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jkielq91
Tab Contributor
Join date: Sep 2007
331 IQ
#1
Hi,

I want a mic for recording both male and female vocals, acoustic and electric guitars, and some various percussion sounds like shakers. But the absolute priority is vocals.

My styles are mainly classic rock, blues, southern rock and Beatles covers.

I have done some research and found the results linked below. Which would you recommend most? Do you know of any thing better in this price range?

Rode NT1A

http://www.andertons.co.uk/condenser-mics/pid17610/cid752/rode-nt1a-complete-vocal-recording-system.asp

(Comes with pop shield, shock mount and XLR cable)


SE X1

http://www.andertons.co.uk/condenser-mics/pid17644/cid752/se-x1-largediaphragm-condenser-microphone.asp


Audio Technica AT2020

http://www.andertons.co.uk/condenser-mics/pid10824/cid752/audio-technica-at2020-condenser-mic.asp


Audio Technica AT2035

http://www.andertons.co.uk/condenser-mics/pid23154/cid752/audio-technica-at2035-cardioid-condenser-microphone.asp

-------

Remember, vocals are the priority. I can add more mic's in the future.

No USB microphones please.

Thanks in advanced =)
Sid McCall
(Actually, I'm Scott)
Join date: Jul 2006
110 IQ
#2
Out of those options, I'd go with the AT2020. I don't have much experience with those mics, but based on specs and price point, that's my recommendation.
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oneblackened
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#3
The X1 is supposed to be a pretty nice mic - but I've heard even better things about the SE2200a II C.
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DeadPolitical
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#5
For your style, I would not recommend the AT2020. I own one and it works the best with soft vocals. It is a great sounding mic, but high decibels are not good for it at all.
HeavyKaribean
Registered User
Join date: Jan 2013
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#6
Well i don't know how professional you want to be but from what i read the ideal for you would be versatility. In that case SM57 and SM58 from Shure are in my opinion the best options. You can record almost everything with them. They aren't the best but they are far from being the worst. The price is a little higher than the AT2020 but they are dynamic microphones. You won't need phantom power and they are more resistant. Give them a search if you want. And good recording =D
kyle62
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Join date: May 2007
190 IQ
#7
Quote by jkielq91
Vocals are the absolute priority.

Remember, vocals are the priority.



Quote by HeavyKaribean
Well i don't know how professional you want to be but from what i read the ideal for you would be versatility. In that case SM57 and SM58 from Shure are in my opinion the best options. You can record almost everything with them. They aren't the best but they are far from being the worst. The price is a little higher than the AT2020 but they are dynamic microphones. You won't need phantom power and they are more resistant. Give them a search if you want. And good recording =D



Please don't listen to this guy.

I honestly think the Behringer B-2 PRO is the best mic in that price range. The SE X1 and SE 2000 are both excellent though.
PSimonR
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Join date: Nov 2010
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#8
All the mics in your list will do an acceptable job. I have an AT2020 and its a good mic, perhaps a little bright for you music styles. Whichever you buy you need a good stand, a suspension mount and a pop shield so if you can get these in a package then all well and good. I would at to the list this mic:
http://www.soundslive.co.uk/product~name~Sontronics-STC2-Black~ID~8809.asp
which I also own and use for vocals.
I would not consider a SM57/8 type suitable for recording use, these are good vocal PA mics (or the SM57 for mic'ing electric guitar and other LOUD stuff, snare for example).
lockwolf
Recording's AdBot/Dick
Join date: Jun 2007
100 IQ
#9
AT2035 (Same as the 2020 but with a few extra features) or SE X1. The NT1-A is okay but overpriced.
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Artemis Entreri
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#10
Quote by HeavyKaribean
Well i don't know how professional you want to be but from what i read the ideal for you would be versatility. In that case SM57 and SM58 from Shure are in my opinion the best options. You can record almost everything with them. They aren't the best but they are far from being the worst. The price is a little higher than the AT2020 but they are dynamic microphones. You won't need phantom power and they are more resistant. Give them a search if you want. And good recording =D


No.


I like the NT1 a lot, though I'm a big fan of Rode mics in general. It might be a little bright to work well with amplified guitars but I love the way it works with acoustic instruments like shakers and guitars. I'd try to get it used though, they jack up the price for all that extra stuff. The at2020 is a great option too but I think the nt1 is better; it certainly has less self noise - it's nearly silent.
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HeavyKaribean
Registered User
Join date: Jan 2013
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#11
Lol anyone tried SM57/58 for recording?
'Cause you all seem noob to me sorry. All trying to look smart with technic stuff and probably thinking that microphones make a major difference in how the recording will sound in the end.
Well that's a lie. Cause nowadays microphones have reached a very high level of quality. Besides that you can make every mic sound like every other mic just by working with positioning. This is true, go search and practice a little. It's even possible to make a cardioid sound like omni just by changing position. But if you want to go all specific and stuff yeah go to the specs of the mics and show me the major frequency response differences, signal-to-noise ratio, polar pattern and all that fancy words you know how to say but just don't give a **** of what they mean.
So basically yeah you are all full of shit. =D
ChemicalFire
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#12
Quote by HeavyKaribean
Lol anyone tried SM57/58 for recording?
'Cause you all seem noob to me sorry. All trying to look smart with technic stuff and probably thinking that microphones make a major difference in how the recording will sound in the end.
Well that's a lie. Cause nowadays microphones have reached a very high level of quality. Besides that you can make every mic sound like every other mic just by working with positioning. This is true, go search and practice a little. It's even possible to make a cardioid sound like omni just by changing position. But if you want to go all specific and stuff yeah go to the specs of the mics and show me the major frequency response differences, signal-to-noise ratio, polar pattern and all that fancy words you know how to say but just don't give a **** of what they mean.
So basically yeah you are all full of shit. =D


All mics are good for something. SM58's can work for vocals but only in specific circumstances when the voice is right for it. This happens infrequently and so your best bet is a LDC.

You make half a good point. But since the sm58's eq band is so poor compared to an LDC you don't make a good point at all. You can't simply add frequencies that aren't there in post.

If you want to prove to us that your telling the truth I think we'd be all happy to hear you out; but the burden of proof is with you, not us. Honestly the whole line of "and probably thinking that microphones make a major difference in how the recording will sound in the end" really makes me doubt your credentials. Even I can tell the difference between my SM58 clone and my AT LDC. It's huge. The LDC is so much bigger and so much warmer.
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Last edited by ChemicalFire at Jan 22, 2013,
HeavyKaribean
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#14
Lol well then I would like to know what is a big and warm sound cause thats completely subjective. And eq band is poor? like you need more than 15 kHz for voice? Lol do you know what you are talking about or do you look to graphics and the one with higher values is the better? SM58 needs specific circumstances like what? voice right for it? yeah voices higher than 15 kHz lol do you understand the joke? xD
And thinking that microphones make a major difference in how the recording will sound in the end is in fact a mistake if you can't make a good recording with 100 € mics you won't make it with 1000 €*mics. 'Cause it's not lack of material is lack of technic. And I don't need to prove nothing to you. You are the one that says that a frequency response from 50 Hz to 15 kHz is poor. Great knowledge that you show xD
So yeah i really doubt your credentials =D
HeavyKaribean
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#15
Quote by jkielq91
Thanks for all the great advice.

I wasnt expecting much love for the 2020 judging by the price.


Never judge something by the price.
ChemicalFire
King of Bacon Pancakes
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#16
My knowledge of microphone eq graphs is indeed lacking. But I know what I hear.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
ChemicalFire
King of Bacon Pancakes
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#18
It's not the high end that's the issue... why would it be? Body never has and never will come from the 15k range...
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
HeavyKaribean
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#21
Lol artemis, i comment and you just say no as answer. You are the one trolling certainly xD
ChemicalFire
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#22
Apart from that dip in the low mids and the hype in the top end...
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
Artemis Entreri
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#23
Quote by HeavyKaribean
Lol artemis, i comment and you just say no as answer. You are the one trolling certainly xD


Because your answer was ridiculously ignorant. You CAN record anything with anything but that does not, by ANY means make it a good option. Especially with the "from what I've read." Reading and experience are two very different things.

Chemical and I argue a lot, but I'm fully with him on this thread except for my preference of the NT1.
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HeavyKaribean
Registered User
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#24
and you hear that? ahah xD have you tested that? really seeing and hearing what that dip and hype mean?
you don't even know what it means. so shut the **** up. Saying a mic is better than other based on how it responds at 50 Hz and 15 kHz. FOR VOICE? ****ing idiot xD
oneblackened
Better Than You At Mixing
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#25
Dude... It's just a fact of life that condensers are more sensitive than dynamics...

Let it not be said that dynamics aren't useful. SM7Bs are very useful for vocals.
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Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
HeavyKaribean
Registered User
Join date: Jan 2013
20 IQ
#26
Artemis you are just a noob. Yeah experience is needed. And you dont seem to have it.
There is no aspect in wich NT1 would be a better option than Shure, Behringer, etc... they would all do a ****ing good job and a good quality recording if not used by noobs like you.
ChemicalFire
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#27
Please enlighten us oh master. Show us your genius masterwork.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
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Artemis Entreri
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#28
Quote by HeavyKaribean
Artemis you are just a noob. Yeah experience is needed. And you dont seem to have it.
There is no aspect in wich NT1 would be a better option than Shure, Behringer, etc... they would all do a ****ing good job and a good quality recording if not used by noobs like you.


You....you simply baffle me
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ChemicalFire
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#29
Quote by HeavyKaribean
and you hear that? ahah xD have you tested that? really seeing and hearing what that dip and hype mean?
you don't even know what it means. so shut the **** up. Saying a mic is better than other based on how it responds at 50 Hz and 15 kHz. FOR VOICE? ****ing idiot xD


The Eq response curve has nothing to do with how they response at 50hz and 15 khz, it's do with how they respond at every eq point between... the eq curve shows that the low mids have a slight dip and the highs are loud as ****.

I know what words mean and your a condescending idiot with nothing to back up your big talk.
All I want is for everyone to go to hell...
...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



Quote by DisarmGoliath
You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
oneblackened
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#30
Calling Derek! CALLING DEREK!
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Quote by Anonden
You CAN play anything with anything....but some guitars sound right for some things, and not for others. Single coils sound retarded for metal, though those who are apeshit about harpsichord probably beg to differ.
HeavyKaribean
Registered User
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#31
The Eq response curve has nothing to do with how they response at 50hz and 15 khz? Lol nothing more to say.. no sense arguing with idiots
ChemicalFire
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#32
Quote by HeavyKaribean
The Eq response curve has nothing to do with how they response at 50hz and 15 khz? Lol nothing more to say.. no sense arguing with idiots


As you've said yourself, you can't HEAR those frequencies, so why do they matter?

Now you're just contradicting yourself.


And you're not arguing. You're going "LALALALA I'M RIGHT YOU'RE WRONG LALALALA I'M NOT LISTENING" whilst insulting people. That does not an argument make.
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...It's the last place I was seen before I lost myself



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You can be the deputy llamma of the recordings forum!
Last edited by ChemicalFire at Jan 22, 2013,
jof1029
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#33
Quote by HeavyKaribean
It's even possible to make a cardioid sound like omni just by changing position.

Maybe you can make a generic cardioid sound like a generic omni in some cases by changing position. but you cannot make it behave the same way. each polar pattern has its uses, and saying otherwise is simply wrong.

now, if you can make something like an Shure sm57 sound like a Neumann U87 (or other high end condensor), i applaud you. it is something that no other person has managed. like polar patterns, for the rest of us mere mortals, different types of microphones, and even different mics of the same type, all have their uses.

because yes, i would still rather use a small diaphram condensor on an acoustic than a sm57.
kyle62
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#34


Either it's a troll...or someone just got an SM57 for Christmas and is butthurt that it's not the world-beating Über-mic they expected.

Quote by HeavyKaribean
Cause nowadays microphones have reached a very high level of quality.
If that's your argument, why are you recommending a mic that dates back to the 1950s?


Quote by HeavyKaribean
Besides that you can make every mic sound like every other mic just by working with positioning. This is true, go search and practice a little.

Of course.

Nothing brings out the richness and depth of a Bosendorfer 290 like the Shure Green Bullet. And my personal favourite way to capture a screaming Marshall stack is a lavalier mic clipped to the grille cloth.
HeavyKaribean
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#35
Saying that an idiot is an idiot is pure realism and should not be taken as an insult. And I'll have my degree in Audio Engineering back up my big talk. But I'll explain:

http://www.rodemic.com/mics/nt1-a here are the specifications of rode NT1a

http://media.rodemic.com//images/mics/nt1-a/nt1-a_freq.jpg this is the frequency response of the same. And what is the frequency response?

The FR (Frequency Response from now on FR, do not interpretate as being Frequency of Resonance) is the way the mic responds trough out the audible band of frequencies. In a non redundant speech is the boost or decrement of the output signal and will vary based on the pressure, frequency or angle of incidence of the acoustic wave in the mic membrane. Normally, frequency response graphics are made to a standard pressure and angle of incidence. As may notice, the X scale of the graphic is set from 10-10 dB's. The objective of a perfect microphone response is to be flat at all frequencies. However perfection is impossible because microphones are based on physical principles and minor variations may occur. Let's say that 1dB or 2dB of pontual variation isn't bad. Has you can see the X scale is made so that you think that the response is mainly good. But that's wrong. If the scale was from 5-5 dB's you would see that at 3000 Hz, 5000 Hz and 10000 Hz the output signal will have a significant boost wich is bad for any recording specially in the middle frequencies that have major weight in almost every type os music. Is this a major problem? Well it's not good but it's easily solved. How? Positioning and equalization. This graphic is made upon measures taken on axis at the distance of one meter. You change that and you change everything.

Now someone understood wrong when I said that microphones won't make a major diference in the way the recording sounds. I'm not saying that there aren't specific microphones for specific situations, I'm saying that if you thinks that's your biggest problem well you are wrong. As I said before. Positioning of the microphone will solve many of your problems. The thing is that such requires a level of experience of a life time. I don't have it, you probably don't have it too, and nobody here probably knows about it 'cause they all made a big scandal when I said SM57 and SM58. But I'm telling the truth. I had a teacher, 60 years old. He would go the AES conventions and make a a 50 € behringer sound like a 5000 € Neumann. It's a life time of work.

Now believe me when I say that from the microphones you have on your list won't make a difference if you choose number one, two or three. They are basically the same. I like condenser microphones, they are usually more flat than dynamic microphones and all but not the ones you have there. You will see that worst problem you have are your monitors and the room in wich you are recording. 'Cause that is what really will change your sound.

The problem with condenser microphones is that high SPL (sound pressure levels) can easily damage them. Percussion might be a problem. Singing very loud can also be a problem. You will have less versatility.

Don't listen to haters. They just don't know of what they talk. I have made a lot of nice recordings of classical guitars, acoustic guitars, snares, even voice with an SM57. And yes I have other microphones. I have Rodes, AKG and i worked with many more. You can do a good job with all of them. If you are starting I think a versatile microphone would be more useful to you.

To all the haters:

jof1029: You should then applaud me. And if you prefer small diaphragm condensor microphones that's your taste but I assure you, you wouldn't do a better job than me with an SM57 recording an Acoustic Guitar.

Chemical Fire: Is this argument enough?

Oneblackened: I liked your comment. They are more sensitive indeed. Nothing to say there.

Artemis: No.
jof1029
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#36
Quote by HeavyKaribean
And if you prefer small diaphragm condensor microphones that's your taste but I assure you, you wouldn't do a better job than me with an SM57 recording an Acoustic Guitar.

thats not the point. i know i would do better with a half decenent SDC than an SM57 on an acoustic. because ive done both. im not comparing me with one mic to you with another, thats a silly comparison. if youve got the same person with the choice between two mics, which would they choose? thats the point.

when you say someone can make a cheap mic sound great, i ask what they could do with a great mic meant for that application.

as for the sm57, it is a great utility mic, i wont argue that. it just would not be my first choice for someone who was primarily recording vocals and acoustics.
HeavyKaribean
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#37
Quote by jof1029
thats not the point. i know i would do better with a half decenent SDC than an SM57 on an acoustic.


That is wrong. I would believe if you say that you will find the sound you want faster with a SDC than with the SM57 but if you know what you are doing you can make the two sound good.

Now if you say that you prefer the sound of SDC ok fine. It's taste. But it isn't better or worst.
HeavyKaribean
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#38
And i forgot. I didn't say they could make a cheap mic sound great. I said they can make a cheap mic sound THE SAME as a great one. The good one would not do a better job. The experiment was basically this:

A classical guitar. Someone (with knowledge in the matter) would go and place the Neumann.
Record was made. He would listen and than he would place the Behringer in a place were it would sound the same.
Just that.

And when i say classical guitar is just an example. This was done many times even recording monitors playing music.

It's possible. You just have to be boss xD
Artemis Entreri
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#39
Quote by HeavyKaribean
And i forgot. I didn't say they could make a cheap mic sound great. I said they can make a cheap mic sound THE SAME as a great one. The good one would not do a better job. The experiment was basically this:

A classical guitar. Someone (with knowledge in the matter) would go and place the Neumann.
Record was made. He would listen and than he would place the Behringer in a place were it would sound the same.
Just that.

And when i say classical guitar is just an example. This was done many times even recording monitors playing music.

It's possible. You just have to be boss xD



That's simply not true. I hope you realize what you're saying is absurd. I do not deny that the skill of the engineer is by far the most important part of a signal chain but the day a Nuemann and a Behringer sound the same I'll eat a brick.


And please, please post a recording of you tracking an acoustic guitar with an SM57. Hell, I'll let you use a pair. Because I really want to like SM57s on acoustic guitars but even with a $1000 preamp, it lacks the clarity and definition of a decent SDC. That's not only preference, it's a better. Of course you can record an acoustic guitar with an SM57, no one will say you can't. You can even make it sound good; Some of Zeppelin's acoustic stuff was done with one. But why do it when you could use a condenser which is more appropriate for the task?
Winner of the 2011 Virginia Guitar Festival

Protools HD
Lynx Aurora 16/HD192
Mojave, Sennheiser, AKG, EV etc mics
Focusrite ISA828 pres
Waves Mercury
Random Rack Gear

65 Deluxe Reverb
PRS CE 22
American Standard Strat
Taylor 712
Last edited by Artemis Entreri at Jan 22, 2013,
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