#1
Title says it all really, would you guys think it's worth upgrading from a Vypyr Tube 60 to a HT-20? I mainly play classic rock and metal (thrash).
The main reason for considering this upgrade is for that real tube sound.
#2
The Vyper kills it. The uses diodes for some of it's clipping (akin to an overdrive pedal).
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#3
This is a downgrade, not an upgrade. Both are valve amps with some extra transistor clipping and control thrown in; at least with the Vypyr you get more headroom and options.
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#4
I owned an HT-20. I would've rather a Vypyr if I'm honest.
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#5
Quote by MrFlibble
This is a downgrade, not an upgrade. Both are valve amps with some extra transistor clipping and control thrown in; at least with the Vypyr you get more headroom and options.


And truth.
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#6
Even though I own a couple of nice tube amps, I still have a Vypyr 30 head because it sounds really nice for what you pay, especially at bedroom volumes.

I say keep the Vypyr because of its overall versatility and sound. You should still try out an HT-20 though if you can, just in case you do actually like it that much more.
#7
I think the HT-40 or HT-60 would be a more fair comparison. The larger versions of these sound more hefty and convincing (larger transformers and more headroom perhaps?). The HT series isn't my favorite by Blackstar, but they seem to sound better the bigger you go (provided you're willing to crank them).
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#8
For the cost of Blackstar HT amplifiers, you can get better amps. They do too little for too much money.
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Deadhorse OD/Boss HM-2
#9
Well today I replaced the preamp tube of my Vypyr and it sounds great now, so much better then it did before. (which is why I was considering replacing it, I never knew it could sound this good )

I have another question... I'm considering trying to run my Vypyr (combo) into a Peavey Windsor 4x12, because I'd really like a bit more of a fuller sound. I've read the manual to the Vypyr and it apparently supports a 16 Ohm cab using the rear extension speaker out.

Would that work out okay?

Cheers
#10
So I guess you don't need me to tell you to put a JJ 12AX7 tube in your Vypyr?

I have a Vypyr 60 and did just that. Next I need to get those Sovtek 6L6s out of there. Generally, Peavey's love JJs. It's like peanut butter and jelly.

Now on the cab question. Yes, as long as the Ohms match you are good. I am assuming the Windsor cab is 16 ohms total. Do it and report back. It should disable the Vypyr's internal speaker.
#11
I've owned the Vypyr tube 60, and my old instructor owned the 120. We both had nothing but issues with them. These amps are made in China. Why else do you think you get a 60W amp with so many features for $350! Peavey's are badass! But we're not talking about an old 5150 or a 6505 here. We're talking about a MODELING amp! Seriously? Modeling amps are "bells & whistles" to distract you from the fact that you just bought a crap amp. There's a reason that no high end amps are modeling amps.

There's also a reason that the Blackstar amps cost more. They use better materials, better QC standards, and better craftsmanship. They are excellent amps for the money. Though still made in Korea, the level of quality is superior. Take guitars for example. China=garbage, but a Korean built ESP LTD 1000 series is a phenomenal instrument. Or look at Korean cars. Some of the best quality in the industry for the money. Name me a car on American roads that's made in China... Nuff said.
I'm not knocking Peavey or trying to pump up Blackstar, but if we're speaking the truth let's speak the WHOLE truth. Save your cash for a beast! A real quality rig=a real $$$ investment.
Last edited by Alexaxe73 at Apr 5, 2013,
#12
^ Welcome to UG

It is always good to hear differing opinions.

I'm glad you like Blackstar amps.

What kinds of problems were you having with your Vypyr?


Quote by Alexaxe73
There's a reason that no high end amps are modeling amps.


I consider the Axe-Fx, Kemper, 11rack and Hughes & Kettner to be high end amps

I also didn't find the Vypyrs to be distracting nor cheaply made.
#13
Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH


I consider the Axe-Fx, Kemper, 11rack and Hughes & Kettner to be high end amps

I also didn't find the Vypyrs to be distracting nor cheaply made.


I'd add the Line6 DT50 to that list.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#14
Quote by Alexaxe73
I've owned the Vypyr tube 60, and my old instructor owned the 120. We both had nothing but issues with them. These amps are made in China. Why else do you think you get a 60W amp with so many features for $350! Peavey's are badass! But we're not talking about an old 5150 or a 6505 here. We're talking about a MODELING amp! Seriously? Modeling amps are "bells & whistles" to distract you from the fact that you just bought a crap amp. There's a reason that no high end amps are modeling amps.

There's also a reason that the Blackstar amps cost more. They use better materials, better QC standards, and better craftsmanship. They are excellent amps for the money. Though still made in Korea, the level of quality is superior. Take guitars for example. China=garbage, but a Korean built ESP LTD 1000 series is a phenomenal instrument. Or look at Korean cars. Some of the best quality in the industry for the money. Name me a car on American roads that's made in China... Nuff said.
I'm not knocking Peavey or trying to pump up Blackstar, but if we're speaking the truth let's speak the WHOLE truth. Save your cash for a beast! A real quality rig=a real $$$ investment.


Theres a lot of BS in this post with a couple nuggets of almost truth tossed in.

You can't compare MIK/MIC cars vs guitars vs amps, they are all very different things. Mass produced amps are made the exact same way in China as they are in Korea as they are in the US as they are in the UK. Granted, you are correct that Korea has better quality control, but MIK and MIC stuff are both using cheap components for cheap amps.

Your statement about modeling amps is just plain silly and definitely shows your ignorance, not even gonna go here.

Also, what problems did you and your instructor have? Its usually nice to back up this kind of statement with what went wrong. I don't doubt you had problems, but its to be expected in the budget amp world.

You are right though, you have to save your cash if you want a real beast, which neither of these amps are.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#15
^ +1


Quote by 311ZOSOVHJH
Also - The Vypyr 60 may surprise you as it relates to quality.


This was AcousticMirror's comments on my gut shots.


Originally Posted by AcousticMirror
heh love the tube circuit board for the peavey vypyr.

it's 50 percent stuff that's better then whats in most boutique gear and 50 percent stuff that most builders advertise as the hot shit.


Originally Posted by AcousticMirror
ya if you start from the top down on this

small resistors are probably xicons
yellow tube caps are mallories which is what stateside builders use when they aren't using sozo or orange drops
big pink resistor is either a koa or a panasonic. Koa is more likely.
all the big electro caps are panasonic or IC or nichicon
there are snubber bypasses on all the major power supply nodes.
there's a bunch of small capacitors that are standard on the higher end japanese maxon pedals.
It's all USA or Japan for the most part.

that's a lot better then say like the recent dr z stuff which has been using a ton of samwha and lelon and other korean and chinese shit.


#16
My view is that adding a speaker to a modelling amp(heck any amp for that matter) is easy enough if the jack is there but there's no garantee the new cab will improve the sound. If you could try different cabs on the actual amp before buying you'd cut the risk of buyng something you don't like. They work together after all.
Moving on.....
#17
Ignorance? Really? I gave my opinion about a subject and instead of just disagreeing you come with the ignorance label? Are you gonna start calling me names next? And ignorance means you have no knowledge of something. I have enough knowledge of various modeling amps as I have owned a few. If you are on a budget and want built in effects they will fit the bill. But in talking about a "real" amp....C'mon now. They are crap by comparison. I knock no one who uses one, as I have said I played through a few. The Vyper being one. Once I was able to afford a real tube amp I was blown away by the difference.
And my point about where anything is made is more than logical. If you are making budget "anything" you are going to cut corners in all steps of your operation. You aren't going to take cheap materials and have them assembled by highly skilled and highly paid craftmen. You're going to have the products made with the cheapest materials assembled by the cheapest labor. Which now exists in China and Indonesia. There IS a difference. Look at the example of ESP guitars that I mentioned before. They have 3 different areas of production Indonesia, Korea and Japan. The price and quality of instrument increases from place to place. Cheapest materials are assembled by the cheapest labor in Indonesia therefore they can keep costs as low as possible to sell budget instruments at competitive prices. Next level is Korea and so on. It IS all relative. Doesn't matter what you're selling.

The only BS in my post is that you don't agree with most of it, and that's fine. You don't have to. That's why we each have opinions. I won't knock yours or put it down. I would hope for the same courtesy. It's not as if I came in with a ridiculous rant like some I've seen on here.
#18
Quote by zgr0826
My culture is worthless and absolutely inferior to the almighty Leaf.


Quote by JustRooster
I incurred the wrath of the Association of White Knights. Specifically the Parent's Basement branch of service.
#19
Quote by Alexaxe73
Words

You claimed that all modeling amps are crap, and there are no high end ones. That is an ignorant statement, because many high end modeling amps also exist. I would also disagree with your statements about the QC on Blackstar amps (Half of the ones at my local shop didn't even make it off the showroom floor without crapping out or having issues), but that's my experience. Also, you haven't said what went wrong with your vypyr and your instructor's.
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#20
Quote by Alexaxe73
Ignorance? Really? I gave my opinion about a subject and instead of just disagreeing you come with the ignorance label? Are you gonna start calling me names next? And ignorance means you have no knowledge of something. I have enough knowledge of various modeling amps as I have owned a few. If you are on a budget and want built in effects they will fit the bill. But in talking about a "real" amp....C'mon now. They are crap by comparison. I knock no one who uses one, as I have said I played through a few. The Vyper being one. Once I was able to afford a real tube amp I was blown away by the difference.
And my point about where anything is made is more than logical. If you are making budget "anything" you are going to cut corners in all steps of your operation. You aren't going to take cheap materials and have them assembled by highly skilled and highly paid craftmen. You're going to have the products made with the cheapest materials assembled by the cheapest labor. Which now exists in China and Indonesia. There IS a difference. Look at the example of ESP guitars that I mentioned before. They have 3 different areas of production Indonesia, Korea and Japan. The price and quality of instrument increases from place to place. Cheapest materials are assembled by the cheapest labor in Indonesia therefore they can keep costs as low as possible to sell budget instruments at competitive prices. Next level is Korea and so on. It IS all relative. Doesn't matter what you're selling.

The only BS in my post is that you don't agree with most of it, and that's fine. You don't have to. That's why we each have opinions. I won't knock yours or put it down. I would hope for the same courtesy. It's not as if I came in with a ridiculous rant like some I've seen on here.



I think your opinion is based on experience with the less expensive modelling stuff & calling peoples stuff crap is likely to offend too. Eleven Rack, Kemper and Fractal Audio and even the higher end Line 6 stuff is good.
IUf you think you 've never heard of anyone using this kind of stuff, you're either referring to personal friends or haven't been keeping up. Lots of producers use it, and many modern artists. ALex Leifson in his curent rig, John Petrucci, Dweezil Zappa, Neal Schon, Steve Vai etc.
Moving on.....
Last edited by KenG at Apr 6, 2013,
#21
You prove your ignorance again.

I said whats being made is what matters. PCBs and the such are made the same way everywhere (besides hand soldered stuff which is not in the realm of what we're talking about at all). Its all have wave soldered, the small easy to handle components are placed by computer, the bigger/awkward stuff is placed by hand. There may or may not be a little bit of hand soldered stuff for wires and such, but on the cheap stuff its gonna be mostly connectors for wires and such so probably no hand soldering.

I totally agree that on stuff like guitars and cars the place its made matters. Those actually require some qc. The qc on amplifiers is super basic. The cards are tested before they're hooked up, you have a chart to show you what is hooked up where. Its subjective stuff, pass or fail. Cars and guitars aren't as black and white with the pass fail on QC.

The modelling thing does show extreme ignorance. There is no way a Valve Jr. or a Little Giant is a better amp than a Kemper or an AxeFx, nor would one expect them to be. A blanket statement like that is ignorant.

Listen, I wasn't trying to insult you. I just stated my opinion and I was blunt on the matter. You can take it however you want.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
Last edited by Kevin Saale at Apr 6, 2013,
#22
Chinese cars are crap therefore everything made in China is crap. I don't even know where to start with what's wrong with that statement.

A HT-20 is a downgrade - and as everybody here knows, I'm not a fan of many modellers.
Don't do it, TS.
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#23
Not gonna spam up the thread with huge walls of quote text, but basically...

@Alexaxe73

Spin 'round carousel when your horse isn't screwed in.

My band:
Fractured Instinct
(For fans of Death/Groove/Prog Metal)

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#24
Vypyr has high quality components. No questions on that.

Maybe a few cold solder joints or input jack concers...
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#25
Joints from China are not necessarily a good thing.


Quote by KenG
I think your opinion is based on experience with the less expensive modelling stuff & calling peoples stuff crap is likely to offend too. Eleven Rack, Kemper and Fractal Audio and even the higher end Line 6 stuff is good.
IUf you think you 've never heard of anyone using this kind of stuff, you're either referring to personal friends or haven't been keeping up. Lots of producers use it, and many modern artists. ALex Leifson in his curent rig, John Petrucci, Dweezil Zappa, Neal Schon, Steve Vai etc.



+311



-----------------------------------------


Eric Clapton - Music Man HD130, mid 70's
Mark Knopfer - Music Man hybrid
Chet Atkins - Music Man hybrid
Johnny Winter - Music Man hybrid
Alex Lifeson (Rush) - Hughes & Kettner Zentera
(Lynryd Skynard) - Peavey Mace Hybrid amp
Steve Albini (Big Black Shellac) Tapco SS preamp


Dave Mustaine (Megadeth) - Line 6 custom modeler and Rocktron Prophesy
Herman Li (DragonForce) - Line 6 ?
(Meshuggah) - Line 6 Vetta and Axe-Fx
Michale Kenee (The Faceless) - Line 6 Vetta
Dustin Kensure (Thrice) - Line 6 Vetta
Ron Thal - Line 6 Vetta
Michael Romeo - Line 6 Vetta
Trent Reznor (NIN) - Line 6 Vetta
Don Henley (Eagles) - Line 6 Flextone
Mike Rutherford - Line 6 Vetta
Ben Moody/John Lecompt (Evanescence) - Line 6 Flextone II and HD147
(The Birthday Massacre) - Line 6 Flextone II
Lincoln Brewster (Linkin Park) - Line 6 Pod X3L
Ed O'Brien (Radiohead) - Line 6 Vetta II
Billy Corgan (Smashing Pumpkins) - Line 6 Vetta
Matt Sweeney - Line 6 Vetta
David Pajo (Zwan) - Line 6 Vetta
Michael Romeo (Symphony X) - Line 6 Pod
(Lacuna Coil) - Line 6 Flextones and HD147, (see post 77)
Ed Sloan (Crossfade) - Line 6 Vetta and Flextone
Steve Wilson (Porcupine Tree) - Line 6 Pod


Marty Friedmam - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Jeff Loomis - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Chris Broderick - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Steve Vai - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Cory Beaulieu (Trivium) - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
(Bulb) - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Dweezil Zappa - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Mike Landau - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
(Cynic) - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
(Periphery) - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Marco Sfogli - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
Greg Howe - Fractal Audio Axe Fx
(After the Burial) - Fractal Audio Axe Fx, studio

(This list is old. It is much longer now)

Frank Gambale - Carvin Tone Navigator with SS power amp - ?
Tom Scholz (Boston) - Rockman SS preamps - ?
Andy LaRoque (King Diamond) - Digitech preamp
Dan Donagan (Disturbed) - Digitech preamp and Randall SS?
Glen Drover - Digitech preamp?
Mark Morton (Lamb of God) - Peavey ReValver*
Devin Townshend - Peavey ReValver
Kurt Rosenwinkel - Polytone Mini-Brute
Joe Pass - Polytone Mini-Brute
Jim Hall - Polytone Mini-Brute
Jimmy Bruno - Acoustic Image Clarus
Pat Metheny - Acoustic 134, Digitech 2101 GSP preamp into Yamaha power amp
Zoltan (Five Finger Death Punch) - Digitech preamp?
Dimebag Darrell (Pantera) - Rocktron Voodu Valve
(Iron Maiden) - Marshall JMP-1 preamp
(Def Leppard Pyromania and Hysteria) - Used Rockman gear, Marshall JMP-1 pre, and Randall SS power amps)
(Nine Inch Nails) - Tech 21 Sans amp PSA-1
(Pain)- Tech 21 Sans amp PSA-1
(Rammstein) - Tech 21 Sans amp PSA-1
Peter Tatgren (Hypocrisy) - Tech 21 Trademark 300/Sans amp PSA-1
(Immortal) - Tech 21 Sans amp PSA-1
John Flansburgh - Line 6 POD


Random people that use random modeling amps
Last edited by 311ZOSOVHJH at Apr 6, 2013,
#26
No, it's not worth the upgrade. If you do it, I guaruntee you that you will be missing the Tube 60 after a week, if not less than that. It's just much more amp for the money, and does a great job of all the amps and effects it models. The Tube 60s get nothing but love from users on this forum, even those that have large, vastly expensive all-tube rigs. The Blackstar HT series continues to get shot down.
Quote by Dunning~Kruger
Yes I was rude, and I was aggressive and I was offending a large group of people. But I was civlized about it.

Taylor 414CE
#27
Quote by cdr_salamander
No, it's not worth the upgrade. If you do it, I guaruntee you that you will be missing the Tube 60 after a week, if not less than that. It's just much more amp for the money, and does a great job of all the amps and effects it models. The Tube 60s get nothing but love from users on this forum, even those that have large, vastly expensive all-tube rigs. The Blackstar HT series continues to get shot down.


People get bored with the HT series. That's the only complaint I really hear.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#28
I have played both, and the vypyr tube is much better than the HT series, actually most amps are better than the HT series
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#29
Quote by R45VT
People get bored with the HT series. That's the only complaint I really hear.

That and their shoddy marketing practices.
Quote by Dunning~Kruger
Yes I was rude, and I was aggressive and I was offending a large group of people. But I was civlized about it.

Taylor 414CE