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#1
As much as I appreciate all the advice I'm getting in the Les Paul thread, I'm kinda derailing it. So I'm gunna ask for your advice here.

Two weeks ago Friday just gone, I bought a Gibson Les Paul 57 Reissue. Three pickup black beauty. My dream guitar. It cost me £1500 off gumtree. The guy sent it the following Wednesday from Glasgow to me, in Dorset.

Long story short, nearly two weeks after he sent it it still hasn't showed up. He is not giving me a tracking number, despite me quite clearly asking for it about ten times now. I've asked for a refund which he has put through but hasn't appeared in my account.

So what do I do?
#6
Whatever you don't delay getting the police involved first thing Monday. And don't listen to those who are telling you to delay contacting the police that is exactly what the scam artist wants you to do.

It is a big mistake to delay taking action since that puts time on the side of the scam artist.

It makes me wonder if some scam artists are working UG to find out the preferences of UG members, then post a "great deal" to lure the unsuspecting victim into a sale, then after the sale goes bad, the scam artists posts messages on UG to convince the victim to delay action until it is too late.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#7
Why wait 'till Monday? The police are open for business now.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!


alhaq369
It is very impotent to success a business.
#8
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Why wait 'till Monday? The police are open for business now.


U R right! Go ahead and file a police report today if your money is not back in your account already. Delaying just gives the scam artist time to ship a fake to you, then it becomes a "civil" matter, not a criminal matter.

If the scam artist is monitoring UG, Monday may be too late.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#10
After duping you into waiting til late Monday to file a police report, don't be surprised if the scam artists tell you Monday that he has located your guitar and that he is shipping it to you right away and don't be surprised if you get a fake after it is too late for you to recover your money.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#11
Quote by ihartfood
I seriously doubt the guy is monitoring UG. that seems like a serious stretch.



Not a stretch at all, If Izzy told the scam artist that he is a member of UG, of course, he would monitor UG.

The stretch is beginning duped into waiting til late Monday to file a police report.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#14
Quote by WholeLottaIzzy
I paid by bank transfer.

Notify your bank of your concerns- they should have records of the transaction, including who- or at least what bank- was on the other side.

If it really is a scam, you may be able to get the other guy's account frozen pretty quickly. Even if you can't, that will be valuable data for the police.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!


alhaq369
It is very impotent to success a business.
#16
Quote by WholeLottaIzzy
I paid by bank transfer.


Has he transferred the money back to your account? If not you should go ahead and make a police report, so there is a record of it before Monday, in case the scam artist tries to say that he found your guitar and is "re-shipping" it on Monday. If he ships you a fake on Monday, he may be able to turn his fraud into a "civil" matter that the police won't handle.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#17
Quote by dannyalcatraz
Notify your bank of your concerns- they should have records of the transaction, including who- or at least what bank- was on the other side.

If it really is a scam, you may be able to get the other guy's account frozen pretty quickly. Even if you can't, that will be valuable data for the police.


Yes and you will also have him on a separate charge of wire fraud, but it is imperative that you not let him turn this into a simple "civil" matter by shipping you a fake on Monday.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#18
Still no money appearing? **** man. I transfered some money between my 2 bank accounts today (different banks) and the funds appeared instantly.

Do you have an address? I'm not gonna lie, i'd never send money like that, but there has no be safeguards in place for the occasion that someone does trust someone and they turn out to be a cuntbucket.

What I'd do now is call him up and ask for an address as you're going to the Police, if he refuses tell him that the Police will be contacting the bank and will get it anyway and if he's innocent he should have nothing to hide.

If it does turn out to be bogus I think that you should post his number in the Pit, explain the story and get the might of UG on your side.

I dunno how old you are, but have your mum or dad said anything?
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


Last edited by Mephaphil at Jan 26, 2013,
#19
If you do get a guitar in the post Monday it could be a fake, don't accept it. Surely then you haven't accepted any goods so he should get the fake back and you'll get your money back.

I think with this guy its a risk, I wouldn't accept anything from him. Tell the courier to return it.

No civil case then, if he doesn't refund the cash he's nicked it.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


#20
He's apparently transferred the money but it's slow through his account. It won't leave his account until Monday. I will go to the bank Monday and ensure the transfer has been made.

The tracking number, he claims as his us a business account, he can only track the guitar's location.
#22
I'm an American lawyer- IOW, not up to speed on UK/EU law- but I can't see how sending a fake turns this into a civil case.

A fake being sent is still some kind of fraud, after all.

It may be a civil case if what is sent is non-conforming in minor details- its not the represented condition, color, or some such- but not if it is simply not at all what was offered for sale.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!


alhaq369
It is very impotent to success a business.
#23
Quote by dannyalcatraz
I'm an American lawyer- IOW, not up to speed on UK/EU law- but I can't see how sending a fake turns this into a civil case.

A fake being sent is still some kind of fraud, after all.

It may be a civil case if what is sent is non-conforming in minor details- its not the represented condition, color, or some such- but not if it is simply not at all what was offered for sale.


While you are technically correct, as a practical matter, if the police see that a guitar has been sent, they are not likely to get involved in authenticating the value of the guitar for a single transaction. If it is a case of multiple fraudulent acts by this guy, they may get involved, but my guess is the police will pass the buck if it is a single transaction, there is just too much crime for a single non-violent case like this to get the attention of the police. I guess Izzy could prosecute the case himself as people do in General Sessions Court in America.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Last edited by LP1951 at Jan 26, 2013,
#24
Quote by Tom 1.0


... I only advise waiting till Monday on the off chance it finally gets delivered.

.


Only the scam artists benefit by delaying the police report until "late Monday" as you told Izzy to do.

Everyone else urged Izzy to go ahead and make a police report today.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Last edited by LP1951 at Jan 26, 2013,
#25
^Just stating the odd fact that you are the only one who urged Izzy to wait until "late Monday" to contact the police.

Your explanation of why you urged him not to act in his best interest is not reasonable.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#26
You really don't do yourself any favours LP1951.

Personally I would go ASAP, I think that the guy is giving anyone enough of a reason to go and needs to have a kick up his arse.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


#27
Quote by Mephaphil
You really don't do yourself any favours LP1951.



I have no idea what you are talking about. I'm not trying to do myself any "favours." I'm only trying to give Izzy the best advice as is everyone else but Tom 1.0 who oddly urged Izzy to delay acting in his best interest to make the police report immediately.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#28
Quote by Tom 1.0
And I'm also the only one here who has the best understanding of how the Police would approach this...


That statement is about as believable as the scam artist saying that he shipped the guitar to Izzy but only he can track the shipment.

The bottom line is that waiting until "late Monday" to file a police report only serves the interest of the scam artist.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
Last edited by LP1951 at Jan 26, 2013,
#29
Quote by Tom 1.0
Believe what you want...

.


I do and that includes little to none of what you say.

Btw, Izzy has plenty of proof of deception, but every moment that Izzy delays filing the police report makes it harder to prove fraud. If as some astute observers have speculated, the scam artist now sends Izzy a fake, he will have to prove fraud and that will be costly.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#30
Quote by WholeLottaIzzy
He's apparently transferred the money but it's slow through his account. It won't leave his account until Monday. I will go to the bank Monday and ensure the transfer has been made.

The tracking number, he claims as his us a business account, he can only track the guitar's location.


Bank Wire Transfers are instantaneous. That is BS about it taking until Monday to leave his account. If he had transferred the money, you would have a record of it.

In the US, the shipping companies give a tracking number for every shipment which anyone can use to track a shipment. You don't need a business account to track a shipment.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#31
Quote by LP1951
That statement is about as believable as the scam artist saying that he shipped the guitar to Izzy but only he can track the shipment.

The bottom line is that waiting until "late Monday" to file a police report only serves the interest of the scam artist.


You realize that Tom's a British cop, right? Though I'd agree to file the police report now. The guy hasn't even proved that he's shipped the guitar yet. If he can prove that, then I'd give it a few extra days. And TBH, the price he sold it for is definitely sketchy. It's a little on the low end here in the States, and I'd assume very low in the EU.
E-peen:
Rhodes Gemini
Fryette Ultra Lead
Peavey 6505
THD Flexi 50

Gibson R0 Prototype
EBMM JP13 Rosewood
Fender CS Mary Kaye

WTLT

(512) Audio Engineering - Custom Pedal Builds, Mods and Repairs
Last edited by mmolteratx at Jan 26, 2013,
#32
Wire transfers aren't all instantaneous. A lot of banks only transfer on days they're open for business. Instant transfers are usually only within accounts at the same bank. Most transfers between banks seem to take a day or two.

And you should lay off of Tom. You don't seem to know what you're talking about.
#33
Quote by mmolteratx
You realize that Tom's a British cop, right? .


I don't believe that for a minute. He has posted that he is unemployed and his posts are way too immature to be posted by a police officer. I don't believe a word Tom 1.0 posts.
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#34
Wire transfers are same day, at least with all of the banks I do business with. Other transfers can take 2-3 days and the fee is smaller. And even then, you'll receive a notification that you're receiving a transfer via e-mail.
E-peen:
Rhodes Gemini
Fryette Ultra Lead
Peavey 6505
THD Flexi 50

Gibson R0 Prototype
EBMM JP13 Rosewood
Fender CS Mary Kaye

WTLT

(512) Audio Engineering - Custom Pedal Builds, Mods and Repairs
#36
Quote by mmolteratx
Wire transfers are same day, at least with all of the banks I do business with. Other transfers can take 2-3 days and the fee is smaller. And even then, you'll receive a notification that you're receiving a transfer via e-mail.


Thank you!
“You’re always learning about this thing every time you pick it up.” Keith Richards
#37
He might be a Special Constable. You're way too confrontational, just chill out, man.

Spend a week posting in the Pit. I want to see it.
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


#38
I am also a Special Constable.


"Moach rrrespekt, Mon!"
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!


alhaq369
It is very impotent to success a business.
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Jan 26, 2013,
#39
Quote by Tom 1.0
Right.

I am unemployed. I am also a history student at University.

I am also a Special Constable.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_Constabulary

Its not something I promote on the web, for obvious reasons.

Is everybody happy with my ****ing credentials now?

Not sure how to approach this particular post but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Anyway, all of which you suggested, I've already done. Screen cap etc. Thanks for your help man, I'll keep you posted. However, he hasn't yet sent me the screen cap. And as you said, no real crime has been committed yet. He's just being a dick. The guitar could be just ridiculously late and he has actually transferred the money but it just doesn't do it on weekends.
#40
Tom is a cop.........WTF is the world comming to?

So Hot Fuzz was based off of Tom
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
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