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#41
I've got a shitton of music that I haven't paid for.

I'd buy the vinyl if I had a record player though, for which I have never had room in either my bedroom or my wallet.

The thing with justifying it though, is that everyone's sense of justice is different. To me, pirating is harmless since you're duplicating a production, you're not stealing it. What you ARE stealing is a license, no more than a bundle of words fitting snugly in the copyright laws, something so silly sounding that I refuse to pay for it 'less the benefits outweigh the phoney.
To somebody else, pirating is the foundation of internet crime. To yet another, pirating is the modern day equivalent of a holy grail.
What I believe however, is that most people simply don't care. Music is a free handout on the internet-market, and you can't blame the market dwellers for taking the opportunity. Only the people offering it.
#42
Quote by Ian_the_whiteknight


Regardless of what's right or wrong, music on an iPod is inferior to hearing it on vinyl.

Get decent headphones and lossless files. Then tell me that vinyl is better with all of its crackling.
#43
I do it, but if it's like music or a game that i really enjoy i will buy it.

I torrent mainly because i have no money to buy all that stuff, but i'm not justifying it, and i don't feel like i should.

I Have An Avant Garde Fetish....
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#44
Quote by Ian_the_fox

Regardless of what's right or wrong, music on an iPod is inferior to hearing it on vinyl.

Depends...if you're loading up on .wav's then there's no real difference anyway. Except obviously the massive difference that people who love vinyl seem to hear that doesn't exist to the rest of us.
#45
Quote by anvil is god
Get decent headphones and lossless files. Then tell me that vinyl is better with all of its crackling.
Don't treat your records like Frisbees and there is no crackling, for the most part.

And lol @ "headphones". Man, you're really missing out at life aren't you.
#46
Quote by Ian_the_fox
You hurt the [honest, paying] consumer.

The whole reason music and software are at the high prices they're sold at is to make up for the amount they lose from people like you who chose pirate everything.


Regardless of what's right or wrong, music on an iPod is inferior to hearing it on vinyl.

Hasn't the average price of CDs actually gone down because of pirating? When I was a kid I remember them regularly being $20 and now even new releases are like $10 at Target.
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#47
Quote by Ian_the_fox
Don't treat your records like Frisbees and there is no crackling, for the most part.

And lol @ "headphones". Man, you're really missing out at life aren't you.

Ian, 'headphones' is not a good topic for trolling. I can see from here that this thread is gonna go to pot because of you within the next half hour.
#48
Quote by ErikLensherr
Hasn't the average price of CDs actually gone down because of pirating? When I was a kid I remember them regularly being $20 and now even new releases are like $10 at Target.


Erm...no?
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#49
Quote by Ian_the_fox
Don't treat your records like Frisbees and there is no crackling, for the most part.

And lol @ "headphones". Man, you're really missing out at life aren't you.

>implying that headphones are bad
>implying vinyl doesn't wear out after a while
lel
#50
Quote by EpiExplorer
I swear this guy in particular writes for the telegraph or some shit.

Quote by Fat Lard
My name can actually be traced back to as early as the 1990s, it means "fuck off data miner"
#51
I haven't noticed any change in CD prices in my life. Always been in and around a tenner from what i can recall
#52
Quote by anvil is god
Get decent headphones and lossless files. Then tell me that vinyl is better with all of its crackling.

I'm not gonna argue that that will sound better than vinyl, but none of my vinyl crackles

You just have to not treat them like shit.
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#54
Quote by opc100
Or you could just put it like this; it's theft, deal with it.

Look, I'm on your side, but just because you believe you're morally in the right, it doesn't give you the right to simplify the issue and dismiss arguments just to make the debate easier for you.
Your friend probably is just trying to justify it to make himself feel better, but if you really want to think about it (and I presume you do, since you made this thread), you should consider the argument he's putting forward, because it is actually a good one.
Some Swedish guy wrote a paper about it: http://lup.lub.lu.se/luur/download?func=downloadFile&recordOId=2157989&fileOId=2158125
It's pretty tl;dr but chapter 1 makes some points that have some logical basis.


Edit: Oh great, Ian is here. Abandon thread!
Last edited by captainsnazz at Jan 18, 2013,
#55
Quote by ErikLensherr
The argument is it ain't wrong if it ain't hurting anybody, which it ain't cuz I ain't buying that shit anyway.

This argument only works against companies suing you an exorbitant amount for "loss sales". Even if you weren't going to buy it in the first place doesn't mean that you didn't knowingly breach the creator's requests.
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#56
I do it and i don't feel bad about it at all. The only ones really missing out on the money are the record company...most musicians make shit all from album sales. They make most of their money from touring and merchandise and i often go to see bands that i like live so i'm giving them more money buying their tickets or shirts to gigs than i would if bought a shitty cd. Having said that i still buy a lot of old second hand vinyl which supports good record stores and also new releases on vinyl from artists i really like.
#57
Quote by willT08
Ian, 'headphones' is not a good topic for trolling. I can see from here that this thread is gonna go to pot because of you within the next half hour.
I've got nothing against a pair of decent cans (ATH-M50's for example, love those things), I'm just saying listening to music on a good stereo system correctly set up with a good spread is better. It's like the band is actually in your room, performing in front of you (assuming it's a good mix).

I've compared lossless files, CD's, and good-condition vinyl. Vinyl wins hands-down when it comes to quality. Not sure what it is but is has that extra little sprinkle of "life" to it. Unless, of course,
the music was recorded digitally or digitally remastered from the original, which in that case you might as well just be listening to it on CD, as that extra bit of life is "stripped".


Quote by ErikLensherr
Hasn't the average price of CDs actually gone down because of pirating? When I was a kid I remember them regularly being $20 and now even new releases are like $10 at Target.
I'd imagine they'd have to be, being that no one buys CD's anymore (it's a shame) and have resorted to online services. Not that it matters at all, being that the music industry has been going downhill as of recent.

But look at software: do you really think Pro Tools is worth $600? How many people do you know who own it have actually purchased it from their own pocket?
#58
Quote by Ian_the_fox
I've got nothing against a pair of decent cans (ATH-M50's for example, love those things), I'm just saying listening to music on a good stereo system correctly set up with a good spread is better. It's like the band is actually in your room, performing in front of you (assuming it's a good mix).
That's not what you said. What you said was 'lol headphones'...

No one was arguing for headphones over proper stereo systems.

I've compared lossless files, CD's,

Well they're the same thing, so well done.

and good-condition vinyl. Vinyl wins hands-down when it comes to quality.
Notice that you never define quality.
Not sure what it is but is has that extra little sprinkle of "life" to it.
And this section is purely made up/hallucinatory

EDIT: Pro Tools comes with some pretty hefty hardware mate.
#59
Quote by anvil is god
A lot of my vinyl is my dads from the 70's, so that doesn't help me. Also, I've had brand new albums that pop.
If brand new albums pop, then that's you're own stupid fault. Get a working player with a half-decent stylus. And keep your grubby hands off the grooves.

Learn how to vinyl correctly, FFS.
#60
My justification for downloading music is that I would be delighted if thousands of people were getting enjoyment from something I created, whether they paid for it or not. Hell, I'd upload the torrent myself. Imagine someone on the other side of the world listening to something that you wrote sat on the end of your bed in your underpants at 3am. That'd be worth more to me than the pennies I'd make on selling them a CD.
#61
I'm slowly trying to buy back everything I've downloaded. Well at least the stuff I like. There was a bunch of shit that I'll never listen to again.

I just pay for Spoitfy to listen to most of my music before I buy it. I'll only download it if I can't find it anywhere else.

As I said earlier, I don't really like people who illegally download games. So many game companies are going out of business. I can't see how someone can justify taking their games for free when a lot of them aren't doing well. I mean THQ just went under. They were pretty damn big.
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
#62
I don't do it. The only time I think it's a problem is when it has the potential to harm the person being pirated, like a band getting kicked off a label. People who justify it are ******s.
#63
Quote by Johnny_Ibanez
My justification for downloading music is that I would be delighted if thousands of people were getting enjoyment from something I created, whether they paid for it or not. Hell, I'd upload the torrent myself. Imagine someone on the other side of the world listening to something that you wrote sat on the end of your bed in your underpants at 3am. That'd be worth more to me than the pennies I'd make on selling them a CD.


But that's the point. The key is music YOU'VE created. If you didn't want to sell YOUR music, you'd release it for free on Bandcamp or the like.

If a band joins a label and sells their music then they are requesting that you pay for their music and they want to make a living from it. You have no right to say that they can't do that, which is effectively what you're doing by taking their music for free.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
#64
Quote by willT08
That's not what you said. What you said was 'lol headphones'...

No one was arguing for headphones over proper stereo systems.
I said "Lol @ 'headphones'" because if you're only listening to your music on phones, no matter how good they are, you're missing out on life. Greatly


Quote by willT08
Well they're the same thing, so well done.
The files, yes. But the means of hooking your computer up to your system in order to play them plays a part. It's meaningless if you're PC has jack-shit for a sound card or you're using shitty Walmart cables.

Quote by willT08
Notice that you never define quality.
And this section is purely made up/hallucinatory

EDIT: Pro Tools comes with some pretty hefty hardware mate.
Honestly, I don't know how to define it. All I can say is, when I listen to live albums, I can just feel the breath going through the microphone, see the faces in the crowd so much better, and get a more realistic experience than just listening to it digitally.

How to put that in technical terms, hell I can't say.
#65
THQ isn't really going under just not doing splendid. It's a way for them to absolve themselves from debts and try trimming down so really, the filing of chapter 11 is somewhat superficial. If they were really going under, the shitstorm would be a lot bigger. Big publishers ****ed up big time and piracy became a really convenient scapegoat. It's really no wonder why triple a publishers aren't doing well, especially when each of their releases aims to be the next Crysis in terms of specs. On the other hand, there have been a lot of people in gaming that have made a killing like Gabe Newell, notch and other indie devs in the piracy age.
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Last edited by Cianyx at Jan 18, 2013,
#66
Quote by Ian_the_fox
I said "Lol @ 'headphones'" because if you're only listening to your music on phones, no matter how good they are, you're missing out on life. Greatly
Greatly? Really?
You honestly think the process of life is greatly diminished by the wrong choice of medium through which you listen to music? I know you're just saying stupid shit for a rise but I don't even care.

The files, yes. But the means of hooking your computer up to your system in order to play them plays a part. It's meaningless if you're PC has jack-shit for a sound card or you're using shitty Walmart cables.
Well nobody's getting out there Commodore to play music. The difference is miniscule most of the time.

How to put that in technical terms, hell I can't say.

That'd be because there is no technical difference. Any experiences you think you might have that separate Vinyl from Lossless files on the same system are purely hallucinatory because of your psychological attachment to how you expect Vinyl to sound.
#67
Quote by Ian_the_fox
I said "Lol @ 'headphones'" because if you're only listening to your music on phones, no matter how good they are, you're missing out on life. Greatly


The files, yes. But the means of hooking your computer up to your system in order to play them plays a part. It's meaningless if you're PC has jack-shit for a sound card or you're using shitty Walmart cables.

Honestly, I don't know how to define it. All I can say is, when I listen to live albums, I can just feel the breath going through the microphone, see the faces in the crowd so much better, and get a more realistic experience than just listening to it digitally.

How to put that in technical terms, hell I can't say.

Obviously, you've never used a decent pair of open cans. I'll take mine over a stereo any day.
Also, cables don't make a difference dipshit.
#68
I don't care if someone does it, but almost all pro-piracy arguments are basically an elaborate explanation of how they feel they deserve to not pay for shit, which is quite hilarious actually. The self entitlement issues is pretty funny.

You read about something like the Humble Indie Bundle, where you get to pick your price to 1 cent to $100. Majority of people who downloaded this game did it illegally where they didn't feel like the game was even worth a single penny out of their pocket.


Also the whole argument "Well the artist only gets 10% from music sales" doesn't justify it better, now instead of giving them 10%, you're giving them 0%.
2013 #5 Uger
2012 #7 Uger

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don't worry guys his girlfriend is black, she said it was okay for him to say that.



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Original Music

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#69
Quote by Cianyx
THQ isn't really going under just not doing splendid. It's a way for them to absolve themselves from debts and try trimming down so really, the filing of chapter 11 is somewhat superficial. If they were really going under, the shitstorm would be a lot bigger. Big publishers ****ed up big time and piracy became a really convenient scapegoat. It's really no wonder why triple a publishers aren't doing well, especially when each of their releases aims to be the next Crysis in terms of specs. On the other hand, there have been a lot of people in gaming that have made a killing like Gabe Newell, notch and other indie devs in the piracy age.

oh ok, well that's better than I thought for them

And yea, I don't really care if someone wants to torrent CoD or GTA. Whatever, those games will make millions (if not billion) of dollars, but I won't be doing it. But I know guys who will download from all these smaller companies that put out games like The Walking Dead

It's just all "wtf are you doing!?!"

idk, maybe that's just me :/
___

Quote by The_Blode
she was saying things like... do you want to netflix and chill but just the chill part...too bad she'll never know that I only like the Netflix part...
Last edited by WCPhils at Jan 18, 2013,
#70
Quote by ErikLensherr
Hasn't the average price of CDs actually gone down because of pirating? When I was a kid I remember them regularly being $20 and now even new releases are like $10 at Target.


Idk, it's always been $10 for new releases at places like Target and Best Buy
2013 #5 Uger
2012 #7 Uger

Quote by jetfuel495
Jesus, Horsedick, you are my hero

Quote by JayT44
don't worry guys his girlfriend is black, she said it was okay for him to say that.



Stalk Me

Shitty Covers

Original Music

Lastfm
#71
Actually, "not doing splendid" might have been a slight exaggeration on my part. On second thoughts, they're doing pretty bad but not dire, I guess

Anyway, I wouldn't steal any games that are on steam, which kinda means all games that isn't ubisoft or EA. Considering the amount of sales they have, it feels pretty douchey to do so.
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#72
Quote by willT08
Greatly? Really?
You honestly think the process of life is greatly diminished by the wrong choice of medium through which you listen to music?
Yes. You don't know what it's like to be at a Jethro Tull concert in your bedroom.


Quote by willT08
Well nobody's getting out there Commodore to play music. The difference is miniscule most of the time.
If you're hooking it up via a cheap Walmart 1/8" to RCA cable then the difference is enormous. Even when I use my M-Audio Fast Track (which I don't use for recording anymore) to hook it up, CD's still sound superior.


Quote by willT08
That'd be because there is no technical difference. Any experiences you think you might have that separate Vinyl from Lossless files on the same system are purely hallucinatory because of your psychological attachment to how you expect Vinyl to sound.
Again, it depends on whether or not it was recorded using a DAW or Reel2Reel.

Buying vinyl albums that were recorded or remastered digitally is a waste of time and money, because there was no analog signal to begin with.

Read this: http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/question487.htm


Quote by anvil is god
Obviously, you've never used a decent pair of open cans. I'll take mine over a stereo any day.
Try a decent stereo, not one that says "RCA" on the front. Like, a real, high quality stereo, if you even have access to one (which you probably don't, lol).


Quote by anvil is god
Also, cables don't make a difference dipshit.




Man, you're mentally retarded, aren't you?
#73
Quote by Ian_the_fox
I said "Lol @ 'headphones'" because if you're only listening to your music on phones, no matter how good they are, you're missing out on life. Greatly


If you're madly obsessed with vinyl, you're missing out on life. Greatly.
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I've got a handle on the fiction.

I'm losing my grip, 'cos I'm losing my fingers.
#74
I only listen to old music, and i don't really see any harm in me downloading music by artists that are either long dead or ridicilously wealthy.
#75
I have downloaded stuff in the past but for the most part I buy music and games, my computer's got thousands of dollars worth of music/programs on it and nearly all of it is legal. I just slowly accumulate crap I guess.

Last week I even paid $30 to download music legally off a label's website
Quote by ChucklesMginty
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#76
Quote by Ian_the_fox
Yes. You don't know what it's like to be at a Jethro Tull concert in your bedroom.
Nor do I want to.


If you're hooking it up via a cheap Walmart 1/8" to RCA cable then the difference is enormous. Even when I use my M-Audio Fast Track (which I don't use for recording anymore) to hook it up, CD's still sound superior.
Yes, cheapest of the range cables and soundcards will make a difference. That's why I said 'most' of the time.


Again, it depends on whether or not it was recorded using a DAW or Reel2Reel.

Buying vinyl albums that were recorded or remastered digitally is a waste of time and money, because there was no analog signal to begin with.

Read this: http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/question487.htm
No it doesn't.

I study Music Technology and had an exam on Digital Audio 2 days ago. You don't need to link me to stuff. Also, that page is laughable and I shouldn't even have to point out why. That graph is an absolute joke and I notice they don't reference anything.

If you'd like me start pulling excerpts from Roads (1994) and Watkinson (1996) I can.
#77
Yeah I do it and is wrong

Although I justify it to myself because I have no way to buy anything via the internet therefore I have no way to get most of the stuff I download >_> (I could buy only like 0.01% of that stuff in my city).

There are times where instead of illegally downloading a videogame to play it I just watch a let's play of it on youtube....so I guess it's something...?

We already have "free" access to most stuff in a limited manner; so although piracy is bad, it's not as bad as stealing in the "real world" considering the medium it belongs to.
#78
You can justify downloading songs/videos if you do it from youtube.

So if you just "happen" to stumble into an illegal video (like a copyrighted song), and you "happen" to download it, then technically you didn't do anything illegal right? The only one doing something "illegal" is the guy uploading the video.
#80
Quote by gonzaw
So if you just "happen" to stumble into an illegal video (like a copyrighted song), and you "happen" to download it, then technically you didn't do anything illegal right? The only one doing something "illegal" is the guy uploading the video.

i assume this post is a joke, but the funny thing about this is that all the anti-filesharing folks no doubt watch illegal videos on youtube, which is literally no different from downloading an album from mediafire as far as ip laws go.