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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#1
Sup people! coming to you with a new thread!

so yeah im going for my first Head Amp, and i have 2,300 american greenies for the
"operation". I Mostly play thrash, with a little bit of punk and hard rock thrown in the mix and i manly use active pups so yeah

This two amps caught my attention,

So? opinions? comments? advice?

One more thing what would be a good cab for these amps and for metal?


My amp is a line 6 Spider IV 75 watt, so im starting in all of this valve amps world so i dont know much of the subject help
Last edited by MeTAL SOLDIER at Dec 26, 2012,
Robbgnarly
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#2
It is not a valid question, the Mesa slays the Blackstar
/thread
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#3
Mesa all the way.
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#4
Mesa!

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#6
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#7
Mesa over Blackstar any day.
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Offworld92
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#8
I wouldn't be so quick to judge. The S1 is pretty damn nice. I've seen My Ruin a couple times and their guitarist uses one - it cuts through crazy well.

They're really different beasts though.

If you can give us some more info and answer these questions here, we can give you some more suggestions, and have more insight into your needs in general.

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1387138
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#9
You will get tons of Mesa love on this forum, and lots of Blackstar hate stemming from their cheaper HT amps. The S1 is a nice amp though, but I would still choose the Mesa over one any day.

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JesusCrisp
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#10
You're comparing a hot-rodded, multichannel Marshall kind of amp to a Dual Rectifier.
They completely different tones TBH.

@ all the other users posting so far: The Dual Rectifier is a great amp for sure, but it really wouldn't be my choice for thrash. At least not the kind of thrash I think of (Slayer, Megadeth, Metallica, Anthrax, Exodus, etc.).
For that, the Series One would overall work better.
Also, if he was comparing the Recto to a JCM800 or some other hotrodded Marshall-type amp (Splawn or whatever), you would probably see the 'apples to oranges' thing going on here.
Unbelievable how much hate Blackstar is getting around here.
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Offworld92
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#11
^ Agreed 100%. Though I will say that I do personally hate Blackstar because of their false advertising bullshit, I still do want to point out that they are different beasts, and further yet there are most likely other options to consider given OP's budget.

I would choose the Blackstar over the Mesa tonally, but I'm sure with some more info we could find an amp with better tone, and better morals.

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#13
Quote by JesusCrisp
You're comparing a hot-rodded, multichannel Marshall kind of amp to a Dual Rectifier.
They completely different tones TBH.

@ all the other users posting so far: The Dual Rectifier is a great amp for sure, but it really wouldn't be my choice for thrash. At least not the kind of thrash I think of (Slayer, Megadeth, Metallica, Anthrax, Exodus, etc.).
For that, the Series One would overall work better.
Also, if he was comparing the Recto to a JCM800 or some other hotrodded Marshall-type amp (Splawn or whatever), you would probably see the 'apples to oranges' thing going on here.
Unbelievable how much hate Blackstar is getting around here.


Sure you're thinking of Slayer, Megadeth, Metallica, Anthrax, Exodus when you read thrash, but did you verify that these were the bands he was seeking to emulate?

Did you verify that he wants to replicate their tone? He also mentioned hard rock and Punk, for which the Recto has its applications as well.

True that there is a lot of Blackstar hate on this forum, and yes there is too much Mesa-love. However, if Blackstar had some integrity to at least advertise honestly, do you really think there'd be that much hate going around? I'd venture to say that even between a Splawn, Marshall and Blackstar, very few would pick Blackstar over the others.
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#14
Quote by ragingkitty
Sure you're thinking of Slayer, Megadeth, Metallica, Anthrax, Exodus when you read thrash

Not my first thoughts when I hear thrash, I'd say most of these bands are just regular 'ol metal, megadeth maybe speed metal. However that's pretty well off topic.
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#15
didn't metallica use mesa at one point?
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I would recommend the marshal MG100

Very versatile and quality sound. It should treat you well
Last edited by gerraguitar at Dec 27, 2012,
MeTAL SOLDIER
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#16
More info: im looking for an amp that gives me the kill em all tone but also something like megadeth's rust in peace, an amp that can be usable for 80 thrash mostly also i would use the amp for giggin mostly

With more than 2 channels
Last edited by MeTAL SOLDIER at Dec 27, 2012,
gerraguitar
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#17
need to look into marshall then, jcm800 all day
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Quote by CaptainAmerican
I would recommend the marshal MG100

Very versatile and quality sound. It should treat you well
Offworld92
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#18
If you need more than two channels then Splawn is probably the way to go. Are you in the US?
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Robbgnarly
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#22
Metallica used Mesa Mark II's

Blackstar still sucks no mater what anyone says. I have played almost every amp they have made and all have fallen short. I dare say Bugera sounds better
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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#23
is it true that you can only use mesa power tubes for the amp? i know its biased for 6l6 or El34s only but they need to be mesas?
Robbgnarly
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#24
well yes and no
You can put any tubes in them, but they are biased for selected mesa tubes or grove tubes. (which is bullshit)

I have done several bias mods to rectifiers and it is easy and pretty cheap.
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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#25
so if a get the dual rectifier i would need to buy only mesa tubes? or would be able to install any brand? (i would use only 6l6s)
Robbgnarly
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#26
groove tubes and Mesa tubes are alright to use with out the bias mod.

But I have installed Ruby 6L6 gc STR's in an old 2 Ch DR and they work fine, you just can not adjust the bias settin on the amp be cause it is set from the factory to be correct (their setting).
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MatrixClaw
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#27
Hell no, you don't need to use Mesa brand tubes

They are overpriced chinese tubes that might be fit within the bias of the Mesa amps, but that doesn't mean they sound as good as other brands.

FWIW, you might want to try EL-34s in it. Makes the amp much tighter and should make it a little more aggressive in the upper mids, which is what you want if you're going for a thrash sound.

That being said, IMO the Dual Recto is totally wrong for thrash. The Blackstar would be a better choice, but they're wayyyy overpriced. A boosted JCM800 is like the holy grail of thrash tones, and you can get them used for about as much as a used Recto
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Robbgnarly
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#28
Quote by MatrixClaw
Hell no, you don't need to use Mesa brand tubes

They are overpriced chinese tubes that might be fit within the bias of the Mesa amps, but that doesn't mean they sound as good as other brands.

FWIW, you might want to try EL-34s in it. Makes the amp much tighter and should make it a little more aggressive in the upper mids, which is what you want if you're going for a thrash sound.

That being said, IMO the Dual Recto is totally wrong for thrash. The Blackstar would be a better choice, but they're wayyyy overpriced. A boosted JCM800 is like the holy grail of thrash tones, and you can get them used for about as much as a used Recto

+1 this is basicly what i ment, even if it was not clear
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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#29
its there any chance of the amp getting damaged with ruby's tubes or another brand

(im entering the tube world as you can see and i want to have everything clear)
Robbgnarly
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#30
Quote by MeTAL SOLDIER
its there any chance of the amp getting damaged with ruby's tubes or another brand

(im entering the tube world as you can see and i want to have everything clear)

No not at all at worst case senario you'll wear out the tubes faster, but your amp will be fine.
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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#31
ok im now considering either the JCM800 or the Dual Rec.

I have heard awesome things of the JCM but as i said before i would like something with 2 or more channels
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#32
Quote by MeTAL SOLDIER
its there any chance of the amp getting damaged with ruby's tubes or another brand

(im entering the tube world as you can see and i want to have everything clear)

No.

Just tell the place that you're buying tubes from that it'll be going in a Mesa and they can find you a set that will match the bias range.

Quote by MeTAL SOLDIER
ok im now considering either the JCM800 or the Dual Rec.

I have heard awesome things of the JCM but as i said before i would like something with 2 or more channels

There are 2 channel JCM800s. Not as well revered as the single channel ones, but they have more gain on tap (which means you might not need a boost), and IMO they are very underrated. Favorite Marshall I've owned/played was a JCM 800 2210.

That being said - Depending on your budget, you could step up to a used Splawn Quickrod around $1300, or a little more for an Orange Rockerverb (much better cleans than the Splawn, but not as aggressive on the gain channel) and either will SLAY for thrash. Splawn Nitro or Rivera K-Tre are also an option, if you want a little more lowend and low mids.
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AcousticMirror
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#33
ya a rockerverb or a ktre would be great as would any of the splawns.
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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#34
MatrixClaw the words you speak are true...

the jcm 800 2205 has to channels, reverb and even and effects loop!!

but they don make them any more right?

any ideas where could i get one?

And how much would be a reasonable price for one?
Last edited by MeTAL SOLDIER at Dec 27, 2012,
311ZOSOVHJH
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#35
^ You'll have to buy a used one. What we are talking about are used amps. I have not played the K-Tre but most of the other ones brought up so far I have. I agree that the Dual Rec is not really geared for what you are looking for but obviously excels at punk, hard core and metal.

The JCM 800s they were talking about would be the ones like these...on your craigslist. Used ones. Forget about the reissues. I don't think these are reissues.
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3425387732.html
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3407656449.html

Here is some other stuff to consider:
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3438819214.html Ugly but can profile any amp
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3496960992.html Randall modular amp with several modules for you
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3457318736.html Rockerverb 100
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3456145850.html JCM 900 SL-X
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3419680637.html Thunderverb
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3444797246.html Mesa Road King
http://sanantonio.craigslist.org/msg/3405070908.html Marshall TSL

A good starting point on these would be say $100 or $200 below asking price and go from there. I'd be pretty happy with any one of these honestly.

I own a Splawn Quick Rod and can tell you that it kicks serious ass. It can do just about any genre but is geared more for 80's metal, rock and thrash. It won't be as modern as a Splawn Nitro and won't do the lower gain stuff as well as say a Bluesbreaker but can pretty much hold its own in most styles. I've seen them as low as $900 - but general asking price is in the 1,100 - $1,300 range.

You can usually find Splawn Quick Rods for sale in your area if you are patient.

With what you are going after - I would def take my time and go play as many amps as possible. The Dual Rec and Blackhearts would be pretty low on my list if I were you.
Last edited by 311ZOSOVHJH at Dec 27, 2012,
MatrixClaw
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#36
^Jeeze, next time you see a QR for $900, PM me immediately so I can buy it
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MeTAL SOLDIER
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#37
Well your saying that a Modded JCM 800 would be the answer, how do i accomplish that?
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#38
Wasn't blackstar the golden calf only a few months back. I say go with the marshall more usable mids.
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Last edited by losing battle at Dec 27, 2012,
bluestratplayer
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#39
Quote by MeTAL SOLDIER
Well your saying that a Modded JCM 800 would be the answer, how do i accomplish that?


By getting a splawn.
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#40
Quote by MatrixClaw
^Jeeze, next time you see a QR for $900, PM me immediately so I can buy it


i paid $950 shipped for my promod a few years ago. came with used tubes and a full set of new JJ's, and a nice cover.
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