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#41
You are asking on this forum where to put money for an investment?? I suggest a CD or IRA. Do some actual research into the market. Then decide if you have the stomach to lose money before spending the cash.
Bhaok

The following statement is true. The proceeding statement is false.
#42
Take 10k, burn it. Then take 5k and buy the nicest custom guitar you can find that meets every tic box you can think of. Now, you're out 15k, so you know what its like to invest and you have a really nice instrument for years to come.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#43
Quote by HighspeedNazi
You'd be better off putting those Federal Reserve Notes in physically held gold. America is the modern day Wiemar Republic. The so-called 'dollar' (not really though) is devalued on a daily basis. The parasites are sucking the last of the wealth from America. When the SHTF and the economy finally collapses that gold with be worth more than wheelbarrows full of FRNs. You might even be able to buy a large ranch in a safe part of the country with that $10,000 in gold at some point in the future.

Or you might consider 'junk silver.' Research it if you don't know what I'm talking about.

Regardless, always hold precious metals. Never ever let it be held in trust by some third party.


I sold gold, silver, junk bags and numismatics for a few years and used this same argument.

20 years ago.

Trouble is, it was nonsense then and it's nonsense now. If the economy collapses so far as to entirely devalue our currency, precious metals will only have value if you can get to a country that still has a working economy. A pound of gold won't buy a loaf of bread from a starving man if he can't get more bread somewhere...

Who is going to sell or be able to transfer that 'large ranch' in an economic collapse?

Metals are a good economic hedge in case of downturn but they are useless in an economic meltdown. Value requires a market.
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#44
edited and messed up original message. oops.
Last edited by gregs1020 at Apr 12, 2013,
#45
Not to burst your bubble OP but it sounds like you want a guitar that is currently a vintage collectible, and you wont find them for the price range you are aiming for, I mean they do exist but odds are they are not guitars you will want and it will still be 20-30 years before you could make a serious return on it. I follow the vintage guitar scene horribly, I call myself a collector but I do not collect for monetary gain I collect simply because I love guitars.

http://www.frettedamericana.com/
http://www.normansrareguitars.com/
http://www.vintageguitars.net/

Those are some good sites to start getting and idea of what you might be paying for your dream collection, pucker the ol' brown eye though some of the prices are stratospheric!
2011 Gibson Honeyburst LP Trad. w/ SD Whole Lotta Humbuckers
2014 Gibson Ocean Water Standard Plus
Marshall Haze 15W Head/Cab
Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister 5
#47
Quote by Tom 1.0


Bloody damn good choice, they have my actual dream guitar, quite similar to yours but has one more pickup! Would totally set it up like Jimmy's old Black Beauty. Now excuse me while I clean out my underwear!

http://www.frettedamericana.com/product/1960-gibson-les-paul-1
2011 Gibson Honeyburst LP Trad. w/ SD Whole Lotta Humbuckers
2014 Gibson Ocean Water Standard Plus
Marshall Haze 15W Head/Cab
Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister 5
#48
Quote by Arby911
I sold gold, silver, junk bags and numismatics for a few years and used this same argument. 20 years ago. Trouble is, it was nonsense then and it's nonsense now.
Just a few short years ago when silver was $13 an ounce (~2006-2007) and I had some really good contracts I was working, I put a fair amount of Federal Reserve Notes (commonly mistaken for U.S. Dollars) into junk silver.

Then within four short years silver was at almost $50 an ounce. (~Early 2011) I nearly quadrupled my investment and it was 'junk silver.' (Well I did have a few Silver Eagles and Maple Leafs.) I sold it all and did quite well. Your mileage clearly varies from mine.

I'll rely on my nonsense since it's my wealth I'm dealing with and not yours. Some people know what to do with precious metals and some don't. It appears you fall into that latter category.

Now if you had been patient enough to sit on that silver until it hit that $50 an ounce mark you too would have done well. Precious metals are for long term thinkers.
Last edited by HighspeedNazi at Apr 11, 2013,
#50
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Just a few short years ago when silver was $13 an ounce (~2006-2007) and I had some really good contracts I was working, I put a fair amount of Federal Reserve Notes (commonly mistaken for U.S. Dollars) into junk silver.

Then within four short years silver was at almost $50 an ounce. (~Early 2011) I nearly quadrupled my investment and it was 'junk silver.' (Well I did have a few Silver Eagles and Maple Leafs.) I sold it all and did quite well. Your mileage clearly varies from mine.

I'll rely on my nonsense since it's my wealth I'm dealing with and not yours. Some people know what to do with precious metals and some don't. It appears you fall into that latter category.

Now if you had been patient enough to sit on that silver until it hit that $50 an ounce mark you too would have done well. Precious metals are for long term thinkers.

Yes, but: right now, gold is floating a serious bubble, worse than it was back in the 1980s when it peaked at @$800. About 4 years later, it was back down to $200.

Right now, panicked/idiotic speculators have driven its price above that of platinum, which is ridiculous.

While I know the metals market well, I own a lot more precious & semiprecious stones.

In 1967, the diamond cartel- a.k.a. DeBeers- started pushing the idea of the investment grade diamond: a 1ct flawless, blue-white/colorless round brilliant. Then, it cost $1000. By 1998, that stone was worth @$16,000.

However, had you bought a (literal) ton of the semiprecious stone blue chalcedony in 1967- for that same $1000- your investment would have been worth more than $1.2M.

The difference? Non-industrial, gem grade diamonds, like gold, have a pretty consistent market. Barring irrational speculation causing a rush on them- as has happened with gold- their price increase over time is pretty predictable. Blue chalcedony, on the other hand, like many other semi-precious stones- are affordable to a MUCH bigger market, and as the lower, middle and even upper class began to spend more on buying jewelry, that market EXPLODED, and with it, the demand for those materials.

Back on point...

The difference between precious metals and collectibles is that the precious metals market is less driven by irrational speculation and desire, and more by the uses to which they are put in the modern industrialized global economy. Simply put, silver's value is more intrinsic than is the market for any collectible.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#51
Quote by dannyalcatraz
In 1967, the diamond cartel- a.k.a. DeBeers- started pushing the idea of the investment grade diamond: a 1ct flawless, blue-white/colorless round brilliant. Then, it cost $1000. By 1998, that stone was worth @$16,000.
Diamonds are a scam in my opinion for the very reason that DeBeers (A Jewish organization by the way) has brainwashed most women (the men have to tag along for the ride though) into thinking that diamonds are something special. It's all marketing, smoke, and mirrors. If people actually were able to think critically and did some research on diamonds that market would crash.

Same goes for Federal Reserve Notes and fractional reserve banking. If people knew it was just shell game that usurious system would fail as it rightly should.
#52
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Diamonds are a scam in my opinion for the very reason that DeBeers (A Jewish organization by the way) has brainwashed most women (the men have to tag along for the ride though) into thinking that diamonds are something special. It's all marketing, smoke, and mirrors. If people actually were able to think critically and did some research on diamonds that market would crash.

Same goes for Federal Reserve Notes and fractional reserve banking. If people knew it was just shell game that usurious system would fail as it rightly should.


Diamonds are so over-rated, made from the cheapest most abundant material on the planet, but formed under pressure so they become heinously over priced, just buy cubic zirconia she will never know otherwise, unless she goes to have it appraised which means odds are she ditched you and is pawning the ring but low and behold you have the last laugh because that shit is WORTHLESS!
2011 Gibson Honeyburst LP Trad. w/ SD Whole Lotta Humbuckers
2014 Gibson Ocean Water Standard Plus
Marshall Haze 15W Head/Cab
Hughes & Kettner Tubemeister 5
#53
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Just a few short years ago when silver was $13 an ounce (~2006-2007) and I had some really good contracts I was working, I put a fair amount of Federal Reserve Notes (commonly mistaken for U.S. Dollars) into junk silver.

Then within four short years silver was at almost $50 an ounce. (~Early 2011) I nearly quadrupled my investment and it was 'junk silver.' (Well I did have a few Silver Eagles and Maple Leafs.) I sold it all and did quite well.


so you cashed out?

why would you do that when you were making such good money?

you know, fort knox is empty.
#54
While I agree that gem-grade diamonds are overvalued- see what happened when the Russians needed wheat back in the 1990s- the same can be said of anything "collectible" or with a value based largely on aesthetics.

However, you said this:

Quote by HighspeedNazi
DeBeers (A Jewish organization by the way)


WTF?

Are you trying to live up to your forum name?

The religion and ethnicity of the company's founders or current owners has nothing to do with jack-all relevant to the discussion.

You have rendered your opinions irrelevant to me.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#55
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Just a few short years ago when silver was $13 an ounce (~2006-2007) and I had some really good contracts I was working, I put a fair amount of Federal Reserve Notes (commonly mistaken for U.S. Dollars) into junk silver.

Then within four short years silver was at almost $50 an ounce. (~Early 2011) I nearly quadrupled my investment and it was 'junk silver.' (Well I did have a few Silver Eagles and Maple Leafs.) I sold it all and did quite well. Your mileage clearly varies from mine.

I'll rely on my nonsense since it's my wealth I'm dealing with and not yours. Some people know what to do with precious metals and some don't. It appears you fall into that latter category.

Now if you had been patient enough to sit on that silver until it hit that $50 an ounce mark you too would have done well. Precious metals are for long term thinkers.


I think you have a comprehension problem? Nothing in your reply was pertinent to what you posted initially, nor to my response. In point of fact your reply SUPPORTED my response... FFS

I bought Gold @350, Platinum @360 and Silver @6 and did very well on it, thank you. I'm pretty sure I'm competent in the market...
“Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”
Charles Darwin
#56
Quote by dannyalcatraz
WTF?

Are you trying to live up to your forum name?

The religion and ethnicity of the company's founders or current owners has nothing to do with jack-all relevant to the discussion.

You have rendered your opinions irrelevant to me.


Just thought the same thing to myself. Just another bigot then?
OffsetOffset
#57
That's my takeaway.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#58
Back on point:

Another investment option in electrics is chasing after guitars made by known builders of high regard, just like in the acoustic market.

Unlike the acoustic market, those builders tend not to have a stable career. They'll work in this company or that, and some even found their own companies. Some do so more than once.

Right now, a few I could name as examples would be Dean B. Zelinsky, Gary Kramer, and Grover Jackson. All have reputations as builders of high-quality player's guitars, and have bounced around the industry a bit. Each has founded companies and been bought out...and all currently have new companies making guitars built to their personal high standards.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Apr 11, 2013,
#59
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Diamonds are a scam in my opinion for the very reason that DeBeers (A Jewish organization by the way) has brainwashed most women (the men have to tag along for the ride though) into thinking that diamonds are something special. It's all marketing, smoke, and mirrors. If people actually were able to think critically and did some research on diamonds that market would crash.

Same goes for Federal Reserve Notes and fractional reserve banking. If people knew it was just shell game that usurious system would fail as it rightly should.


Wow, someone Jewish owns something!
Quote by Shredwizard445
Go ahead and spend your money, I don't care. It won't make you sound better.


Quote by Shredwizard445
Sure upgrading your gear will make you sound better.


#60
Quote by gregs1020
so you cashed out?
why would you do that when you were making such good money?
Buy low, sell high.
#61
Quote by Mephaphil
Wow, someone Jewish owns something!
It's not the Jewish ownership that bothers me. It's the complete monopoly they have on so many different things like the media, the U.S. Government via AIPAC, banking and finance, etc. Question those monopolies and you get called all sorts of nasty names even though your questions are right and true.

That ownership leads to YOUR (and mine) wealth being siphoned and sent overseas to a foreign power. This wouldn't happen if America weren't first brainwashed with the media that they also control.

I'm not going to get into a flame war on this subject. Not why I'm here. However, I did want to address your presumption, and rebut that presumption with my position on the subject. Again, it's not the ownership, but the monopoly and use of that monopoly to manipulate the populace into surrendering their wealth and freedom that would not otherwise be surrendered if not for the mental and emotional manipulation through their various other organs and monopolies.
Last edited by HighspeedNazi at Apr 11, 2013,
#62
Quote by HighspeedNazi
It's not the Jewish ownership that bothers me. It's the complete monopoly they have on so many different things like the media, the U.S. Government via AIPAC, banking and finance, etc. Question those monopolies and you get called all sorts of nasty names even though your questions are right and true.

That ownership leads to YOUR (and mine) wealth being siphoned and sent overseas to a foreign power. This wouldn't happen if America weren't first brainwashed with the media that they also control.

I'm not going to get into a flame war on this subject. Not why I'm here. However, I did want to address your presumption, and rebut that presumption with my position on the subject. Again, it's not the ownership, but the monopoly and use of that monopoly to manipulate the populace into surrendering their wealth and freedom that would not otherwise be surrendered if not for the mental and emotional manipulation through their various other organs and monopolies.

So you're a paranoid anti-Semite? Brainwashed? Sure, it's everyone else, couldn't be you.
OffsetOffset
#63
Originally Posted by MissingSomethin
As for general conversation,
(1) how has the collector guitar market fared since the 2008 recession?
(2) Is this a good time to get into the game? Or a bad one?
(3) Have certain models dropped in value?
(4) Have others gone even higher?
(5) Are there certain segments you'd focus on? (6) Good deals these days?
(7) Or priced too high, since everyone's getting in on the action?
(8) Supply vs. demand?
(9) Which one wins these days?


Quote by gregs1020
1 - it took a huge hit.
2 - it's always a good time.
3 - yes
4 - not really, most dropped some. the best stuff held on pretty well considering it was as overinflated as the real estate market.
5 - yes
6 - yes, very good.
7 - everyone isn't getting in on the action, where did you get that idea?
8 - as usual.
9 - cash wins everytime. there is still a supply and a demand.

.


Can you share your insight?

Can you give me some examples of how hard the market has been hit?
Peak price vs. current price on a popular model?

What segment would you focus on?
What segment has the best value right now?
Where are the best deals?
1978 Les Paul Custom Sunburst
2001 USA Strat (Hot & Cool Rails)
Effects: Boss GT-6 with Tech-21 Power Amp
#64
In light on some responses here, I have realized that I am not really looking for an "investment". I already have investments. I want to treat myself, and take the first step in starting a vintage guitar collection that I can enjoy (and jam with). While I am not looking to lose 50% on a deal, I am not treating this as an income play. If I ever sell and get most of my money back, that's all I need. This is for collecting, not investing. I understand the difference. Collecting can be an expensive hobby. I can do that.

I do not want modern guitars (that are high in supply).
I do not want acoustic guitars.
I do not want amps.
I do not want 80s guitars.

I want vintage. I want electric. I want rare. I want to play my guitars. I want somewhat rare and established collectibles in the "top 20". I am going to focus on pre-65 Stats, as my first deal. I want a great value, and am very patient. I feel most comfortable in the $10k range for my first collectible.

Got any good links? I am going to do some more reading this weekend.
1978 Les Paul Custom Sunburst
2001 USA Strat (Hot & Cool Rails)
Effects: Boss GT-6 with Tech-21 Power Amp
Last edited by MissingSomethin at Apr 11, 2013,
#66
Quote by engage757
under 50k? DAMN. 50's all original Fender stratocaster. No if, ands, or buts. Can be had for under 15k easily. I know where some are online right now actually.


Where are you seeing 1950's Strats for under $15k ?
It seems like 1950's Strats are more like $25k-$30k and up...
1978 Les Paul Custom Sunburst
2001 USA Strat (Hot & Cool Rails)
Effects: Boss GT-6 with Tech-21 Power Amp
#67
MissingSomethin, build a bedroom surrounded by gear rooms and get every Gibson and Fender available and will be available. Do the same with amps, start with Soldanos, Mesas, and Bogners. Then buy some Germans: Diezel, Hughes & Kettner, and ENGL.
#68
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Diamonds are a scam in my opinion for the very reason that DeBeers (A Jewish organization by the way) has brainwashed most women (the men have to tag along for the ride though) into thinking that diamonds are something special. It's all marketing, smoke, and mirrors. If people actually were able to think critically and did some research on diamonds that market would crash.

Same goes for Federal Reserve Notes and fractional reserve banking. If people knew it was just shell game that usurious system would fail as it rightly should.

If it is such a scam, why have so many gotten rich off of this

Your logic is flawed and you are wrong.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#69
I do not want modern guitars (that are high in supply).
I do not want acoustic guitars.
I do not want amps.
I do not want 80s guitars.

I want vintage. I want electric. I want rare. I want to play my guitars. I want somewhat rare and established collectibles in the "top 20". I am going to focus on pre-65 Stats, as my first deal. I want a great value, and am very patient. I feel most comfortable in the $10k range for my first collectible.

OK, Sam-I-Am!

When it comes to instrument stores, every Guitar Center I have ever been in, oddly, has had a small selection of high end vintage electrics.

Other places I would look:

Charley's
http://www.charleysguitar.com/

Elderly Instruments
http://elderly.com/welcome.htm

I would also check out the ads in Vintage Guitar Magazine and Premiere Guitar Magazine to find other vintage dealers of note.

The prices may not be the best- after all, they know exactly what they have- but you can rest assured that if you buy a $10k guitar from them, it is the real deal.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Apr 12, 2013,
#70
Quote by Robbgnarly
If it is such a scam, why have so many gotten rich off of this

Your logic is flawed and you are wrong.

In the interest of serving the truth, I have to say the hatemonger is right in saying that the price on diamonds is artificially inflated.

The fact is, though, while it used to be that DeBeers controlled 90% of the market, they don't have that power any more. Too many big, high-quality strikes have been made in places like Australia, Russia, Canada and the USA for them to do so. However, it serves the interests of the mine owners to behave as if DeBeers still had a monopoly, and set a price.

Remember my mentioning the Russians? They were looking for loans to buy wheat at one time, and South Africa was voting against them every time. So they gave 60 Minutes a tour of a Russian diamond vault, saying that if they couldn't get a loan, they'd have to start selling diamonds.

South Africa stopped blocking the Russians shortly after that piece aired: had the Russians liquidated diamonds, the price would have fallen so low, not only would the diamond market crash, but so would the market for simulated diamonds like CZ and YAGs.

But with all those players in question, its clearly not all about the Jews.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
Last edited by dannyalcatraz at Apr 12, 2013,
#71
Quote by dannyalcatraz
In the interest of serving the truth, I have to say the hatemonger is right in saying that the price on diamonds is artificially inflated.

The fact is, though, while it used to be that DeBeers controlled 90% of the market, they don't have that power any more. Too many big, high-quality strikes have been made in places like Australia, Russia, Canada and the USA for them to do so. However, it serves the interests of the mine owners to behave as if DeBeers still had a monopoly, and set a price.

Remember my mentioning the Russians? They were looking for loans to buy wheat at one time, and South Africa was voting against them every time. So they gave 60 Minutes a tour of a Russian diamond vault, saying that if they couldn't get a loan, they'd have to start selling diamonds.

South Africa stopped blocking the Russians shortly after that piece aired: had the Russians liquidated diamonds, the price would have fallen so low, not only would the diamond market crash, but so would the market for simulated diamonds like CZ and YAGs.

But with all those players in question, its clearly not all about the Jews.

That may be, but Diamonds are worth big money and millions have made a fortune or are making a fortune off them.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#72
I don't know enough about the collector and high vintage guitar trade to really add anything to that conversation, but I'd like to mirror Ippon's post to throw out an alternative that you could always entire soundproof a room, set it up with some great recording equipment, and still have a great amount of cash to spare on some serious GAS.
OBEY THE MIGHTY SHITKICKER
#73
Quote by Robbgnarly
That may be, but Diamonds are worth big money and millions have made a fortune or are making a fortune off them.

And it will remain that way as long as everyone mostly plays by the unwritten rules set down by DeBeers.
Sturgeon's 2nd Law, a.k.a. Sturgeon's Revelation: “Ninety percent of everything is crap.”

Why, yes, I am a lawyer- thanks for asking!

Log off and play yer guitar!

Strap on, tune up, rock out!
#74
If we're all being honest with one another I think it's clear that op doesn't want an investment. He wants a really sweet vintage guitar. You don't play investments, you don't love investments. You don't put gold bars on a shelf to show off. You lock them up.

In terms of what I'm talking about fenders are sweet and you can find some fairly lowish.
#75
The thing with vintage guitars is many of them suck. They made as many duds back then as they do today. You're gonna have a hard time finding a vintage guitar in the price range you're looking for that plays well also.

I still say go for a high end custom or something if you want a player's guitar. I'd have a few custom shop strats for that kind of money. A traditional style with a 12 inch board, blocked 6 point trem and some duncal SSL, a showmaster type without the painted headstock and a hardtail bridge and a couple of p90s and another showmaster style decked out like an 80s guitar with a floyd.
I don't give a shit if you listen to me or not
#76
Missing something, I'll give you the same advice as I give anyone asking what sort of guitar to buy-do lots and lots of research, take your time, and go and try a lot of guitars-the more experience you have then hopefully the easier you will realise what you are looking for.

Everyone on here can give you their personal opinion of what they like or think, but until you've sat down and played lots of guitars you wont know what works for you. Its an easy choice to recommend certain era Gibsons or Fenders, but if you don't like the feel of them, or the way they play, then its pointless you buying them unless you are specifically looking for an investment.

I've read through your posts and I would say a couple of other things, you mention you dont want to buy amps, I find this strange. If you're willing to pay £10k+ for a guitar why not shop for a great amp too. To get a great sound you dont need just a great guitar, you need to consider everything in the signal chain, amp, cables etc etc, you get what you pay for. Also, I wouldn't discount Japanese guitars, if you know what to look for there are some stunning Japanese made guitars out there, which command good prices-until you've tried some, please don't discount them, as you could be missing out.

Hope this helps.

Joe
#77
Quote by Robbgnarly
If it is such a scam, why have so many gotten rich off of this
Marketing and gullible women. "A diamond is forever" and all of that horse crap. Women will believe anything if you present it in an emotional, romantic package.
#78
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Marketing and gullible women. "A diamond is forever" and all of that horse crap. Women will believe anything if you present it in an emotional, romantic package.

reguardless, they have made money weather you agree with their practices, your point is invalid.
2002 PRS CE22
2013 G&L ASAT Deluxe
2009 Epiphone G-400 (SH-4)
Marshall JCM2000 DSL100
Krank 1980 Jr 20watt
Krank Rev 4x12 (eminence V12)
GFS Greenie/Digitech Bad Monkey
Morley Bad Horsie 2
MXR Smart Gate
#79
Quote by Robbgnarly
reguardless, they have made money weather you agree with their practices, your point is invalid.
It's "whether," not "weather." My point is quite valid while your spelling and grammar are atrocious.
#80
Quote by HighspeedNazi
Marketing and gullible women. "A diamond is forever" and all of that horse crap. Women will believe anything if you present it in an emotional, romantic package.


So you've got misogyny going on as well. You realize that making prejudicial remarks is presenting issues in an Emotional , irrational package, right? Oh, and it makes you sound like a jackass.
OffsetOffset