#1
I'm a gigging Metal guitarist currently playing A Blackstar ht-100 through a marshall 1960 cab with the t-75's, and I'm looking to find a new amp (I can't stand the diode overdrive; it feels very artificial). I've heard many great things about the newer versions of the Bugera 333xl's, the ones that don't catch on fire lol. What's everyone's opinion on it?

Here's the thing: The other guitarist in my band has a Bugera 6262, and he's been trying to stray me away from Bugera because he says that us having the same amp will kind of take away a broad range of tones. While this seems logical, I feel like it's partly because he feels like I'm copying him. But the truth is, we're broke teenagers who can't afford mesas and engl's, and it seems like Bugera is one of the best when it comes to affordability.

So my question is, will us having similar amp take away from our overall sound? And if so, can anyone recommend any alternatives?

Thanks in advance!

Edit: Alright, let me give some more info.

Budget: I'd like to stay around 5-600, as I'd like to pay for it mainly through the gear that I'm already selling.

Genre: Simply metal. As you can see from my username, I ****ing love Opeth, and their tone is amazing. I was looking into Laneys for awhile after I heard they play them but I'm in the US so it's hard to come by a used one. And yes, I play clean sections in my songs so it'd be nice to have a good clean tone.

Definitely wanna go used on buying amps.

I play shows all the time so take that into consideration.

Kansas City is the closest city to me.

As said before, I have an HT-100 and a 1960a cab, and I play mainly through a Dean Cadillac with a dimebucker in it atm.
Last edited by GodIloveOpeth at Mar 9, 2013,
#2
To answer your basic question.

No it won't take away from the overall sound. Amps can be EQ'd in different ways and those two amps have different circuits anyway. Your tone won't be his tone etc.

Yes there are alternatives.

Now. How do you know the HT-100 has diodes?

Doesn't matter. You don't like the sound.

PS: The new Bugera Infinium series have the same if not worse track record as the original 333x imo so listen to your other guitarist and stay away.


OK: Now.

Read this and then use the Edit function to edit your original post to give us the answers we need.

https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/showpost.php?p=31052894&postcount=2



oh, and welcome to GGnA
#3
Bugera amps have terrible QC and are made with incredibly cheap parts. Yes they sound good, but the reliabiliy issues would be a major consern if you are giging.

Obviously your friend is clueless, the 333xl and the 6262 are completely iffrent sounding amps. The 333xl is a clone of the Peavey JSX and the 6262 is a clone of the Peavey 5150II/6506+. Two very diffrent sounding amps.


Look at the Jet City JCA 50/100/100hdm if you need a new cheap amp.

Or look for a Used :
Peavey JSX/XXX/3120
Marshall JCM2000 DSL50/100
Laney GH50/100
Mesa Single Recto
All of these amps can be found for $500ish every day on guitar centers used site (the Mesa might be difficult)
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#4
In a band I actually find it's better if you think of the band as an overall sound rather than your guitarist ego as a singular sound. With that in mind it could be very benefitial for you to both use exactly the same amp with pretty much the same sound, for live it will create a massive sound.

Back a many few years ago I got a 5150 (end of 2004) and I thought I was the dogs bollox, my other guitarist was still using a lowly Marshall AVT150 and I thought I was awesome and that we were blending the sound. Then he bought a Marshall JMP-1 preamp and Marshall 20/20 poweramp, great sounding thing to be honest but it was again completely different to my 5150 and I liked that, but was it a good thing? In terms of sounding like a pro band probably not, but I thought it was cool at the time.

But to be honest the band probably would have sounded more "together" as a single powerhouse unit if our sounds were closer together. That guitarist was kicked from/left the band on mutual agreement and we got in a new guy, he needed an amp and the Peavey Valveking had just been released, it sounded great and could do 5150 tones and was to be honest by far the best value amp on the market at the time.

So he got the Valveking and we decided we would be less self serving and think of the band as "god", the band as a whole, we ended up with sounds that were near identical in a live situation. To be honest it sounded better, much bigger and easier to mix for the soundguy, we got more compliments about our playing and our sound because now the sound was more focussed and glued together better.

What I'm saying is, don't be afraid to both use the same amps, it can definitely be a good thing, think of it as crafting the band sound as a whole and keep the guitar sounds very balanced with each other, aswell as with the bass.

I'm not saying don't do the "different sounds" thing though either, you do your own thing and make it work, because others have. Buy the amp you want (and hope it doesnt blow up, I've seen a few of them Bugera amps blow on the live circuit, they are notorious for it).
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
Last edited by Bigbazz at Mar 8, 2013,
#5
Quote by Bigbazz
In a band I actually find it's better if you think of the band as an overall sound rather than your guitarist ego as a singular sound. With that in mind it could be very benefitial for you to both use exactly the same amp with pretty much the same sound, for live it will create a massive sound.

Back a many few years ago I got a 5150 (end of 2004) and I thought I was the dogs bollox, my other guitarist was still using a lowly Marshall AVT150 and I thought I was awesome and that we were blending the sound. Then he bought a Marshall JMP-1 preamp and Marshall 20/20 poweramp, great sounding thing to be honest but it was again completely different to my 5150 and I liked that, but was it a good thing? In terms of sounding like a pro band probably not, but I thought it was cool at the time.

But to be honest the band probably would have sounded more "together" as a single powerhouse unit if our sounds were closer together. That guitarist was kicked from/left the band on mutual agreement and we got in a new guy, he needed an amp and the Peavey Valveking had just been released, it sounded great and could do 5150 tones and was to be honest by far the best value amp on the market at the time.

So he got the Valveking and we decided we would be less self serving and think of the band as "god", the band as a whole, we ended up with sounds that were near identical in a live situation. To be honest it sounded better, much bigger and easier to mix for the soundguy, we got more compliments about our playing and our sound because now the sound was more focussed and glued together better.

What I'm saying is, don't be afraid to both use the same amps, it can definitely be a good thing, think of it as crafting the band sound as a whole and keep the guitar sounds very balanced with each other, aswell as with the bass.

I'm not saying don't do the "different sounds" thing though either, you do your own thing and make it work, because others have. Buy the amp you want (and hope it doesnt blow up, I've seen a few of them Bugera amps blow on the live circuit, they are notorious for it).

I agree that the bands sound should be the priority

The VK is a diecent cheap tube amp. It can not do 5150 tones at all

Some amps will work much better with others. I use a Marshall JCM2000 and my other guitarist uses a Mesa Dual Recto, we EQ diffrently and the 2 tones really complement each other. It is all about the EQ
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#6
Quote by Robbgnarly
I agree that the bands sound should be the priority

The VK is a diecent cheap tube amp. It can not do 5150 tones at all

Some amps will work much better with others. I use a Marshall JCM2000 and my other guitarist uses a Mesa Dual Recto, we EQ diffrently and the 2 tones really complement each other. It is all about the EQ


I own a 5150 and played and recorded alongside a guitarist who plays a Valveking for close to 6 years, i've played hundreds of shows with a 5150/VK combination. A Valveking can do 5150 tones, not only that but live it can do them so well that you cannot tell the two amps apart.

This is coming from years of side by side experience and touring. I always hear it especially from other 5150 owners, some of which have turned up at our shows and eventually agreed with me.
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
#7
Quote by Bigbazz
I own a 5150 and played and recorded alongside a guitarist who plays a Valveking for close to 6 years, i've played hundreds of shows with a 5150/VK combination. A Valveking can do 5150 tones, not only that but live it can do them so well that you cannot tell the two amps apart.

This is coming from years of side by side experience and touring. I always hear it especially from other 5150 owners, some of which have turned up at our shows and eventually agreed with me.

No it cant. I am not some young kid that believes every thing I read in line. I have played both amps many times, and the VK is not capable of 5150 tones. The tone stacks are very diffrent. Not that the VK is bad, but it is not a 5150.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#8
Quote by Robbgnarly
No it cant. I am not some young kid that believes every thing I read in line. I have played both amps many times, and the VK is not capable of 5150 tones. The tone stacks are very diffrent. Not that the VK is bad, but it is not a 5150.


The VK is perfectly capable of 5150 tones.

Lets not get into an arguement that turns into "who is the bigger man", if you don't want to believe it then you can just read it and move on. I'm stating my viewpoint based on years of side by side real world experience.

The difference between the amps is slightly more noticeable on record, as you would expect, (it isnt noticeable at all live). Here is a 4 year old video I did in my previous band, a mix of a 5150 and Valveking.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=670zoBOHK_w
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
Last edited by Bigbazz at Mar 8, 2013,
#9
Quote by Bigbazz
The VK is perfectly capable of 5150 tones.

Lets not get into an arguement that turns into "who is the bigger man", if you don't want to believe it then you can just read it and move on. I'm stating my viewpoint based on years of side by side real world experience.



It probably blends well live, however it does not sound the same. I have played both a bunch... 2 VK does not equal 5150.

Just my opinion.


Also don't be an ass. He's not even close to saying bigger man about anything. He can have his opinion as well even if it doesn't agree with yours.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5DPChFrH1c
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
Last edited by R45VT at Mar 8, 2013,
#10
I don't think you understand the meaning that it sounds exactly the same live, I've proven it so many times, a Valveking live can sound identical to a 5150, we both hit the same chord after each other and it sounds identical.

End of the day they are both high gain 6L6 amps both with JJ valves in them, both of us (at the time) were playing similar guitars (me an Ibanez Jem, and him a high end RG) as can be seen in the music video I posted, and both running into Marshall 1960A Cabs and both our settings were adjusted accordingly to even out our sound. Everytime a local 5150 owner who disagreed with me heard us live, he changed his mind. I will never let it go because I have good reason and years of experience with both these amps, so in other words I really do know better.

And this is not about opinions, it's about sharing experiences.
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
Last edited by Bigbazz at Mar 8, 2013,
#11
Quote by Bigbazz
I don't think you understand the meaning that it sounds exactly the same live, I've proven it so many times, a Valveking live can sound identical to a 5150, we both hit the same chord after each other and it sounds identical.

End of the day they are both high gain 6L6 amps both with JJ valves in them, both of us (at the time) were playing similar guitars (me an Ibanez Jem, and him a high end RG) as can be seen in the music video I posted.

Everytime a local 5150 owner who disagreed with me heard us live, he changed his mind. I will never let it go because I have good reason and years of experience with both these amps, so in other words I really do know better.


No offense but if you dumb a 5150 EQ down to a valve king it will probably sound similar.

No need to let it go. Turn the gain up to 10 on the VK and gain down to 2 on the 5150


I'm sure you can make a 5150 sound like a VK... I really don't see it going the other way unless you your EQ is the range of the VK. I get what you are saying... I just don't think a VK could keep up i with the way I had my 5150 EQ'd.

When you are in a band everything changes.

Anyway I didn't mean for it to go so far off topic.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
Last edited by R45VT at Mar 8, 2013,
#12
Quote by R45VT
No offense but if you dumb a 5150 EQ down to a valve king it will probably sound similar.

No need to let it go. Turn the gain up to 10 on the VK and gain down to 2 on the 5150


I'm sure you can make a 5150 sound like a VK... I really don't see it going the other way unless you your EQ is the range of the VK. I get what you are saying... I just don't think a VK could keep up i with the way I had my 5150 EQ'd.


We both used 4 on the gain, he had to set his volume higher on the poweramp than I did, I used less top end than he did but I like it that way (5 bass/5 mid/3 treb, 5 res/3 pres was my typical 5150 setup for live.

If that guitarist in the video above wasn't playing so sloppy and made a few quick adjustements the Peavey VK even in that fairly low volume and isolated situation would sound near identical to the 5150, put that into a live volume situation with all the blending of sounds and the room sound affecting it and you're at that point of both sounding exactly the same by time.
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
Last edited by Bigbazz at Mar 8, 2013,
#13
Quote by Bigbazz
We both used 4 on the gain, he had to set his volume higher on the poweramp than I did, I used less top end than he did but I like it that way (5 bass/5 mid/3 treb, 5 res/3 pres was my typical 5150 setup for live.


to get back on topic I think those settings would have the bugera shit a tube or worse...

I played the tri-rec at NAMM and it sounded like a mesa.. just with horrbily shitty build quality. It was funny seeing the ones in display look like ass. You would have thought they would have cared.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#15
I have a Peavey xxx ii, a valve king combo and a 333xl. I can say if you didn't like the Blackstar you won't like a Vk. I know what you mean about the gain. I used to drive the clean channel with a OD pedal cause the gain channel was awful on the VK. Although I have had no issues with the Bugera (knock on wood) for the same price you could get a used XXX and retube it. If you do get a new Bugera get the extended warranty but don't get the Bugera cab. Speakers are weak, small magnets. I think you are risking it used with whatever or new with the 333. But like I said I have played the shit out of mine before the XXX II with not even a burp.