Page 2 of 4
#41
Quote by Bigbazz
Na I disagree, it's nowhere near the same. I Also fail to see how that was one of the main selling points of the Vetta.


I was able to get some sparkly Fender single sounds out my LP on the HD500. Normal tone controls don't usually have the range of adjustment in frequency, bandwidth or gain for this. In fact many classic tube amps tone controls are passive and can only cut the ranges they adjust.
Moving on.....
#44
Quote by IbanezIke91
SS is hassle-free and more reliable.

/fact


I've had two SS amps fail on me, and never a tube amp. Your information does not compute.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#45
Quote by IbanezIke91
SS is hassle-free and more reliable.

/fact
So a Behringer SS amp is more reliable than a Mesa Mark 5? Really? So all those SS amps I've repaired were a figment of my imagination? You have a strange definition of what constitutes a fact there, boyo.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
Last edited by Cathbard at Apr 6, 2013,
#47
If you play your favourite band through a tiny little old school CD player, it's gonna sound shit because it's a low quality, bad speakers budget job, even though your fave band recorded through the best amps with the best guitars and the best pickups. Play that same band through an expensive hifi and it'll sound amazing. The moral of the story is yes, the thing recreating your sound (in this case your amp) is the most important factor.
#49
In regards to Caths statement about fixing SS amps. You have to be a total moron to be able to kill a (good) SS amp. If you do kill a SS amp you shouldn't be allowed near an electric outlet.

Tube amps do sound better most of the time. And no doubt they are more fragile. Its just their nature.

You really need to just go out and play as many amps in your budget that you can and buy the one that sounds best to you.
What the hell!!!
Last edited by danvwman at Apr 7, 2013,
#50
I've seen loads of SS amps blow up, if plugging it in and using it as intended is being a "total moron" then everyone is a total moron for using SS amps as they were intended in the first place.

Seen a few SS keyboard amps blow up, my Bassist broke his SS Trace Elliot bass amp and also was playing through another Trace Elliot at a different show that stopped working while we were playing. SS amps blow up or break, good ones too just as the valve amps do.

I've had my Weeping Widow amp (a 10w ish Class A valve amp) for 8 years and it's been played a lot mostly as a studio/practice amp, never been revalved and has never stopped working. Just because an amp is SS and "good" doesn't mean that it wont break, they can and do break under normal use, just as an amp being a valve amp doesn't mean it is going to need a lot of valve replacements and/or repairs.
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
Last edited by Bigbazz at Apr 7, 2013,
#51
Quote by IbanezIke91
SS is hassle-free and more reliable.

/fact



I remember back in the 70's when we all we're going SS crazy. I played out with a 1970 Marshall 100-watt Superlead but had a box of parts in my Van for emergency repairs. My backup was an old beatup Fender SuperTwin & I actually traded it for a new SUNN Beta Lead (new to the market - SS too). SS was more dependable to me but nothing beat the sound that ol' Marshall put out...

The Sunn sounded great & I could get distortion (ala 70's style) at low volumes. I used it twice on gigs & everyone seemed to like the sound. Back then we never had a board - we played thru our amps (drove the drummers nuts it would get so loud). Nobody miced their drums then either so the poor drummer had to pound like an animal to be heard...
Now running an Eleven Rack with Pro Tools 10.3.3 - it's amazing and I'm having ball with it - worth every penny. PT 10 is tops IMO and the Eleven Rack is a work of art!
Last edited by strangedogs at Apr 7, 2013,
#52
Quote by danvwman
In regards to Caths statement about fixing SS amps. You have to be a total moron to be able to kill a (good) SS amp. If you do kill a SS amp you shouldn't be allowed near an electric outlet.

Tube amps do sound better most of the time. And no doubt they are more fragile. Its just their nature.

You really need to just go out and play as many amps in your budget that you can and buy the one that sounds best to you.


Still wrong. Tube amps are not more fragile, only the tubes themselves are more fragile; i.e. the most easily replaceable part.

Provide some statistics to show that SS amps fail less than tube amps (not counting tube failures) then you'll have some credence to your statement. As it stands, the 3 tubes I've owned have never failed and two of the five SS amps I have owned have failed (one I was able to repair, the other wasn't worth the effort).
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#53
YAY ANECDOTAL EVIDENCE.

None of the amps I've owned—four valve, two solid state, one hybrid—have 'failed'. 'Been damaged', sure, but that can hardly be attributed to the technology inside. Guess what, when an amp is thrown up on and then falls out the back of a moving van, shit ain't gonna work any more no matter what it is.

I've had to fix valve amps. I've had to fix solid state amps. I've had to fix hybrid amps. I've had to fix entirely analogue amps and digital amps. Sometimes things break. Sometimes they last for decades.

The only thing I would say that separates valve and hybrid amps from solid states is that solid states are very vaguely less prone to suffering at the hands of user error. You can't blow a solid state amp by not plugging it into a cab or maxing the volume before you've let it warm up. But if you treat an amp that way then you deserve to have it break on you.
Yes, I know everything. No, I can't play worth a damn.
A child is trafficked and sold for sex slavery every 30 seconds. Support Love146.
#54
I like both, but prefer SS. For my kind of playing it's the ticket. Hey, if it was good enough for Dimebag (90% of his career) it's good enough for me. I have a Randall all tube amp, and two SS amps, and I play the SS mostly by far.
Last edited by hatchet_job at Apr 7, 2013,
#55
Quote by danvwman
In regards to Caths statement about fixing SS amps. You have to be a total moron to be able to kill a (good) SS amp. If you do kill a SS amp you shouldn't be allowed near an electric outlet.
Untrue. I had to replace the power transistors in my Yamaha G100 and they are one of the most reliable amps out there. I didn't blow it up, the transistors just failed. Transistors do fail you know. Nothing lasts forever.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#56
Transistors do not have a defintive life to them like tubes. That being said excessive heat will kill transistors. Running an amp flat out could do it, mismatching impedances may draw excessive current through a transistor which would overheat it. Another thing that can occur is if the transistors (or FETS) are ganged in parallel to increase power and one fails the others will overheat and quicly follow.
One thing they don't do though is blow when there's no load. Tube amps will and I've repaired a few that this has happened to.
I think the whole question is somewhat loaded as there's a lot more SS models at the lower end of the price spectrum than tube amps.
As someone who actually remembers the original decline of tube amps in favour of SS way back, the SS amps back then failed to deliver the tube sound, especially on distortion. Thats not really true these days as there's been tons of designs developed that are much more satisfying than the old harsh sounds of years ago.
Moving on.....
#57
Quote by KenG
Transistors do not have a defintive life to them like tubes. That being said excessive heat will kill transistors. Running an amp flat out could do it, mismatching impedances may draw excessive current through a transistor which would overheat it. Another thing that can occur is if the transistors (or FETS) are ganged in parallel to increase power and one fails the others will overheat and quicly follow.
One thing they don't do though is blow when there's no load. Tube amps will and I've repaired a few that this has happened to.
I think the whole question is somewhat loaded as there's a lot more SS models at the lower end of the price spectrum than tube amps.
As someone who actually remembers the original decline of tube amps in favour of SS way back, the SS amps back then failed to deliver the tube sound, especially on distortion. Thats not really true these days as there's been tons of designs developed that are much more satisfying than the old harsh sounds of years ago.


Tubes don't have a definitive life either.

Tube amps blow when they don't have a load attached. Wow, user error, not an error in the design.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#58
There are very few things that do have a definitive life. This idea that transistors last forever is quite puzzling, experience tells me otherwise. They may last longer usually but even top end gear has failures. I have a top end hifi power amp here that I have to change the MOSFETs in. They are damn expensive too. That hasn't been damaged by misuse, it's just worn out.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#59
Quote by Kevin Saale
Tubes don't have a definitive life either.

Tube amps blow when they don't have a load attached. Wow, user error, not an error in the design.


Tubes do wear out, that's we had tube testers to measure tube performance. They just degrade slow enough that most people don't notice. If they aren't driven they can last a long time yes. Transistors, MOSFETs generally work and when they fail it's quick. They do not "wear out"they get damaged, either during manufacturing by things like ESD through improper handling, poor design of the circuits they are used in or as I mentioned being run at 100% during use, or by overheating for other reasons, (fan failures, poor installation affecting cooling or even cascade type failures. One of our current products uses 3 MOSFets per side on an electronic regulator and the designer found variances between production dates that had them (FETs) not all performing equally, when one had a lower on resistance the others, it would take more than it's share of current over stressing it and resulting in its failure.
The two tube amps I repaired with damaged power amps lost the load when the speakers coils opened up, hardly user error.
Moving on.....
Last edited by KenG at Apr 7, 2013,
#60
The MOSFET's in the Perreaux I'm repairing didn't totally fail, they just sound bad.
Gilchrist custom
Yamaha SBG500
Telecasters
Randall RM100 & RM20
Marshall JTM45 clone
Marshall JCM900 4102 (modded)
Marshall 18W clone
Fender 5F1 Champ clone
Atomic Amplifire
Marshall 1960A
Boss GT-100


Cathbard Amplification
My band
#61
Quote by IbanezIke91
SS is hassle-free and more reliable.

/fact


I'd like to see where you got your information
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#62
Everything wears out, that isn't a point at all.

The only 2 amps you've ever repaired were because of speaker coils failing? Seems pretty unusual to me. Still not a fault in the amp. Sure the design isn't perfect, but you still don't see folks calling for protection for this kind of thing. Just isn't that big of an issue. Most tube amps are fine without a load attached for a bit. I just find it hard to believe that a speaker coil would fail and the amp would instantly blow the output transformer. If something else blew its really not that big of an issue.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#63
Quote by Kevin Saale
Everything wears out, that isn't a point at all.

The only 2 amps you've ever repaired were because of speaker coils failing? Seems pretty unusual to me. Still not a fault in the amp. Sure the design isn't perfect, but you still don't see folks calling for protection for this kind of thing. Just isn't that big of an issue. Most tube amps are fine without a load attached for a bit. I just find it hard to believe that a speaker coil would fail and the amp would instantly blow the output transformer. If something else blew its really not that big of an issue.


I've repaired a lot more than two amps, I've been an electronic tech for over 30 years. 13 + years for the Military and 20 years in defense electronics industry. All that time I also fixed people shit on the side.
The transformers didn't blow in those amps, not sure where you got that idea, the output tubes failed and took out the plate resistors. It probably wasn't instantaneous but since I wasn't there when it happened either time I don't know how long it took.

For someone who's just gotten out of his teen years you seem awfully confident in your "knowledge"". I have a daughter your age, thankfully she's in University learning a profession.
Moving on.....
Last edited by KenG at Apr 7, 2013,
#64
Well, unless its the output transformer its a minor issue. A few bucks for tubes and a few cents for some resistors and its on its way.

I still don't see how any of this makes an SS amp more reliable than a tube amp.

Age has nothing to do with knowledge or wisdom. Instead of arguing the point you resort to some little smartass remark about my age. Show me some proof that SS amps are more reliable that isn't anecdotal evidence and I'll do the same. Until then, no tube amps have ever failed and 2 SS amps have failed.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
Last edited by Kevin Saale at Apr 7, 2013,
#65
Quote by Kevin Saale
Well, unless its the output transformer its a minor issue. A few bucks for tubes and a few cents for some resistors and its on its way.

I still don't see how any of this makes an SS amp more reliable than a tube amp.

Age has nothing to do with knowledge or wisdom. Instead of arguing the point you resort to some little smartass remark about my age. Show me some proof that SS amps are more reliable that isn't anecdotal evidence and I'll do the same. Until then, no tube amps have ever failed and 2 SS amps have failed.



Age has everything to do with knowledge and wisdom. There are not inherited qualities they are learned over time. I think you are confusing them with basic intellegence which is only potential for widsom & knowledge. The phase you're in right now most of us go through, we form opinions based on little to no experience then as we get older we realize we weren't as smart as we thought we were. Welcome to the human race.
Moving on.....
#66
Quote by KenG
Age has everything to do with knowledge and wisdom. There are not inherited qualities they are learned over time. I think you are confusing them with basic intellegence which is only potential for widsom & knowledge. The phase you're in right now most of us go through, we form opinions based on little to no experience then as we get older we realize we weren't as smart as we thought we were. Welcome to the human race.


Age has little to do with either knowledge or wisdom, that's utter rubbish.

While both can be acquired by experiential learning (Aka the hard way, the school of hard knocks, life etc.) that's far from the only method available, nor is it the 'best'.

If age were the determinative factor, every old person would be both smart and wise. Since that's clearly not the case, I'd say your claim falls overwhelmingly short.

Since your claim was neither wise nor knowledgeable, we can now use it as an example to further reinforce that age isn't the primary (or even a particularly salient) determinant.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
Last edited by Arby911 at Apr 8, 2013,
#67
Quote by KenG
Age has everything to do with knowledge and wisdom. There are not inherited qualities they are learned over time. I think you are confusing them with basic intellegence which is only potential for widsom & knowledge. The phase you're in right now most of us go through, we form opinions based on little to no experience then as we get older we realize we weren't as smart as we thought we were. Welcome to the human race.


Playing the age card now? How incredibly original. The fact you are resorting to such methods suggests you have nothing more useful to add to the debate.
EH


"Show me war; show me pestilence; show me the blood-red hands of retribution..."
Last edited by eddiehimself at Apr 8, 2013,
#68
Tubes fail from time to time. Be a dumbass and replace the fuse and keep playing it. Thats a sure fire way to kill the power section and have to do a rebuild.

Most common failures are solder joints and capacitors, potentiometers, input jacks which both SS and tube have.

I have never had a tube amp go down on me. I buy them broken and fix them as often as a good deal pops up on CL. Plenty of cheap broken SS practice amps out there as well, just for me they don't have any resale value to I stick clear of them.

Tubes are a maintenance item. Replace them before they wear out and you save $$.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#69
Most people tend to guess I'm either 15 or 50. **** all y'all.

None of you can say that [X] design is more reliable than [Y]. All any of you have is purely anecdotal evidence. So, hey. Get over it.
Yes, I know everything. No, I can't play worth a damn.
A child is trafficked and sold for sex slavery every 30 seconds. Support Love146.
#70
Quote by MrFlibble
Most people tend to guess I'm either 15 or 50. **** all y'all.

None of you can say that [X] design is more reliable than [Y]. All any of you have is purely anecdotal evidence. So, hey. Get over it.


You can't support anything you just said.

Get over it.
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#71
Quote by Arby911
Since your claim was neither wise nor knowledgeable, we can now use it as an example to further reinforce that age isn't the primary (or even a particularly salient) determinant.

+1

Since poor eyesight is commonly associated with advanced age and we've already established that you are unintelligent, I'll help you with both reading it and comprehending it, Ken:

You're dumb.
Quote by Cathbard
Quote by Raijouta
Unless its electronic drums.

BURN THE WITCH!!!!!
Last edited by tubetime86 at Apr 8, 2013,
#72
Quote by tubetime86
+1

Since we've established that you are unintelligent and age is known to lead to poor eyesight I'll help you with both reading it and comprehending it, Ken:

You're dumb.


Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#73
Quote by Cathbard
Untrue. I had to replace the power transistors in my Yamaha G100 and they are one of the most reliable amps out there. I didn't blow it up, the transistors just failed. Transistors do fail you know. Nothing lasts forever.

Heeey you have a G100? Man, I loved mine! Wish I still had it.

Edit: Awkward. I was responding to something on the previous page. I had no clue I was interrupting the-- "Insult each others intelligence because all attempts at a legitimate debate have been exhausted"-- section of the thread. Carry on.
Last edited by Dimarzio45 at Apr 8, 2013,
#74
Quote by Dimarzio45

Edit: Awkward. I was responding to something on the previous page. I had no clue I was interrupting the-- "Insult each others intelligence because all attempts at a legitimate debate have been exhausted"-- section of the thread. Carry on.


And you have just taken it to the "make self appear to be morally and intellectually superior to others by pointing out the complete obvious" section
EH


"Show me war; show me pestilence; show me the blood-red hands of retribution..."
Last edited by eddiehimself at Apr 8, 2013,
#75
Quote by eddiehimself
And you have just taken it to the "make self appear to be morally and intellectually superior to others by pointing out the complete obvious" section

No. Just the power of observation.
#76
Quote by Dimarzio45
No. Just the power of observation.


Observation doesn't require one to communicate the observed phenomena to others...
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#77
SS amps suck, the only reason to run them is cuz they're so reliable. they never break down.
punk isn't dead, it's always smelled that way.

"A perfection of means, and confusion of aims, seems to be our main problem."
-ae
#78
Talking about age/wisdom.

This forum has a much higher percentage of younger people than the other guitar forums I'm a member of, specifically teens and early 20s and it really shows, when I look around other forums like the Music Radar, Marshall amps and Seymour Duncan forums I don't see anywhere near as many aggressive, pride driven wikipedia experts arguing endlessly and pointlessly, because those forums have a much smaller percentage of younger members.

For a start, someone who has enough experience in stupid, pointless arguements that I often see popping up on these forums will be wise enough to not let it get out of hand. Yes you can say "oh bla bla evidence this, prove that etc etc" but really to the reader who has seen it time and time again it just looks like you're all full of shit, making a massive thing out of nothing and nitpicking to the very extreme just prove yourself to be right or "win" an arguement.

Have your opinion and use your experiences but expect other people to disagree, the problem with this internet and the wikipedia geniuses is that everyone is an expert in everything and often enough think they know better than the real experts with real world experience.


How many threads have to turn into turd throwing contests over something so pointless and petty? If there was any degree of "wisdom" around here I can tell you that it wouldn't be this many.
Cornford Hellcat
Peavey 5150
1994 Ibanez Jem 7V
#79
Quote by Bigbazz
Talking about age/wisdom.

This forum has a much higher percentage of younger people than the other guitar forums I'm a member of, specifically teens and early 20s and it really shows, when I look around other forums like the Music Radar, Marshall amps and Seymour Duncan forums I don't see anywhere near as many aggressive, pride driven wikipedia experts arguing endlessly and pointlessly, because those forums have a much smaller percentage of younger members.

For a start, someone who has enough experience in stupid, pointless arguements that I often see popping up on these forums will be wise enough to not let it get out of hand. Yes you can say "oh bla bla evidence this, prove that etc etc" but really to the reader who has seen it time and time again it just looks like you're all full of shit, making a massive thing out of nothing and nitpicking to the very extreme just prove yourself to be right or "win" an arguement.

Have your opinion and use your experiences but expect other people to disagree, the problem with this internet and the wikipedia geniuses is that everyone is an expert in everything and often enough think they know better than the real experts with real world experience.


How many threads have to turn into turd throwing contests over something so pointless and petty? If there was any degree of "wisdom" around here I can tell you that it wouldn't be this many.


you have never gone to TGP and asked about the best over-drive pedal....




Your opinion does not count...
Quote by DeathByDestroyr
See, it's important that people clarify when they say "metal", because I pretty much always assume they are a Cannibal Corpse fanboi.
#80
I like what I get out of my Ampeg, for like thrash/black metal. The Gallien-Krueger RB400 I used to use, for bass, sounds pretty decent. Cheap too. That's a big part of it is cheap, I really don't have >1k to blow on an amp right now, or I totally would.

Your argument is invalid.
"If you're looking for me,
you better check under the sea,
because that's where you'll find me..."