311......

BTW
Epi changed their serialnumber system in mid 2008....

there are no prefix-letters anymore (except some models)
and guitardater fails for more than 4 years to decipher it....
KG6_Steven
Eats ponies for breakfast
Join date: Nov 2006
3,163 IQ
#13
Quote by paruwi
It is a 'factory second' or refurbished.....

all of them have gold stickers with the serial# starting 311......

BTW
Epi changed their serialnumber system in mid 2008....

there are no prefix-letters anymore (except some models)
and guitardater fails for more than 4 years to decipher it....



Even if it was a factory second, the headstock logo would be correct. This is more likely a "made in China" fake.
paruwi
€pi Wiki Team
Join date: Aug 2009
12 IQ
#14
Quote by KG6_Steven
Even if it was a factory second, the headstock logo would be correct. This is more likely a "made in China" fake.


The headstock logo is correct !
paruwi
€pi Wiki Team
Join date: Aug 2009
12 IQ
#16
Quote by Wisthekiller
Not for this model.


the headstock logo is different on Chinese and Indonesian made Epis !

Do you really think they now fake factory seconds....
DartS17
Registered User
Join date: Jun 2008
120 IQ
#18
Quote by Karan_
I asked the owner about it and he told me that there were two versions of this guitar, in case someone finds gold to be too flashy.

I thought the whole point of the Royale line was to be flashy. They're basically an Epi Standard with gold hardware, seems like you may have just bought an Epi Standard with switched out hardware. The Royales don't have that black piece around the input jack either. I'd return it on the basis that even if it's not a fake it's not what you ordered.
paruwi
€pi Wiki Team
Join date: Aug 2009
12 IQ
#19
Quote by Wisthekiller
It's a Standard headstock, he was asking if it was a Royale model.




this ^^ IS a headstock from a LP Standard Royale !
solidrane
Wekk Blka
Join date: Mar 2011
1,008 IQ
#21
To hell with "fake or not"

IMO
As long as there are no blaring physical defects, or poor craftmanship. If it plays well and sounds good.
Les pauls are somewhat known to have shotty intonation work

... if it plays good... just keep it
???
Wisthekiller
UG's Nigel Tufnel
Join date: Dec 2009
1,897 IQ
#22
Quote by solidrane
To hell with "fake or not"

IMO
As long as there are no blaring physical defects, or poor craftmanship. If it plays well and sounds good.
Les pauls are somewhat known to have shotty intonation work

... if it plays good... just keep it



What? Since when?

And if you bought something and it ended up being fake, even if it's okay, it's probably not as good as what they're faking.
W4RP1G
Please, call me Pig.
Join date: May 2010
2,847 IQ
#23
I don't know much about Epiphones, but my guess would be that that is a different model than the Royale, not a counterfeit Epiphone.
KG6_Steven
Eats ponies for breakfast
Join date: Nov 2006
3,163 IQ
#24
Send the photos to Gibson/Epiphone. They can tell you if it's fake or real. I'm going with fake - not a factory second.
paruwi
€pi Wiki Team
Join date: Aug 2009
12 IQ
#25
Quote by Wisthekiller
This is according to Epiphone



Look at the "n" again.


Yep, I see the different logos.....

Once again.....Epi is well known for NOT having their sh!t correct on their website !

Sending pics to Epi is useless, because the original serial# under the sticker is partly scrapped out - Epi was NOT selling this guitar as a new one....
it is a refurbished with lesser warranty than a new one

http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/epiphone-les-pauls/31153-fake-epiphone-thread-ii-365.html

ask here ^^ and believe it or not......

http://www.mircweb.com/

this ^^ is where it was refurbished

Last edited by paruwi at Dec 10, 2012,
KG6_Steven
Eats ponies for breakfast
Join date: Nov 2006
3,163 IQ
#26
Ok. So, I had a look at the sites Paruwi listed. At first, I was ready to say hogwash, but after having a closer look at the back of the headstock, I think he may be right. TS - Does the word "USED" appear to be stamped in the back of the headstock above the serial number sticker? I had a look at all three photos TS submitted and it looks like something is lightly stamped in the finish just above the sticker. On the third photo, I can almost make out the word "USED." If so, Paruwi is right - this is a refinished/repaired guitar and is authentic.

Now, that brings up another question... If the seller misrepresented the guitar and sold it as a factory prime unit, that is wrong. The guitar should have been represented as a factory second, or refurbished unit. It looks like the gold plated tuners have some corrosion on them, so it's hard to say what they did to it. Based on that, I'd be somewhat tempted to return it. But, that's up to you. If it plays well and you got it for a decent price, then keep it.
paruwi
€pi Wiki Team
Join date: Aug 2009
12 IQ
#27
Quote by KG6_Steven
Ok. So, I had a look at the sites Paruwi listed. At first, I was ready to say hogwash, but after having a closer look at the back of the headstock, I think he may be right. TS - Does the word "USED" appear to be stamped in the back of the headstock above the serial number sticker? I had a look at all three photos TS submitted and it looks like something is lightly stamped in the finish just above the sticker. On the third photo, I can almost make out the word "USED." If so, Paruwi is right - this is a refinished/repaired guitar and is authentic.

Now, that brings up another question... If the seller misrepresented the guitar and sold it as a factory prime unit, that is wrong. The guitar should have been represented as a factory second, or refurbished unit. It looks like the gold plated tuners have some corrosion on them, so it's hard to say what they did to it. Based on that, I'd be somewhat tempted to return it. But, that's up to you. If it plays well and you got it for a decent price, then keep it.



Thank You !
Last edited by paruwi at Dec 10, 2012,
Karan_
Registered User
Join date: Nov 2012
212 IQ
#28
Quote by KG6_Steven
Ok. So, I had a look at the sites Paruwi listed. At first, I was ready to say hogwash, but after having a closer look at the back of the headstock, I think he may be right. TS - Does the word "USED" appear to be stamped in the back of the headstock above the serial number sticker? I had a look at all three photos TS submitted and it looks like something is lightly stamped in the finish just above the sticker. On the third photo, I can almost make out the word "USED." If so, Paruwi is right - this is a refinished/repaired guitar and is authentic.

Now, that brings up another question... If the seller misrepresented the guitar and sold it as a factory prime unit, that is wrong. The guitar should have been represented as a factory second, or refurbished unit. It looks like the gold plated tuners have some corrosion on them, so it's hard to say what they did to it. Based on that, I'd be somewhat tempted to return it. But, that's up to you. If it plays well and you got it for a decent price, then keep it.


Yeah it does say USED. I am returning the guitar anyways since I wanted the guitar mainly as an eye candy.
Thanks for all the feedback, I learned my lesson and will pay more attention when buying a used guitar.
The previous owner still claims the guitar to be an authentic Epiphone Les Paul Royale and he tells me that my eyes are wrong if I see any corrosion, the pickguard is not necessary since most guitarist take it off and every other flaw the guitar has is the fault of the manufacturer.
He probably has paid the same price for the guitar as I did.