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#1
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/video-planned-parenthood-official-argues-right-post-birth-abortion_712198.html

http://youtu.be/qEv1afKaLhA

Rep. Jose Oliva followed up, asking the Planned Parenthood official, "You stated that a baby born alive on a table as a result of a botched abortion that that decision should be left to the doctor and the family. Is that what you’re saying?”

Again, Snow replied, “That decision should be between the patient and the health care provider.”


Planned Parenthood representative says it's up to the woman and health care provider to decide whether or not to abort a baby that has been born.

So are you in favor of post-birth abortions?
“Just to sum up: I would do various things very quickly.” - Donald Trump
#2
I support you not making threads.

Quote by EyeNon15
Thats too bad, I was under the impression I was arguing something profound


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#4
Idc about abortion, but that's just gross.
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#5
Aren't abortions supposed to be so early the baby is not capable of living on the outside? That's really shitty for that to happen
#7
I can't watch the video atm. Is this an abortion after full term or something? If so this is really stupid and forget the dead baby, it's a LOT more dangerous for the mother as well.
cat
#8
EDIT: No.

And for me, this is one of the main reasons why I'm against abortion. It's possible to have botched abortions. That says a lot for me. The fact that an abortion can occur at a time when the child can end up alive once it's out... I don't see how someone can view a fetus as "just a pile of cells" if it can be literally seconds away from a breathing, crying creature.
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LET'S GO BUCKS
Last edited by AeroRocker at Apr 4, 2013,
#9
It's not an abortion after full-term. It's killing a fetus that has been removed from the body but still "lives", that is, has a beating heart, working nerves, all that jazz. So it could happen in any trimester.

That said, I can't wait to see how FOX news spins this. Planned Parenthood officials should know better than to say anything even remotely close to endorsing post-birth abortions, but she's not wrong in suggesting the principle of that being up to the mother and doctor. The sad thing is, if a fetus is pulled out before it's developed enough to be a baby, it's really best to just kill it. The life it'll lead as doctors struggle to keep it alive will be torture, at best.


Oh, boy, what a tough question. :\
#10
When's the cut off for abortion being not okay? Post-birth? A little bit before birth? Halfway through pregnancy?
#11
Quote by Adbot1
When's the cut off for abortion being not okay? Post-birth? A little bit before birth? Halfway through pregnancy?


Depends where you go, but generally speaking, the third trimester is hands-off. Most doctors who perform abortions won't do one past the second trimester.

Abortion is never "OK", really, but it depends on the moral scale you place it on.

If your concern is diminishing food supply to an ever-growing population, abortions are mad awesome.

If your concern is the principle of life not being in our hands, but rather God (or whatever it is), then abortion is bad all the time. Period.
#12
I used to be a lot more pro-choice than I am now. I still am, but regardless of ethical issues I think it should only be allowed in the first trimester/early second. Also I was premature by 3 months and im still here so it's just creepy for me to think about anything later haha
cat
#13
that video wasnt going anywhere. i cant understand who is what side and what the sides are. i honestly have no idea what anyone is talking about, the girl is just being harassed for no apparent reason. if they are discussing if a supposed aborted baby gets born alive, whos decision is it to provide health care or termination, then i want to agree that it is a mutal decision by the family and physician. but i dont understand who is on what side.
#15
Quote by guitarxo
I can't watch the video atm. Is this an abortion after full term or something? If so this is really stupid and forget the dead baby, it's a LOT more dangerous for the mother as well.

I think they're talking about the doctor botching the abortion, so that the baby lives (and, in the practical sense, is essentially forced to be born prematurely).
#16
Quote by crazysam23_Atax
I think they're talking about the doctor botching the abortion, so that the baby lives (and, in the practical sense, is essentially forced to be born prematurely).


You sure? I saw it the other way around. An extremely premature baby is aborted, but after being removed from the uterus they find it's still alive. So at that point they either decide to try to save it or continue the task at hand which is to terminate it.
#17
I'm in favor of a post-birth abortion of TS.

I'm just kidding. I just can't believe nobody went that way with this immediately


So if I'm against post-birth abortion, does that make me for abortion abortions?

Meh, I think, like guitarxo made the point, if a fetus is at a point where it is able to survive outside the uterus, it should not be aborted in the first place. Otherwise, SMASH IT WITH A HAMMER!
BOOM-SHAKALAKALAKA-BOOM-SHAKALAKUNGA
#18
Quote by snipelfritz
I'm in favor of a post-birth abortion of TS.

I'm just kidding. I just can't believe nobody went that way with this immediately


So if I'm against post-birth abortion, does that make me for abortion abortions?

Meh, I think, like guitarxo made the point, if a fetus is at a point where it is able to survive outside the uterus, it should not be aborted in the first place. Otherwise, SMASH IT WITH A HAMMER!


I've had a few drinks, so I thought your sig was part of your post, which made me get some lulz.
#21
Hey let's fixate on this thing that happens probably 0.001% of the time and make a talking point out of it. It will be incredibly honest and not at all questionable!
It was my privilege
#22
Quote by AeroRocker
EDIT: No.

And for me, this is one of the main reasons why I'm against abortion. It's possible to have botched abortions. That says a lot for me. The fact that an abortion can occur at a time when the child can end up alive once it's out... I don't see how someone can view a fetus as "just a pile of cells" if it can be literally seconds away from a breathing, crying creature.
People will still have abortions even if they are illegal. If you're scared of "botched" abortions, then proper medical facilities provided by an environment that allows women to make that choice should be your goal man. Here is a read about what it was like before:
Back-Alley Abortions
The prohibition of legal abortion from the 1880s until 1973 came under the same anti-obscenity or Comstock laws that prohibited the dissemination of birth control information and services.

Criminalization of abortion did not reduce the numbers of women who sought abortions. In the years before Roe v. Wade, the estimates of illegal abortions ranged as high as 1.2 million per year.1 Although accurate records could not be kept, it is known that between the 1880s and 1973, many thousands of women were harmed as a result of illegal abortion.

Many women died or suffered serious medical problems after attempting to self-induce their abortions or going to untrained practitioners who performed abortions with primitive methods or in unsanitary conditions. During this time, hospital emergency room staff treated thousands of women who either died or were suffering terrible effects of abortions provided without adequate skill and care.

Some women were able to obtain relatively safer, although still illegal, abortions from private doctors. This practice remained prevalent for the first half of the twentieth century. The rate of reported abortions then began to decline, partly because doctors faced increased scrutiny from their peers and hospital administrators concerned about the legality of their operations.

Of course in a perfect world, abortions would be banned cause no one would need/want them. Being against it is really just refusing to understand the situation and choosing beliefs over the health of the population.
#23
Quote by Godsmack_IV
Cruel and unusual to keep it alive at that point. Either abort or don't; just be committed to whichever option you choose.


^ This.

Also, to AeroRocker, the "pile of cells" statement? Depends who you ask. If you ask me, you and I are no more a pile of cells than a 3 month old fetus.
#24
Well if it's a botched abortion then it's probably best to kill it. A true post-birth abortion though? wtf gooby
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Snake?

Snake?

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#25
Quote by Gibson_SG_uzr55
Well if it's a botched abortion then it's probably best to kill it. A true post-birth abortion though? wtf gooby



Post-birth abortions should be legal until the age of 5.
It was my privilege
#27
Quote by Morphogenesis26
Make it 9. I know a kid.



Let's be real here, there should be no age limit.
It was my privilege
#28
People keep assuming that "post-birth" means "post-9 months of gestation".

That's not what it means. Birth, in this case, is the moment which the fetus is no longer a part of the mother's body. That could happen at 2 months, 4 months, 8 months, etc.


edit: Why not make it 18? A lot of kids, we can see what's coming. It's euthanasia to help society.
#30
Quote by Good Ol' Ramos
People keep assuming that "post-birth" means "post-9 months of gestation".

That's not what it means. Birth, in this case, is the moment which the fetus is no longer a part of the mother's body. That could happen at 2 months, 4 months, 8 months, etc.


edit: Why not make it 18? A lot of kids, we can see what's coming. It's euthanasia to help society.

Oh, well if that's the case then I guess it's fine with certain restrictions I guess, just like a standard abortion.
Quote by beadhangingOne
What happened to Snake?

Snake?

Snake?

SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE?!


Quote by TunerAddict
you can take my mouse and keyboard from my cold, slightly orange from cheetos, dead fingers


Quote by Baby Joel
Isis is amazing
#31
Quote by deadsmileyface
doesnt matter, post-birth, pre-birth. they're both fine.


i miss the old kanye
#32
anything under 3 years is abortable
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#33
Quote by Weaponized
People will still have abortions even if they are illegal. If you're scared of "botched" abortions, then proper medical facilities provided by an environment that allows women to make that choice should be your goal man. Here is a read about what it was like before:
Back-Alley Abortions
The prohibition of legal abortion from the 1880s until 1973 came under the same anti-obscenity or Comstock laws that prohibited the dissemination of birth control information and services.

Criminalization of abortion did not reduce the numbers of women who sought abortions. In the years before Roe v. Wade, the estimates of illegal abortions ranged as high as 1.2 million per year.1 Although accurate records could not be kept, it is known that between the 1880s and 1973, many thousands of women were harmed as a result of illegal abortion.

Many women died or suffered serious medical problems after attempting to self-induce their abortions or going to untrained practitioners who performed abortions with primitive methods or in unsanitary conditions. During this time, hospital emergency room staff treated thousands of women who either died or were suffering terrible effects of abortions provided without adequate skill and care.

Some women were able to obtain relatively safer, although still illegal, abortions from private doctors. This practice remained prevalent for the first half of the twentieth century. The rate of reported abortions then began to decline, partly because doctors faced increased scrutiny from their peers and hospital administrators concerned about the legality of their operations.

Of course in a perfect world, abortions would be banned cause no one would need/want them. Being against it is really just refusing to understand the situation and choosing beliefs over the health of the population.


I agree with all of this.
#34
Quote by Good Ol' Ramos
If your concern is the principle of life not being in our hands, but rather God (or whatever it is), then abortion is bad all the time. Period.

Which is why pro-life, religious people never go to doctors.

Quote by AeroRocker
And for me, this is one of the main reasons why I'm against abortion. It's possible to have botched abortions. That says a lot for me. The fact that an abortion can occur at a time when the child can end up alive once it's out... I don't see how someone can view a fetus as "just a pile of cells" if it can be literally seconds away from a breathing, crying creature.

It's stupid to say you're against abortion if you are only opposed to it in some circumstances (as your post suggests).
Quote by Dirtydeeds468
Holy Crap.

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Last edited by catempire at Apr 4, 2013,
#35
I'm not even taking a stance on abortion, but I am pretty sure that "aborting" a baby after it has been born isn't an abortion anymore for that exact reason.
#36
Quote by catempire
Which is why pro-life, religious people never go to doctors.


A doctor who hands out a tylenol to a teenager with a mild headache is as much a sinner as Lucifer himself before the grace of God.

Duh.
#37
Quote by AeroRocker
EDIT: No.

And for me, this is one of the main reasons why I'm against abortion. It's possible to have botched abortions. That says a lot for me. The fact that an abortion can occur at a time when the child can end up alive once it's out... I don't see how someone can view a fetus as "just a pile of cells" if it can be literally seconds away from a breathing, crying creature.

You're just a pile of cells.

Anyway, if this does happen, it's gotta be a hella premature baby, a fetus, cut the cord, it probably won't live long. I'd imagine these "baby's" are tiny as hell, and will have mental and physical problems. No one's gonna let them shove it back in their vagina, that'd probably kill it anyway and hurt like hell. If it does live by some miracle, put it up for adoption. I know if you're getting an abortion, anything near baby size is gonna hurt like ****, and I don't know how the baby would come out in one piece. Numbed cervix or not. I'm very prochoice, but once you think you're pregnant, it's not a good idea to sit on the fence for months.
Last edited by stratkat at Apr 4, 2013,
#38
I'm all for abortions up to like 6 months, but this is just straight up murder, isn't it?
Quote by MetalGS3SE
This is the best idea I have ever heard. Ever.

Naedauuf for president people.


#39
Quote by naedauuf
I'm all for abortions up to like 6 months, but this is just straight up murder, isn't it?

I think it's like a regular abortion, but the baby ends up outside and not dead. So like, it's still premature and has no chance of making it, the real choice is weather to terminate it there or try to keep it alive with science n stuff.
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