#1
OK, so I want a bitchin amp. Peavey makes some of the best amps for metal out there. The 6505 is a beast. But the 6505+ only has 2 channels right? I want a head with a clean channel and a gain channel. I was planning on using a Maxon pedal infront. But if I want to switch to the clean channel I'd have to hit the maxon pedal and the footswitch to switch back to the clean channel. But I saw the XXX II and the 3120. They have 3 channels. But I don't know guys. Don't know what to go for. I love the tone of the 6505 with a maxon on it. SO MANY AMP!! Any input?
#2
Guitar gear & accessories would be the better sub forum for this thread.
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#3
Quote by HeavyGuitarGuy
....[ ].... But I saw the XXX II and the 3120. They have 3 channels. But I don't know guys. Don't know what to go for. I love the tone of the 6505 with a maxon on it. SO MANY AMP!! Any input?
If the "XXX" model is somewhere near right on my Vyper, I can honestly say the triple X doesn't actually have a clean channel....

And it's Peavey's own model of their own amp, how wrong could it be? Any Vyper has models of the amps you're looking at. Just use the modeler to help you choose.

The real deal can only sound better than the model.
Last edited by Captaincranky at Mar 16, 2013,
#4
Quote by Captaincranky
If the "XXX" model is somewhere near right on my Vyper, I can honestly say the triple X doesn't actually have a clean channel....

And it's Peavey's own model of their own amp, how wrong could it be. Any Vyper has models of the amps you're looking at. Just just the modeler to help you choose.

The real deal can only sound better than the model.


Time to check your logic.

Many (if not most) amp models only copy one channel from the modeled amp. The real XXX has 3 channels, including a clean channel. If you don't believe me, look in the manual:

http://peavey.com/assets/literature/manuals/80304881.pdf
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#5
Quote by jetwash69
Time to check your logic.

Many (if not most) amp models only copy one channel from the modeled amp. The real XXX has 3 channels, including a clean channel. If you don't believe me, look in the manual:
Well maybe but, The Vyper series models 2 channels, (clean and dirty), of any amp on the selector. This is done with a push on, push off on the amp selector. And as they say, "two out of three ain't bad".

I you like I can link a PDF of that for your edification.

FWIW, when I say the "XXX" doesn't have a clean channel, I mean that the amp is dirty on its clean channel.

It's pretty much a slam dunk that a "XXX" has more gain than a 6505.

The "Krankenstein" has something they call a "clean channel" too, which is as dirty as most amps "Lead", or "gain", or, "dirty" channel, whatever you want to call it.

Besides if great cleans are a consideration, just go ahead and buy a Fender Twin...
Last edited by Captaincranky at Mar 16, 2013,
#6
the vypyr serirs has a few 3 channel amp models, they picked their "favortie two"

i have one, its damn good but dont buy a peavey because you think they make the best metal amps, thats ****ing stupid
#7
Quote by Captaincranky
Well maybe but, The Vyper series models 2 channels, (clean and dirty), of any amp on the selector. This is done with a push on, push off on the amp selector. And as they say, "two out of three ain't bad".

I you like I can link a PDF of that for your edification.

FWIW, when I say the "XXX" doesn't have a clean channel, I mean that the amp is dirty on its clean channel.

It's pretty much a slam dunk that a "XXX" has more gain than a 6505.

The "Krankenstein" has something they call a "clean channel" too, which is as dirty as most amps "Lead", or "gain", or, "dirty" channel, whatever you want to call it.

Besides if great cleans are a consideration, just go ahead and buy a Fender Twin...

OK. No need for the PDF; I figured that was possible, which is why I left room for that in my original wording. I'd tested them enough in guitar stores to know they didn't have 3 or more channels on any of their models.

Your "FWIW" is a much less ambiguous way of making your point than the original post.

IMHO, I still don't think that it's a great practice to make decisions on which tube amp to buy based on amp models on a SS or hybrid amp, even if it's made by the same company.
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#8
Quote by jetwash69
IMHO, I still don't think that it's a great practice to make decisions on which tube amp to buy based on amp models on a SS or hybrid amp, even if it's made by the same company.
If "Guitar Player" magazine isn't making shit up, and big name players such as Alex Lifeson aren't bold face liars, they actually use models on stage these days.

In any event, I certainly don't advocate slapping a grand down at the local GC and walking out with an amp you've never actually heard.

A 6505 sim on a 15 watt Vyper can only give you an "impression" of what the real thing would sound like. However, you have all the time in the world to see how it tracks with your idea of what you want your tone to be, and how it responds to the instruments you'll be using it with.

With that said, the amp models in the Vyper series, are designed around popular settings for any given channel of the amps represented.

So, that would likely save valuable time, and other customer's ears, if you could just walk into the store, dial up the settings you're familiar with, and get right down to A/B testing the amps for the final decision.

And as I said in my first post, the sound from a real 100 watt head, will be so much better than the tiny model you've been listening to.

I'm not naive, I don't think a single 8" speaker can truly emulate the sound of a 4 X 12 cab.
#10
Quote by ouchies
For what its worth I've played the XXX before. I was using a strat with very low output pick ups and the clean channel was distorted w/ the volume at around 12' o clock. The amount of "distortion" was very little. It sounded like cranking any other clean amp.
So what you're you're saying is basically, with a set of hot humbuckers, the clean channel wouldn't really be clean?
#12
Quote by J-Dawg158
Guitar gear & accessories would be the better sub forum for this thread.

Moved.
Si
#13
The XXX has a 'real' clean channel, not sure where captaincranky is coming up with this crap.

The XXX and the 5150 (and their derivatives) are very different beasts. The 5150 is more raw and darker compared to the XXX which is a bit smoother in my experience. Only you can decide which you prefer. If a real clean channel is a big factor the XXX will probably suit you better since its clean channel is better than the 5150 (although the 5150s cleans get more hate than they deserve).
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#14
Quote by Captaincranky
If "Guitar Player" magazine isn't making shit up, and big name players such as Alex Lifeson aren't bold face liars, they actually use models on stage these days.

In any event, I certainly don't advocate slapping a grand down at the local GC and walking out with an amp you've never actually heard.

A 6505 sim on a 15 watt Vyper can only give you an "impression" of what the real thing would sound like. However, you have all the time in the world to see how it tracks with your idea of what you want your tone to be, and how it responds to the instruments you'll be using it with.

With that said, the amp models in the Vyper series, are designed around popular settings for any given channel of the amps represented.

So, that would likely save valuable time, and other customer's ears, if you could just walk into the store, dial up the settings you're familiar with, and get right down to A/B testing the amps for the final decision.

And as I said in my first post, the sound from a real 100 watt head, will be so much better than the tiny model you've been listening to.

I'm not naive, I don't think a single 8" speaker can truly emulate the sound of a 4 X 12 cab.


So it sounds like we agree. You sure do have the right username tonight
Quote by shiggityswah

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#15
Quote by Kevin Saale
The XXX has a 'real' clean channel, not sure where captaincranky is coming up with this crap..
No, actually I've been mistaken. I confused the "XXX" model with the "JSX" Satriani model which is right next to it on the dial. (A combination of old eyes, and never using the high gain models with my AE and hybrid guitars). The XXX does have a clean channel. The JSX, not so much.

The XXX also seems to have the biggest jump in volume from clean to dirty of the amps presented. They probably decided to model the clean and the highest gain channel, ignoring the mid gain input. Does that jibe with your impression?
Last edited by Captaincranky at Mar 17, 2013,
#16
Quote by Captaincranky
No, actually I've been mistaken. I confused the "XXX" model with the "JSX" Satriani model which is right next to it on the dial. (A combination of old eyes, and never using the high gain models with my AE and hybrid guitars). The XXX does have a clean channel. The JSX, not so much.

The XXX also seems to have the biggest jump in volume from clean to dirty of the amps presented. They probably decided to model the clean and the highest gain channel, ignoring the mid gain input. Does that jibe with your impression?


Thats funny, because the jsx was basically a modified XXX designed for satch. They aren't terribly different. As far as the volume jump, thats more an issue with the vypyr than with the actual amps seeing as each channel has its own volume control.
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#17
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#18
Quote by Kevin Saale
As far as the volume jump, thats more an issue with the vypyr than with the actual amps seeing as each channel has its own volume control.
Well, it may also have to do with them cherry picking the volume, tone and reverb settings, in order to present each amp at its sweet spot on any given channel, more than the idiosyncrasies of the Vyper itself.

As an example, perhaps they feel the XXX sounds best on the clean channel @ 4, and the high gain channel sounds best @ 8.

Somewhere in my largely unread set of instructions, they do give exact volume, tone, and reverb settings used, for each channel of each amp modeled. I expect these are the most widely used and / or popular settings of each amp.

Whereas the tonal quality of each amp would vary with respect to settings, in a modeling amp those are constants, and all the modeling amp does is change the overall volume, not the sound character. The original amp's "settings" are always the same.

Don't know if that helps or is a statement of the obvious.
Last edited by Captaincranky at Mar 17, 2013,
#19
Did someone say Peavey?

There are some ways around tap dancing, but none of them are really cheap. Ideally, for the most straightfoward (not to be confused with uncomplicated) way, you'd need a MIDI setup, which tend to get very expensive, very fast.

For sake of ease, I use a clean model on my GT-10, and switch that off with the Ultra channel on my JSX.


As for the XXX/JSX discussion, yes the XXX/JSX has a dedicated clean channel. The Vypyr utilizes two different sounds from each amp they model - red is the higher gain, green is the lower gain. Nowhere is it stated that the green has to be clean - and as is obvious, sometimes it's not.

And on the note of their clean channels... don't base your opinions on the real amps from a modeler. The JSX's clean channel shits all over the XXX's (or any other Peavey's) clean channel all week long. As per Satriani's request, the clean channel in the JSX is basically a modified Classic 50. And that shit sparkles.
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Last edited by Offworld92 at Mar 17, 2013,
#20
Quote by HeavyGuitarGuy
OK, so I want a bitchin amp. Peavey makes some of the best amps for metal out there. The 6505 is a beast. But the 6505+ only has 2 channels right?


Correct, it only has two channels. They each have their own EQ, resonance and presence, and pre & post gains. HOWEVER, with the right footswitch, (I use a Boss FS-6), you can switch the "crunch" on and off on the clean (labeled "rhythm") channel, essentially making it a 3 channel amp. The "crunch" boost on the clean channel gives it a milder overdrive, I daresay sort of Marshally, crunch. Still plenty of gain though.

The lead channel is pretty much balls to the walls even if the gain is turned way down.

As for cleans, you can dial in exceptional cleans if you take your time. They are not the warmest cleans on the planet, but you can improve them by using your neck pickup, turning the guitar volume down a bit, and using the right tubes in the amp. I've found some very beautiful cleans on my 6505+, especially when coupled with reverb/delay and a slight chorus effect going. To me, it's worth having cleans that aren't the best in the world in order to retain the onslaught that the 6505 series is known for...
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#21
The XXX II that TS originaly asked about is exactly the same as the older Peavey JSX. They renamed the amp because JS went to Marshall (just like the 5150 was renamed the 6505 when EVH left). The XXX II/JSX has a really good clean channel, and 2 good gain channels.

The original XXX was discontinued, but Peavey renamed it also it is now called the 3120 and the only diffrence in the 3120 and the XXX is the XXX had 6l6 tubes stock and the 3120 has el34 (both can accept either).

If you need versitility, the Peavey JSX/XXXII is the amp to go with. The 5150/6505 amps are really good at high-gain, but very mediocre at anything else (if even that good). The 6505+/5150II amps have a little better clean ch, but not by much
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#22
Quote by Robbgnarly
The XXX II that TS originaly asked about is exactly the same as the older Peavey JSX. They renamed the amp because JS went to Marshall (just like the 5150 was renamed the 6505 when EVH left). The XXX II/JSX has a really good clean channel, and 2 good gain channels...


A little off topic, but since you brought up Satch & Marshall, what do you think of his version of the JVM?
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#23
Quote by jetwash69
A little off topic, but since you brought up Satch & Marshall, what do you think of his version of the JVM?

I cant really say. I have only heard clips, never saw one in person yet

I am not a fan of the JVM series, but I have heard the JS JVM is pretty stellar even from people like me who much prefer the JCM2000 to the JVM series. I would love to play one, but no stores in my area carry them. I still have not played the fullsized 5153, but I really liked the 5153 mini I played.
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Morley Bad Horsie 2
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#24
Quote by Robbgnarly
I cant really say. I have only heard clips, never saw one in person yet

I am not a fan of the JVM series, but I have heard the JS JVM is pretty stellar even from people like me who much prefer the JCM2000 to the JVM series. I would love to play one, but no stores in my area carry them. I still have not played the fullsized 5153, but I really liked the 5153 mini I played.


Thanks. I've got a JVM, but I only got it because I couldn't pass up the deal. I understand the flak it gets, and I prefer to color its tones with MFX amp modeling over its stock tones. Although I am impressed with its clean channel.

I haven't run across a JS JVM in person either, so I was curious.

I do think it's rather humorous that the Schecter Hellwin looks like it was heavily influenced by the JVM--no big surprise since Gates was using the JVM during his Marshall endorsement days

Take care.
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