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#161
You're not gay are you Due? Why would homophobia affect you?

Unless you mean people calling you homophobic slurs despite your sexuality.
#162
Quote by Elderer
Dont care however I dont get the whole "loud n proud" thing.Shit is annoying.Get your partner and do whatever gross things you do behind closed doors.

this is the kind of shit im talking about
#163
Quote by due 07
why are you such an apologist for so many awful things? this pretty much pisses me off because of the way i've been affected by the homophobia of peers and how i know so many other people have been affected worse.

i do. if you have homophobic beliefs then fuck you, that's p much my whole philosophy.
*-)
Quote by Bob_Sacamano
i kinda wish we all had a penis and vagina instead of buttholes

i mean no offense to buttholes and poop or anything

Rest in Peace, Troy Davis and Trayvon Martin and Jordan Davis and Eric Garner and Mike Brown
#164
Notice you never hear anyone go "You know what mate, take your woman and only kiss her indoors. It's fucking disgusting. Oh no, I don't care though hehe".

You're a nobhead if you say things like that to anyone.
#165
I say that, but I'm not a fan of public affection. Keep that shit private, gay or straight.
*-)
Quote by Bob_Sacamano
i kinda wish we all had a penis and vagina instead of buttholes

i mean no offense to buttholes and poop or anything

Rest in Peace, Troy Davis and Trayvon Martin and Jordan Davis and Eric Garner and Mike Brown
#166
Institutional homophobia is fading and will continue to fade as older generations die, like institutional racism did, but homophobia will still exist as long as prejudice persists as an influence over peoples' behavior.

We're raised to consider heterosexuality to be "normal" just because it's the most common thing, so a prejudice quickly develops toward homosexual behavior. Often, we begin to see it as something "weird" or "gross" or "abnormal." People seek out justifications for these prejudices because they don't like to be challenged. Such behavior ingrains discrimination into society. Until everyone is willing to give up on their unfounded prejudices there will be homophobia, racism, etc.
#167
Quote by element4433
I say that, but I'm not a fan of public affection. Keep that shit private, gay or straight.

Well yeah, there are people that don't like anything affectionate happening in public, but they don't really do it with the same vitriol.
#168
Quote by due 07
why are you such an apologist for so many awful things? this pretty much pisses me off because of the way i've been affected by the homophobia of peers and how i know so many other people have been affected worse.

i do. if you have homophobic beliefs then fuck you, that's p much my whole philosophy.

I would say a lot of people I know are at least a little homophobic. It's mainly ignorance and none of them are going to go on rants against gays or beat them or anything extreme like that. It mainly just offhand comments and the like. And if one of the aforementioned events did happen I would quickly tell them to cut that shit out and if it was bad enough probably wouldn't want to be around them anymore. That's never happened though.

I don't think many people put much thought into it. Most are just like, "oh those people are different, that's kinda weird." I know, I was like that when I was younger. I didn't hate gays, I was just ignorant on the subject. All it takes is a little educating and most people get over ignorant beliefs. At least from what I've seen in people.

I don't think a small character flaw that is probably easily changed for most people is enough to tell them to go **** themselves and that they are awful people.


idk, just my two cents
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
Last edited by WCPhils at Jan 4, 2013,
#169
Quote by WCPhils
I would say a lot of people I know are at least a little homophobic. It's mainly ignorance and none of them are going to go on rants against gays or beat them or anything extreme like that. It mainly just offhand comments and the like. And if one of the aforementioned events did happen I would quickly tell them to cut that shit out and if it was bad enough probably wouldn't want to be around them anymore. That's never happened though.

I don't think many people put much thought into it. Most are just like, "oh those people are different, that's kinda weird." I know, I was like that when I was younger. I didn't hate gays, I was just ignorant on the subject. All it takes is a little educating and most people get over ignorant beliefs. At least from what I've seen in people.

I don't think a small character flaw that is probably easily changed for most people is enough to tell them to go **** themselves and that they are awful people.

idk, just my two cents


Indeed. A lot of people who would be called a homophobe aren't really, they just consider it a little disgusting (in much the same way as someone who considers giving oral sex disgusting) and apply their own logic to everyone.

However, people who are legitimately homophobic, who've actually put thought into it and actively hate gay people, are sociopathic in some form.
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#170
Quote by Todd Hart

However, people who are legitimately homophobic, who've actually put thought into it and actively hate gay people, are sociopathic in some form.

Oh definitely.

I just mean that just because someone displays some homophobia out of ignorance, like a lot of younger people do, I don't think that's enough to call them an awful person.

I was brought up not knowing really anything about gay people. I just wasn't ever really exposed to it. So I thought it was a bit gross in my early teenage years. Eventually I became more educated on that subject and that line of thinking went away. I think this is how it is for many people.
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#171
People hate gays for the same reason they hated blacks back then,

they're ruining America.
#173
Quote by PoisonousNipple
Alot of people are ignorant and hatred is a very easy thing to feel

/thread

___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#174
I'm going to get a lot of shit for this but I kind of see The Madcap's point. Homophobic beliefs are bad but having them doesn't make somebody an inherently bad person, they've probably just grown up surrounded by homophobia and that carries over into adulthood. If they actually have put though into it than yes, '**** them' but I don't think being homophobic (as in, not putting thought into, just accepting it) makes somebody inherently bad. It's kind of like how I don't think most Nazi supporters were inherently bad people (although that isn't the best comparison, I know).

With that said, in no way am I an 'apologist' and when I hear homophobic bs I do challenge it.

On a side note, I don't like public affection either.
#175
Just before seeing this thread I noticed an old school friend post something on Facebook about the government being to blame because a huge fire has burnt out atleast one town here. Why you ask? Because they were too busy "supporting the gay ****wit movement" instead of managing the forest industry. Yep.
#176
Quote by PoisonousNipple
Just before seeing this thread I noticed an old school friend post something on Facebook about the government being to blame because a huge fire has burnt out atleast one town here. Why you ask? Because they were too busy "supporting the gay ****wit movement" instead of managing the forest industry. Yep.


Shouldn't you be inhaling CO or something?
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#178
Quote by PoisonousNipple
You should troll in EVERY single thread instead of a select few


I know I should troll more but I simply don't have the stamina, just ask your boyfriend.
...Stapling helium to penguins since 1949.
#179
it's icky and they deserve hellfire
i mean I just go by what the word of God says. It's not something we can change.

Maybe God creates homosexuals without souls so they don't actually go to heaven or hell. Like population control. I mean he is all powerful and we shouldn't question him.
Last edited by Ignite at Jan 4, 2013,
#180
WCPhils and slipknot5678 said it alright enough.

I don't support homophobia. I think it's a bad thing. If somebody happens to have some passive homophobic beliefs, so long as they don't harm others due to their beliefs, I'm not going to hate them like they're members of the Westboro Baptist Church. I'd have more respect for them if they were in favor or LGBT rights, but whatever. They've probably been raised in a more conservative and religious environment than me, and don't give much thought to their beliefs.

I think a person can still have a good heart while maybe having a few bad beliefs they shouldn't have. But like I said, those beliefs have probably come from their environment, upbringing, culture, religion, ignorance, etc. Those are hard forces to fight.
#181
Quote by Ignite
it's icky and they deserve hellfire
i mean I just go by what the word of God says. It's not something we can change.

Maybe God creates homosexuals without souls so they don't actually go to heaven or hell. Like population control. I mean he is all powerful and we shouldn't question him.

#182
Quote by willT08
You're not gay are you Due? Why would homophobia affect you?

i'm pansexual i guess although i don't really like the term for me. homophobia still affects me in places i'd rather feel safe--like, i'd strongly prefer not to be chastised and called a faggot (maliciously) at a local show, but maybe that's just me.

homophobia among peers has never taken a huge toll on me, it would just be like physical/verbal harassment in locker rooms or in certain classes. i know that shit i've gone through is pudding compared to lots of lgbt kids growing up, and that's why it pisses me off when homophobia is dismissed as just ignorance--it's not like that shitty outlook on life doesn't ever affect anyone else.

and just to address what some other people have said about being raised in a conservative environment or something: as far as america goes, there really is no excuse to be homophobic nowadays regardless of your family's views. it's different in other countries i'm sure, but here it's not like you grow up without being exposed to a more tolerant worldview, you just reject it for whatever reason.*

*unless you're a weirdo homeschooled kid
Last edited by due 07 at Jan 4, 2013,
#183
Quote by The Madcap
But like I said, those beliefs have probably come from their environment, upbringing, culture, religion, ignorance, etc. Those are hard forces to fight.


It seems to me UGers tend to forget about this. This, combined with the source of the problem itself (due and jetfuel have covered this well) is why I think homophobia exists.
#184
repressed and unaccepted homoerotic desires among those dealing the hate
Quote by Arthur Curry
it's official, vintage x metal is the saving grace of this board and/or the antichrist




e-married to
theguitarist
minterman22
tateandlyle
& alaskan_ninja

#185
Quote by due 07
as far as america goes, there really is no excuse to be homophobic nowadays regardless of your family's views. it's different in other countries i'm sure, but here it's not like you grow up without being exposed to a more tolerant worldview, you just reject it for whatever reason.


I just want to say that I'm aware that it affects others and that I'm not okay with it.

I see your point but I think we are ignoring the effects of peer pressure, what the overall view of an entire community, and 'family values'. I know personal experiences don't mean anything in these sorts of debates but in Mormon dominated suburbs of Utah (disclaimer: I'm not talking about where I grew up, just observations from surrounding areas), for example, you're really not likely to be exposed to the LGBT movement or anything like that, unless you actively search for it. Most people obviously are going to trust their families views more than just people they know. I have a friend who is a closet atheist and respects gays but outwardly he sometimes pretends to be a staunch Mormon who hates gays because if he doesn't his parents will disown him. It's easy for us to say 'well **** his family' but I can see why he does it. That's not the best example (because he doesn't actually hate gays) but for many people they just hear it so often they accept it. And then it extends beyond just their households when 97% of everybody they know feels the same way.

I don't know, I'm not defending homophobia or homophobes themselves, I just think this is large part of the 'deal with gay hate'.

If you're a homophobe reading this, this goes for you too. Try to see things from a gay persons point of view instead of throwing the word 'fag' around.
#186
Quote by due 07


*unless you're a weirdo homeschooled kid

I was up until 4th grade. Then 5th grade I was again.


Shit was awful.

I think homeschooling can really mess you up. It keeps you under a rock and then you're hit with the real world and it's almost unbearable.
#188
Quote by due 07

and just to address what some other people have said about being raised in a conservative environment or something: as far as america goes, there really is no excuse to be homophobic nowadays regardless of your family's views. it's different in other countries i'm sure, but here it's not like you grow up without being exposed to a more tolerant worldview, you just reject it for whatever reason.*

*unless you're a weirdo homeschooled kid


While this is true, being exposed to other beliefs doesn't do you any good if you've been taught to think that other beliefs are wrong without examining them. It's indoctrination, just like with more dogmatic religious beliefs, and just as hard to break out of.

I always try to be careful with these sorts of things, because talking to people has made me very aware of how much of our selves is derived from the environment we're raised in. So while I do hold somebody in much higher esteem if they support LGBT rights, I try not to immediately condemn homophobes I run into; some have never had a chance to be anything but.
My signature lacks content. It is, however, blue.
#189
Quote by slipknot5678
I just want to say that I'm aware that it affects others and that I'm not okay with it.

I see your point but I think we are ignoring the effects of peer pressure, what the overall view of an entire community, and 'family values'. I know personal experiences don't mean anything in these sorts of debates but in Mormon dominated suburbs of Utah (disclaimer: I'm not talking about where I grew up, just observations from surrounding areas), for example, you're really not likely to be exposed to the LGBT movement or anything like that, unless you actively search for it. Most people obviously are going to trust their families views more than just people they know. I have a friend who is a closet atheist and respects gays but outwardly he sometimes pretends to be a staunch Mormon who hates gays because if he doesn't his parents will disown him. It's easy for us to say 'well **** his family' but I can see why he does it. That's not the best example (because he doesn't actually hate gays) but for many people they just hear it so often they accept it. And then it extends beyond just their households when 97% of everybody they know feels the same way.

I don't know, I'm not defending homophobia or homophobes themselves, I just think this is large part of the 'deal with gay hate'.

If you're a homophobe reading this, this goes for you too. Try to see things from a gay persons point of view instead of throwing the word 'fag' around.

i totally understand what you mean, but my opinion is that given mass media nowadays and given science (like just knowing homosexuality is a real thing and not a choice and shit) and given a whole bunch of other things, you'd have to have an exceptionally (and i mean exceptionally) sheltered, bizarro upbringing to not ever be in the position that you question those beliefs.

i'm totally aboard the "environment basically shapes who you are," but on a macro level we are all raised in pretty much the same environment as far as social outlook goes. our family/peers might differ greatly, but the way we develop our worldview in the modern world has a lot to do with so many other things rather just family/peers.
Quote by Ignite
I was up until 4th grade. Then 5th grade I was again.


Shit was awful.

I think homeschooling can really mess you up. It keeps you under a rock and then you're hit with the real world and it's almost unbearable.

i agree. there are exceptions but not enough to justify weirdo homeschooling.
Last edited by due 07 at Jan 4, 2013,
#190
This thread stands to prove that the people without an avatar are far more hilarious than the ones with one.



Whenever it's one of these topics I've realised you can just scroll down the page and stop when you a post without an avatar. it's bound to be hilarious

People with avatars are boring.
sometimes I see us in a cymbal splash or in the sound of a car crash
Last edited by JohnnyGenzale at Jan 4, 2013,
#191
Quote by due 07
i totally understand what you mean, but my opinion is that given mass media nowadays and given science (like just knowing homosexuality is a real thing and not a choice and shit) and given a whole bunch of other things, you'd have to have an exceptionally (and i mean exceptionally) sheltered, bizarro upbringing to not ever be in the position that you question those beliefs.


Yeah you're right. I'm sure there are way more people like that than I'm aware of though. >_>

Edit: Also now I feel like an idiot because I just read through the whole thread and there are far more productive things I could have debated about (like the guy saying 'words are just words and anybody who is offended is weak'). So I apologise for wasting everyone's time.
Last edited by slipknot5678 at Jan 4, 2013,
#192
Quote by due 07

and just to address what some other people have said about being raised in a conservative environment or something: as far as america goes, there really is no excuse to be homophobic nowadays regardless of your family's views. it's different in other countries i'm sure, but here it's not like you grow up without being exposed to a more tolerant worldview, you just reject it for whatever reason.*

I wasn't raised in a conservative environment. My entire family is pretty liberal. I just didn't know more than one or two gay people. And I don't think there are a ton of children who do unless they have gay family members. It was just never really brought up so when I started thinking about it I was just all "eww, that's pretty gross" and that was about it. I'm sure many many other people are like that too. That's why I said most people are ignorant on the subject. I wasn't actively hating gay people, but I was homophobic.

That's why I think it's stupid to just say "**** you" to anyone with some homophobic beliefs. People can be educated to get rid of their ignorance. Not everyone who is a bit homophobic is out preaching intolerance. They just have some stupid worldview that can easily be changed.

Good for you for being so much more enlightened than everyone else before ever leaving the womb. Bravo



*unless you're a weirdo homeschooled kid

Go **** yourself. Don't even act like that wasn't directed at me
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
Last edited by WCPhils at Jan 4, 2013,
#193
Quote by WCPhils
I wasn't raised in a conservative environment. My entire family is pretty liberal. I just didn't know more than one or two gay people. And I don't think there are a ton of children who do unless they have gay family members. It was just never really brought up so when I started thinking about it I was just all "eww, that's pretty gross" and that was about it. I'm sure many many other people are like that too. That's why I said most people are ignorant on the subject. I wasn't actively hating gay people, but I was homophobic.

That's why I think it's stupid to just say "**** you" to anyone with some homophobic beliefs. People can be educated to get rid of their ignorance. Not everyone who is a bit homophobic is out preaching intolerance. They just have some stupid worldview that can easily be changed.

Good for you for being so much more enlightened than everyone else before ever leaving the womb. Bravo


well obviously i won't be like "fuck you" to a homophobic nine year-old, but i will be like "fuck you" to a homophobic 18 year-old.
Go **** yourself. Don't even act like that wasn't directed at me

rofl i didn't even know you were homeschooled. but if you really are, then chances are you are a weirdo. soz that's just the way it is.
#194
Quote by due 07
well obviously i won't be like "fuck you" to a homophobic nine year-old, but i will be like "fuck you" to a homophobic 18 year-old.

Why wouldn't you try to tell him why his beliefs are wrong and stupid?

Cursing him out isn't going to do any good. Saying "**** you" isn't going to get him or her to stop calling people fags or whatever.


Quote by due 07

rofl i didn't even know you were homeschooled. but if you really are, then chances are you are a weirdo. soz that's just the way it is.

Whatever, I'll just drop it.

It doesn't even go with this discussion
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
Last edited by WCPhils at Jan 4, 2013,
#195
Quote by WCPhils
Why wouldn't you try to tell him why his beliefs are wrong and stupid?

Cursing him out isn't going to do any good.

ok obviously i'm not going to literally be like "**** you," 'cuz that's not the kind of guy i am. i probably won't spend time trying to educate them (because in most environments that's not very reasonable), i'd probably just tell them i'm queer and find that offensive so that they feel awkward and repentant.
Quote by WCPhils
Whatever, I'll just drop it.

It doesn't even go with this discussion

you seem well-adjusted enough, so i never guess you were homeschooled. but like there are people here that i'm like "yeah they were probably homeschooled."

ftr only reason i mentioned homeschooling is 'cuz that's the only way one could feasibly be that sheltered.
Last edited by due 07 at Jan 4, 2013,
#196
Quote by due 07
well obviously i won't be like "fuck you" to a homophobic nine year-old, but i will be like "fuck you" to a homophobic 18 year-old.

rofl i didn't even know you were homeschooled. but if you really are, then chances are you are a weirdo. soz that's just the way it is.


Homeschoolaphobe
Fuck that nazi guy.
#197
Quote by due 07
ok obviously i'm not going to literally be like "**** you," 'cuz that's not the kind of guy i am. i probably won't spend time trying to educate them (because in most environments that's not very reasonable), i'd probably just tell them i'm queer and find that offensive so that they feel awkward and repentant.


I honestly think that is the best way to handle that situation.

This is probably inappropriate but I have on several occasions told people I'm gay just to change their opinion on the issue. >_>
#198
Quote by due 07
ok obviously i'm not going to literally be like "**** you," 'cuz that's not the kind of guy i am. i probably won't spend time trying to educate them (because in most environments that's not very reasonable), i'd probably just tell them i'm queer and find that offensive so that they feel awkward and repentant.

you seem well-adjusted enough, so i never guess you were homeschooled. but like there are people here that i'm like "yeah they were probably homeschooled."

ftr only reason i mentioned homeschooling is 'cuz that's the only way one could feasibly be that sheltered.


Who would some of these people be?

>.>
#199
Quote by slipknot5678
I honestly think that is the best way to handle that situation.

This is probably inappropriate but I have on several occasions told people I'm gay just to change their opinion on the issue. >_>

yeah i think it's good because it's like, see anyone could be gay so stop being a tit.
Quote by Morphogenesis26
Who would some of these people be?

>.>

rofl, you're kind of a weirdo but in a nice way. i'm a weirdo too. but like i would seriously be shocked if that treborillusion or whatever guy wasn't homeschooled.
#200
The only thing worse than being gay is being home-schooled.
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