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#1
Dear Ultimate Guitar,

A considerable percentage of your overall visitors come solely to download GP tabs for the popular tablature software, Guitar Pro.

Due to the short nature of this visit, we're not subjected to as much of you excessive advertising. So in order to tap this large stream of revenue that bypasses the current spam (that's how you see us, right?) not only do you make a large pop-up to inform us of you latest marketing scheme, you force us to view it for fifteen seconds.

My question is this: how do you consider this morally justifiable?

I will grant, for the sake of argument that some advertising is acceptable. We as consumers need to be informed about the products that are available. I am not concerned here with simple, modest, and informative advertising.


-Edit:

Don't ask me this stuff, as I've already countered it:


Are you kidding me? I wish I could send you youngsters back in time to dial-up internet and 256k ram speed on your computer. I realize that we are in the generation of "instant satisfaction"

Just as you expected 256k ram speeds back in "the day" (just pick a seemingly random number below 2013 and insert here) , we expect not to wait 15 seconds when ever we desire to be instantly satisfied. As technology evolves, why shouldn't the people whom use it do so too?


I would like to see UG have ads for Tampax and Oprah magazine

As would I. When I'm forced to view advertisements, I like them to actually be relevant to my needs/wants. Anything would be more constructive than UG's blatantly obvious final effort to entice visitors to buy into their own alternative to the software the visitor clearly (by the fact they are downloading a .GP file) already owns.


And even then 15 seconds is not an inconvenience.

I come to this site solely to download .GP tabs, as stated in my OP. I actually have other things do, such as playing the guitar. I generally open a webpage, navigate to UG, download the tab I want to play and play it. But I've been unable to achieve that as of late. Right before I receive the "instant satisfaction" of picking my guitar back up and playing this new groove, I'm being forced to view an intrusive advertisement for an entire, very inconvenient, fifteen seconds.

Not to mention, all the while, I'm being subjected to countless background images displaying more than enough information for me to base my opinion. I don't need an additional fifteen seconds of forced advertising for UG's latest plan to capitalize on the website for me to recall the fact, that hey, I already have Guitar Pro.


The 2 minutes that I spent reading your bitch session and trying to figure out if you were trolling was a waist of time and offensive to several senses.

Do you understand these advertisements have been added recently? Would a company, who puts themselves across as community orientated as UG, not appreciate and listen too the feedback on there latest marketing campaign provided (via their dedicated sub-forum I might add) by the people who actually use the website?

By referring to my valid feedback as 'just some bitching session from a kid who hasn't even used a computer with speeds limited to 256k' also offends me on several scenes. Does this not make you the troll by your own standards?

Besides, of course my "bitching session" was offensive to several scenes. Would I've sparked this debate without making it such? All I've done, aside from offend a few of your subjective morals, is made people stop and think about what's actually going on.


Nothing is free, but UG is as close as it gets.

I quite agree. Nothing is free. Including user submitted data. Directly copying user submitted GP tabs, converting them to Tab Pro and automatically giving them a 5-star rating to make them seem more appealing to potential customers is one of the practices that really tarnishes this websites reputation.


Please please please find a different site that has all of these features with no ads. Then find something to bitch about there.

As stated in my original post: I will grant, for the sake of argument that some advertising is acceptable. We as consumers need to be informed about the products that are available. I am not concerned here with simple, modest, and informative advertising.
Last edited by Surrealistic at Apr 15, 2013,
#2
LOLZ. you do know there's a skip advertisement link at the bottom of all the advertisements, right?

And if you'd contribute, say, 3 or so tabs? they give you AdFree...just sayin... they don't even have to be GuitarPro tabs.
#3
Quote by mjones1992
LOLZ. you do know there's a skip advertisement link at the bottom of all the advertisements, right?

And if you'd contribute, say, 3 or so tabs? they give you AdFree...just sayin... they don't even have to be GuitarPro tabs.



Do you think I would be writing this if there were a skip advertisement link at the bottom?

This is the message I'm confronted with each time I download a .GP file.


Try clicking "[download]Guitar Pro Tab" On this page.
(Full link: http://tabs.ultimate-guitar.com/j/jimi_hendrix/hey_joe_ver2_guitar_pro.htm)

I come here to learn how to play songs, not teach others. Would you be grateful for me contributing 3 incorrect or duplicate tabs just so I could become ad free?

Would becoming "Adfree" even help me? I mean, my Ad Blocker add-on blocks all of the ads on the page. The advertising that I'm referring to is, in my experience, non-bypassable.
Last edited by Surrealistic at Apr 13, 2013,
#4
Yeah this is most definitely not cool in the slightest. There's already the blatant tab pro advertising in the form of a demo and this really isn't cool, more like the biggest turn off ever.
#5
Frankly i don't have enough time to be sitting around 15 seconds for every tab i want to look at.. Pop up ads with download link.. yeah i can live with that.. count down timer with 15 seconds.. nope!
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#6
Agreed, tab pro is pushed and pushed on us a shitload already, all this is doing is encouraging me to find another site for tabs.
#7
This is a real bummer, I would be able to stand it if i could go open another tab while I wait the 15 seconds, but it honestly just feels like such a waste. I come to UG cause I know I can find GP tabs and get them no hassle, but urgh. I hope they take this down.
I paid for guitarpro, im happy with it, I understand you want us to use your product, but don't reprimand us like this, the demo versions of tab pro on the page is enough to let me know what your product can offer.
I think it would make sense to advertise tab pro more heavily on the tabs and chord pages because people viewing them are less likely to have a product such as GP that theyve already paid for, and hence would be more interested in purchasing such a product.
#8
This is really fucked, I am a contributor and the adfree doesn't work on this 15 second bullshit. No amount of time staring at the ad is going to change my mind about tabpro so go ahead and reverse this blunder.

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Warned for trolling!


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#9
Quote by jthm_guitarist
This is really fucked, I am a contributor and the adfree doesn't work on this 15 second bullshit. No amount of time staring at the ad is going to change my mind about tabpro so go ahead and reverse this blunder.

yea same for me.
I have just started looking for tabs at other places.
#10
Quote by crzywhiteboy
yea same for me.
I have just started looking for tabs at other places.

Yeah I often search up a tab while everything's on, and my guitar's in my hands. It's extremely frustrating and very much a moodkill to have a riff stuck in your head and be forced to delay it just to see the same advertisement as the last 5 files.

Rapid accessibility is a feature of the site that, in my humble opinion, shouldn't be squandered.
#11
I have 41 tabs and the majority of them are Guitar Pro tabs. So if I already have Guitar Pro (and everyone else who is downloading a gp tab) why would I pay for Tab Pro?

I also got it once free for 6 months because of the number of my contributions. I tried it once on the first day and never used it again. And the sound banks are also horrible in it.

I understand that UG has to get money from somewhere, but there's even a free alternative for Guitar Pro (Tux Guitar). They should either find some other way, or make it somehow superior than the others, but this 15 sec wait time won't make anyone pay for it, especially if only those who already have a better software are the only ones who are exposed to it.
#12
Has anyone seen a 'tab pro' tab with less than a five star rating? It's almost as if those tabs are getting automatic 5-stars rating rather than user submitted ratings. Not cool.
#13
Tab pro is an inferior product to guitar pro. If it was superior i'd buy it but its not. 15 second wait time is ridiculous, You cant even browse another tab because it just pauses the countdown. Rage will occur when you wait 15 seconds to download an unrated tab that turns out to be bad.
#14
It's a joke, all its gonna do is put people off buying tab pro. Terrible way to advertise it.
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#15
The worst thing is that you need to have the window / browser tab active, otherwise the countdown will be stopped :P

Seems like I'll be starting a UG boycott soon, if they don't remove the feature. Well done UG, well done...
#16
I think I'm totally right. Just done some more research. The tab pro tabs are copied from a guitarpro tab that a user has submitted. The tab pro automatically gets the same rating and number of votes as the guitarpro tab it was nicked from. On top of that, if the guitar pro it was taken from has less than a five-star rating then the tab pro will get a five-star rating with one vote. I call bullshit.

This superficially makes the tab pro tabs seem better or equal to the already existing user submitted tabs despite nobody actually rating it to that point. Vote rigging, nice.
#17
Nothing is more guaranteed to put me off buying a product than aggressive advertising. As soon as I'm pushed like that, it just makes me go elsewhere. Ironically, if things like the all 5 star ratings etc didn't happen, it would be more inclined to trust it as a product and buy it.
#18
I've submitted well over 3 tabs and I did get the ad-free thing that UG offered, it doesn't work for these ones, I'm still stuck looking at them for 15 seconds.
#19
Quote by el_paso
I think I'm totally right. Just done some more research. The tab pro tabs are copied from a guitarpro tab that a user has submitted. The tab pro automatically gets the same rating and number of votes as the guitarpro tab it was nicked from. On top of that, if the guitar pro it was taken from has less than a five-star rating then the tab pro will get a five-star rating with one vote. I call bullshit.

This superficially makes the tab pro tabs seem better or equal to the already existing user submitted tabs despite nobody actually rating it to that point. Vote rigging, nice.


You are right, or at least you're partially right because GP tabs that I've submitted have been turned into Tab Pro tabs.
#20
I was gonna come here and be like "wtf you on 'bout".

Clicked on the link.

What the **** UG.
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Quote by angusfan16
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#21
Quote by el_paso
I think I'm totally right. Just done some more research. The tab pro tabs are copied from a guitarpro tab that a user has submitted. The tab pro automatically gets the same rating and number of votes as the guitarpro tab it was nicked from. On top of that, if the guitar pro it was taken from has less than a five-star rating then the tab pro will get a five-star rating with one vote. I call bullshit.


Yeah, like my Scaretale tab which took me more than 20 hours to make and they don't even give me credit for it. Or I just can't seem to find it anywhere. But if you copy our tabs at least put there that it's made by us and not by those who get the money for it.

I just browsed through the Tab Pro site and they don't say it anywhere that these tabs were made by the users, only that "made by guitaritst for guitarists" (which doesn't necessarily mean that it was made by users, it could also imply that they have hired professional guitarists specially to tab songs for them), "world's largest tab catalog" and stuff like that. Or if they do write it somewhere, they hid it very well.
#22
Hm, mine still lets me download instantly... ad blocker? And if you can't be bothered to wait 15 seconds, be bothered to spend a couple hours figuring it out by ear

Still, I agree with the sentiment about tab pro.
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#23
Quote by el_paso
Has anyone seen a 'tab pro' tab with less than a five star rating? It's almost as if those tabs are getting automatic 5-stars rating rather than user submitted ratings. Not cool.

Quote by el_paso
I think I'm totally right. Just done some more research. The tab pro tabs are copied from a guitarpro tab that a user has submitted. The tab pro automatically gets the same rating and number of votes as the guitarpro tab it was nicked from. On top of that, if the guitar pro it was taken from has less than a five-star rating then the tab pro will get a five-star rating with one vote. I call bullshit.

This superficially makes the tab pro tabs seem better or equal to the already existing user submitted tabs despite nobody actually rating it to that point. Vote rigging, nice.


I just had a look at one of them using the demo mode and it's a direct rip of a gp tab I uploaded, my tab has no ratings yet and the tab pro one has 5 star ratings (which is obviously still my hard work) but I don't get the rating added to my score. Sad.

I'd happily have ads turned back on for contributors if it meant getting rid of the wait because I sure as hell wont be buying tab pro, especially now seeing that they just steal tabs from us while we get nothing.
Last edited by moo03d at Apr 13, 2013,
#24
Quote by moo03d
I just had a look at one of them using the demo mode and it's a direct rip of a gp tab I uploaded, my tab has no ratings yet and the tab pro one has 5 star ratings (which is obviously still my hard work) but I don't get the rating added to my score. Sad.

I'd happily have ads turned back on for contributors if it meant getting rid of the wait because I sure as hell wont be buying tab pro, especially now seeing that they just steal tabs from us while we get nothing.


Yeah we're pretty sure they take the GP tabs for Tab Pro and just give them 5 start instantly.

Bit shitty if you ask me.
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Quote by angusfan16
Okay UG where's my refund and free xbox. I need It for my 80 yr old grandma. She needs a new flower pot
#25
Another one here. This is insane, plus I am a big contributor, I've also been offered some free tab pro and the no adds version because of this. How come I have to wait 15 seconds for tabs? I mean, at least remove it for those of us that contribute a lot! It is obvious that after YEARS of being here and not caring about tab pro, I will never do.
#26
Posting to express agreeing with you guys.
I exclusively write gpx, this already means I have absolutely no need for tab pro, and I was told I would go ad free some weeks ago. Yet I am being spammed in the face with tab pro ads - even when checking my own tabs - that is completely obnoxious.
I already know that tab pro = the GP/power tab, the duplicated / fake ratings, etc.
There are so many things wrong about this. Please try to find another way
#27
I asked about the five star thing earlier, and they said it was a "technical problem" and they were "fixing" it. Take that as you will, but I think they just didn't think anyone would notice, and now they're backpedaling as fast as they can (which is embarrassingly slow).

My biggest issue with Tab Pro is that they seem to have removed the contributor credit. I made this tab, for example, and I don't see my handle anywhere on that page. I (and a bunch of other tabbers) raised a fuss about this when Tab Pro was first introduced, and they started crediting us. Now, they've stopped.

I love UG's tab archive. It's a big part of the way I learned to play guitar in the first place, and the reason I write tabs is to give something back. I understand their bandwidth charges must be huge, and they have to pay them one way or another, but the sooner they can accept that Tab Pro has failed, and try something else, the better things will work out for them in the long run.

On the bright side, this makes my life easier. Now I can just post ASCII tabs from now on, and not have to worry about the drum parts (which are easily the hardest part of each song).

E:
Quote by Petzakecske
Yeah, like my Scaretale tab which took me more than 20 hours to make and they don't even give me credit for it.

By the way, thanks for that tab.

EE: It pauses the counter if you switch windows (or even tabs). Now I'm annoyed.
Last edited by Cavalcade at Apr 13, 2013,
#28
Wow, just when I thought the annoying download page shoving Tab Pro down our throats couldn't get any worse...

Come on UG, turn this awful feature off
#29
I'm just going to draw some more attention to part of my previous post. If you contribute tabs, and the way that UG has handled Tab Pro so far irritates you, then I urge you to only post ASCII (text) tabs from now on. Without a database built from Guitar Pro (or Power, but who uses that anymore?) tabs, Tab Pro is useless.

Hey, I wonder what Arobas (the company that makes Guitar Pro) thinks about all the stuff that's happening at the Internet's biggest archive of Guitar Pro files. Maybe someone should ask them?
Last edited by Cavalcade at Apr 13, 2013,
#30
Ultimate Guitar Site Maintainers, or anyone that controls this: PLEASE LISTEN TO WE THE MUSICIANS: YOU ARE DOING A HORRIBLE THING MAKING US WAIT 15 SECONDS TO DOWNLOAD GUITAR PRO FILES.

Like another user said, you CAN'T EVEN SWITCH TABS. Why would you do this to us? It doesn't help anything, any logical/non-braindead musician knows guitar pro is much better than tab-pro. a quick trip to the pirate bay or Arobas' website will obviously reinforce that.

Has ANYONE found a workaround to the 15 second wait?
Last edited by alex94kumar at Apr 13, 2013,
#31
Yep, get rid of it please.

Not cool.


There's a damn great demo for it already, the ads are all over the place, if I wanted it, I'd have bought it already. This is making me want it even less than I already did.
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#33
Quote by alex94kumar
Ultimate Guitar Site Maintainers, or anyone that controls this: PLEASE LISTEN TO WE THE MUSICIANS: YOU ARE DOING A HORRIBLE THING MAKING US WAIT 15 SECONDS TO DOWNLOAD GP FILES. Like another user said, you CAN'T EVEN SWITCH TABS. Why would you do this to us? It doesn't help anything, any logical/non-braindead musician knows guitar pro is much better than tab-pro. a quick trip to the pirate bay or Arobas' website will obviously reinforce that.

Has ANYONE found a workaround to the 15 second wait?

The people behind Tab Pro services are using other people's work, for profit, without their permission, or crediting them, or compensating them, and faking the ratings of bad tabs in order to get people to switch, and showing an unprecedented amount of dishonesty when people call them on it.

There are bigger things afoot than waiting fifteen bloody seconds.

My workaround is to pick up your guitar, and just try to work out some parts by ear while you wait. Just keep the page open and do something that doesn't require a computer, and it'll run out eventually. It will not, however, make anyone more honest, and neither will telling people to pirate a program from a completely different company, that's been minding their own business while UG tries to rob them of users.
Last edited by Cavalcade at Apr 13, 2013,
#37
I noticed this the other day. Goddamn ridiculous. This needs to go immediately.
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#38
Honestly, I'm more pissed about the fact that I constantly have to battle pop-ups on my iPhone when searching for tabs on UG. I already have UG Tabs AND UG Tools installed on my phone, so develop some base level **** to realize this fact and stop subjecting me to these ****ing ads all the time. I honestly use the site less because of it.
#39
Guess what?
I cobbled together a crappy GreaseMonkey script to bypass the download wait.
Get it while it's hot.
UG staff, I hope you understand why I did this. It's not even about the wait; 15 seconds be damned, this took me like 5 whole minutes. It's to get your attention, and express my feelings on how you've treated people like me, whose contributions power your entire site, the only way I can.
Last edited by Cavalcade at Apr 13, 2013,
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